More Catholic Than the Pope: An Inside Look At Extreme Traditionalism

by Patrick Madrid, Pete Vere

Faithful Remnant or Fanatic Schismatics? It can be difficult to distinguish defenders from defectors. Many traditionalist schisms that sprang up after the Second Vatican Council are filled with devotion to the Blessed Mother. They remain extremely conservative with regard to most moral issues afflicting the Western world today. They practice a strict reverence before the Blessed Sacrament during their traditional Latin liturgies. It can be easy to sympathize with such seemingly devout but truly disaffected Catholics. Now More Catholic Than the Pope examines one such group – the Society of St. Pius X – and explains how its prime architect and figurehead, Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, and his followers chose to cut themselves off from the Church. Here is the history of the society, from its beginning in France, to its rise and fall within the Catholic Church, to Pope John Paul II’s fraternal but ultimately fruitless efforts at reconciliation. Here, too, in a series of carefully chosen appendices, are the clear, concise, canonical answers to the issues Society members continue to raise, the arguments they still offer. "We earnestly hope that the evidence we present in this book will help extreme traditionalists to see the mistakes made by the SSPX and similar groups, abandon them, and come home to the Church." If your loved one is a member of an extreme traditionalist group … if representatives have been urging you to become involved … please read this book.

Genres: Catholic, Nonfiction

186 pages, Paperback

First published September 30, 2004

About the author

PATRICK MADRID is the publisher of Envoy Magazine, a journal of contemporary Catholic thought, and the director of the Envoy Institute of Belmont Abbey College. Since its inception in 1996, the Envoy team has garnered numerous journalism awards, including several first-place awards in the magazine-of-the-year “General Excellence” category from the Catholic Press Association.

Patrick is the author or editor of 14 books on Catholic themes including, Pope Fiction, Search and Rescue, Does the Bible Really Say That, 150 Bible Verses Every Catholic Should Know, and The Godless Delusion: A Catholic Challenge to Modern Atheism (Spring 2010). He edited and co-authored the acclaimed multi-volume Surprised by Truth series.

He has published numerous popular articles on Scripture, Church history, patristics, apologetics, and evangelization in various Catholic and Protestant periodicals, and he has contributed scholarly articles on apologetics in the New Catholic Encyclopedia.

Active in apologetics since 1987, he worked at Catholic Answers for eight years (from January 1988 to January 1996), where he served as vice president and helped co-found that apostolate's flagship magazine, This Rock, in January of 1990.

Patrick is a cradle-Catholic, not a convert. By God's grace, he was raised in the Catholic Faith and has been a practicing Catholic his entire life.

Growing up in Southern California, he attended grammar school at the Mission San Juan Capistrano parish school, where for years he served as an altar boy for the parish's daily Traditional Latin Mass in the famed Serra Chapel. Ever since his boyhood, Patrick has loved the Traditional Latin Mass.

Patrick earned a bachelor of science degree in business from the University of Phoenix and a bachelor of philosophy degree (B.Phil.) from the Pontifical College Josephinum in Columbus, Ohio, where he is completing a master's degree in dogmatic theology. He has also done graduate studies in theology at the University of Dallas.

He is the host of several EWTN television series, including “Pope Fiction,” “Search & Rescue,” and "Where Is That In the Bible?" and he hosts the Thursday edition of EWTN Radio's “Open Line” broadcast, heard on approximately 150 AM & FM stations across the United States, as well as on shortwave and on the Sirius Satellite Radio Network (Thursdays from 3:00 p.m. — 5:00 p.m. ET). He is also a regular guest on the "Catholic Answers Live" program and Sirius Radio's "The Catholic Channel."

Patrick serves on the board of trustees of the Dominican School of Philosophy and Theology in Berkeley, CA, on the board of directors of St. Gabriel Catholic Radio, in Columbus, Ohio, and on the board of advisors for Catholics United for the Faith, Immaculate Heart Radio Network, and Catholic Scripture Study International. He authored all the original website content for CatholicsComeHome.org, where he also serves as a theologica

Reviews

[Owen · Rating 2 out of 5]

The first half, which deals with the canonical status of the SSPX and traces the Archbishop Lefebvre's actions up to and including the 1988 Econe consecrations was the only worthwhile part of this book. Canon law is obviously a very technical field, but I found the presentation intelligible for a layman. Without reading more on the subject I cannot judge the validity of the excommunications, though the insistence that the SSPX is in schism is just untenable. This was written before Pope Benedict XVI's papacy so I would be interested to see how the authors would have argued differently based on the lifting of the excommunications, the vindication of Archbishop Lefebvre's position on the Mass by Summorum Pontificum, and then, under Pope Francis, the granting of faculties to SSPX priests to hear confessions and perform marriages.

The last two sections of the book attempted to address traditionalist critiques of Vatican II and the Novus Ordo, and it utterly failed. One of the authors, Pete Vere, used to attend an SSPX chapel, so I find it rather odd that the arguments that are presented for refutation are so weak. There were a number of logical fallacies in the argumentation, and the consistent rhetoric of "extreme" traditionalists really prevented this from being considered a serious response to the positions of the SSPX.

[Andy Lind · Rating 2 out of 5]

The reader needs to know first and foremost that if they plan on giving this book to their Latin Mass-loving friends, it is out of print. That was my first disappointment, but it also makes me wonder if Patrick Madrid has changed his stance on TLM (Traditional Latin Mass) Catholics, especially with how far from tradition Pope Francis's papacy has been. Also, readers should know this is the only one of Patrick Madrid's books that I could find that was deemed out of print. Even his website lists all of his books as available for purchase except this one. With that being said, on with the review.

The book is divided into three parts.

Part One goes into the history of the SSPX (Society of Saint Pius The Tenth). One must understand that this isn't the only sedevacantist group out there.

Part Two seeks to prove that sedevacantist groups were wrong about The Second Vatican Council.

Part Three is a Question and Answer section.

Although the book does list some orders that do the TLM that are in communion with The Holy See (such as The Priestly Fraternity of Saint Peter (FSSP)), it doesn't list all of them and it doesn't say many positive things about them.

In Conclusion, I would say, "Get this out-of-print book more as a collector's item than an actual read and/or evangelization tool, because the TLM is making a comeback, no matter how hard Pope Francis and the cardinals and bishops he appoints try to stop it."

[Steven H · Rating 5 out of 5]

A CRITIQUE OF ARCHBISHOP LEFEBVRE AND THE SSPX

Patrick Madrid (born 1960), is a Catholic author, TV/radio host on EWTN, apologist, and the publisher of Envoy Magazine; he has written many books such as 'Search and Rescue: How to Bring Your Family and Friends Into or Back Into the Catholic Church,' 'Where is That in the Bible?,' 'Answer Me This!,' 'Why is That in Tradition?,' 'A Pocket Guide to Catholic Apologetics,' 'Pope Fiction: Answers to 30 Myths and Misconceptions About the Papacy', etc. Pete Vere is a canon lawyer and "a former adherent of the SSPX schism."

The Introduction to this 2004 book states, "This book examines the claims made by the extreme-traditionalist movement spawned by the late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre---the Society of St Pius X, commonly referred to as the SSPX. At the heart of this story is the question of schism: Is the SSPX separated from the Catholic Church, or is it, as its adherents claim, the most faithful and authentic expression of the Church? Our thesis is that the SSPX is in schism, and this book will lay out the evidence in support of this conclusion. Along the way we will consider and respond to various arguments and controversies raised by followers of Archbishop Lefebvre." (Pg. 9)

They note, "Sadly, Archbishop Lefebvre passed away in Ecône in March of 1991 without formally reconciling either his followers or himself with the Church... Bishop de Castro Mayer's successor would lead his followers back into full communion with Rome within ten years of the bishop's death, and today his followers enjoy their own juridical structure within the Church... Yet, similar negotiations with Archbishop Lefebvre's followers broke down, and today the SSPX remains in a state of schism from the Catholic Church... Many estimates place the number of adherents to Archbishop Lefebvre's schism at the one million rank." (Pg. 22-23)

Of Lefebvre's controversial priestly ordinations in 1976, they observe, "Whether or not Lefebvre subjectively believed the Pope had suppressed his society was not irrelevant... Archbishop Lefebvre knew that the will of the Roman Pontiff forbade him from proceeding with the ordinations. Therefore, he knew how the highest authority in the Church would interpret the law as it applied to his situation...

"While Archbishop Lefebvre found this prohibition harsh---especially given the canonical warning's proximity to the date scheduled for the ordination of his seminarians---the fact remains the Rome had suppressed the SSPX and its seminary approximately a year before. Therefore, Rome's actions were hardly surprising, and ought to have been anticipated by Lefebvre and his followers." (Pg. 46)

They point out, "in 1988 ... Pope John Paul II ... lifted most of the previous restrictions place upon the traditional Liturgy and eliminated the extra paperwork involved. He also extended permission for diocesan bishops to allow for the other sacraments to be celebrated according to the liturgical books used in 1962. Basically, Rome took a hands-off approach---allowing each diocesan bishop to determine the level of pastoral support for traditionalists within respective diocese...

"The authors, who themselves are traditionalists who love and revere the ancient liturgical patrimony of the Church, respectfully encourage all Catholics, especially traditionalist Catholics, to avail themselves of any and all lawful opportunities, such as those mentioned above, to maintain and deepen their love for Catholic Tradition." (Pg. 146)

This is an insightful examination of Archbishop Lefebvre and the SSPX, that be of great interest to anyone studying these matters.

[Linda Taylor · Rating 3 out of 5]

Pretty dense stuff, but important.

[Paul Millington · Rating 5 out of 5]

The book is split into three parts; background/canonical status, traditionalist statements regarding Vatican II, brief answers to some some traditionalist arguments.

The first part is very technical with many references to Canon Law - best to take a few notes as you go along or have the references handy for each time they are mentioned. I think this was the best section as it dealt with ultimately the most important factor in dealing with groups like the SSPX, namely Canon Law. The arguments are water tight with every possibility explored.

The second chapter is also excellent and deals with questions such as, "Was Vatican II merely pastoral?" "Did the Council change Church teachings regarding the Eucharist?". Again, very interesting.

The third chapter is a slight disappointment. The book only aims to give brief explanations to typical traditional argument but questions such as, "Is the New Mass a danger to the faith" deserve a whole book to themselves rather than a page giving a very simplistic answer to (often valid) criticisms of the Novus Ordo Mass.

Saying that, if you would like to know more about the SSPX, their history and have a solid refutation against their arguments then this is the book for you. 5 stars.

[Karina · Rating 4 out of 5]

The first part is a bit technical focusing on how the schism came about and quoting canon law etc. The next few parts were more interesting to me dealing with the actual issues raised by these traditionalists.

This book was really thin and authors tended to repeat themselves a lot.they repeated and repeated. So this felt like a speech more than a book. I mean in a speech you need to repeat important points so the audience catches that it's important and remembers. In a book where readers can back up and reread this is superfluous and annoying -- "didn't you just say this in a previous sentence or two?"

[TheRose · Rating 3 out of 5]

This great book is packed with great information!