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Carnival
In Old Earth's clandestine world of ambassador-spies, Michelangelo Kusanagi-Jones and Vincent Katherinessen were once a starring team. But ever since a disastrous mission, they have been living separate lives in a universe dominated by a ruthless Coalition - one that is about to reunite them.
The pair are dispatched to New Amazonia as diplomatic agents. Allegedly, they are to return priceless art. Covertly, they seek to tap its energy supply. But in reality, one has his mind set on treason. And among the extraordinary women of New Amazonia, in a season of festival, betrayal, and disguise, he will find a new ally - and a force beyond any that humans have known....
The pair are dispatched to New Amazonia as diplomatic agents. Allegedly, they are to return priceless art. Covertly, they seek to tap its energy supply. But in reality, one has his mind set on treason. And among the extraordinary women of New Amazonia, in a season of festival, betrayal, and disguise, he will find a new ally - and a force beyond any that humans have known....
392 pages, Mass Market Paperback
First published January 1, 2006
33 people are currently reading
1179 people want to read
About the author
Elizabeth Bear
310 books2,455 followersWhat Goodreads really needs is a "currently WRITING" option for its default bookshelves...
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 112 reviews
May 3, 2018
Between 4 and 5 stars, and easily one of the best books I've read this year.
It must seem like all I do these days is like or fall in love with every book I read. Not so. I read sample chapters all the time and abandon lots of books. I just don't record them. The ones I do record are usually the memorable ones, many just happen to be favorites. This book is one of them, and wholly unexpected too. The title and cover just don't convey what's actually in the book. I mean, could anyone guess what this book is about based on that?
Anyhow. This book is the most fun I've had with a political intrigue space opera that's written in the style of the novel-of-manners in a while. There are depths and layers and it's a sort of culmination of all the issues we face today, presented in exact strokes, except the story is set in a distant future on an Earth-like planet. But all the things plaguing our world today is still very much present in the distant future, a future in which we colonize planets yet still have time to persecute queer people and have a stranglehold on reproduction rights. It looks as though we did not learn from the past or reconcile with it, and so these problems rear their heads once more, with force, in the future. I think Elizabeth Bear is trying to say something... I just figure out what exactly...
There's a lot to unpack here, and this book is very hard to sum up because there are too many moving parts and so many layers, and there are just so many things to talk about. But simply, the beauty of reading this is letting the world (and universe) and all its loaded political predicaments reveal themselves to you gradually as you read.
At the start, we have a pair of male agents from the Colonial Coalition (hegemony) entering a foreign planet called New Amazonia. Their official purpose is opening trade talks and placating the planet's leaders, but their unofficial purpose is finding and stealing the planet's mysterious, much sought after energy source. Since the Coalition has already tried to take the planet once, although unsuccessfully, the agents expect negotiations to be tense, if not outright hostile from the start.
The agents themselves are controversial figures in this already dicey situation. Old lovers, working for an intensely homophobic organization, separated for over 20 years after their affair was outed; it was a high-profile scandal that strained their careers. One of them was sent back to his planet; the other was put through the equivalent of conversion therapy. Now the agents are reunited once again for this mission, which they are expected not only to fail but to fail spectacularly. To add more layers to an already layered problem, each agent has his own agenda and secret mission to carry out once on the planet, unbeknownst to the other.
New Amazonia is ruled by a matriarchal system, and it's very much what you might imagine if you were to imagine the exact opposite of a patriarchal system. Saying any more would... spoil the fun, but hopefully some of the choice quotes below will give you a glimpse of the matriarchy at work. In short, there's a lot of tension here and a lot of planet-side factions reacting to the agents' presence; some are in support of, while most seem to be against.
Of course, not all is harmonious in New Amazonia. There is dissent among the population in the form of fringe groups, and many of them are men's rights groups to advocate for men's rights under the strictly matriarchal leadership. There is literally "a radical male-rights movement called Parity," pronounced "parody," and I just... This book was published in 2006. Once again, I think Ms. Bear is trying to tell us something, but I just can't figure out what...
Every player in this game has hidden agendas, and they all are working against each other. So there's a lot of sparring, scheming, duplicity, and intrigue. The dialogue is easily my favorite thing about this book. Every scene in which the characters discuss a matter of state or business, usually over a banquet, the interaction is heady and charged with a delicious, electric current. The whole book is politically delicious, and I enjoyed the hell out of it.
There are some instances and moments that I think were a bit too exacting, too obvious, with the messages conveyed and I thought they could have benefited from some subtlety, but overall, I like this book. I like what it is and what it's meant to be.
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
Another excellent buddy with Beth and the Sci-fi and Fantasy Book Club.
Cross-posted at https://covers2covers.wordpress.com/2...
at once familiar and alien, like coming home to a place where you used to live.
It must seem like all I do these days is like or fall in love with every book I read. Not so. I read sample chapters all the time and abandon lots of books. I just don't record them. The ones I do record are usually the memorable ones, many just happen to be favorites. This book is one of them, and wholly unexpected too. The title and cover just don't convey what's actually in the book. I mean, could anyone guess what this book is about based on that?
Anyhow. This book is the most fun I've had with a political intrigue space opera that's written in the style of the novel-of-manners in a while. There are depths and layers and it's a sort of culmination of all the issues we face today, presented in exact strokes, except the story is set in a distant future on an Earth-like planet. But all the things plaguing our world today is still very much present in the distant future, a future in which we colonize planets yet still have time to persecute queer people and have a stranglehold on reproduction rights. It looks as though we did not learn from the past or reconcile with it, and so these problems rear their heads once more, with force, in the future. I think Elizabeth Bear is trying to say something... I just figure out what exactly...
There's a lot to unpack here, and this book is very hard to sum up because there are too many moving parts and so many layers, and there are just so many things to talk about. But simply, the beauty of reading this is letting the world (and universe) and all its loaded political predicaments reveal themselves to you gradually as you read.
At the start, we have a pair of male agents from the Colonial Coalition (hegemony) entering a foreign planet called New Amazonia. Their official purpose is opening trade talks and placating the planet's leaders, but their unofficial purpose is finding and stealing the planet's mysterious, much sought after energy source. Since the Coalition has already tried to take the planet once, although unsuccessfully, the agents expect negotiations to be tense, if not outright hostile from the start.
The agents themselves are controversial figures in this already dicey situation. Old lovers, working for an intensely homophobic organization, separated for over 20 years after their affair was outed; it was a high-profile scandal that strained their careers. One of them was sent back to his planet; the other was put through the equivalent of conversion therapy. Now the agents are reunited once again for this mission, which they are expected not only to fail but to fail spectacularly. To add more layers to an already layered problem, each agent has his own agenda and secret mission to carry out once on the planet, unbeknownst to the other.
New Amazonia is ruled by a matriarchal system, and it's very much what you might imagine if you were to imagine the exact opposite of a patriarchal system. Saying any more would... spoil the fun, but hopefully some of the choice quotes below will give you a glimpse of the matriarchy at work. In short, there's a lot of tension here and a lot of planet-side factions reacting to the agents' presence; some are in support of, while most seem to be against.
Of course, not all is harmonious in New Amazonia. There is dissent among the population in the form of fringe groups, and many of them are men's rights groups to advocate for men's rights under the strictly matriarchal leadership. There is literally "a radical male-rights movement called Parity," pronounced "parody," and I just... This book was published in 2006. Once again, I think Ms. Bear is trying to tell us something, but I just can't figure out what...
Every player in this game has hidden agendas, and they all are working against each other. So there's a lot of sparring, scheming, duplicity, and intrigue. The dialogue is easily my favorite thing about this book. Every scene in which the characters discuss a matter of state or business, usually over a banquet, the interaction is heady and charged with a delicious, electric current. The whole book is politically delicious, and I enjoyed the hell out of it.
There are some instances and moments that I think were a bit too exacting, too obvious, with the messages conveyed and I thought they could have benefited from some subtlety, but overall, I like this book. I like what it is and what it's meant to be.
“Now that we’ve established that we think each other monsters, do you suppose we can get back to business?”
[...]
The Coalition was a typical example of what men did to women when given half an excuse: petty restrictions, self-congratulatory patronization, and a slew of justifications that amounted to men asserting their property rights.
[...]
“Not only will whoever’s on top fight to stay there, but if you reset everyone to equality, whoever wins the scramble for power will design the rules to stay there.”
[...]
“Just because we’ve disavowed Old Earth history doesn’t mean we fail to study it. You can file that one with sense of humor, if you like.”
[...]
“Traditionally, the responsibility for safety falls on the victim. Women are expected to defend themselves from predators. To act like responsible prey. Limit risks, not take chances. Not to go out alone at night. Not talk to strange men. Rely on their own, presumably domesticated men for protection from other feral men—in exchange for granting them property rights over the women in question.”
“And the New Amazonian system is superior in what way?”
“Punishes the potential predator and arms the potential victim. If men cannot control themselves, control will be instituted. Potential predators are caged, regulated.”
[...]
This is what we are when we’re left to our own devices—savage, selfish, short-sighted. [...] But free. Any government founded on a political or religious agenda more elaborate than “protect the weak, temper the strong” is doomed to tyranny.
[...]
“So slavery is more moral than engineering out aggression.”
“It’s not chattel slavery.”
“No,” Kusanagi-Jones said. “An extreme sort of second-class citizenship.”
“Not much worse than women in the Coalition.”
“Women in the Coalition can vote, can work—”
“Can be elected to the government.”
“Theoretically.”
“Practically?”
“Doesn’t happen.”
[...]
There were a lot of weird worlds, a lot of political structures based on points of philosophy. Not all the ships of the Diaspora had been faster than light, even; humanity had scrambled off Earth in any rowboat or leaky bucket that might hold them, and dead ships were still found floating between the stars, full of frozen corpses.
Vincent found it alternately creepy and reassuring when he considered that no matter how strange the culture might be, every single world out there, every instance of intelligent life that he had encountered, claimed common descent from Earth.
[...]
Strike two for utopia. The problem with the damned things always comes when you try to introduce actual people into your philosophical constructs.
Another excellent buddy with Beth and the Sci-fi and Fantasy Book Club.
Cross-posted at https://covers2covers.wordpress.com/2...
March 20, 2018
Holy hell this book was confusing. It didn’t even get better as the book went on. It just got more complex.
I won’t spoil anything plot related, a couple spoilers for in book technology but that’s it. I’m giving it four stars for the world building, the characters, and the sheer creativity involved in writing this book. If I was rating the incredibly complex plot which I don’t understand, I’d give it a two. Sometimes I don’t understand and I’m okay with it. In an espionage novel- I feel like comprehension is sort of necessary. I get some readers love lack of info dumps but seriously- all it would have taken was a diagram. A glossary would have been nice too.
First of all- I want me a House. I need one like yesterday. Is Elon Musk working on it yet? Somebody give him this book. I’m sure he could do it. Don’t forget the carpetplant. This is vital.
Secondly- I want a khir. No reason, just because.
Third- I want a wardrobe for all the reasons. (Just imagine- that guy that bumped into you in a crowd and didn’t apologize- Zap! That person that cut you in line. Zap!)
Okay so seriously- this is a great book for discussions. There are lots of ethical and moral questions asked/illustrated (which I always love). The characters are absolutely fantastic. Lesa is my favorite. Antonia Kyoto, though she isn’t present for a large portion of the book is a close second. This must be tough to manage for a writer- to make a character with like two scenes in the whole book as wonderful as she did but there it is.
The writing was okay. I found some parts overly descriptive but otherwise it was okay. Zero infodumps, if I haven’t made that clear.
The M/M romance between older characters was beautiful and well told. It starts off with the characters being hesitant to interact at all (though they had been together a very long time)
The ending. Dear God. If anyone gets it please explain it to me. I almost threw the book across the room in a “WTF does that mean?” type rage.
I would recommend to sci-fi fans looking for something different that explores different cultures.
I won’t spoil anything plot related, a couple spoilers for in book technology but that’s it. I’m giving it four stars for the world building, the characters, and the sheer creativity involved in writing this book. If I was rating the incredibly complex plot which I don’t understand, I’d give it a two. Sometimes I don’t understand and I’m okay with it. In an espionage novel- I feel like comprehension is sort of necessary. I get some readers love lack of info dumps but seriously- all it would have taken was a diagram. A glossary would have been nice too.
First of all- I want me a House. I need one like yesterday. Is Elon Musk working on it yet? Somebody give him this book. I’m sure he could do it. Don’t forget the carpetplant. This is vital.
Secondly- I want a khir. No reason, just because.
Third- I want a wardrobe for all the reasons. (Just imagine- that guy that bumped into you in a crowd and didn’t apologize- Zap! That person that cut you in line. Zap!)
Okay so seriously- this is a great book for discussions. There are lots of ethical and moral questions asked/illustrated (which I always love). The characters are absolutely fantastic. Lesa is my favorite. Antonia Kyoto, though she isn’t present for a large portion of the book is a close second. This must be tough to manage for a writer- to make a character with like two scenes in the whole book as wonderful as she did but there it is.
The writing was okay. I found some parts overly descriptive but otherwise it was okay. Zero infodumps, if I haven’t made that clear.
The M/M romance between older characters was beautiful and well told. It starts off with the characters being hesitant to interact at all (though they had been together a very long time)
The ending. Dear God. If anyone gets it please explain it to me. I almost threw the book across the room in a “WTF does that mean?” type rage.
I would recommend to sci-fi fans looking for something different that explores different cultures.
April 11, 2018
I am a careful, astute reader who's willing to read meaning in for poetry's sake. But I have no f***ing clue what this book is. I...liked it? I'm torn between 2 stars for a book that makes no sense and 3 stars for writing a book that didn't feel like dental surgery even when it was carried just with a "meaningful look" and a really amazing world.
CONTENT WARNING: (no actual spoilers, just a list of topics)
Things to like
-Vincent and Michaelangelo. A really sweet couple. It's nice to see an older couple and to have both the joy of reunion and the comfort of a long relationship that was fairly well portrayed. They were also both badass, and I liked the word choices used to explain them. It didn't fall into gender tropes, which I liked.
-New Amazonia. Not the culture so much, but the world. Sentient houses, birds that were even better dogs than dogs, lush forest. The writing about it felt like tropical sunshine, and I loved that part of the atmosphere. I think the culture lacked a little. The set up for it was a strong concept, but the conclusions were, I think, chosen specifically to make the point that gender inequality never leads to actual peace, but it was a little forced.
-The interrogation. It was nice that for once a book used more standard procedures rather than torture for information. I want to see more things like this, so I'll call it out.
-The thought experiments. There were A. Lot. Animal rights activism that sees pets as slaves, an AI controlling government, planetary expansion as part pilgrimage, part refugee flight, the need for energy, the "perfect" blend of jobs required, genetic manipulation...this book had a lot going on and they were each a nice thing to chew on for a bit. Except...
Things That Made No Flocking Sense
-There was no chewing. These ideas were thrown out but we never really explored any of them. It was given that these were the conclusions and then you were left on your own to figure out why the author would say that. I don't think I agree wholly, given what we know.
-The dialogue. There were no conversations. Everyone talked past each other in cryptic codes that were supposed to mean something because of the length of their relationships or because of their missions, but we weren't given anything to help us decipher. It was inscrutable. Also, they chose weird times for exposition, like...
-The plot. There were so many and none of the motivations and mechanations added up to me. The logic was spurious, the reactions illogical, and the conclusions all happened off screen.
-The exceptionalism of the main characters. First of all, "but you're not like the other men/gays" felt a liittle baked in to the story and that was uncomfortable. Lesa was a renowned duelist and security expert who sucked at security and whose only duel was off camera. Vincent was a "super receiver," an expert in body language so well trained that it was like he could read minds...except that others did that as well or better than him and it never came up as being a decisively useful skill. Michaelangelo was a skilled spy who could lie so well that even super receivers couldn't read him...except everyone but Vincent cracked him like a book.
It was a muddled mess of a story, but the world was awesome (it is agreed, everyone wants a House with a carpetplant and a khir!) and the relationships were sweet. That said, I likely will not recommend it.
CONTENT WARNING: (no actual spoilers, just a list of topics)
Things to like
-Vincent and Michaelangelo. A really sweet couple. It's nice to see an older couple and to have both the joy of reunion and the comfort of a long relationship that was fairly well portrayed. They were also both badass, and I liked the word choices used to explain them. It didn't fall into gender tropes, which I liked.
-New Amazonia. Not the culture so much, but the world. Sentient houses, birds that were even better dogs than dogs, lush forest. The writing about it felt like tropical sunshine, and I loved that part of the atmosphere. I think the culture lacked a little. The set up for it was a strong concept, but the conclusions were, I think, chosen specifically to make the point that gender inequality never leads to actual peace, but it was a little forced.
-The interrogation. It was nice that for once a book used more standard procedures rather than torture for information. I want to see more things like this, so I'll call it out.
-The thought experiments. There were A. Lot. Animal rights activism that sees pets as slaves, an AI controlling government, planetary expansion as part pilgrimage, part refugee flight, the need for energy, the "perfect" blend of jobs required, genetic manipulation...this book had a lot going on and they were each a nice thing to chew on for a bit. Except...
Things That Made No Flocking Sense
-There was no chewing. These ideas were thrown out but we never really explored any of them. It was given that these were the conclusions and then you were left on your own to figure out why the author would say that. I don't think I agree wholly, given what we know.
-The dialogue. There were no conversations. Everyone talked past each other in cryptic codes that were supposed to mean something because of the length of their relationships or because of their missions, but we weren't given anything to help us decipher. It was inscrutable. Also, they chose weird times for exposition, like...
-The plot. There were so many and none of the motivations and mechanations added up to me. The logic was spurious, the reactions illogical, and the conclusions all happened off screen.
-The exceptionalism of the main characters. First of all, "but you're not like the other men/gays" felt a liittle baked in to the story and that was uncomfortable. Lesa was a renowned duelist and security expert who sucked at security and whose only duel was off camera. Vincent was a "super receiver," an expert in body language so well trained that it was like he could read minds...except that others did that as well or better than him and it never came up as being a decisively useful skill. Michaelangelo was a skilled spy who could lie so well that even super receivers couldn't read him...except everyone but Vincent cracked him like a book.
It was a muddled mess of a story, but the world was awesome (it is agreed, everyone wants a House with a carpetplant and a khir!) and the relationships were sweet. That said, I likely will not recommend it.
June 25, 2010
3.5 stars. Highly original debut novel with some terrific ideas and concepts along with pretty good world-building. Plot was a bit convoluted and difficult to follow and may benefit from a second read through.
Nominee: Philip K. Dick Award for Best Novel (2007)
Nominee: Locus Award for Best Science Fiction Novel (2007)
Nominee: Philip K. Dick Award for Best Novel (2007)
Nominee: Locus Award for Best Science Fiction Novel (2007)
September 16, 2013
One of my favorite M/M Sci Fi books - this one is really a mainstream book with gay characters, more than a romance, but the relationship between the two protagonists is the emotional heart of the fascinating story about a very uniquely written far-future society.
December 7, 2022
This book is a very enjoyable cross between speculative science fiction and a political/spy thriller. The basic concept is that the matriarchal colony world of New Amazonia possesses a mysterious power source that Old Earth wants; Unofficially, Earth also wants to bring New Amazonia under the hegemony of the Coalition. However, the Amazonians won’t accept a male ambassador unless he is “gentle” (AKA gay). This is a problem for patriarchal Old Earth, as it doesn’t have any female ambassadors, and homosexuality is criminalized. But, luckily for them, Vincent Katherinessen and Michelangelo Kusanagi-Jones are highly skilled ambassador-spies who, while having been disgraced for a previous failed mission and the subsequent revelation of the relationship between them, are at least still alive. However, the leadership of Old Earth either fails to consider that those classified as essentially “useful trash” might not be 100% loyal…or just figures they have to go with this plan because Vincent and Angelo are their only options!
It would be awesome to see a film adaptation of this book. The exciting 007-ish cloak-and-dagger stuff would likely draw in an audience who might not otherwise jump to see a story centering a non-white middle-aged gay couple. And the visual nature of such an adaptation would fill in some gaps without slowing the plot down. For instance, we don’t get many clear descriptions of the pageantry of the titular carnival, or of what Lesa Pretoria’s gunslinging looks like in action. Similarly, while I would expect that Amazonia would abound in Sapphic couples, the prime minister and her wife and Lesa and her favorite male consort are the only confirmed pairings of any kind from that world. A movie, however, could reveal those details at the same time as the plot is happening!
I want to note that the cover of the edition I read, which features a human-ish face but with steel-grey skin and eyes with no whites, as well as a description of the Amazonians as “highly evolved”, is misleading. There are no humanoid aliens in this book – though there ARE some interesting non-humanoid ones! – and all the humans are just normal-looking POC. Nor are the Amazonians, or anyone else, particularly “evolved”, biologically or socially. (But that discrepancy is probably the publisher's fault, not the author's!)
While the political machinations are fascinating, I wouldn’t have been half so engaged if it weren’t for Angelo and Vincent. They are both interesting characters with excellent chemistry and a fun-yet-threatening-to-be-tragic dynamic. The charismatic Vincent Katherinssen led a relatively privileged life on the egalitarian colony world of Ur…until it was added to the earth-led “coalition”. Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusanagi Jones was born on an earth dominated by the Governors, a set of AI designed by radical environmentalists to “Assess” the human population and decide how it should be reduced, and within a highly sexist and homophobic human culture. In such an environment, his similar talents in reading people made him a Liar, skilled in concealment rather than charm. Their shared history and the reasons they are reluctant to fully admit their feelings – WAY better reasons than in most romantic misunderstandings! - are revealed gradually as the story progresses. Not that they’re particularly good at hiding those feelings. Lesa, who has similar skills at reading people notes:
"They had not been lied to. The men were gentle; when one leaned, moved, spoke, the other mirrored. She sensed it in the energy between them, their calm failure to react on any visceral level to her smile…or to the more youthful charms of her security detail…Not only were they gentle, they were together.”
I dare you not to root for things to work out between them – but, once you’re hooked, absolutely DO read the epilogue! If you skip it, you will come away with an inaccurately sad impression.
Regarding the gender politics, this was thankfully NOT one of those books that writes matriarchy as a direct inversion of patriarchy. It reminded me in many respects of Ursula Le Guin’s ‘The Matter of Segri’ (in The Birthday of the World and Other Stories). Because the driving forces in both these cases is different from each other and from patriarchy, and because the rationales that are developed in favor of a given social system make sense as an outgrowth of those forces, the kinds of injustices that result are different too – but feel realistic. Moreover, it immediately becomes clear that there are multiple factions on New Amazonia that are not happy with the status quo but for varying reasons.
For further thoughts, see full review: https://ajungleoftales.blogspot.com/2...
It would be awesome to see a film adaptation of this book. The exciting 007-ish cloak-and-dagger stuff would likely draw in an audience who might not otherwise jump to see a story centering a non-white middle-aged gay couple. And the visual nature of such an adaptation would fill in some gaps without slowing the plot down. For instance, we don’t get many clear descriptions of the pageantry of the titular carnival, or of what Lesa Pretoria’s gunslinging looks like in action. Similarly, while I would expect that Amazonia would abound in Sapphic couples, the prime minister and her wife and Lesa and her favorite male consort are the only confirmed pairings of any kind from that world. A movie, however, could reveal those details at the same time as the plot is happening!
I want to note that the cover of the edition I read, which features a human-ish face but with steel-grey skin and eyes with no whites, as well as a description of the Amazonians as “highly evolved”, is misleading. There are no humanoid aliens in this book – though there ARE some interesting non-humanoid ones! – and all the humans are just normal-looking POC. Nor are the Amazonians, or anyone else, particularly “evolved”, biologically or socially. (But that discrepancy is probably the publisher's fault, not the author's!)
While the political machinations are fascinating, I wouldn’t have been half so engaged if it weren’t for Angelo and Vincent. They are both interesting characters with excellent chemistry and a fun-yet-threatening-to-be-tragic dynamic. The charismatic Vincent Katherinssen led a relatively privileged life on the egalitarian colony world of Ur…until it was added to the earth-led “coalition”. Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusanagi Jones was born on an earth dominated by the Governors, a set of AI designed by radical environmentalists to “Assess” the human population and decide how it should be reduced, and within a highly sexist and homophobic human culture. In such an environment, his similar talents in reading people made him a Liar, skilled in concealment rather than charm. Their shared history and the reasons they are reluctant to fully admit their feelings – WAY better reasons than in most romantic misunderstandings! - are revealed gradually as the story progresses. Not that they’re particularly good at hiding those feelings. Lesa, who has similar skills at reading people notes:
"They had not been lied to. The men were gentle; when one leaned, moved, spoke, the other mirrored. She sensed it in the energy between them, their calm failure to react on any visceral level to her smile…or to the more youthful charms of her security detail…Not only were they gentle, they were together.”
I dare you not to root for things to work out between them – but, once you’re hooked, absolutely DO read the epilogue! If you skip it, you will come away with an inaccurately sad impression.
Regarding the gender politics, this was thankfully NOT one of those books that writes matriarchy as a direct inversion of patriarchy. It reminded me in many respects of Ursula Le Guin’s ‘The Matter of Segri’ (in The Birthday of the World and Other Stories). Because the driving forces in both these cases is different from each other and from patriarchy, and because the rationales that are developed in favor of a given social system make sense as an outgrowth of those forces, the kinds of injustices that result are different too – but feel realistic. Moreover, it immediately becomes clear that there are multiple factions on New Amazonia that are not happy with the status quo but for varying reasons.
For further thoughts, see full review: https://ajungleoftales.blogspot.com/2...
April 6, 2018
The story in Carnival revolves around a couple of Earth agents in late middle age, Michelangelo and Vincent, who are sent to the planet New Amazonia to obtain their impossible-seeming energy source for the planetary Coalition based on Earth. Earth offers to return some artwork, stolen in a previous confrontation, to sweeten the deal.
There are powerful women on New Amazonia who are reluctant to give up the power source, and there are also factions in and around the capital acting against the current government, at least one of them willing to go to war for equal rights for the men living in this extremely matriarchal society.
Carnival reminded me of Ann Leckie's Ancillary series in a lot of ways. There's political wrangling between multiple factions, cool scene-setting, and a terrifying hegemony that acts "rationally" on the surface. There are scenes that feel like a novel of manners, and situations that encourage the reader to ponder on gender.
Each of these things is handled differently in each work, and my reading Bear's book after Leckie's trilogy in no way diminishes it. Thematically, they're very different. Where the Ancillary series has several characters who struggle with identity, Carnival opens questions about eugenics. Is it ethical to breed and own pets? To breed out undesirable traits in humans, such as aggression? (In males, in particular.) To eliminate seven billion people on a planet to preserve the integrity of the environment?
The plot of the novel is fairly straightforward, although it tries to pretend it isn't by having the characters be coy about their intentions and rarely bring them right out into the open, even when thinking to themselves. Despite that, it wasn't too confusing or difficult to follow.
Angelo's and Vincent's plight was easy to empathize with. They're subject to prejudice both in Earth's society, and New Amazonia's, for different reasons. Despite their evident love for each other, their work for the Coalition has torn them apart more than once, and could again on this mission. A few of the New Amazonian characters were good, too, especially the Pretoria family that included Lesa, Katya, and Elena, whose family bonds are strained, to say the least, as all the political wrangling and dueling-with-guns goes on.
I get a little grouchy when every single SF or fantasy novel's climax hinges around a violent, large-scale confrontation. Carnival's, refreshingly, was small in scale and relatively peaceful, and made me question the characters' ethics in a thought-provoking way. Well done.
Carnival was a buddy read with Mimi and The SF and Fantasy Book Club, and was an excellent choice!
There are powerful women on New Amazonia who are reluctant to give up the power source, and there are also factions in and around the capital acting against the current government, at least one of them willing to go to war for equal rights for the men living in this extremely matriarchal society.
Carnival reminded me of Ann Leckie's Ancillary series in a lot of ways. There's political wrangling between multiple factions, cool scene-setting, and a terrifying hegemony that acts "rationally" on the surface. There are scenes that feel like a novel of manners, and situations that encourage the reader to ponder on gender.
Each of these things is handled differently in each work, and my reading Bear's book after Leckie's trilogy in no way diminishes it. Thematically, they're very different. Where the Ancillary series has several characters who struggle with identity, Carnival opens questions about eugenics. Is it ethical to breed and own pets? To breed out undesirable traits in humans, such as aggression? (In males, in particular.) To eliminate seven billion people on a planet to preserve the integrity of the environment?
The plot of the novel is fairly straightforward, although it tries to pretend it isn't by having the characters be coy about their intentions and rarely bring them right out into the open, even when thinking to themselves. Despite that, it wasn't too confusing or difficult to follow.
Angelo's and Vincent's plight was easy to empathize with. They're subject to prejudice both in Earth's society, and New Amazonia's, for different reasons. Despite their evident love for each other, their work for the Coalition has torn them apart more than once, and could again on this mission. A few of the New Amazonian characters were good, too, especially the Pretoria family that included Lesa, Katya, and Elena, whose family bonds are strained, to say the least, as all the political wrangling and dueling-with-guns goes on.
I get a little grouchy when every single SF or fantasy novel's climax hinges around a violent, large-scale confrontation. Carnival's, refreshingly, was small in scale and relatively peaceful, and made me question the characters' ethics in a thought-provoking way. Well done.
Carnival was a buddy read with Mimi and The SF and Fantasy Book Club, and was an excellent choice!
June 15, 2016
The backstory here was fascinating--both the history of Earth, with its Governors and Assessments, and the history of New Amazonia, with its feminist dystopia and splintering factions. Unfortunately, the actual plot doesn't quite live up to the universe it's set in. There's a lot of scheming that ultimately has no effect on the resolution, and a romance that the author clearly expects to be the emotional heart of the story but that for me fell entirely flat.
File under "story author was interested in telling was not the story I wanted to hear."
File under "story author was interested in telling was not the story I wanted to hear."
March 28, 2008
First, shameful confession: I couldn't remember which one of the guys was Vincent, and which one was Angelo. They both have a lot of names, they're both determined, resourceful, embittered, hiding things, and madly in love with each other. If one of them could have had a speech impediment, or been a vampire, that would have helped me a lot. This isn't a reflection on the book, though: I just have a massive name-thing.
Carnival isn't quite the novel on Matriarchy I've been waiting for all my life, but it's damned close. No sentimentality about women (or men,) no utopia, a recognition that the lifestyle we choose comes at a price that is often payed by someone else, and a recognition how gender is constructed (and how it isn't.)
Bear is paying particular attention to taboos in this book, and result is a bit like being hit over the head with a millimetre thick sheet of ice: it doesn't hurt, but something shatters. Vincent and Angelo are both vegans, not particularly for ethical reasons, although they both explain themselves that way, but simply because they've been raised in a culture where exploitation of animals is unthinkable. They find the Amazonian keeping of animals as pets abhorrent, and are rather dismayed by how well the khir (a native animal) fits into the social fabric of Amazonian family and public life.
(You notice how I keep saying 'they'? Yeah, I can't remember which one did what at any given point. I promise, I plan to reread and make notes as I go in some sort of attempt to figure out who is who.)
I think I can argue that the central theme being explored in the book is freedom: who has it, what they pay for it, and who is denied it. Vincent and Angelo have a certain amount of freedom as (secret-ish) agents for their government(s), but they are denied a certain amount of freedom given the quasi-illegal state of being homosexual. The Earth government tightly controls its citizens' economic and reproductive lives, and Vincent and Angelo both resent this, and to some extent, regard it as sensible and necessary.
On New Amazonia, homosexual men enjoy slightly more freedom: they're regarded as less threatening, less savage, almost woman-like in their ability to be civilized. "Stud" males are kept much more closely confined.
I keep on wanting to give more little clever details and grand rearrangements of status quo, but the book is too densely packed and I'd end up rewriting it. Let it be taken as read that the world-building, or rather, universe-building, is marvelous.
The book is full of men and women who are willing to make personal sacrifices for a better world: the tragedy comes when people who love each other sacrifice each other for a better world they can't agree on.
I was in agony for most of the book as Vincent and Angelo got closer and closer, since I know Bear delights in tearing apart happy couples. I'm not telling you how it ends, though: you can suffer too.
Carnival isn't quite the novel on Matriarchy I've been waiting for all my life, but it's damned close. No sentimentality about women (or men,) no utopia, a recognition that the lifestyle we choose comes at a price that is often payed by someone else, and a recognition how gender is constructed (and how it isn't.)
Bear is paying particular attention to taboos in this book, and result is a bit like being hit over the head with a millimetre thick sheet of ice: it doesn't hurt, but something shatters. Vincent and Angelo are both vegans, not particularly for ethical reasons, although they both explain themselves that way, but simply because they've been raised in a culture where exploitation of animals is unthinkable. They find the Amazonian keeping of animals as pets abhorrent, and are rather dismayed by how well the khir (a native animal) fits into the social fabric of Amazonian family and public life.
(You notice how I keep saying 'they'? Yeah, I can't remember which one did what at any given point. I promise, I plan to reread and make notes as I go in some sort of attempt to figure out who is who.)
I think I can argue that the central theme being explored in the book is freedom: who has it, what they pay for it, and who is denied it. Vincent and Angelo have a certain amount of freedom as (secret-ish) agents for their government(s), but they are denied a certain amount of freedom given the quasi-illegal state of being homosexual. The Earth government tightly controls its citizens' economic and reproductive lives, and Vincent and Angelo both resent this, and to some extent, regard it as sensible and necessary.
On New Amazonia, homosexual men enjoy slightly more freedom: they're regarded as less threatening, less savage, almost woman-like in their ability to be civilized. "Stud" males are kept much more closely confined.
I keep on wanting to give more little clever details and grand rearrangements of status quo, but the book is too densely packed and I'd end up rewriting it. Let it be taken as read that the world-building, or rather, universe-building, is marvelous.
The book is full of men and women who are willing to make personal sacrifices for a better world: the tragedy comes when people who love each other sacrifice each other for a better world they can't agree on.
I was in agony for most of the book as Vincent and Angelo got closer and closer, since I know Bear delights in tearing apart happy couples. I'm not telling you how it ends, though: you can suffer too.
March 31, 2009
A marvelous playing out of the dynamics of colonization in the shadow of an environmental apocalypse on Earth -- though what brings about the apocalypse is actually radical engineers who create a program to Assess humans on the basis of their practices of sustainability. The Assessment that lies behind Carnival is draconian -- essentially no resident of Europe or the US survives -- but only alluded to. Carnival is rather a novel of intrigue, involving a pair of double agents who were once were lovers (and are both men), an Amazonian planet, and a "transcedended" intelligence. Bear places perhaps too much on her plate for this not to be a sometimes murky novel as there are at least three conspiracies at work on the planet, not to mention other wheels within wheels. But incrementally it holds up, in part because of sharp character development as well as the interest of the the dizzying mirror she holds up to postmodernity. The theme of the book is that no matter how fancy tech gets, certain aspects of humanity will lag, some for good reasons, but not all.
June 6, 2022
This is one of Bear's early novels, and it is ok! Two men, diplomats and lovers, head to a planet called New Amazonia. Women rule this world and its social hierarchy, and men need to have licenses to even be on the street. Also, their cities are leftovers from an alien technology, and are an extremely advanced AI/technology. Complicated politics ensue!
Bear's later work is much better. She's made an effort to create some three dimensional characters, but she's not yet skilled at fleshing them out. And the plot is complex and just a little too hard to follow. So the plot lost my interest at times, and the characters didn't make me want to keep reading for their sake. But there are some glimmerings of what's to come from Bear here, and a lot of her other work, like Karen Memory, Ancestral Night or Range of Ghosts are well worth your time.
Bear's later work is much better. She's made an effort to create some three dimensional characters, but she's not yet skilled at fleshing them out. And the plot is complex and just a little too hard to follow. So the plot lost my interest at times, and the characters didn't make me want to keep reading for their sake. But there are some glimmerings of what's to come from Bear here, and a lot of her other work, like Karen Memory, Ancestral Night or Range of Ghosts are well worth your time.
February 17, 2011
Yes, again/still with the Elizabeth Bear. This ... will ask you to think too much. And yeah, it is distinctly yaoi-ish, at least as the term is (somewhat mis)used in the US, or at least seems as if it was intended to appeal to that segment of the population. (Even if Mme. Bear thought one reviewer was way off in bringing it up.)
Where to start. Okay, there's backstory in this one that could probably have been its own book, or at least its own novella. It doesn't help that there are questions about the cultural attitudes of this universe raised by the nature of the characters that don't get answered until much later in the book than they should. And the ending itself is just weird, and, argh, deus ex machina. (Oh, and the names? There's a tradition of weird-seeming names in SF, but Michelangelo Kusanagi-Jones is about at the limit. Especially since the full version is Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusanagi-Jones. And it seems weird that the people on the colony planet where most of the action takes place have the surnames of Earth cities but have lost/forgotten the names of the continents.) It may be that I was deliberately choosing not to think enough, but this book made my brain hurt a little. And the male protagonists believing that omnivorism (Omnivory? I've always liked the sound of that better.) and pet ownership were tyranny was irritating, and reminded me of Kage Baker's Company series, which probably didn't help. Frankly, I seriously hope that's not where humanity is actually headed. I am a vegetarian, but ... it should be by choice, and really, the arguments that it's morally superior have never made sense to me.
Where to start. Okay, there's backstory in this one that could probably have been its own book, or at least its own novella. It doesn't help that there are questions about the cultural attitudes of this universe raised by the nature of the characters that don't get answered until much later in the book than they should. And the ending itself is just weird, and, argh, deus ex machina. (Oh, and the names? There's a tradition of weird-seeming names in SF, but Michelangelo Kusanagi-Jones is about at the limit. Especially since the full version is Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusanagi-Jones. And it seems weird that the people on the colony planet where most of the action takes place have the surnames of Earth cities but have lost/forgotten the names of the continents.) It may be that I was deliberately choosing not to think enough, but this book made my brain hurt a little. And the male protagonists believing that omnivorism (Omnivory? I've always liked the sound of that better.) and pet ownership were tyranny was irritating, and reminded me of Kage Baker's Company series, which probably didn't help. Frankly, I seriously hope that's not where humanity is actually headed. I am a vegetarian, but ... it should be by choice, and really, the arguments that it's morally superior have never made sense to me.
September 13, 2017
This is a really interesting story, with a nice blend of action, political intrigue, and social commentary. There was a lot going on, but the story moved quickly and never got bogged down in explaining things. The main characters - Vincent, Angelo, and Lesa - were all fantastic. I found the exploration of extreme environmental protections and male oppression under a strict matriarchy to be really interesting, and the world-building for both the major societies was detailed without ever becoming boring or overwhelming.
A couple minor quibbles, mostly around queer rep/issues, that kept me from giving the book 5 stars:
-Both of the societies in this world seem to be very binary around gender and sexuality. Fine, neither of them are presented as a utopia, but I was a little put out that the author never acknowledged that there might be people who didn't fall into these binaries, given that divisions based on gender and sexuality were key concepts in these societies and in the story.
-The only women that are confirmed in the book to be attracted to other women are anti-male separatists . Yeah, that doesn't play into stereotypes at all (/sarcasm).
So, great representation for gay men, not so awesome for any other queer people.
A couple minor quibbles, mostly around queer rep/issues, that kept me from giving the book 5 stars:
-Both of the societies in this world seem to be very binary around gender and sexuality. Fine, neither of them are presented as a utopia, but I was a little put out that the author never acknowledged that there might be people who didn't fall into these binaries, given that divisions based on gender and sexuality were key concepts in these societies and in the story.
-The only women that are confirmed in the book to be attracted to other women are anti-male separatists . Yeah, that doesn't play into stereotypes at all (/sarcasm).
So, great representation for gay men, not so awesome for any other queer people.
August 19, 2015
Kusanagi-Jones and Katherinessen come to New Amazonia on a complex ambassadorial/espionage mission, further fraught by their troubled personal history and the sights they have set on treason. Carnival shoves the reader into the middle of a vast world, focusing equally on high-concept worldbuilding and intricate interpersonal relationships. But not enough differentiates the protagonists: similar names, headhopping, and identical POVs, focus on microexpressions, and ulterior motives mean that it wasn't until the two-thirds mark that I could begin to tell them apart. (This may not be a problem for readers who are better with names.) But the sci-fi is great, creative, far-reaching, with the philosophical and social bent--which, always, ties into the lives of the characters--that makes Bear's work resonate for me. Carnival feels like a first novel, suffused with the promise of things to come but with an abundance of the author's weaknesses and common tropes. I don't particularly recommend it, especially as a starting place for Bear, but I liked it.
February 28, 2009
I liked the canon that Bear created for this long bit of science fiction, and that's what kept me reading despite the too obvious attempts to write an epic. (When the first line of a writer's bio proclaimed that she shares a birth-date with Sam and Frodo, I smiled and rolled my eyes.) This is the world of New Amazonia, a matriarchal society of unexplained resources that other survivors of Old Earth would like to partner with, if not conquer. Gender roles play an important part when two "gentle" males are sent as diplomats to negotiate some sort of alliance, but their real motivation is something different. The men are long separated lovers that pick up where they left off, when they're not disagreeing with each other. It took me a couple weeks to get through this book because it's so overwritten, but I did always come back to it.
May 29, 2022
Elizabeth Bear’s ‘Carnival’ (Bantam Spectra, $6.99, 395 pages) is everything I like about science fiction. The setting is unusual but plausible, cutting edge science comes into play (without overwhelming the narrative), the plot is clever and engaging, and the characters drive the story. In short, go buy this book.
If you want more details, two diplomats from the Coalition, a group of planets united by the rule of computer-like Governors to ensure population control and ecological balance, come to New Amazonia, a planet where women carry guns, run the show and keep men under their thumbs. The diplomats’ ostensible goal is to bring New Amazonia into the Coalition, but there are wheels within wheels.
There’s action, sex (though of the male-to-male variety) and grand schemes, and it’s all woven together neatly.
If you want more details, two diplomats from the Coalition, a group of planets united by the rule of computer-like Governors to ensure population control and ecological balance, come to New Amazonia, a planet where women carry guns, run the show and keep men under their thumbs. The diplomats’ ostensible goal is to bring New Amazonia into the Coalition, but there are wheels within wheels.
There’s action, sex (though of the male-to-male variety) and grand schemes, and it’s all woven together neatly.
July 29, 2019
I enjoyed this a lot, but man it took me for. ev. ver. to read. It's really long for a start, but it's also throws a lot of stuff at you from all directions. And it's all cool stuff, but I had to go up a gear in my brain to keep track of it all.
We have two ambassador-spies, (fact: I bought this book based solely on the promise of ambassedor spies), Vincent and Angelo. (His full name is Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusunagi-Jones, and there's an explanation for this ridiculousness in the book, a good one even, but still. What a name). They were once lovers, but have been apart for seventeen years after their affair was discovered. Homosexuality, under the rule of the Governors who represent Old Earth and control much of this universe, is super illegal. They were lucky not to be straight up killed for it.
But now they're needed for this mission to a planet called New Amazonia. As the name suggests, it's all super matriarchal and shit. There are men, but they are very much second class citizens, divided into two roles: stud, and gentle. Gentle males, or "safe" males as the New Amazonian society views them, are gay. This is why Vincent and Angelo have been reunited; the woman who rule New Amazonia would only accept "gentle" ambassadors. (So much of the New Amazonian and Old Earth societies is interesting subversions on ours. Not just the gender stuff, but also the approach to energy use and resources and stuff. It was really cool).
And the Governors, on behalf of Old Earth, really need this diplomatic mission to go well. Energy use is a huge issue for the rest of the universe, but New Amazonia has a seemiglny unlimited supply. Vincent and Angelo are to get them to share their secrets, peacefully or.... otherwise.
But both men have their own agendas, and this is where a good chunk of this book struggled for me. Figuring out Angelo and Vincent's differing agendas and keeping them straight was a real mission. Oh and also Lesa, our New Amazonian POV, who also has an angenda other than the one everyone is pretending to have on the surface.
I think because both of them had complicated backstories and complicated true purposes for being on New Amazonia, and it tied into the complicated history of the universe Bear had created, and was influenced by the complicated politics of social strata of New Amazonia. So all these complicated little balls were bouncing off each other in all directions and I was expected to juggle them.
After the fifty percent point I started to feel like I understood the history and politics that were informing what everyone did. The reality of the Governors and everyone's motivations and all of it clicked into place, which made the second half way more enjoyable for me than the first. I still enjoyed the first half, I was just confused a lot. I really loved watching Vincent and Angelo circle around and figure out what their relationship looked like now. The way they would describe each other and the way they interacted was like soothing aloe vera on the confusing burn of everything else.
I thought more than once while I read this that it would be enjoyed by folks who loved the recent and fantastic This Is How You Lose The Time War. It doesn't reach the same poetic heights, but that 'spies who love each other' vibe is all over this. You and Me vs. all our bosses.
So yeah. I have no idea why this book has so few ratings, because Elizabeth Bear is fantastic and this is a fantastic book by her. Imagine being so prolific that a book like this could become almost forgotten amid your incredible back catalogue?
We have two ambassador-spies, (fact: I bought this book based solely on the promise of ambassedor spies), Vincent and Angelo. (His full name is Michelangelo Osiris Leary Kusunagi-Jones, and there's an explanation for this ridiculousness in the book, a good one even, but still. What a name). They were once lovers, but have been apart for seventeen years after their affair was discovered. Homosexuality, under the rule of the Governors who represent Old Earth and control much of this universe, is super illegal. They were lucky not to be straight up killed for it.
But now they're needed for this mission to a planet called New Amazonia. As the name suggests, it's all super matriarchal and shit. There are men, but they are very much second class citizens, divided into two roles: stud, and gentle. Gentle males, or "safe" males as the New Amazonian society views them, are gay. This is why Vincent and Angelo have been reunited; the woman who rule New Amazonia would only accept "gentle" ambassadors. (So much of the New Amazonian and Old Earth societies is interesting subversions on ours. Not just the gender stuff, but also the approach to energy use and resources and stuff. It was really cool).
And the Governors, on behalf of Old Earth, really need this diplomatic mission to go well. Energy use is a huge issue for the rest of the universe, but New Amazonia has a seemiglny unlimited supply. Vincent and Angelo are to get them to share their secrets, peacefully or.... otherwise.
But both men have their own agendas, and this is where a good chunk of this book struggled for me. Figuring out Angelo and Vincent's differing agendas and keeping them straight was a real mission. Oh and also Lesa, our New Amazonian POV, who also has an angenda other than the one everyone is pretending to have on the surface.
I think because both of them had complicated backstories and complicated true purposes for being on New Amazonia, and it tied into the complicated history of the universe Bear had created, and was influenced by the complicated politics of social strata of New Amazonia. So all these complicated little balls were bouncing off each other in all directions and I was expected to juggle them.
After the fifty percent point I started to feel like I understood the history and politics that were informing what everyone did. The reality of the Governors and everyone's motivations and all of it clicked into place, which made the second half way more enjoyable for me than the first. I still enjoyed the first half, I was just confused a lot. I really loved watching Vincent and Angelo circle around and figure out what their relationship looked like now. The way they would describe each other and the way they interacted was like soothing aloe vera on the confusing burn of everything else.
I thought more than once while I read this that it would be enjoyed by folks who loved the recent and fantastic This Is How You Lose The Time War. It doesn't reach the same poetic heights, but that 'spies who love each other' vibe is all over this. You and Me vs. all our bosses.
So yeah. I have no idea why this book has so few ratings, because Elizabeth Bear is fantastic and this is a fantastic book by her. Imagine being so prolific that a book like this could become almost forgotten amid your incredible back catalogue?
January 14, 2025
The worldbuilding in this is complicated and I'm not sure it all makes sense. We take place in the far future. At some point, humans constructed these AI/robot things called "Governors" for environmental protection but they took things way too far - wiping out half of the human population and then ruthlessly enforcing strict regulations from then on. A few groups escaped by fleeing to other planets, but now the "Old Earth" Coalition is attempting to bring those all back under their control.
In addition to the strict environmental protection rules and periodically culling the population during "Assessments," the Old Earth Coalition operates under draconian laws such as making it illegal to be LGBTQ+. However, I'm not sure how that makes sense with the obsession with strict population control. Wouldn't same-sex couples be ideal if you're constantly worried about overpopulation? This is even brought up in text toward the end of the novel and hand-waved away.
Anyway, we follow a pair of spies - Vincent Katherinessen and Michelango Kusanagi-Jones - who are gay and former lovers, separated by their superiors who tried to put them through "therapy" (i.e. conversion/reeducation). They would have been killed outright, but they're just such good spies that the Coalition prefers to use them for specific missions.
Currently, the Coalition has set its sights on a planet called "New Amazonia" (yes, really) which seems to have some sort of limitless power source. New Amazonia will only deal with women or gay men, hence the Coalition allowing Vincent and Michelangelo to be reunited and paired together for the mission. On the surface, they are diplomats, returning stolen artwork as an act of "good faith." However, underneath, the Coalition fully intends to destroy/conquer New Amazonia. But also, Vincent and Michelangelo each secretly plan to betray the Coalition (and really, who wouldn't?) but don't tell each other this because each is convinced the other wouldn't approve (for some reason?)
"New Amazonia" is set up - at first glance - as a kind of women-centric utopia. However, it soon becomes apparent that it has its own problems, imbalances, and prejudices. Men, especially straight men, are basically chattel who are forced to compete in violent blood-sports to prove themselves worthy of being purchased by leading families. Gay men have a little more freedom (bi/pan people apparently don't exist.)
Not all the women on New Amazonia like this, either. We meet our other main character, Lesa Pretoria, who has a secret agenda of her own because she wants her young son, Julian, to have a better life.
Oh, also there are dragons.
There is a lot going on in this novel, with the double agents and the political machinations and it honestly made my head spin. I'm not sure if it's just that I don't really like spy stories or political intrigue all that much, or if the novel was actually as over-complicated as it felt.
The pace really picks up in the second half and the book gets a lot more readable as a result. Overall though, I'm left feeling mixed on it.
In addition to the strict environmental protection rules and periodically culling the population during "Assessments," the Old Earth Coalition operates under draconian laws such as making it illegal to be LGBTQ+. However, I'm not sure how that makes sense with the obsession with strict population control. Wouldn't same-sex couples be ideal if you're constantly worried about overpopulation? This is even brought up in text toward the end of the novel and hand-waved away.
Anyway, we follow a pair of spies - Vincent Katherinessen and Michelango Kusanagi-Jones - who are gay and former lovers, separated by their superiors who tried to put them through "therapy" (i.e. conversion/reeducation). They would have been killed outright, but they're just such good spies that the Coalition prefers to use them for specific missions.
Currently, the Coalition has set its sights on a planet called "New Amazonia" (yes, really) which seems to have some sort of limitless power source. New Amazonia will only deal with women or gay men, hence the Coalition allowing Vincent and Michelangelo to be reunited and paired together for the mission. On the surface, they are diplomats, returning stolen artwork as an act of "good faith." However, underneath, the Coalition fully intends to destroy/conquer New Amazonia. But also, Vincent and Michelangelo each secretly plan to betray the Coalition (and really, who wouldn't?) but don't tell each other this because each is convinced the other wouldn't approve (for some reason?)
"New Amazonia" is set up - at first glance - as a kind of women-centric utopia. However, it soon becomes apparent that it has its own problems, imbalances, and prejudices. Men, especially straight men, are basically chattel who are forced to compete in violent blood-sports to prove themselves worthy of being purchased by leading families. Gay men have a little more freedom (bi/pan people apparently don't exist.)
Not all the women on New Amazonia like this, either. We meet our other main character, Lesa Pretoria, who has a secret agenda of her own because she wants her young son, Julian, to have a better life.
Oh, also there are dragons.
There is a lot going on in this novel, with the double agents and the political machinations and it honestly made my head spin. I'm not sure if it's just that I don't really like spy stories or political intrigue all that much, or if the novel was actually as over-complicated as it felt.
The pace really picks up in the second half and the book gets a lot more readable as a result. Overall though, I'm left feeling mixed on it.
June 30, 2020
A male couple from Earth are sent to a planet run by women for diplomatic negotiations (but really to set the stage for an Earth Coalition takeover). Earth doesn't like gay people, but women don't have responsible positions there, and this planet wouldn't readily accept male diplomats who are "stud males" rather than "gentle" ones. Oh, and Earth's population was decimated, and continues to be culled, by the Governors, artificial intelligence originally created by a group of radicals.
This planet was previously populated by intelligent "dragons" who left behind their intelligent AI cities when they moved to...no spoilers here. But the dragons and their creations are important to the book.
The couple from Earth both have their own hidden agendas, as do seemingly most of the women they are in contact with. The main character among the women is the handler for the men from Earth. She is part of a prominent family that has its own intrigues.
The negotiations are to take place during Carnival, when the streets are so full of partiers that it's easier for various fringe groups to carry out their plots.
The characters are engaging and the plot moves along at a nice pace. Excellent book.
This planet was previously populated by intelligent "dragons" who left behind their intelligent AI cities when they moved to...no spoilers here. But the dragons and their creations are important to the book.
The couple from Earth both have their own hidden agendas, as do seemingly most of the women they are in contact with. The main character among the women is the handler for the men from Earth. She is part of a prominent family that has its own intrigues.
The negotiations are to take place during Carnival, when the streets are so full of partiers that it's easier for various fringe groups to carry out their plots.
The characters are engaging and the plot moves along at a nice pace. Excellent book.
September 18, 2018
I wanted to like this more than I did, and my main gripe about it is something kind of silly, but here goes:
One of the main characters here is named Michaelangelo Osiris Leary Kusangi-Jones. Then throughout the story he is referred to alternately as Michaelangelo, or Angelo, or Kusangi-Jones, for almost no reason(and sometimes even by the whole moniker). This would be bad enough, but the other character's is also referred to by his first and last name alternating (he has the label of Vincent Katherinessen). I kept getting confused which one was which and kept having to go back and look, which made the first half of the story really hard going for me.
Also, there was a HUGE amount of detail. It really set the scene, and the world building was great, but all the wardrobe talk was VERY distracting from the story.
Although these two things distracted me enough that I kept putting the book down, and made for a long time to finish, but the premise was interesting enough that I kept with it.
One of the main characters here is named Michaelangelo Osiris Leary Kusangi-Jones. Then throughout the story he is referred to alternately as Michaelangelo, or Angelo, or Kusangi-Jones, for almost no reason(and sometimes even by the whole moniker). This would be bad enough, but the other character's is also referred to by his first and last name alternating (he has the label of Vincent Katherinessen). I kept getting confused which one was which and kept having to go back and look, which made the first half of the story really hard going for me.
Also, there was a HUGE amount of detail. It really set the scene, and the world building was great, but all the wardrobe talk was VERY distracting from the story.
Although these two things distracted me enough that I kept putting the book down, and made for a long time to finish, but the premise was interesting enough that I kept with it.
August 4, 2025
Enjoyed this one -- Bear's books are always interesting and well written. The juxtaposition of sources for Old Earth's government was strange, but I could absolutely see how that happened. New Amazonia's society had a real old-school Second Wave feminism vibe that again, felt strange but plausible. The overall resolution to the plot seemed to happen too quickly, but maybe that's just me.
August 25, 2019
Cerebral, bendy, satisfying
If you're looking for space opera sci-fi, this isn't it. If you're looking for cultural echoes of our own struggles across planetary divides, with even starker lines drawn, this is the one. I enjoyed it.
If you're looking for space opera sci-fi, this isn't it. If you're looking for cultural echoes of our own struggles across planetary divides, with even starker lines drawn, this is the one. I enjoyed it.
January 8, 2016
I had the benefit of having little-to-no preconceptions about what this would be about or what to expect in the universe construction.
I thought it was an interesting look into gender constructions and interactions. Each side has their set of prejudices and it's interesting to observe where they intersect.
The whole political machinations was beyond me. I'll admit to being more of a character/atmosphere reader, and this did indeed have that, but towards the mid-end/end, it got heavier and heavier on the machinations, and at some point, I somehow completely lost track of what was going on. Like, literally, I somehow managed to completely miss a major plot point and only found out about it when it was referenced, and I sort of sat there staring dumbfounded like "...what. what the what. are you sure...? what?"
The ending completely lost me. I don't know if that's on me or on the writing, but I think another thing is, Bear "created" a lot of terminology based on pre-existing words, so I'm reading things thinking it's one thing, when it's something else completely. Sometimes, the things are explained, or at least sorta explained, like the whole Consent thing. But then sometimes, it's like I tripped and fell into a different world where certain words have different understood meanings than the one I was used to, but since it's their world, they didn't realize that might be a problem and no one really bothered to clue me in.
Actually, I lost interest in the characters at some point. It was interesting at first, and the whole world and dynamics of it, but somewhere along the way, the two MCs became...banal, somehow. So by the time they rolled out the whole , I found that I wasn't invested enough to actually care. It all fell somewhat flat for me by the end.
You know what I was actually interested in finding out about?
I thought it was an interesting look into gender constructions and interactions. Each side has their set of prejudices and it's interesting to observe where they intersect.
The whole political machinations was beyond me. I'll admit to being more of a character/atmosphere reader, and this did indeed have that, but towards the mid-end/end, it got heavier and heavier on the machinations, and at some point, I somehow completely lost track of what was going on. Like, literally, I somehow managed to completely miss a major plot point and only found out about it when it was referenced, and I sort of sat there staring dumbfounded like "...what. what the what. are you sure...? what?"
The ending completely lost me. I don't know if that's on me or on the writing, but I think another thing is, Bear "created" a lot of terminology based on pre-existing words, so I'm reading things thinking it's one thing, when it's something else completely. Sometimes, the things are explained, or at least sorta explained, like the whole Consent thing. But then sometimes, it's like I tripped and fell into a different world where certain words have different understood meanings than the one I was used to, but since it's their world, they didn't realize that might be a problem and no one really bothered to clue me in.
Actually, I lost interest in the characters at some point. It was interesting at first, and the whole world and dynamics of it, but somewhere along the way, the two MCs became...banal, somehow. So by the time they rolled out the whole , I found that I wasn't invested enough to actually care. It all fell somewhat flat for me by the end.
You know what I was actually interested in finding out about?
October 21, 2007
http://www.strangehorizons.com/reviews/2007/04/the_2007_philip.shtml[return][return]This is a superb tale of two galactic diplomatic agents sent to liaise with the matriarchal society of a formerly isolated planet; they are both men, former lovers reconstructing their relationship; each of the two has his own secret agenda, and so does each of the women (and occasional men) they must deal with on the planet, and the revelation and casting aside of their various masks both meshes with the Carnival theme and keeps up the tension of the narrative. I found this a brilliantly realised future environment at every level - the physical description of the planet (urban, alien ruins and wilderness), the societal background of the human characters (with both the war-weary galactic milieu and the matriachy of New Amazonia having clear plus and minus points) and the future technology inmagined (yer basic galactic empire stuff, but with a few interesting wrinkles thrown in). Add to that an intriguing and cryptic alien intelligence (or is it an artificial intelligence? or both?), and you are set for a great ride.[return][return]It's also notable that this book seriously addresses gender issues. There are discernable homages here to Joanna Russ and Ursula Le Guin, and yet Bear has taken us into a somewhat new territory - not prescribing how society ought to be, but looking at the damage that people can do to each other under any circumstances. Carnival takes us to another world from which we can look back more critically at our own.
August 6, 2016
This is my first Elizabeth Bear book, and I'm now afraid I'll be forever disappointed, because this is one ambitious, brilliantly done book.
I've read sci fi with matriarchal cultures before, but not one like this. This planetary culture is driven by deep-seated misandry / androphobia and it pervades the culture. For instance: women wear guns, men are not allowed weapons.
The world-building is fantastic; from the description of the carpetplant that covers the surface of the ground in the cities and buildings to the detailed exploration of this misandrist matriarchal colony planet's culture and institutionalized androphobia.
It took me a little while to get into the plot, but I fell in love with several of the characters, most especially Vincent. Vincent is a super-perceiver. I'm sensitive to subtle body language and facial expressions, and I really appreciated the show-don't-tell of Vincent's super-perception and how leveraged it as a diplomat.
Interesting plot, interesting conflict, interesting characters, great world-building and some decent speculative technology. Highly recommend!
I've read sci fi with matriarchal cultures before, but not one like this. This planetary culture is driven by deep-seated misandry / androphobia and it pervades the culture. For instance: women wear guns, men are not allowed weapons.
The world-building is fantastic; from the description of the carpetplant that covers the surface of the ground in the cities and buildings to the detailed exploration of this misandrist matriarchal colony planet's culture and institutionalized androphobia.
It took me a little while to get into the plot, but I fell in love with several of the characters, most especially Vincent. Vincent is a super-perceiver. I'm sensitive to subtle body language and facial expressions, and I really appreciated the show-don't-tell of Vincent's super-perception and how leveraged it as a diplomat.
Interesting plot, interesting conflict, interesting characters, great world-building and some decent speculative technology. Highly recommend!
July 29, 2016
Definitely an interesting book, all about sexual politics. This is a sci-fi novel, set in the distant future after a very authoritarian earth has taken political correctness to an extreme degree, and yet is still homophobic. How did that happen? Anyway, humans have spread out through space, and this novel centers on intergalactic diplomacy, which is a real cloak-and-dagger business. The heroes are a gay male couple, in disgrace because of their tendencies, posted to a planet where women have all the power and men are basically household pets.
The focus of the book is the relationship between the heroes, who are trying not to be in love with each other, and constantly surprising the women around them by not being idiots. They are the only characters that really seem alive. The swashbuckling women around them are equally heroic but the writer doesn’t give them the benefit of many emotions.
The writing is pithy, understated, and keeps you guessing about where everyone’s allegiances lie. It’s as much a mystery as a sci-fi novel.
The focus of the book is the relationship between the heroes, who are trying not to be in love with each other, and constantly surprising the women around them by not being idiots. They are the only characters that really seem alive. The swashbuckling women around them are equally heroic but the writer doesn’t give them the benefit of many emotions.
The writing is pithy, understated, and keeps you guessing about where everyone’s allegiances lie. It’s as much a mystery as a sci-fi novel.
Read
August 31, 2010Mini Review:
Political & emotional machinations are the moving force throughout this story. Not a light read.
...
The love story is integral but not blatant. Sexual intimacy is striking limited, though the single encounter I remember was enticing in the way of lovers, not pornographers.
The thickness of this novel may be a deterrent to some, but if you brave the weight of pages you will find yourself invested in a rich world with phantom stories flanking the past and the future... an echoing call for more, the history of this strange new world she has created.
Visit me at Sweet Vernal Zephyr for my long winded reviews.
Political & emotional machinations are the moving force throughout this story. Not a light read.
...
The love story is integral but not blatant. Sexual intimacy is striking limited, though the single encounter I remember was enticing in the way of lovers, not pornographers.
The thickness of this novel may be a deterrent to some, but if you brave the weight of pages you will find yourself invested in a rich world with phantom stories flanking the past and the future... an echoing call for more, the history of this strange new world she has created.
Visit me at Sweet Vernal Zephyr for my long winded reviews.
December 16, 2021
I would describe this book as being tedious. I could not finish it.
The book is a very slow. I feel like I stepped in the middle of a conversation and no one plans on letting me know what I missed or even the topic. I'm sure a lot of people find the book to be lovely but I can't see how they finished reading it or listening to it. If I had the physical book, I would have put it down after the second chapter.
The book is a very slow. I feel like I stepped in the middle of a conversation and no one plans on letting me know what I missed or even the topic. I'm sure a lot of people find the book to be lovely but I can't see how they finished reading it or listening to it. If I had the physical book, I would have put it down after the second chapter.
December 25, 2015
Fine adventure/intrigue, and I did like the way the author had such fun with her extreme reversals of gender roles. Thought the sex was overwrought, which cost it that fifth star.
Memorable line: "Can they be educated?" "Have you met my species?"
Memorable line: "Can they be educated?" "Have you met my species?"
April 8, 2018
Quite a few interesting ideas but I was too irritated by the quantum mumbo-jumbo, the "child genius outsmarting a (pseudo-)superintelligence", and the fact that they have utility fog but can't produce enough energy to sustain a 21st century style civilization for <100 million people to enjoy it.
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