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Elegie romane - Epigrammi veneziani
Goethe verfasste sie nach seiner Rückkehr von der Italienischen Reise 1788 bis Ende 1790 und veröffentlichte 1795 zunächst zwanzig davon in Schillers Monatsschrift „Die Horen“. Johann Gottfried Herder sah sich aufgrund der erotischen Freizügigkeit der Gedichte zu der bissigen Bemerkung veranlasst, die „Horen“ müssten nun mit einem „u“ gedruckt werden. Vier Elegien (die II., die XVI. sowie die zwei „priapischen“ Elegien) hielt Goethe zurück (was Schiller bei der – ursprünglich – zweiten Elegie bedauerte), da sie besonders „rüstige“ Stellen enthielten. Dabei wurde die ursprünglich vierte Elegie an die zweite Stelle versetzt. Goethe überarbeitete die 20 verbliebenen in metrischer Hinsicht für die Ausgabe des Jahres 1800 mit Hilfe von August Wilhelm Schlegel. Die Elegien erschienen erstmals 1914 ungekürzt in der Weimarer Ausgabe von Goethes Werken (Band 53).
100 pages, Mass Market Paperback
First published January 1, 1795
49 people are currently reading
839 people want to read
About the author
Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
13.3k books6,918 followersA master of poetry, drama, and the novel, German writer and scientist Johann Wolfgang von Goethe spent 50 years on his two-part dramatic poem
Faust
, published in 1808 and 1832, also conducted scientific research in various fields, notably botany, and held several governmental positions.
George Eliot called him "Germany's greatest man of letters... and the last true polymath to walk the earth." Works span the fields of literature, theology, and humanism.
People laud this magnum opus as one of the peaks of world literature. Other well-known literary works include his numerous poems, the Bildungsroman Wilhelm Meister's Apprenticeship and the epistolary novel The Sorrows of Young Werther .
With this key figure of German literature, the movement of Weimar classicism in the late 18th and early 19th centuries coincided with Enlightenment, sentimentality (Empfindsamkeit), Sturm und Drang, and Romanticism. The author of the scientific text Theory of Colours , he influenced Darwin with his focus on plant morphology. He also long served as the privy councilor ("Geheimrat") of the duchy of Weimar.
Goethe took great interest in the literatures of England, France, Italy, classical Greece, Persia, and Arabia and originated the concept of Weltliteratur ("world literature"). Despite his major, virtually immeasurable influence on German philosophy especially on the generation of Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel and Friedrich Wilhelm Joseph von Schelling, he expressly and decidedly refrained from practicing philosophy in the rarefied sense.
Influence spread across Europe, and for the next century, his works inspired much music, drama, poetry and philosophy. Many persons consider Goethe the most important writer in the German language and one of the most important thinkers in western culture as well. Early in his career, however, he wondered about painting, perhaps his true vocation; late in his life, he expressed the expectation that people ultimately would remember his work in optics.
George Eliot called him "Germany's greatest man of letters... and the last true polymath to walk the earth." Works span the fields of literature, theology, and humanism.
People laud this magnum opus as one of the peaks of world literature. Other well-known literary works include his numerous poems, the Bildungsroman Wilhelm Meister's Apprenticeship and the epistolary novel The Sorrows of Young Werther .
With this key figure of German literature, the movement of Weimar classicism in the late 18th and early 19th centuries coincided with Enlightenment, sentimentality (Empfindsamkeit), Sturm und Drang, and Romanticism. The author of the scientific text Theory of Colours , he influenced Darwin with his focus on plant morphology. He also long served as the privy councilor ("Geheimrat") of the duchy of Weimar.
Goethe took great interest in the literatures of England, France, Italy, classical Greece, Persia, and Arabia and originated the concept of Weltliteratur ("world literature"). Despite his major, virtually immeasurable influence on German philosophy especially on the generation of Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel and Friedrich Wilhelm Joseph von Schelling, he expressly and decidedly refrained from practicing philosophy in the rarefied sense.
Influence spread across Europe, and for the next century, his works inspired much music, drama, poetry and philosophy. Many persons consider Goethe the most important writer in the German language and one of the most important thinkers in western culture as well. Early in his career, however, he wondered about painting, perhaps his true vocation; late in his life, he expressed the expectation that people ultimately would remember his work in optics.
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 63 reviews
May 5, 2018
I can tell not only about a discomfort far greater than others,
But of a horror besides, thinking of which will arouse
Every fiber in me to revulsion. My friends, I confess it:
Great displeasure I take lying alone in my bed.
But it's a horror to fear on the pathways of love you'll discover
Snakes and their venom beneath roses of eager desire—
That at the moment supreme, when I'm yielding to pleasure so fully,
Right at my head as it droops, hissing disease may approach.
That's why Faustina as my companion in bed makes me happy:
Loving she always remains faithful, as I am to her.
Young men are aroused in their passions by obstacles and by excitement;
I prefer to go slow, savoring pleasures secure.
Is it not bliss to exchange tender kisses containing no dangers,
Sucking into our lungs, carefree, our partner's own life?
That is the way our long nights of enjoyment are passed. We listen,
Breast against breast, to the storm, pouring down rain in the wind
Morning begins to dawn, we expect from these hours approaching
Blossoms that will adorn festive the coming new day.
Quirites, permit me the joy, and may this, of all pleasures on earth the
First and the last, be vouchsafed all of mankind by the god.
But of a horror besides, thinking of which will arouse
Every fiber in me to revulsion. My friends, I confess it:
Great displeasure I take lying alone in my bed.
But it's a horror to fear on the pathways of love you'll discover
Snakes and their venom beneath roses of eager desire—
That at the moment supreme, when I'm yielding to pleasure so fully,
Right at my head as it droops, hissing disease may approach.
That's why Faustina as my companion in bed makes me happy:
Loving she always remains faithful, as I am to her.
Young men are aroused in their passions by obstacles and by excitement;
I prefer to go slow, savoring pleasures secure.
Is it not bliss to exchange tender kisses containing no dangers,
Sucking into our lungs, carefree, our partner's own life?
That is the way our long nights of enjoyment are passed. We listen,
Breast against breast, to the storm, pouring down rain in the wind
Morning begins to dawn, we expect from these hours approaching
Blossoms that will adorn festive the coming new day.
Quirites, permit me the joy, and may this, of all pleasures on earth the
First and the last, be vouchsafed all of mankind by the god.
September 1, 2018
il Faust è puerile, il Werther noioso, le affinità elettive poco interessanti per una persona come me. se devo scegliere il mio Goethe, io so che sceglierò per sempre le "Elegie romane". Le lessi la prima volta a 15 anni nella traduzione di Pirandello, e le rilessi qualche anno dopo, nel periodo universitario romano, tanto che ritrovo sul retro della copertina una poesia intitolata "Roma" che scrissi a 18 anni, e che è smaccatamente goethiana nella voce.
Non più versi, ma strade
che rimano al vento case
che moltiplicano case
infinite ed uguali.
Nel quartiere la quiete,
regina pallida di questo mondo
un tempo, il mondo.
basti vedere i versi della prima elegia:
In vero, o Roma, un mondo sei tu; ma pur senza l'amore
Non saria mondo il mondo, e nemmen Roma, Roma.
un uomo di esperienza, non più giovanissimo, che viene dal grigio "Norte" ad apprezzare la bellezza di Roma, a scandire esametri sulla schiena di una dolce fanciulla, a sedurla. Ma quel che sa è che lei viene sedotta da quel che ha fatto, non da quel che lui è. Lei si offre come concubina, e non come amante; e lui accetta, accetta di amare e non essere amato. Accetta questo dono che l'età gli regala, le elegie sono le memorie delle sue puttane tristi, e non si lascia illividire dalla smania dell'esercizio del potere. come Agostino, ama, e fa ciò che vuole. come la Dickinson, dwell in possibility, abita nella possibilità.
Non più versi, ma strade
che rimano al vento case
che moltiplicano case
infinite ed uguali.
Nel quartiere la quiete,
regina pallida di questo mondo
un tempo, il mondo.
basti vedere i versi della prima elegia:
In vero, o Roma, un mondo sei tu; ma pur senza l'amore
Non saria mondo il mondo, e nemmen Roma, Roma.
un uomo di esperienza, non più giovanissimo, che viene dal grigio "Norte" ad apprezzare la bellezza di Roma, a scandire esametri sulla schiena di una dolce fanciulla, a sedurla. Ma quel che sa è che lei viene sedotta da quel che ha fatto, non da quel che lui è. Lei si offre come concubina, e non come amante; e lui accetta, accetta di amare e non essere amato. Accetta questo dono che l'età gli regala, le elegie sono le memorie delle sue puttane tristi, e non si lascia illividire dalla smania dell'esercizio del potere. come Agostino, ama, e fa ciò che vuole. come la Dickinson, dwell in possibility, abita nella possibilità.
February 7, 2017
Good poems and massive poetic devices.
I like as it flows from persons to god.
From Germany to Rome.
Good lines-
*"World would not be the world,
Rome would cease to be Rome."
*"'In the end you poor girls are the ones who are sure to be cheated.' So said my father although"*Boy, won't you light me a lamp. "But dear master, there's light in the sky yet
Don't waste your oil and the wick. Don't close the shutters so soon
Only the houses are blocking the sun there, it's not yet the mountains
Until the curfew shall ring, full half an hour must pass." Wretched young fellow, be gone and obey me!
My loved one is coming
I like as it flows from persons to god.
From Germany to Rome.
Good lines-
*"World would not be the world,
Rome would cease to be Rome."
*"'In the end you poor girls are the ones who are sure to be cheated.' So said my father although"*Boy, won't you light me a lamp. "But dear master, there's light in the sky yet
Don't waste your oil and the wick. Don't close the shutters so soon
Only the houses are blocking the sun there, it's not yet the mountains
Until the curfew shall ring, full half an hour must pass." Wretched young fellow, be gone and obey me!
My loved one is coming
June 10, 2018
Common folks lighten up!
A classy dirty book, a poem (Actually 24 poems) at AND by a German. If only all of Goethe’s writing was this easy. I am tempted at this point to append: Life is Good. Let there be no mincing about the title, Erotica Romana is not and never was Roman Elegies. It is Roman Erotica. Autobiographical, classically tuned whatever, this is about a semi-impoverished student, a visitor to Rome who is getting his ashes hauled.
Think of it this way, from now on you get to say “Yes, I have read Goerthe”. No one needs to know it was this beautiful little romp. In fact I have also read his, https://www.amazon.com/Faust-Johann-W... , but that was decades ago , part of a class wherein we read several tellings of the Dr. Faust story. I do not remember more than the fact that every word passed before my eyes. Maybe the fun I had with this one will motivate me to give this German altakocker another read.
Excuse me while I am slightly more serious. These are beautiful and tender poems. Every aspect of them speak of a gentle if aroused spirit. .Generally I do not do well with poetry, my fault, however these poems are exceptional. There is art here and humanity. I cannot promise that I caught every literary allusion, but the context was usually such that a person who was up on the more famous myths could bluff their way past.
Our boy is in Rome. He keeps trying to tell us about the beauty of its classical heritage, and he makes some learned allusions to various of the great stories from the Roman mythologies. A careful reader will want to have some good references about to insure they do not miss what they add to the narrative. Whatever his determination to keep his thoughts, above the waist, he cannot but tell us about his assignations and the pleasure he shares with his mistress.
The language, at least in this translation is clear enough. It is never, crude or anatomical as to be pornographic. It is not milady’s maidenly blushes or her innocent coquettishness. It is in his joy in their conjoined naked flesh under the guidance of Eros (He specifically denies any involvement by Cupid) towards which our young man's fancy lightly turns.
Decidedly not bed time reading for the kinder. Not a bad idea for the adult bed room with the plus that you can name drop one of the great authors. And yes this work is proof that Goethe was a literary great.
A classy dirty book, a poem (Actually 24 poems) at AND by a German. If only all of Goethe’s writing was this easy. I am tempted at this point to append: Life is Good. Let there be no mincing about the title, Erotica Romana is not and never was Roman Elegies. It is Roman Erotica. Autobiographical, classically tuned whatever, this is about a semi-impoverished student, a visitor to Rome who is getting his ashes hauled.
Think of it this way, from now on you get to say “Yes, I have read Goerthe”. No one needs to know it was this beautiful little romp. In fact I have also read his, https://www.amazon.com/Faust-Johann-W... , but that was decades ago , part of a class wherein we read several tellings of the Dr. Faust story. I do not remember more than the fact that every word passed before my eyes. Maybe the fun I had with this one will motivate me to give this German altakocker another read.
Excuse me while I am slightly more serious. These are beautiful and tender poems. Every aspect of them speak of a gentle if aroused spirit. .Generally I do not do well with poetry, my fault, however these poems are exceptional. There is art here and humanity. I cannot promise that I caught every literary allusion, but the context was usually such that a person who was up on the more famous myths could bluff their way past.
Our boy is in Rome. He keeps trying to tell us about the beauty of its classical heritage, and he makes some learned allusions to various of the great stories from the Roman mythologies. A careful reader will want to have some good references about to insure they do not miss what they add to the narrative. Whatever his determination to keep his thoughts, above the waist, he cannot but tell us about his assignations and the pleasure he shares with his mistress.
The language, at least in this translation is clear enough. It is never, crude or anatomical as to be pornographic. It is not milady’s maidenly blushes or her innocent coquettishness. It is in his joy in their conjoined naked flesh under the guidance of Eros (He specifically denies any involvement by Cupid) towards which our young man's fancy lightly turns.
Decidedly not bed time reading for the kinder. Not a bad idea for the adult bed room with the plus that you can name drop one of the great authors. And yes this work is proof that Goethe was a literary great.
May 29, 2016
Cito el prefacio de Jesús Munárriz, traductor y editor de este volumen: "Cuando Goethe entregó a Schiller estas "Elegías romanas" para su publicación en la revista 'Die Horen', éste, probablemente escandalizado por algunos de los poemas, se los dio a leer también a Herder, quien cometnó que si los publicaba, su revista pasaría de ser conocida como 'Die horen' (Las horas) a ser llamada 'Die Huren' (Las putas)'.
Poesía amorosa, basada en los metros clásicos latinos, en esta traducción Jesús Munárriz sigue la clásica tradición de sustituir los pies de la poesía grecolatina (divididos en "cortos" y "largos") por los ritmos acentuales. Renuncia, por tanto, a la rima como elemento rítmico, buscando parecerse más a los modelos clásicos.
Y ahora, toca revisar la sustancia poética: el contraste entre el mediodía latino y el norte oscuro, el reflejo de los poetas clásicos, los temas mitológicos como imágenes poéticas para reflejar sus vivencias amorosas... Todo ello hacen de esta breve colección de poemas una auténtica delicia.
Eso sí, algunos de sus poemas son claramente eróticos. Y por cierto, deliciosos.
Poesía amorosa, basada en los metros clásicos latinos, en esta traducción Jesús Munárriz sigue la clásica tradición de sustituir los pies de la poesía grecolatina (divididos en "cortos" y "largos") por los ritmos acentuales. Renuncia, por tanto, a la rima como elemento rítmico, buscando parecerse más a los modelos clásicos.
Y ahora, toca revisar la sustancia poética: el contraste entre el mediodía latino y el norte oscuro, el reflejo de los poetas clásicos, los temas mitológicos como imágenes poéticas para reflejar sus vivencias amorosas... Todo ello hacen de esta breve colección de poemas una auténtica delicia.
Eso sí, algunos de sus poemas son claramente eróticos. Y por cierto, deliciosos.
July 15, 2014
Goethe was a name I'd encountered in passing, primarily as a philosopher, but I'd never read. after reading this one poem it's something I intend to rectify.
I am one of the most unromantic, unsentimental people around. hearts and flowers aren't for me. This poem doesn't have them. It has love, passion, adoration, care and understanding. He intertwines Amor and Roma with his love and passion for his then-secret lover as well his love of Classics and of his work.
What other poets supply with hearts and flowers, Goethe supplies with real emotion. I was almost in his lover's bed with him. A woman who was also a giver in the relationship, and not just a passive receiver of his amorous attention. (I've since found out that this was probably Christiane Vulpius, his lover for 18 years before they finally married, and, it seems, a very strong woman.)
It made me smile and feel the warmth, one of the most unromantic people about.
The Classical allusions shouldn't get in the way, even if you're unfamiliar with them.
I am one of the most unromantic, unsentimental people around. hearts and flowers aren't for me. This poem doesn't have them. It has love, passion, adoration, care and understanding. He intertwines Amor and Roma with his love and passion for his then-secret lover as well his love of Classics and of his work.
What other poets supply with hearts and flowers, Goethe supplies with real emotion. I was almost in his lover's bed with him. A woman who was also a giver in the relationship, and not just a passive receiver of his amorous attention. (I've since found out that this was probably Christiane Vulpius, his lover for 18 years before they finally married, and, it seems, a very strong woman.)
It made me smile and feel the warmth, one of the most unromantic people about.
The Classical allusions shouldn't get in the way, even if you're unfamiliar with them.
March 13, 2014
Heard about this poem from a friend. I'm not used to reading a book that's written the way this was. The wording/writing style alone will put some ppl off. I didn't ''get'' most of it, but I did understand some and got the gist of it. I'm rating it like I did because it was well written, that is to say others more adapt to this writing style like Shakespeare will probably love it! I did like the intimacy scenes and how they were written. So that's another reason for my rating.
September 2, 2015
The Roman Elegies first produced as the Erotica Romana, is a collection of twentyfour poems of an erotic sexual nature depicting the Italian and classical cultures of the time. There are also erotic poems to the author's lover whom he picked up in his travles. I would recommend this to all. The language and structure of the poems are beautiful and grand.
Enjoy and Be Blessed.
Diamond
Enjoy and Be Blessed.
Diamond
September 8, 2020
Best enjoyed slowly. Written, not spoken, if you get my drift.
Read
September 11, 2023Rome - admired, Venice - disdained, girls - seduced (hotel - trivago)
May 15, 2013
It is a good thing I had recently refreshed my knowledge of greco-roman mythology, otherwise the majority of the poems would have remained pretty opaque. The Roman Elegies mark a turning point in Goethe's bibliography, and biography as he was rediscovering the love for his art, living and, most importantly the fair sex. They also mark the beginning of his collaboration and friendship with Schiller.
The contents of the poems will not be considered scandalous anymore by the modern reader, but even aside from their significance for the poet's work they still make for a very enjoyable read.
The contents of the poems will not be considered scandalous anymore by the modern reader, but even aside from their significance for the poet's work they still make for a very enjoyable read.
October 11, 2013
'Let my thoughts rest on your form!
Please close your eyes. They're inebriation, confusion, they rob me
All too soon of the joy quiet reflection affords.'
It's so beautiful you want to keep going back to it, reading some certain stanzas over and over again. Like visual beauty, you don't get tired of it. Rich and moving too. Touches you deeply if you're in love, or if you want to fall in love (what a cheesy thing to say, but it's true!)
Another good thing is that it's free in Kindle Store.
'Rome thou art a whole world, it is true, and yet without love this
World would not be the world, Rome would cease to be Rome.'
Please close your eyes. They're inebriation, confusion, they rob me
All too soon of the joy quiet reflection affords.'
It's so beautiful you want to keep going back to it, reading some certain stanzas over and over again. Like visual beauty, you don't get tired of it. Rich and moving too. Touches you deeply if you're in love, or if you want to fall in love (what a cheesy thing to say, but it's true!)
Another good thing is that it's free in Kindle Store.
'Rome thou art a whole world, it is true, and yet without love this
World would not be the world, Rome would cease to be Rome.'
May 28, 2017
The Sorrows of young Goethe
February 3, 2025
Beautiful and heart warming poems that pair perfectly with a cup of coffee and a scenic view.
May 10, 2025
من مرثیههای رومی از اینجا خوندم
https://www.poetryintranslation.com/P...
مرثیههای رومی مجموعهای از ۲۴ شعر اروتیک و کلاسیک نوشته گوتهست که بین سالهای ۱۷۸۸ تا ۱۷۹۰ بعد از سفرش به ایتالیا (۱۷۸۶-۱۷۸۸)، سروده.
مرثیههای رومی گوته در نسخه اصلی شامل ۲۴ شعر بود اما وقتی گوته این اشعار رو برای انتشار در مجله Die Horen شیلر آماده کرد، به دلیل محتوای خیلی صریح اروتیک بعضی از اشعار، شیلر و گوته تصمیم گرفتن چهار شعر رو حذف کنن.
این اشعار ابتدا با عنوان Erotica Romana در مجله Die Horen شیلر در سال ۱۷۹۵ منتشر شدن. اشعار حس و حال فرهنگ ایتالیایی و کلاسیک رو منتقل میکنن و به موضوعات عاشقانه و لذتجویانه میپردازن.
در این اشعار گوته از تجربیات شخصی خودش، از جمله روابط عاشقانه، الهام گرفته. با این حال، مرز بین واقعیت و تخیل در این اشعار مشخص نیست، چون گوته خودش آثارش رو ترکیبی از «شعر و حقیقت» توصیف کرده.
توصیفات گوته در این شعر خیلی زنده و حسی هستن. مثلاً میگه: «وقتی او را در آغوش میگیرم، انگار مرمر سرد مجسمههای باستانی گرم میشود و جان میگیرد.» این ترکیب از سردی سنگ و گرمای عشق واقعاً زیباست و نشون میده چطور گوته تجربه شخصی رو با فرهنگ کلاسیک پیوند میزنه.
همینطور شعر پر از ارجاعات به فضای رم، مثل معابد، مجسمهها، و حس آزادی و لذتجوییه که گوته در سفرش به ایتالیا کشف کرد. این باعث میشه شعر هم شخصی باشه هم جهانی.
یک چیزی هم اضافه کنم: وقتی اشعار رومی گوته رو میخوندم، بیش از همه اصالت گوته در ابراز عشق توجهم رو جلب کرد. مثلا گوته در مرثیه سیزدهم، رم رو با نور طلایی غروب و زمزمه دیوارهای باستانی توصیف میکنه، انگار کلمات رو از عمق قلبش تراشیده، این صداقت شاعرانه امروز کمیابه.... در دنیای مدرن، شبکههای اجتماعی عشق رو به ژستهای تقلیدی از فیلمها یا پستهای نمایشی اینستاگرام تقلیل دادن، جایی که ابراز احساسات کمتر شخصی و منحصربهفرده. هرچند گوته از شاعران رومی الهام گرفت، اما با خلاقیتش این قالبها رو به اثری زنده تبدیل کرده.
زمانه عوض شده، اما گوته نشون میده که عشق واقعی در اصالت و صداقت نهفتهست.
https://www.poetryintranslation.com/P...
مرثیههای رومی مجموعهای از ۲۴ شعر اروتیک و کلاسیک نوشته گوتهست که بین سالهای ۱۷۸۸ تا ۱۷۹۰ بعد از سفرش به ایتالیا (۱۷۸۶-۱۷۸۸)، سروده.
مرثیههای رومی گوته در نسخه اصلی شامل ۲۴ شعر بود اما وقتی گوته این اشعار رو برای انتشار در مجله Die Horen شیلر آماده کرد، به دلیل محتوای خیلی صریح اروتیک بعضی از اشعار، شیلر و گوته تصمیم گرفتن چهار شعر رو حذف کنن.
این اشعار ابتدا با عنوان Erotica Romana در مجله Die Horen شیلر در سال ۱۷۹۵ منتشر شدن. اشعار حس و حال فرهنگ ایتالیایی و کلاسیک رو منتقل میکنن و به موضوعات عاشقانه و لذتجویانه میپردازن.
در این اشعار گوته از تجربیات شخصی خودش، از جمله روابط عاشقانه، الهام گرفته. با این حال، مرز بین واقعیت و تخیل در این اشعار مشخص نیست، چون گوته خودش آثارش رو ترکیبی از «شعر و حقیقت» توصیف کرده.
توصیفات گوته در این شعر خیلی زنده و حسی هستن. مثلاً میگه: «وقتی او را در آغوش میگیرم، انگار مرمر سرد مجسمههای باستانی گرم میشود و جان میگیرد.» این ترکیب از سردی سنگ و گرمای عشق واقعاً زیباست و نشون میده چطور گوته تجربه شخصی رو با فرهنگ کلاسیک پیوند میزنه.
همینطور شعر پر از ارجاعات به فضای رم، مثل معابد، مجسمهها، و حس آزادی و لذتجوییه که گوته در سفرش به ایتالیا کشف کرد. این باعث میشه شعر هم شخصی باشه هم جهانی.
یک چیزی هم اضافه کنم: وقتی اشعار رومی گوته رو میخوندم، بیش از همه اصالت گوته در ابراز عشق توجهم رو جلب کرد. مثلا گوته در مرثیه سیزدهم، رم رو با نور طلایی غروب و زمزمه دیوارهای باستانی توصیف میکنه، انگار کلمات رو از عمق قلبش تراشیده، این صداقت شاعرانه امروز کمیابه.... در دنیای مدرن، شبکههای اجتماعی عشق رو به ژستهای تقلیدی از فیلمها یا پستهای نمایشی اینستاگرام تقلیل دادن، جایی که ابراز احساسات کمتر شخصی و منحصربهفرده. هرچند گوته از شاعران رومی الهام گرفت، اما با خلاقیتش این قالبها رو به اثری زنده تبدیل کرده.
زمانه عوض شده، اما گوته نشون میده که عشق واقعی در اصالت و صداقت نهفتهست.
July 19, 2022
I gave only 3 stars, because I prefer other works of the same author. I’d recommend to read the Elective Affinities or The Sorrows of Young Werther, they are way better than this collection of poems.
June 6, 2023
If it was supposed to be humor, maybe it would have been slightly amusing?
November 19, 2023
Goethe sa essere splendidamente lirico, elevato, poetico, ma anche dolce e divertente. Bellissime poesie
August 13, 2016
The epilogue was shocking. I didn't expect something like that from him:
...
Nor do the girls take offense when they see me--by no means the matrons.
None finds me ugly today, though I am monstrously strong.
Half a foot long, as reward, your glorious rod (dear poet)
Proudly shall strut from your loins, when but your dearest commands,
Nor shall your member grow weary until you've enjoyed the full dozen
Artful positions the great poet Philainis describes.
The prologue, the epilogue the 3rd and the 7th poem weren't published in the first edition released in 1795, because at the time they were considered obscene. Only in 1914 the full cycle of poems was published, using the version Goethe made for the 1800 edition.
Some beautiful erotic scenes:
From the 3rd poem:
What would you give to me more? --You, Nipotina, what yours?
Banquets and game tables, operas, balls, promenades down the Corso?
These but deprive my sweet boy of his most opportune times.
Finery, haughtiness do not entice me. Does one not lift a
Gown of the finest brocade just as one lifts common wool?
If she's to press in comfort a lover against that soft bosom,
Doesn't he want her to be free from all brooches and chains?
Must not the jewelry, and then the lace and the bustles and whalebone
All of it come off entire, if he's to learn how she feels?
I encounter no troubles like those. Simple dress of rough homespun,
At but a lover's mere touch, tumbles in folds to the floor.
Quickly he carries the girl as she's clad in chemise of coarse linen--
Just as a nursemaid might, playfully up to her bed.
Drapings of satin are absent; the mattress is quite unembroidered.
Large is this room where the bed offers its comfort for two.
Jupiter's welcome to more from his Juno if he can get it;
Let any mortal find rest, softer, wherever he can.
We are content with Cupid's delights, authentic and naked--
And with the exquisite creak /crack of the bed as it rocks.
From the 7th poem:
Do then I not become wise when I trace with my eye her sweet bosom's
Form, and the line of her hips stroke with my hand? I acquire,
As I reflect and compare, my first understanding of marble,
See with an eye that feels, feel with a hand that sees.
While my beloved, I grant it, deprives me of moments of daylight,
She in the nighttime hours gives compensation in full.
And we do more than just kiss; we prosecute reasoned discussions
(Should she succumb to sleep, that gives me time for my thoughts).
In her embrace--it's by no means unusual--I've composed poems
And the hexameter's beat gently tapped out on her back,
Fingertips counting in time with the sweet rhythmic breath of her slumber.
Air from deep in her breast penetrates mine and there burns.
Cupid, while stirring the flame in our lamp, no doubt thinks of those days when
For the triumvirs he similar service performed.
From the 23rd poem:
Mine is a secret more pleasant, but even more difficult keeping:
Out of abundance of heart eagerly speaketh my mouth.
None of my ladyfriends dare I confide in, for they would but chide me;
Nor any gentleman friend, lest he be rival to me.
Rapture proclaim to the grove, to the echoing cliffs perorate it?
One can do that if one's young, or if one's lonely enough.
I to hexameters tell, in pentameters I will confide it:
During the day she was joy, happiness all the night long.
Courted by so many suitors, avoided the snares that were set her
Now by one bolder than I, now by another in guile,
Cleverly, daintily, always slipped past them, and sure of the byways,
Comes to her lover's embrace, where he so eagerly waits.
Luna! Don't rise yet. She's coming, and must not be seen by the neighbor!
Breezes, rustle the leaves: muffle the sound of her feet.
And as for you, little poems, o grow and flower, your blossoms
Cradling themselves in the air, tepid and soft with love's breath.
Wafting, betray to Quirites, as Midas' reeds did with cheap gossip,
One happy couple in love, and their sweet secret, at last.
...
Nor do the girls take offense when they see me--by no means the matrons.
None finds me ugly today, though I am monstrously strong.
Half a foot long, as reward, your glorious rod (dear poet)
Proudly shall strut from your loins, when but your dearest commands,
Nor shall your member grow weary until you've enjoyed the full dozen
Artful positions the great poet Philainis describes.
The prologue, the epilogue the 3rd and the 7th poem weren't published in the first edition released in 1795, because at the time they were considered obscene. Only in 1914 the full cycle of poems was published, using the version Goethe made for the 1800 edition.
Some beautiful erotic scenes:
From the 3rd poem:
What would you give to me more? --You, Nipotina, what yours?
Banquets and game tables, operas, balls, promenades down the Corso?
These but deprive my sweet boy of his most opportune times.
Finery, haughtiness do not entice me. Does one not lift a
Gown of the finest brocade just as one lifts common wool?
If she's to press in comfort a lover against that soft bosom,
Doesn't he want her to be free from all brooches and chains?
Must not the jewelry, and then the lace and the bustles and whalebone
All of it come off entire, if he's to learn how she feels?
I encounter no troubles like those. Simple dress of rough homespun,
At but a lover's mere touch, tumbles in folds to the floor.
Quickly he carries the girl as she's clad in chemise of coarse linen--
Just as a nursemaid might, playfully up to her bed.
Drapings of satin are absent; the mattress is quite unembroidered.
Large is this room where the bed offers its comfort for two.
Jupiter's welcome to more from his Juno if he can get it;
Let any mortal find rest, softer, wherever he can.
We are content with Cupid's delights, authentic and naked--
And with the exquisite creak /crack of the bed as it rocks.
From the 7th poem:
Do then I not become wise when I trace with my eye her sweet bosom's
Form, and the line of her hips stroke with my hand? I acquire,
As I reflect and compare, my first understanding of marble,
See with an eye that feels, feel with a hand that sees.
While my beloved, I grant it, deprives me of moments of daylight,
She in the nighttime hours gives compensation in full.
And we do more than just kiss; we prosecute reasoned discussions
(Should she succumb to sleep, that gives me time for my thoughts).
In her embrace--it's by no means unusual--I've composed poems
And the hexameter's beat gently tapped out on her back,
Fingertips counting in time with the sweet rhythmic breath of her slumber.
Air from deep in her breast penetrates mine and there burns.
Cupid, while stirring the flame in our lamp, no doubt thinks of those days when
For the triumvirs he similar service performed.
From the 23rd poem:
Mine is a secret more pleasant, but even more difficult keeping:
Out of abundance of heart eagerly speaketh my mouth.
None of my ladyfriends dare I confide in, for they would but chide me;
Nor any gentleman friend, lest he be rival to me.
Rapture proclaim to the grove, to the echoing cliffs perorate it?
One can do that if one's young, or if one's lonely enough.
I to hexameters tell, in pentameters I will confide it:
During the day she was joy, happiness all the night long.
Courted by so many suitors, avoided the snares that were set her
Now by one bolder than I, now by another in guile,
Cleverly, daintily, always slipped past them, and sure of the byways,
Comes to her lover's embrace, where he so eagerly waits.
Luna! Don't rise yet. She's coming, and must not be seen by the neighbor!
Breezes, rustle the leaves: muffle the sound of her feet.
And as for you, little poems, o grow and flower, your blossoms
Cradling themselves in the air, tepid and soft with love's breath.
Wafting, betray to Quirites, as Midas' reeds did with cheap gossip,
One happy couple in love, and their sweet secret, at last.
January 11, 2023
The writing is so beautiful and technically brilliant - even if I don't understand a lot of it. My favourite line was "there's a soul in each object" - II
I enjoyed that he brought up Werther "How many times have I cursed those frivolous pages that broadcast / Out among all mankind passions I felt in my youth // Were he my brother, why then I'd have murdered poor Werther / Yet his despondent ghost couldn't have sought worse revenge" IV
The controversy around the book drew me in. "When gods and goddesses in days of heroes made love" V is an interesting line because it alludes to the sterility and prudence that came with Christianity. The significant change (that I should really research into) from polytheism to a single God. Humans using gods to guide behaviour - as if guided by a higher truth. The sex is obviously controversial but there is also a disloyalty in loving lovers above god, or loving other gods who may be "unprincipled" (XV) as Goethe describes Cupid
The religious obsession with sex is probably to control something that has power over humans - an innate drive. Sex being part of romantic love which is also controlled - who to love and how to love. In romantic love there are so many unknown factors and possibilities. And knowing the power of love, the sacrifices people make, the insanity that often comes with romantic love, it can lead to a place of chaos. There is much unknown, uncertain, chaotic, and potentially dangerous which makes a valid fear of romantic love. When there is fear in uncertainty its best to erase all the possibilities to create a single rule (just as their is a single god with a set of commands) To keep things in order, to control sexual selection, to control love, to control coupling and family organisation. Its crazy to think of the extremes that were taken to preserve dogma and control the masses. But malice aside, there is also a more innocent desire for certainty, meaning, and purpose, and wanting that to be justified and affirmed
Fun read and now I want to read Schiller who published the work in his literary journal Die Horen
I enjoyed that he brought up Werther "How many times have I cursed those frivolous pages that broadcast / Out among all mankind passions I felt in my youth // Were he my brother, why then I'd have murdered poor Werther / Yet his despondent ghost couldn't have sought worse revenge" IV
The controversy around the book drew me in. "When gods and goddesses in days of heroes made love" V is an interesting line because it alludes to the sterility and prudence that came with Christianity. The significant change (that I should really research into) from polytheism to a single God. Humans using gods to guide behaviour - as if guided by a higher truth. The sex is obviously controversial but there is also a disloyalty in loving lovers above god, or loving other gods who may be "unprincipled" (XV) as Goethe describes Cupid
The religious obsession with sex is probably to control something that has power over humans - an innate drive. Sex being part of romantic love which is also controlled - who to love and how to love. In romantic love there are so many unknown factors and possibilities. And knowing the power of love, the sacrifices people make, the insanity that often comes with romantic love, it can lead to a place of chaos. There is much unknown, uncertain, chaotic, and potentially dangerous which makes a valid fear of romantic love. When there is fear in uncertainty its best to erase all the possibilities to create a single rule (just as their is a single god with a set of commands) To keep things in order, to control sexual selection, to control love, to control coupling and family organisation. Its crazy to think of the extremes that were taken to preserve dogma and control the masses. But malice aside, there is also a more innocent desire for certainty, meaning, and purpose, and wanting that to be justified and affirmed
Fun read and now I want to read Schiller who published the work in his literary journal Die Horen
March 12, 2024
ELEGÍAS ROMANAS (1789-1791) son una serie de composiciones poéticas que Goethe escribió durante su viaje por Italia. Así es, cuando se le terminó el curro de ser funcionario del duque (?) Se dedicó durante dos años a pasear por Italia y recoger sus impresiones en su diario personal y en una serie de poemas que recién serían publicados por primera vez de manera completa en Alemania en 1914 (Mal año para editar no?). La razón? Bueno es que estas ELEGÍAS ROMANAS no son las típicas lamentaciones que uno espera desde el título (recordemos que una elegía es una composición poética toda versada sobre el lamento de alguna desgracia). Aquí no solo tenemos una rememoración pícara del alma juvenil del autor sino además algunas escenas de desnudos (!)
.
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Goethe, el clásico y serio y apolineo poeta de Weimar se despacha en este libro que la verdad me recontra impresionó, con una serie de poemas líricos que oscilan entre la tierna invocación de amores juveniles en la toscana (que podrían, de ser una canción, haber sido compuestos por Airbag o Rata Blanca) hasta alguna que otra súplica a los dioses para que no se le infecte el pene porque lo estaba metiendo en cualquier lado por lo que se ve.
.
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El poeta nos pinta una Italia pagana, embriagante, divertida y llena de luz. Oscila, como Catulo entre la inflexión amorosa del lenguaje en sus cimas más líricas y la guarangada graciosa. Incluso lo parodia y lo reescribe (rememora además el celebre poema del tapiz en el cual Catulo ve la historia de Ariadna siendo abandonada por Teseo) pero además de todo esto rescata las formas clásicas para componer una pequeña obra que es un lamento si, pero un lamento de la juventud que se pierde y de los años que se van. Para aquellos que solo conocimos al Goethe arrastrado por la solemnidad inmaculada esta obrita será un hermoso y grato placer.
.
.
Goethe, el clásico y serio y apolineo poeta de Weimar se despacha en este libro que la verdad me recontra impresionó, con una serie de poemas líricos que oscilan entre la tierna invocación de amores juveniles en la toscana (que podrían, de ser una canción, haber sido compuestos por Airbag o Rata Blanca) hasta alguna que otra súplica a los dioses para que no se le infecte el pene porque lo estaba metiendo en cualquier lado por lo que se ve.
.
.
El poeta nos pinta una Italia pagana, embriagante, divertida y llena de luz. Oscila, como Catulo entre la inflexión amorosa del lenguaje en sus cimas más líricas y la guarangada graciosa. Incluso lo parodia y lo reescribe (rememora además el celebre poema del tapiz en el cual Catulo ve la historia de Ariadna siendo abandonada por Teseo) pero además de todo esto rescata las formas clásicas para componer una pequeña obra que es un lamento si, pero un lamento de la juventud que se pierde y de los años que se van. Para aquellos que solo conocimos al Goethe arrastrado por la solemnidad inmaculada esta obrita será un hermoso y grato placer.
August 25, 2017
Someday I hope to read these poems in the original German. For now, I'm grateful for the translation, and for the translator's elucidating introduction.
September 16, 2013
يا روح الانسان كم تشبهين الماء!
يا قدر الانسان كم تشبه الريح!
**************************
ها انذا اتبع النصيحة
فاتصفح اعمال القدماء
بيد متلهفة ولذة تتجدد كل نهار
لكن طوال الليل يشغلني اله الحب
بامور اخرى
فاذا كنت اصيب من العلم نصفه فقط
فانني احظى من السعادة بنصيب مضاعف
***************************
دع البداية والنهاية يتقلصان الى نقطة واحدة!
وبخفة اكبر من الاشياء حلق بعيداً..!
*************************
لن يمكث الحب بعيداً
سوف يهوي من السماء
الى حيث صعد من القفار القديمة
ويحوم نحونا بجناحين هفافين
حول الجبهة والصدر طوال عيد الربيع
يبدو الان انه يفر
ومن جديد يدير ظهره للفرار
عندئذ يصبح في الالم راحة عذبة ومفعمة بالقلق
قلوب كثيرة تحوم بوجه عام
لكن انبلها يكرس نفسه للواحد الاحد
***********************
سعيد هو من ينسحب من العالم
دون بغضاء
يضم الى صدره صديقاً ويهنأ معه
فما هو غير معروف من الناس
ولا يفكرون فيه
عبر متاهة القلب يتجول ليلاً
July 8, 2015
Wow, what words...
"Had Ariadne lain thus, Theseus never had fled.
Only a single kiss for these lips and then, O Theseus, leave her;
Look at her eyes—she's awake! Now you're eternally bound."
"Even the woman we love may afford us uncertain enjoyment;
Nowhere can feminine lap safely encouch a man's head.
Matrimonial bed's insecure and so's fornication;
Husband, lover and wife pass to each other the hurt"
"Cupid in my heart comes first."
"Ah, to uphold one's respectable name is not easy."
"Secrecy is for a man most important of all.."
"Had Ariadne lain thus, Theseus never had fled.
Only a single kiss for these lips and then, O Theseus, leave her;
Look at her eyes—she's awake! Now you're eternally bound."
"Even the woman we love may afford us uncertain enjoyment;
Nowhere can feminine lap safely encouch a man's head.
Matrimonial bed's insecure and so's fornication;
Husband, lover and wife pass to each other the hurt"
"Cupid in my heart comes first."
"Ah, to uphold one's respectable name is not easy."
"Secrecy is for a man most important of all.."
Read
April 1, 2016"Therefore, ye living, rejoice that love keeps you warm for a while yet, until cold. Let he anoints, captures your foot in its flight."
"Cupid is always a scoundrel, and if you believe him he'll cheat you."
"Wasn't antiquity young when those fortunate Ancients were living."
"Love in our hearts makes us one."
"Cupid is always a scoundrel, and if you believe him he'll cheat you."
"Wasn't antiquity young when those fortunate Ancients were living."
"Love in our hearts makes us one."
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
November 7, 2016
(...)
¿No aprendo acaso viendo las formas de los dulces pechos? ¿Acariciando de cintura hacia abajo? Ahora comprendo el mármol; reflexiono y comparo; con mano que ve siento; veo con ojo sintiente. (V)
¿No aprendo acaso viendo las formas de los dulces pechos? ¿Acariciando de cintura hacia abajo? Ahora comprendo el mármol; reflexiono y comparo; con mano que ve siento; veo con ojo sintiente. (V)
January 3, 2021
- so far this is the easiest book to read by Goethe
- you forget about the world and get immersed in the poems, you start dreaming with open eyes
- some are quite dirty, beautifully dirty
- ah, I miss Italy
- you forget about the world and get immersed in the poems, you start dreaming with open eyes
- some are quite dirty, beautifully dirty
- ah, I miss Italy
August 29, 2012
Presented as twenty-four elegies, these are von Goethe's poems of erotic love...
September 12, 2013
Not really my cup of tea, but enjoyable.
October 23, 2014
Me encantaron sus novelas, Fausto, wherter; tendré que leer estos poemas más detenidamente, Goethe fue un magnífico escritor, sin duda alguna que esto tiene algo mád.
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