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Dagmar Shaw #3
The Fourth Wall
Dagmar Shaw got out of the game... and into the movies.
Sean is a washed-up child actor reduced to the lowest dregs of reality television to keep himself afloat. His life was a downward spiral of alcoholism, regret, and failure... until he met Dagmar.
Except Sean has secrets, dark even for the Hollywood treadmill of abuse, addiction, and rehab. And Dagmar is a cipher. There are dark rumors about her past, the places she's been, the things she was involved in. People tend to die around her and now, she wants Sean for something. A movie, she says, but with her history, who's to say what her real game is?
Sean is a washed-up child actor reduced to the lowest dregs of reality television to keep himself afloat. His life was a downward spiral of alcoholism, regret, and failure... until he met Dagmar.
Except Sean has secrets, dark even for the Hollywood treadmill of abuse, addiction, and rehab. And Dagmar is a cipher. There are dark rumors about her past, the places she's been, the things she was involved in. People tend to die around her and now, she wants Sean for something. A movie, she says, but with her history, who's to say what her real game is?
416 pages, Kindle Edition
First published January 1, 2012
15 people are currently reading
480 people want to read
About the author
Walter Jon Williams
238 books892 followersWalter Jon Williams has published twenty novels and short fiction collections. Most are science fiction or fantasy -Hardwired, Voice of the Whirlwind, Aristoi, Metropolitan, City on Fire to name just a few - a few are historical adventures, and the most recent, The Rift, is a disaster novel in which "I just basically pound a part of the planet down to bedrock." And that's just the opening chapters. Walter holds a fourth-degree black belt in Kenpo Karate, and also enjoys sailing and scuba diving. He lives in New Mexico with his wife, Kathy Hedges.
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 76 reviews
February 13, 2012
This why WJW is not a more widely popular writer. He is just so uneven. This third book in the series reverts to the detective story format of the first, but now projected on the luridly and scornfully depicted world of Hollywood. The book's "Big Idea" is underwhelming, and when it undergoes a revision during the ending, the new explanation just seems weird and contrived. And the detective story threads resolve themselves in extremely unsatisfactory fashion, so that one is left wondering, what all the fuss was about.
But on the positive side, there is plenty of fuss and nail-biting action, and there are some magnificently-written episodes in the book, which reminded me of why I've been such a fan of WJW over all these years. Three and a half stars, really, but rounding up.
But on the positive side, there is plenty of fuss and nail-biting action, and there are some magnificently-written episodes in the book, which reminded me of why I've been such a fan of WJW over all these years. Three and a half stars, really, but rounding up.
May 17, 2018
This third Dagmar Shaw is quite different from the first two; it's told from the viewpoint of Sean, an actor (and cottage-cheese wrestler, as well as a -very- unreliable narrator), who is starring in her latest production. It's more of a detective thriller (readers of the first two novels will remember that Dagmar's associates tend to die a lot), than anything, on the surface at least, the sf element being more implied and off-camera. It's a complicated and layered story (which seems to inspire a lot of parentheses and commas and semi-colons here), but does finally wind itself into an intelligent and satisfying conclusion of the immediate events. Sean isn't really a nice character at all and the reader can't help but wonder how accurate his portrayal of some of the events (and Dagmar in particular) is; I'd like to be able to read a further volume someday and see how she and her (surviving) companions turned out.
November 29, 2022
Well it just goes to show well all can make mistakes - me choosing to read this book out of sequence (although in my defence I didn't realise it till I came here to enter it) is a perfect point to make.
I will say that the story is perfectly self contained but now realising that it is part of a sequence focusing on one of the characters it makes a whole load more sense especially when there are references - in the way of veiled comments about Dagmars past and rumours about what she had been (or not) involved it. I think this is the first time that a sequel has stood self contained but has made references to previous books rather than trying to sell further sequels.
The story itself is an intriguing style of narratives and the action is both witty and very topical - although I have wondered in the past how a topical story can very quickly start to date itself. I guess the question now is - should I go back and read the earlier books in the series ?
I will say that the story is perfectly self contained but now realising that it is part of a sequence focusing on one of the characters it makes a whole load more sense especially when there are references - in the way of veiled comments about Dagmars past and rumours about what she had been (or not) involved it. I think this is the first time that a sequel has stood self contained but has made references to previous books rather than trying to sell further sequels.
The story itself is an intriguing style of narratives and the action is both witty and very topical - although I have wondered in the past how a topical story can very quickly start to date itself. I guess the question now is - should I go back and read the earlier books in the series ?
April 14, 2012
The "fourth wall" is a theatrical convention, the invisible barrier that, for most actors in most productions, keeps the audience separate from (and invisible to) the players. To "break the fourth wall," to step outside character and address an audience directly, is another theatrical convention, one at least as old as the wall itself. Everyone in this media-literate time probably already knows that much. But you may not know that The Fourth Wall is Walter Jon Williams' third entry in the growing Dagmar Shaw series, about a near-future ARG (Alternative Reality Game) entrepreneur. (The first two are, in order, since you'll want to read them first anyway, This Is Not A Game and Deep State, both of which I greatly enjoyed).
In The Fourth Wall, Williams never actually breaks the fourth wall, though—not in the sense of addressing the reader as himself, anyway. He does break with one self-imposed constraint from the first two books: this one's really not a Dagmar Shaw book. Oh, she's featured in it, and is in fact a prime mover behind the action... but Dagmar is neither the narrator nor the viewpoint character for this installment.
That honor now goes to Sean Makin, an actor of a type all too common in Hollywood's history: the wildly successful child star whose finances were misappropriated by his greedy parents, and for whom puberty was an audience-killing disaster. Sean's down on his luck... he has been reduced to wrestling around in cottage cheese on Celebrity Pitfighter, which is precisely as degrading as it sounds. Dagmar Shaw shows up, but in Makin's world she's a peripheral character, except in one specific regard: what she can do for Sean Makin.
Sean (often known as "Luggage Boy" from his signature sitcom catchphrase) is fond of addressing the audience, but he always does it in character, and often through his blog, "Heavy Luggage" (geddit?). As in real life, the comments that show up on Sean's blog are often illiterate (and kinda funny), but sometimes they're cogent and germane to the post, or plot. Williams occasionally even includes comment spam for verisimilitude, which I thought was a nice touch.
Sean's hard to like, though. I'll admit that I've been spoiled by Wil Wheaton, a real-life child star who's turned out to be an accomplished writer (both online and in print), a well-regarded adult actor, a family man and a pretty decent guy all around—the kind of success story that doesn't happen to kids on stage nearly as often as it should. Sean Makin blogs too, just like Wheaton, but he is not nearly as accomplished a blogger... or as self-aware a person, especially at first.
He does get better, though that's not (as far as I'm concerned) the most interesting plot arc in The Fourth Wall. What I found more interesting was the way what starts out as Dagmar Shaw's attempt to enter Sean's world gradually becomes Makin being drawn into Shaw's. Excitement, danger and even a little hopefulness duly ensue.
I picked up this novel on the strength of its predecessors, and I was not disappointed. Now I want to see where Williams takes Dagmar Shaw next.
In The Fourth Wall, Williams never actually breaks the fourth wall, though—not in the sense of addressing the reader as himself, anyway. He does break with one self-imposed constraint from the first two books: this one's really not a Dagmar Shaw book. Oh, she's featured in it, and is in fact a prime mover behind the action... but Dagmar is neither the narrator nor the viewpoint character for this installment.
That honor now goes to Sean Makin, an actor of a type all too common in Hollywood's history: the wildly successful child star whose finances were misappropriated by his greedy parents, and for whom puberty was an audience-killing disaster. Sean's down on his luck... he has been reduced to wrestling around in cottage cheese on Celebrity Pitfighter, which is precisely as degrading as it sounds. Dagmar Shaw shows up, but in Makin's world she's a peripheral character, except in one specific regard: what she can do for Sean Makin.
Sean (often known as "Luggage Boy" from his signature sitcom catchphrase) is fond of addressing the audience, but he always does it in character, and often through his blog, "Heavy Luggage" (geddit?). As in real life, the comments that show up on Sean's blog are often illiterate (and kinda funny), but sometimes they're cogent and germane to the post, or plot. Williams occasionally even includes comment spam for verisimilitude, which I thought was a nice touch.
Sean's hard to like, though. I'll admit that I've been spoiled by Wil Wheaton, a real-life child star who's turned out to be an accomplished writer (both online and in print), a well-regarded adult actor, a family man and a pretty decent guy all around—the kind of success story that doesn't happen to kids on stage nearly as often as it should. Sean Makin blogs too, just like Wheaton, but he is not nearly as accomplished a blogger... or as self-aware a person, especially at first.
He does get better, though that's not (as far as I'm concerned) the most interesting plot arc in The Fourth Wall. What I found more interesting was the way what starts out as Dagmar Shaw's attempt to enter Sean's world gradually becomes Makin being drawn into Shaw's. Excitement, danger and even a little hopefulness duly ensue.
I picked up this novel on the strength of its predecessors, and I was not disappointed. Now I want to see where Williams takes Dagmar Shaw next.
July 8, 2019
This one was OK, in parts excellent -- but WJW is too good a writer to do tech-thrillers. I hope he goes back to writing SF next time. Maybe these pay the rent.
February 7, 2012
The third installment in the Dagmar Shaw series -- kind of, since it follows an entirely new character. Dagmar and the usual crew are involved, but the first-person narrative pushes them far to the side. I hate to say it, but I think this is his weakest book in quite some time. I loved it as a character study of Sean and of show biz, but I could not buy the plot.
First problem: Four psychos is two too many. I wasn't convinced by most of the supposed motivations involved. Having the "big bad" be some guy I don't even remember being introduced to and have no reason to care about was a let-down.
A much bigger problem for me was that Dagmar has had the law of unintended consequences get all up in her business to a deadly extent before this; we're supposed to believe she's had the attack of blinding naivete required to think the plot as revealed is a good idea?
The cyber posse get some screen time, but as walk-ons; there isn't a game for them to play, as in the last two books. That made me a bit sad.
The main character, Sean Makin, is interesting, not least because he is the only protagonist I can remember liking *less* over the course of the novel. By the time he confronted Joey, I wouldn't have cared if he'd gotten killed. I spent some amount of time trying to figure out if Sean could actually be the killer. He's really pretty disturbing, and I'm planning to re-read the book to study his portrayal. Narcissistic personality disorder, indeed.
I find myself hoping that all of this is actually a setup for another book in which Dagmar will have to deal with the Frankenstein's monster she's just created, either in the form of the network or Sean himself (or both).
First problem: Four psychos is two too many. I wasn't convinced by most of the supposed motivations involved. Having the "big bad" be some guy I don't even remember being introduced to and have no reason to care about was a let-down.
A much bigger problem for me was that Dagmar has had the law of unintended consequences get all up in her business to a deadly extent before this; we're supposed to believe she's had the attack of blinding naivete required to think the plot as revealed is a good idea?
The cyber posse get some screen time, but as walk-ons; there isn't a game for them to play, as in the last two books. That made me a bit sad.
The main character, Sean Makin, is interesting, not least because he is the only protagonist I can remember liking *less* over the course of the novel. By the time he confronted Joey, I wouldn't have cared if he'd gotten killed. I spent some amount of time trying to figure out if Sean could actually be the killer. He's really pretty disturbing, and I'm planning to re-read the book to study his portrayal. Narcissistic personality disorder, indeed.
I find myself hoping that all of this is actually a setup for another book in which Dagmar will have to deal with the Frankenstein's monster she's just created, either in the form of the network or Sean himself (or both).
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
June 24, 2019
I really wish I had half stars... Heck the full 0.00 to 5.00 would be better. This book is more like a 4.0 but I enjoyed it much more than that so call it a 4.5. This is a book 3 - it follows up Deep State (which I wish had been called This is not a revolution), which followed up This Is Not A Game - which I liked best of the three. I guess this one should have been, This is not a movie. Same universe but we are following a washed-up has-been child star with a funny looking head who ends up starring in something in the Dagmar Shaw universe. If you haven't read This is not a game you ought to. But if you also haven't ready Ready Player One you ought to read that instead.
I guess I've gotten used to reading books I don't like and protagonists that I find annoying. This book was a nice change.
.
Oh - calling this book science fiction is a bit of a stretch. It's barely speculative.
Huh. And another re-read. And this time a quick one. Definitely not a five star. But it had that madcap adventure thing going. And a body count. And Dagmar is definitely less broken. Something felt off on this re-read, a little too unbelievable.
I guess I've gotten used to reading books I don't like and protagonists that I find annoying. This book was a nice change.
.
Oh - calling this book science fiction is a bit of a stretch. It's barely speculative.
Huh. And another re-read. And this time a quick one. Definitely not a five star. But it had that madcap adventure thing going. And a body count. And Dagmar is definitely less broken. Something felt off on this re-read, a little too unbelievable.
September 4, 2015
I had read and enjoyed one other WJ Williams book (Implied Spaces), so I tried another, and enjoyed this one too. The narrator is a strange looking, washed up, grown up famous child actor, fallen on hard times, when suddenly he is offered a lead in a movie to be shown as a serial through internet subscriptions. He can't believe his luck and accepts the role- winds up working with a director, other actors, etc. he used to know- but he has some close calls with a black SUV, and some of his friends start dying. The whole story is very clever, full of movie, social media and tech ideas and tidbits, full of heart and sadness. I really liked it and will pick up another WF Williams book soon.
September 23, 2015
I liked this novel in a lot of ways.
The POV character, Sean, rather weird but personable and believable. The secondary characters, too. And the plot is pretty tight yet convoluted, and ends up mostly making sense.
(Mild spoiler here, though it's in the first 100 pages) One of the foci of the plot rests on Sean's guilt for "killing" a friend. And yeah, the friend died. However, I think if 2 people drunker than lords decide to drive vehicles, and while trying to avoid a collision one of them dies- well, this is not at ALL the same as premeditated murder. Culpable? oh, yeah. But it's not premeditated murder (like others were getting up to). So that struck me wrong, especially as a motive.
Still, a fun twisty plot with good writing and characters.
And I think I will put blocks on the cameras my various devices have. :)
The POV character, Sean, rather weird but personable and believable. The secondary characters, too. And the plot is pretty tight yet convoluted, and ends up mostly making sense.
(Mild spoiler here, though it's in the first 100 pages) One of the foci of the plot rests on Sean's guilt for "killing" a friend. And yeah, the friend died. However, I think if 2 people drunker than lords decide to drive vehicles, and while trying to avoid a collision one of them dies- well, this is not at ALL the same as premeditated murder. Culpable? oh, yeah. But it's not premeditated murder (like others were getting up to). So that struck me wrong, especially as a motive.
Still, a fun twisty plot with good writing and characters.
And I think I will put blocks on the cameras my various devices have. :)
November 17, 2014
In my eyes this is the best of the Dagmar Shaw series (so far?) even though here we really follow Sean Makin in first person and Dagmar is relegated to a bit player, albeit an important one.
Sean is a washed up ex-child star, appearing in Celebrity Pit Fighter to get exposure and struggling with the fact that he's done some pretty horrible things in his past in order get recognition. He's been a struggling actor for a long time - not helped by the fact he is skint , his nest egg from his successful sitcom when he was a child wasted by his parents... both now in hiding.
When Dagmar Shaws production company offers him the starring role in a new production, to be played out using augmented reality and serialized he cannot resist, and soon he gets caught up in a conspiracy involving egotistical directors, billionaire investors, and Shaw herself.
I really enjoyed this novel because it continues the modern techno-thriller feel of the Dagmar Shaw books but it delves into the seedy side of Hollywood too. Sean is an interesting character and his adventures with both friend and foe throughout his latest production kept me enthralled. It was a page turner for me, and that's always a good sign!
With its themes of fame and the transient nature of celebrity mixed with a good old fashioned mystery I found The Fourth Wall an interesting and enthralling read. YMMV.
Sean is a washed up ex-child star, appearing in Celebrity Pit Fighter to get exposure and struggling with the fact that he's done some pretty horrible things in his past in order get recognition. He's been a struggling actor for a long time - not helped by the fact he is skint , his nest egg from his successful sitcom when he was a child wasted by his parents... both now in hiding.
When Dagmar Shaws production company offers him the starring role in a new production, to be played out using augmented reality and serialized he cannot resist, and soon he gets caught up in a conspiracy involving egotistical directors, billionaire investors, and Shaw herself.
I really enjoyed this novel because it continues the modern techno-thriller feel of the Dagmar Shaw books but it delves into the seedy side of Hollywood too. Sean is an interesting character and his adventures with both friend and foe throughout his latest production kept me enthralled. It was a page turner for me, and that's always a good sign!
With its themes of fame and the transient nature of celebrity mixed with a good old fashioned mystery I found The Fourth Wall an interesting and enthralling read. YMMV.
November 20, 2017
This just squeaks into SF. If Williams hadn't done other stuff that clearly IS sf-f, this one might be on the thriller or mystery shelves.
I hadn't read the previous two Dagmar books, but this one seemed to stand alone OK. Indeed, from the blurbs of the first two, I'm in no hurry to read them.
So what is this book? A character study of Sean's progress? A satire of Hollywood? A thoughtful examination of how mass-media technology can be used for social engineering? A murder mystery? A thriller? I'd have to say it tried to be all those at once, and that's its weakness.
Williams knows how to tell a story, but as I put this one down I felt unsatisfied. So that's what they were up to? That's who did the killing? Meh.
I agree with those who couldn't buy the "I killed Timmi" part of the plot. Too bad, because Williams leveraged it pretty hard.
Cottage cheese wrestling? OK, I'll remember that. And I liked the explanations/demonstrations of what a director brings to a movie.
A decent page-turner, but in the end, if it was intended as a lightweight, it has succeeded.
I hadn't read the previous two Dagmar books, but this one seemed to stand alone OK. Indeed, from the blurbs of the first two, I'm in no hurry to read them.
So what is this book? A character study of Sean's progress? A satire of Hollywood? A thoughtful examination of how mass-media technology can be used for social engineering? A murder mystery? A thriller? I'd have to say it tried to be all those at once, and that's its weakness.
Williams knows how to tell a story, but as I put this one down I felt unsatisfied. So that's what they were up to? That's who did the killing? Meh.
I agree with those who couldn't buy the "I killed Timmi" part of the plot. Too bad, because Williams leveraged it pretty hard.
Cottage cheese wrestling? OK, I'll remember that. And I liked the explanations/demonstrations of what a director brings to a movie.
A decent page-turner, but in the end, if it was intended as a lightweight, it has succeeded.
December 23, 2017
Williams has written a novel of the near future. The plot lines intertwine and lead you through an interesting novel. Williams has plotted the story well, combining movies, reality TV, video games, augmented reality, and Hollywood. From time to time you may find it hard to put this book down. In my case I read it in several days and learned quickly not to read it in bed before turning out the lights.
Sean Makin, the main character, grows on you quickly. A former child star, not a has-been trying to hang on to a career, he is in love with acting. So when he gets a chance to star in a new production he leaps at it. He does everything he can to hold onto the role, even when people around him begin to die. So in addition to his acting, Sean tries to find out who the killer is, before the killer kills him.
Overall, a very good and engaging book. Worth a read and repeated re-reads.
Sean Makin, the main character, grows on you quickly. A former child star, not a has-been trying to hang on to a career, he is in love with acting. So when he gets a chance to star in a new production he leaps at it. He does everything he can to hold onto the role, even when people around him begin to die. So in addition to his acting, Sean tries to find out who the killer is, before the killer kills him.
Overall, a very good and engaging book. Worth a read and repeated re-reads.
July 1, 2012
I really enjoyed reading this. The interconnected story of the former child star, his almost Lebowski-ish inability to comprehend what's going on, the futuristic gameing/movie world, religious cults, and the shadowy realm of international terrorism (or something else?)... it was fun.
I had no idea that one of the characters was a reoccuring lead for W J Williams until I went to log this book into Goodreads. Notable also is that the folks who did know that, didn't seem to like this book as much as I did. Well, taken as a stand-alone, it's thoroughly enjoyable reading. I have to go back now and read the others!
I had no idea that one of the characters was a reoccuring lead for W J Williams until I went to log this book into Goodreads. Notable also is that the folks who did know that, didn't seem to like this book as much as I did. Well, taken as a stand-alone, it's thoroughly enjoyable reading. I have to go back now and read the others!
February 12, 2012
Walter Jon Williams goes from strength to strength. This third Dagmar book is written from the viewpoint of a largely failed actor who's given the chance to star in a Dagmar-produced movie/game/what else... tie-in. Combine this with murders, espionage and crazy parents and it's funny, thrilling and a fulfilling read. It makes m want to re-read the earlier books.
October 26, 2012
The character of Sean and his world of fading child stardom is alien yet feels very authentic.
February 8, 2020
OK, I can see why this book drew so much criticism in terms of its essential Dagmar-ness (or lack thereof).
I always find it jarring when authors write books from one character's viewpoint for a few books and then switch to another character's. Just ask me what I felt like when Outlander switched from Claire and Jamie's perspective to Roger and Brianna's for a couple of books!
And, let's face it, Sean - the main protagonist in this book - is NOT a likeable character at the start. For me, I'd say that lasted for the first third of the book, before I found myself starting to identify with him despite myself. But that didn't change the fact that this didn't feel like a Dagmar book - it had far more of a spinoff series vibe.
All of that said, on a tech level, I love the premise of the book, and I love finding out what Dagmar and co are up to at the same pace that Sean does. (Of course, as the audience, we have the advantage of having known Dagmar for the past two books, so we're pretty sure they're not doing anything super evil - something Sean has no way of knowing).
And it's fascinating seeing Dagmar through a stranger's eyes for the first time too. It's interesting seeing just how scarily competent and determined she appears from the outside, after we've seen her in all her anxiety and self-doubt for two books. It reminds me a little bit of how Harry Dresden suddenly realises how powerful and terrifying the Wardens must see him as from the outside after we've spent nine or ten books in his head where HE feels like he's just stumbling along.
So I also get why Mr Williams might have gone for this kind of angle for telling this story. And if he did it to give us an outsider's view of Dagmar, it worked.
On the downside, I felt like the book took me a long time to get into - partly because Dagmar was no longer the POV character, but also because Sean is so bloody unlikeable at the beginning. I did warm to him over time though, and I found the book got far more readable once I did.
So I think all up that I enjoyed the book: both the 'whodunnit' crime aspect and the whole trademark Dagmar Shaw tech side of things. There was a definite sense that Mr Williams had done his research around what it's like to work as an actor too, which I always appreciate.
Looking forward to the final book (which I think is just a novella) in the series now.
I always find it jarring when authors write books from one character's viewpoint for a few books and then switch to another character's. Just ask me what I felt like when Outlander switched from Claire and Jamie's perspective to Roger and Brianna's for a couple of books!
And, let's face it, Sean - the main protagonist in this book - is NOT a likeable character at the start. For me, I'd say that lasted for the first third of the book, before I found myself starting to identify with him despite myself. But that didn't change the fact that this didn't feel like a Dagmar book - it had far more of a spinoff series vibe.
All of that said, on a tech level, I love the premise of the book, and I love finding out what Dagmar and co are up to at the same pace that Sean does. (Of course, as the audience, we have the advantage of having known Dagmar for the past two books, so we're pretty sure they're not doing anything super evil - something Sean has no way of knowing).
And it's fascinating seeing Dagmar through a stranger's eyes for the first time too. It's interesting seeing just how scarily competent and determined she appears from the outside, after we've seen her in all her anxiety and self-doubt for two books. It reminds me a little bit of how Harry Dresden suddenly realises how powerful and terrifying the Wardens must see him as from the outside after we've spent nine or ten books in his head where HE feels like he's just stumbling along.
So I also get why Mr Williams might have gone for this kind of angle for telling this story. And if he did it to give us an outsider's view of Dagmar, it worked.
On the downside, I felt like the book took me a long time to get into - partly because Dagmar was no longer the POV character, but also because Sean is so bloody unlikeable at the beginning. I did warm to him over time though, and I found the book got far more readable once I did.
So I think all up that I enjoyed the book: both the 'whodunnit' crime aspect and the whole trademark Dagmar Shaw tech side of things. There was a definite sense that Mr Williams had done his research around what it's like to work as an actor too, which I always appreciate.
Looking forward to the final book (which I think is just a novella) in the series now.
July 1, 2023
I'm not sure why I like this series so much, but I do. This book is barely science fiction (there's some minimally more sophisticated surveillance and media technology), and is mostly a murder mystery.
Sean, the protagonist, has a fictional (as near as I can tell) condition that involves having a disproportionately big head. He was a child star in a sitcom and wants desperately to regain stardom, but his looks make him mostly unemployable. He needs the money because his narcissistic parents squandered his earnings. He's not a particularly likable or good person, but he's a good viewpoint character, as he is very observant of other people and situations. Also he's an excellent actor.
Dagmar is still with Ismet from the previous book, and she is pregnant. She hires Sean for a serialized movie project, a game-style movie in that viewers can choose from a couple of courses of action within the movie. She and her group are important to the book, but are seen mostly from the sidelines.
Someone is trying to kill Sean; he's been almost hit by a black SUV a couple of times, and he's seen it lurking. Then (to be vague so it's not a spoiler) people are killed in hit-and-runs, and then there's another murder. Okay, no more spoilers.
There's much more, and many more details. There are subplots involving Sean's participation in a humiliating washed-up-celebrity fight show and his almost-nonexistent relationships with his parents. I love the writing, the characters, and the action. Sean tries to figure out whodunit, and the reader's guesses aren't any better than his. Turns out to be....satisfactory. The one thing I didn't like was that when Dagmar's whole reason for doing the movie (you know it's not just about the movie for her) is revealed at the end, it seemed a bit lame to me, or maybe just underexplained.
Sean, the protagonist, has a fictional (as near as I can tell) condition that involves having a disproportionately big head. He was a child star in a sitcom and wants desperately to regain stardom, but his looks make him mostly unemployable. He needs the money because his narcissistic parents squandered his earnings. He's not a particularly likable or good person, but he's a good viewpoint character, as he is very observant of other people and situations. Also he's an excellent actor.
Dagmar is still with Ismet from the previous book, and she is pregnant. She hires Sean for a serialized movie project, a game-style movie in that viewers can choose from a couple of courses of action within the movie. She and her group are important to the book, but are seen mostly from the sidelines.
Someone is trying to kill Sean; he's been almost hit by a black SUV a couple of times, and he's seen it lurking. Then (to be vague so it's not a spoiler) people are killed in hit-and-runs, and then there's another murder. Okay, no more spoilers.
There's much more, and many more details. There are subplots involving Sean's participation in a humiliating washed-up-celebrity fight show and his almost-nonexistent relationships with his parents. I love the writing, the characters, and the action. Sean tries to figure out whodunit, and the reader's guesses aren't any better than his. Turns out to be....satisfactory. The one thing I didn't like was that when Dagmar's whole reason for doing the movie (you know it's not just about the movie for her) is revealed at the end, it seemed a bit lame to me, or maybe just underexplained.
September 17, 2017
Interesting to see a Dagmar book from the perspective of someone who is not Dagmar, and it's fairly clear why this was done by the end. Similar to Dagmar, Sean somewhat teeters on the edge of likability, which isn't a terribly bad thing in my opinion.
Overall, this book wasn't terrible, but it was somewhat uninspired. It doesn't really make much of a point (maybe in the end there's a somewhat misguided attempt at appealing to technocratic fallacies, but that's almost an afterthought), and the mystery aspects of it are somewhat weak. When I got to the end of each mystery, it wasn't a "Eureka!" moment, it was more of a "Hmm, I guess that explains all the facts..." moment.
2.5 of 5 stars
Overall, this book wasn't terrible, but it was somewhat uninspired. It doesn't really make much of a point (maybe in the end there's a somewhat misguided attempt at appealing to technocratic fallacies, but that's almost an afterthought), and the mystery aspects of it are somewhat weak. When I got to the end of each mystery, it wasn't a "Eureka!" moment, it was more of a "Hmm, I guess that explains all the facts..." moment.
2.5 of 5 stars
October 22, 2019
Dagmar as ruler of the universe?
I had a little difficulty warming up to Sean. The whole first chapter the cottage cheese wrestling just kind of turned me off but I persisted and although I did not find this book quite as enjoyable as the others once it got into the making of "Escape to Earth" and the ancillary programs, I thought it quite fascinating. I think it's kind of sad though that Williams depicts Sean as a person who only start seeing himself positively once he has acquired wealth and fame.
I had a little difficulty warming up to Sean. The whole first chapter the cottage cheese wrestling just kind of turned me off but I persisted and although I did not find this book quite as enjoyable as the others once it got into the making of "Escape to Earth" and the ancillary programs, I thought it quite fascinating. I think it's kind of sad though that Williams depicts Sean as a person who only start seeing himself positively once he has acquired wealth and fame.
July 12, 2012
This is the third book in Williams' series about Dagmar Shaw (the others are This is Not a Game and Deep State). I guess therefore this review may contain spoilers for those two books, like the fact that she survives.
This one is not like the others because Dagmar is not the main protagonist. Instead, she moves onto the sidelines, becoming a somewhat shadowy, sometimes even fearsome, mover and shaker. I was a bit surprised by this change because Dagmar had worked so very well in the others; she's a character I developed a great rapport with. To see her from the perspective of someone else - someone to whom she is a stranger, and quite strange - was disconcerting. It does mean that someone could very easily read this without having read the other two; having read the first two it meant that I had a greater trust than Sean, the narrator, could have in her. Which distanced me slightly from Sean, and meant that I kept expecting great things from Dagmar.
Sean is twenty-something and, as the novel opens, a contestant on Celebrity Pitfighter, which is exactly what you're thinking it is, with the added bonus that every round, there's a surprise handicap. When Sean enters the ring to face Jimmy Blogjoy (!), he steps into a ring covered in cottage cheese. Our Sean qualifies for this edifying programme because he was a child star on a show called Family Tree... a rather long time ago. Since then, he's done bits and pieces, but the reality is that 'washed up' is a kind description. He is hampered partly by a condition called pedomorphosis, which he describes as meaning that "while the rest of [his] body has aged normally, [his] head has retained the features of an infant" (p34). Cute in a kid, decidedly odd in an adult. This is, however, not a problem for the part that Dagmar Shaw wants him to audition for.
In the first two novels, Dagmar was running Alternate Reality games: games that interacted with reality once you'd signed up for it, that worked on a mass level and created huge flashmobs, and which occasionally had real-world implications. With this novel, she has moved to Hollywood and is looking to make her first feature film, although not quite in the way that Sean and his agent expect. The plot therefore revolves around the making of the film, which has two parts: first, the outrageous plans Dagmar has for making the film and changing the very experience of film-watching; second, the dramas on and off set between cast and crew - both of which suggest Williams has some experience of Hollywood and its weirdness.
If this were all the novel offered, it would still be very entertaining. But twisted throughout the novel is a rather curious reflection on the realities of life for Sean, has-been child star. One of the awesome techniques Williams used in previous novels is forum threads between people interacting in Shaw's AR games. There's not quite as much scope for that here, but it's replaced by entries from Sean's blog - because really, what's a has-been celebrity going to do but blog about his has-been-ness? They come complete with comments, from trolls to supporters to spam. In these entries, Sean reflects on how he got to where he is, and particularly about how he was screwed over by his parents. It's a neat way to get into Sean's head a little bit more.
There's also the fact that someone appears to be trying to kill Sean, which becomes quite the mystery for him to unravel. Williams doesn't overplay this aspect, but weaves it too throughout the main narrative.
As mentioned above, I thought I was getting another Dagmar novel, so there was a level of disappointment when she didn't turn out to be as present as I'd hoped. Sean is not as likeable as Dagmar; he's close to being alcoholic, and while he's not quite the ruthless Hollywood shark that some of his friends are, he is well aware of how to play the game, and is generally willing to do just that. I found his cynicism and pessimism somewhat disheartening, if realistic. Happily, though, he's not completely repellant. He's a good friend - usually - and his devotion to acting as a craft, as a lifelong passion, is a joy. Most of the characters do not get particularly fleshed out. Sean's agent is a sleaze and a huckster; many of the showbiz types on the periphery of Sean's world are not quite caricatures - they're individual enough to miss that - but neither do they have much impact. Even Dagmar is shadowy, occasionally looming large and at other times disappearing into the background.
Finally, it's important to discuss the SFnal nature of the book. It's very much what I think of as 'tomorrow fiction': the technology is only just out of reach (probably), and the world as a whole is intensely, sometimes miserably, recognisable. The main technological advance is in the Alternate Reality goggles and other such 'ware, which allows the user to see and interact with content that has been posted not just on the net, but in the 'real' world'. Sadly, most of the time AR seems to be used for ads and porn (see? recognisable and miserable). It's the sort of SF which doesn't always feel like SF, but then a character uses technology or mentions a recent event that sounds plausible, but definitely hasn't happened (...yet...).
It's a fast read, it's a well-structured and pacey read, and it's a lot of fun.
This one is not like the others because Dagmar is not the main protagonist. Instead, she moves onto the sidelines, becoming a somewhat shadowy, sometimes even fearsome, mover and shaker. I was a bit surprised by this change because Dagmar had worked so very well in the others; she's a character I developed a great rapport with. To see her from the perspective of someone else - someone to whom she is a stranger, and quite strange - was disconcerting. It does mean that someone could very easily read this without having read the other two; having read the first two it meant that I had a greater trust than Sean, the narrator, could have in her. Which distanced me slightly from Sean, and meant that I kept expecting great things from Dagmar.
Sean is twenty-something and, as the novel opens, a contestant on Celebrity Pitfighter, which is exactly what you're thinking it is, with the added bonus that every round, there's a surprise handicap. When Sean enters the ring to face Jimmy Blogjoy (!), he steps into a ring covered in cottage cheese. Our Sean qualifies for this edifying programme because he was a child star on a show called Family Tree... a rather long time ago. Since then, he's done bits and pieces, but the reality is that 'washed up' is a kind description. He is hampered partly by a condition called pedomorphosis, which he describes as meaning that "while the rest of [his] body has aged normally, [his] head has retained the features of an infant" (p34). Cute in a kid, decidedly odd in an adult. This is, however, not a problem for the part that Dagmar Shaw wants him to audition for.
In the first two novels, Dagmar was running Alternate Reality games: games that interacted with reality once you'd signed up for it, that worked on a mass level and created huge flashmobs, and which occasionally had real-world implications. With this novel, she has moved to Hollywood and is looking to make her first feature film, although not quite in the way that Sean and his agent expect. The plot therefore revolves around the making of the film, which has two parts: first, the outrageous plans Dagmar has for making the film and changing the very experience of film-watching; second, the dramas on and off set between cast and crew - both of which suggest Williams has some experience of Hollywood and its weirdness.
If this were all the novel offered, it would still be very entertaining. But twisted throughout the novel is a rather curious reflection on the realities of life for Sean, has-been child star. One of the awesome techniques Williams used in previous novels is forum threads between people interacting in Shaw's AR games. There's not quite as much scope for that here, but it's replaced by entries from Sean's blog - because really, what's a has-been celebrity going to do but blog about his has-been-ness? They come complete with comments, from trolls to supporters to spam. In these entries, Sean reflects on how he got to where he is, and particularly about how he was screwed over by his parents. It's a neat way to get into Sean's head a little bit more.
There's also the fact that someone appears to be trying to kill Sean, which becomes quite the mystery for him to unravel. Williams doesn't overplay this aspect, but weaves it too throughout the main narrative.
As mentioned above, I thought I was getting another Dagmar novel, so there was a level of disappointment when she didn't turn out to be as present as I'd hoped. Sean is not as likeable as Dagmar; he's close to being alcoholic, and while he's not quite the ruthless Hollywood shark that some of his friends are, he is well aware of how to play the game, and is generally willing to do just that. I found his cynicism and pessimism somewhat disheartening, if realistic. Happily, though, he's not completely repellant. He's a good friend - usually - and his devotion to acting as a craft, as a lifelong passion, is a joy. Most of the characters do not get particularly fleshed out. Sean's agent is a sleaze and a huckster; many of the showbiz types on the periphery of Sean's world are not quite caricatures - they're individual enough to miss that - but neither do they have much impact. Even Dagmar is shadowy, occasionally looming large and at other times disappearing into the background.
Finally, it's important to discuss the SFnal nature of the book. It's very much what I think of as 'tomorrow fiction': the technology is only just out of reach (probably), and the world as a whole is intensely, sometimes miserably, recognisable. The main technological advance is in the Alternate Reality goggles and other such 'ware, which allows the user to see and interact with content that has been posted not just on the net, but in the 'real' world'. Sadly, most of the time AR seems to be used for ads and porn (see? recognisable and miserable). It's the sort of SF which doesn't always feel like SF, but then a character uses technology or mentions a recent event that sounds plausible, but definitely hasn't happened (...yet...).
It's a fast read, it's a well-structured and pacey read, and it's a lot of fun.
December 26, 2019
The only negative thing I could say about this book is that Dagmar is hardly in it. Instead the focus is Sean Makin, a washed-up child actor now all grown up and trying to rekindle his career. When Dagmar offers him a role in her new movie, he can hardly say yes fast enough. But of course there’s trouble brewing...
January 29, 2019
Its been years since I read either of the earlier books in the series, so it took me a few chapters to get into the story.
I found this one overall enjoyable & had a couple of laughs along the way.
I found this one overall enjoyable & had a couple of laughs along the way.
May 15, 2019
Dagmar Shaw strikes again
Good read. This Is Not a Game & Deep State focus on Dagmar, on whom I have a big crush. She is third person POV in the Fourth Wall. It’s first person POV as told by Sean Makin. He is amiable enough, but I wanted more Dagmar.
Still, a good read.
Good read. This Is Not a Game & Deep State focus on Dagmar, on whom I have a big crush. She is third person POV in the Fourth Wall. It’s first person POV as told by Sean Makin. He is amiable enough, but I wanted more Dagmar.
Still, a good read.
December 28, 2018
Pretty fun, but pitch black and cynical picture of Hollywood actors who are just as self destructive when successful as when they are failures. Weird ARG/world domination thing going on.
May 5, 2020
Dull - too much Hollywood chit-chat and not enough SF. Plus the ending was a bit lame.
May 17, 2024
Can't say I liked the ending but I stayed up all night to get to it.
August 13, 2024
Unconventional but one of the stronger installments in this series.
May 25, 2019
I didn’t like this one as much as the previous two books in the Dagmar trilogy. Dagmar is not the point-of-view character; and despite her good intentions, she’s gone toward the dark side with her elaborate scheme.
The story is astoundingly cynical. The familiar theme of Hollywood being full of shallow, selfish people is definitely present. The narrator is Sean Makin, a former child star with a genetic condition that gives him an appearance not suited toward typical leading man roles. His parents did a number on him—though in some ways, he’s more like them than he seems to realise. Sean isn’t always likeable, but he’s rather complex and can at times be insightful and sympathetic. He does some amazingly selfish and stupid things. It’s not much of a spoiler to reveal that he’s been keeping secret the fact that he hit someone with his car years before and the person died. If he had called 911, she might have been saved; but he was too concerned with protecting himself. In the end, everything is about Sean and what he wants. This is not a story of redemption.
Having multiple killers/attempted killers for multiple reasons in a story is better than having one serial killer mastermind, but it still seems weird that Dagmar ended up with all this stuff going on in her world. Only a small part of it is directly related to her and what she’s doing. (I tend to prefer murder mysteries that involve homicide detectives and/or private detectives, because long ago I lost my ability to suspend disbelief in stories of amateur sleuths/people who’re continually in places where murders are committed.)
The story is astoundingly cynical. The familiar theme of Hollywood being full of shallow, selfish people is definitely present. The narrator is Sean Makin, a former child star with a genetic condition that gives him an appearance not suited toward typical leading man roles. His parents did a number on him—though in some ways, he’s more like them than he seems to realise. Sean isn’t always likeable, but he’s rather complex and can at times be insightful and sympathetic. He does some amazingly selfish and stupid things. It’s not much of a spoiler to reveal that he’s been keeping secret the fact that he hit someone with his car years before and the person died. If he had called 911, she might have been saved; but he was too concerned with protecting himself. In the end, everything is about Sean and what he wants. This is not a story of redemption.
Having multiple killers/attempted killers for multiple reasons in a story is better than having one serial killer mastermind, but it still seems weird that Dagmar ended up with all this stuff going on in her world. Only a small part of it is directly related to her and what she’s doing. (I tend to prefer murder mysteries that involve homicide detectives and/or private detectives, because long ago I lost my ability to suspend disbelief in stories of amateur sleuths/people who’re continually in places where murders are committed.)
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
April 29, 2012
Some really good books take me three weeks, and some take me a week. This is not a measure of literary worth or my enjoyment with the book, it just means that it reads into my brain that much easier. Walter Jon Williams is from New Mexico. I grew up in Flagstaff. His syntax pours into my brain like an IV of lactated ringers into a thirsty soul.
The fourth wall is a Dagmar novel, and I love this tangent. Walter Jon Williams is a versatile writer, a writer who can take on a genre or subgenre with an ease that drives more rigid writers to frustration and envy.
Cyberpunk, Historical Novel, Space Opera, Slipstream, Thriller, Contemporary intrigue,(hell, the dagmar genre is still undefined)William Gibson, Bruce Sterling, and WJW are it. I like it. I wish I could give a cogent review, full of insightful previews and recapitulations, and maybe I will later. I liked it. nuff said. John Jakes probably hates his ass.
The third one in the Dagmar series, this one is different in that it focuses more on the lead character and his redemption. He is a washed up child star with a genetic condition that makes his adult head look like a Klingon's.
Suddenly, after licking his wounds after a particularly rough episode of "Celebrity Pit Fighter," he is contacted by "Great Big Idea," Dagmar's company, and he is invited to audition for a role in an interactive multi-branched cinematic adventure. Intrigue, self-aware comedy, and balls-out craziness ensues.
Walter Jon Williams brings a contemporary immediacy into anything he writes, and this story lives and breaths in your brain. Set in a world that begins the day after tomorrow, all of the characters are familiar to anyone who has happened to watch an episode of TMZ, walking through a world where current technology is puffed into something marvelous and mind-boggling.
Solid extrapolation, amazing dialogue, and realistic action (WJW is a multi-rank black belt). This was a great book. Next please?
The fourth wall is a Dagmar novel, and I love this tangent. Walter Jon Williams is a versatile writer, a writer who can take on a genre or subgenre with an ease that drives more rigid writers to frustration and envy.
Cyberpunk, Historical Novel, Space Opera, Slipstream, Thriller, Contemporary intrigue,(hell, the dagmar genre is still undefined)William Gibson, Bruce Sterling, and WJW are it. I like it. I wish I could give a cogent review, full of insightful previews and recapitulations, and maybe I will later. I liked it. nuff said. John Jakes probably hates his ass.
The third one in the Dagmar series, this one is different in that it focuses more on the lead character and his redemption. He is a washed up child star with a genetic condition that makes his adult head look like a Klingon's.
Suddenly, after licking his wounds after a particularly rough episode of "Celebrity Pit Fighter," he is contacted by "Great Big Idea," Dagmar's company, and he is invited to audition for a role in an interactive multi-branched cinematic adventure. Intrigue, self-aware comedy, and balls-out craziness ensues.
Walter Jon Williams brings a contemporary immediacy into anything he writes, and this story lives and breaths in your brain. Set in a world that begins the day after tomorrow, all of the characters are familiar to anyone who has happened to watch an episode of TMZ, walking through a world where current technology is puffed into something marvelous and mind-boggling.
Solid extrapolation, amazing dialogue, and realistic action (WJW is a multi-rank black belt). This was a great book. Next please?
February 14, 2014
I was introduced to The Fourth Wall by reading Walter Jon Williams’ Big Idea essay over at Whatever. Intrigued by the idea behind the novel, I bought it on pure speculation, as I seem to do quite a bit when I read The Big Idea articles. After all, it’s how I found out about Feed, to name one of the best examples. And much like Feed, The Fourth Wall has a killer opening, which is not entirely appropriate for all readers.
“When you spot someone sitting at the beach wearing a headset for Augmented Reality, or wearing AR specs on the bus, or smiling quietly in the back pew of the church with his video glasses on, what do you think?
I’ll tell you what you think. You think he’s watching porn.“
This sets the tone for pretty much the whole novel: cynical, witty and a bit dark. It’s also hard to classify this novel because just when you think you know what’s going to happen, the plot takes a sharp turn and you’re left mystified once more. You really won’t be able to predict the ending either, which stays true to the dark, cynical atmosphere that Williams maintains throughout the novel.
Sean Makin is a washed-up child actor and even though The Fourth Wall is set in the future, he offers a lot of insight into the cutthroat world of Hollywood. You see both the glamorous side and the incredibly dark side that no one wants to talk about. Sean is the perfect character to tell a story like this because of his dark past and his highly cynical attitude towards life and acting. He has a very sad past that adds a lot of layers to his character, making him a wonderfully three dimensional character. There is no doubt in my mind he is a memorable character.
After enjoying The Fourth Wall so much, I have a feeling I’ll be reading and reviewing a lot more Walter Jon Williams novels in the future.
I give this book 5/5 stars.
“When you spot someone sitting at the beach wearing a headset for Augmented Reality, or wearing AR specs on the bus, or smiling quietly in the back pew of the church with his video glasses on, what do you think?
I’ll tell you what you think. You think he’s watching porn.“
This sets the tone for pretty much the whole novel: cynical, witty and a bit dark. It’s also hard to classify this novel because just when you think you know what’s going to happen, the plot takes a sharp turn and you’re left mystified once more. You really won’t be able to predict the ending either, which stays true to the dark, cynical atmosphere that Williams maintains throughout the novel.
Sean Makin is a washed-up child actor and even though The Fourth Wall is set in the future, he offers a lot of insight into the cutthroat world of Hollywood. You see both the glamorous side and the incredibly dark side that no one wants to talk about. Sean is the perfect character to tell a story like this because of his dark past and his highly cynical attitude towards life and acting. He has a very sad past that adds a lot of layers to his character, making him a wonderfully three dimensional character. There is no doubt in my mind he is a memorable character.
After enjoying The Fourth Wall so much, I have a feeling I’ll be reading and reviewing a lot more Walter Jon Williams novels in the future.
I give this book 5/5 stars.
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