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Talking to the Spirits: Personal Gnosis in Pagan Religion
A guide to direct communication with the spirits and the Gods • Offers practices for seekers and groups to learn to hear and respond to the spirits and the Gods as well as what to do (and not do) if you receive a message • Explains how to authenticate spiritual messages with divination • Discusses how to avoid theological conflicts when someone’s personal gnosis differs from that of their Pagan group For our ancestors the whole world was alive with spirits. The Gods bubbled forth from rivers and springs and whispered in the breezes that rustled through cities and farms. The ground underfoot, the stones, the fire that cooked the food and drove off the darkness, these all had spirits--not just spirits in some other dimension, but spirits in them who could be spoken to and allied with. In today’s world we are led to believe that the spirits long ago went silent and that spiritual wisdom can only be gained through established religious doctrine. Providing a guide for opening two-way conversation with the spirits of daily life as well as direct communication with the Gods, Kenaz Filan and Raven Kaldera explore how to enrich your spiritual path with personal gnosis--asking your Guides for assistance or teachings and receiving a response. They explain how to develop your sensitivity to the voices of the Divine, discern genuine spiritual messages from the projection of internal psychodrama, and what to do (and not do) with the messages you receive. Confirming their own personal gnosis with Northern Tradition Pagan beliefs and Greco-Roman, Celtic, Egyptian, and indigenous hunter-gatherer lore, the authors discuss how to avoid theological conflicts when someone’s personal gnosis differs from that of their Pagan group as well as how to authenticate messages with individual and group divination. Offering practices and principles for seekers and groups, they reveal that the spirits never went silent, we simply forgot how to hear them.
326 pages, Kindle Edition
First published February 15, 2013
10 people are currently reading
133 people want to read
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Displaying 1 - 11 of 11 reviews
June 10, 2014
The book has pro's and con's. There is a lot of good information, but it should be taken under advisement of your intuition.
For one thing, there is an over emphasis on using others divination. I honestly believe, it is imperative that someone figure out for themselves Gnosis and not trust on others viewpoint. That way leads to danger in my point of view.
I also strongly believe that the chapter on mental illness and medication needs to be strongly looked at. I'm gobsmacked that one of the advise was to consult someone who uses divination in regards to medication. No, NO and NO!!! I don't care how psychic you are, that stuff is between the patient and doctor.
If you feel the medication is wrong and you aren't having a good relationship with the doc, then talk to people who are advocates of patients. Talk to other patients who know what they are talking about. Do not go to someone who is psychic to figure this out.
For one thing, there is an over emphasis on using others divination. I honestly believe, it is imperative that someone figure out for themselves Gnosis and not trust on others viewpoint. That way leads to danger in my point of view.
I also strongly believe that the chapter on mental illness and medication needs to be strongly looked at. I'm gobsmacked that one of the advise was to consult someone who uses divination in regards to medication. No, NO and NO!!! I don't care how psychic you are, that stuff is between the patient and doctor.
If you feel the medication is wrong and you aren't having a good relationship with the doc, then talk to people who are advocates of patients. Talk to other patients who know what they are talking about. Do not go to someone who is psychic to figure this out.
March 10, 2015
If you’re going to buy one book on Pagan Religion and Philosophy this year, make it this one. If you’re new to the practice, it’ll give you a great grounding in a vital topic. If you’ve been around Neo-Paganism for a while, it provides both practical advice for taking your spirituality to a deeper level and a lot of validation for beliefs you might already hold. I can’t count the number of times that, while reading this, I sat up and shouted, “YES! That is exactly it!”
Personal Gnosis—the experience of a deep inner knowledge of spiritual truth—is a cornerstone of Neo-Pagan religion. Yet, according to Filan and Kaldera, many Neo-Pagans do not trust or understand it and may even fear it. This is due to a number of circumstances, mainly the fact that many, if not most people come to Paganism from religions where personal gnosis is suspect, and the idea of forming a relationship with Gods and spirits who can and do act in the material world is seen as superstitious at best. In the authors’ view, however, being able to talk to—and more importantly, listen to—the Gods is the key to honest worship and religious practice that will keep Neo-Paganism from becoming hidebound and stagnant.
Talking to the Spirits is more than a manual for having a mystical experience, though. It is a thoroughly-researched and well-organized examination of the place of Personal Gnosis in Paganism from historic times up through the present day. Starting with definitions, it progresses to experiential accounts of Personal Gnosis, explores why it’s an important concept, and delves into the qualities necessary to mysticism and how to develop them. With numerous quotes taken from prominent practitioners in various traditions, it addresses such concerns as how to be sure you’re really receiving a divine message and how to deal with it when, despite your best efforts, the psychic “airwaves” remain silent. The latter third of the book is devoted to an examination of how Personal Gnosis can be incorporated into groups, with detailed suggestions for Group Leaders, “Messengers,” and Diviners, among others.
One thing I found refreshing and gratifying in this book was that Filan and Kaldera hold themselves to an impeccable academic standard throughout. All too often, books on Paganism fail to rise above the beginner level and seem to be more about the author getting some ego gratification by trying to sound profound than they are about providing clear information to a specific audience. Filan and Kaldera made occasional reference to themselves and their experiences, but for the most part they refrained from making the book about them. When they wanted to elucidate a point with personal narrative, they used someone else’s. It helped me take their work seriously because it was clear that they took it seriously, and believed in it enough to let it speak for itself.
This is not an easy book to read because the subject matter is intense and the material is dense. I’m a fast reader, and it took me over a month to wade through Talking to the Spirits. There were times I had to put it aside for several days, the better to digest some juicy morsel. However, I was always excited and eager to get back to it, which is often not the case for me with Pagan non-fiction. I can honestly say that reading it not only gave me a better understanding of my own spiritual identity, but gave me more hope for the survival of Neo-Paganism as a whole. Filan and Kaldera understand necessary things like boundaries and courtesy, and how critical dialogue is necessary to any discussion about faith. I hope to read more of their work in the future.
Personal Gnosis—the experience of a deep inner knowledge of spiritual truth—is a cornerstone of Neo-Pagan religion. Yet, according to Filan and Kaldera, many Neo-Pagans do not trust or understand it and may even fear it. This is due to a number of circumstances, mainly the fact that many, if not most people come to Paganism from religions where personal gnosis is suspect, and the idea of forming a relationship with Gods and spirits who can and do act in the material world is seen as superstitious at best. In the authors’ view, however, being able to talk to—and more importantly, listen to—the Gods is the key to honest worship and religious practice that will keep Neo-Paganism from becoming hidebound and stagnant.
Talking to the Spirits is more than a manual for having a mystical experience, though. It is a thoroughly-researched and well-organized examination of the place of Personal Gnosis in Paganism from historic times up through the present day. Starting with definitions, it progresses to experiential accounts of Personal Gnosis, explores why it’s an important concept, and delves into the qualities necessary to mysticism and how to develop them. With numerous quotes taken from prominent practitioners in various traditions, it addresses such concerns as how to be sure you’re really receiving a divine message and how to deal with it when, despite your best efforts, the psychic “airwaves” remain silent. The latter third of the book is devoted to an examination of how Personal Gnosis can be incorporated into groups, with detailed suggestions for Group Leaders, “Messengers,” and Diviners, among others.
One thing I found refreshing and gratifying in this book was that Filan and Kaldera hold themselves to an impeccable academic standard throughout. All too often, books on Paganism fail to rise above the beginner level and seem to be more about the author getting some ego gratification by trying to sound profound than they are about providing clear information to a specific audience. Filan and Kaldera made occasional reference to themselves and their experiences, but for the most part they refrained from making the book about them. When they wanted to elucidate a point with personal narrative, they used someone else’s. It helped me take their work seriously because it was clear that they took it seriously, and believed in it enough to let it speak for itself.
This is not an easy book to read because the subject matter is intense and the material is dense. I’m a fast reader, and it took me over a month to wade through Talking to the Spirits. There were times I had to put it aside for several days, the better to digest some juicy morsel. However, I was always excited and eager to get back to it, which is often not the case for me with Pagan non-fiction. I can honestly say that reading it not only gave me a better understanding of my own spiritual identity, but gave me more hope for the survival of Neo-Paganism as a whole. Filan and Kaldera understand necessary things like boundaries and courtesy, and how critical dialogue is necessary to any discussion about faith. I hope to read more of their work in the future.
February 21, 2017
The first few chapters of this book were quite useful, and I imagine they would be even moreso to someone less versed in spirit talk theory or animism/polytheism in general. The sections on methods, determining true messages from your own subconscious, and improving signal clarity were all quite helpful, if a little vague. It's understandable because spirit talk is going to be different for everyone, but at times it felt as if the authors were hesitant to use any specifics or examples less they be attacked by someone whose mileage varied -- a very plausible event in the neopagan 'community'.
Interspersed throughout the book are quotations and personal experiences from pagans around the world. While these were insightful at times, often they were exceedingly long and overshadowed the writing of the authors themselves. Some chapters seemed to be more block quotes than actual text, and many names appeared repeatedly, such as that I began to form personal opinions about the respondents and get annoyed with their repetitiveness. I think it's important and helpful to allow multiple opinions and experiences to be shown, but I think the authors or editors went a little overboard and could have trimmed down those interjections.
The rest of the book talked a lot (A LOT) about the politics of being a spirit worker or a god phone. This is really really important stuff because the 'community' tends to get their collective undergarments in a bunch over spirit work quite frequently, and frauds and charlatans abound. But it wasn't exactly what I was expecting from the book. I'm glad it was included, but again I felt that the authors' wisdom and experience with actual spirit work was overshadowed by politics.
Another bit -- when they say talking to spirits, they mean pretty much any entity, so gods were included. There was a lot more god-phone or god spouse or god talking information than I had expected; I was looking for a book that would focus more on 'small' or local spirits, the ones that might not have names, that people don't usually boast about talking to. While the techniques could surely be useful in speaking with these entities, it's a shame that they were a bit overshadowed as well.
A pretty good read for anyone interested in spirit work. Required reading for anyone who thinks they want to become a spiritual leader, public spiritworker, god-phone/spouse/whatever, or any sort of visible presence in the 'community'. Not exactly what I was expecting, but very good for what it was. Now I'm moving on to The Tradition of Household Spirits by Lecouteux -- I feel that it might have more of the folklore and specifics for local spirits that I'm looking for.
Interspersed throughout the book are quotations and personal experiences from pagans around the world. While these were insightful at times, often they were exceedingly long and overshadowed the writing of the authors themselves. Some chapters seemed to be more block quotes than actual text, and many names appeared repeatedly, such as that I began to form personal opinions about the respondents and get annoyed with their repetitiveness. I think it's important and helpful to allow multiple opinions and experiences to be shown, but I think the authors or editors went a little overboard and could have trimmed down those interjections.
The rest of the book talked a lot (A LOT) about the politics of being a spirit worker or a god phone. This is really really important stuff because the 'community' tends to get their collective undergarments in a bunch over spirit work quite frequently, and frauds and charlatans abound. But it wasn't exactly what I was expecting from the book. I'm glad it was included, but again I felt that the authors' wisdom and experience with actual spirit work was overshadowed by politics.
Another bit -- when they say talking to spirits, they mean pretty much any entity, so gods were included. There was a lot more god-phone or god spouse or god talking information than I had expected; I was looking for a book that would focus more on 'small' or local spirits, the ones that might not have names, that people don't usually boast about talking to. While the techniques could surely be useful in speaking with these entities, it's a shame that they were a bit overshadowed as well.
A pretty good read for anyone interested in spirit work. Required reading for anyone who thinks they want to become a spiritual leader, public spiritworker, god-phone/spouse/whatever, or any sort of visible presence in the 'community'. Not exactly what I was expecting, but very good for what it was. Now I'm moving on to The Tradition of Household Spirits by Lecouteux -- I feel that it might have more of the folklore and specifics for local spirits that I'm looking for.
June 15, 2022
The gods are among us and talking to us - if only we are ready to listen. It is a revolutionary idea if you were brought up in the Church of England where all the revelations were hundreds of years ago. I found the book a good introduction to pagan beliefs and enjoyed the wide range of voices.
February 4, 2014
I enjoyed this book. It spoke fairly well he my experiences and gave me insight into how gnosis works within other groups, as I've had limited group experience myself. The most valuable parts that I will refer others to were the sections on how to evaluate a diviner and how to evaluate groups that deal with gnosis, and, my favorite part, the Four-Fold Signal Clarity divination method--it's something that I have largely done for myself when I receive messages from my Powers or from other people and it has born out quite well for me. Sadly, it's not something that's held onto by the larger pagan or polytheist communities, which is a symptom of a lack of balance between faith and cynicism--going too far in either direction is the kiss of death.
A lot of problematic behaviors are talked about and a lot of the folks quoted talk about how other people have done , but no one really owns making those mistakes--whether they are misinterpreting a message or getting caught up in ego and thinking you are the only person who can do or not getting outside checks done. It happens because we all do it, whether we want to admit it or not, and I wish there had been an exploration of what it is like to screw up, what the fallout is, and how it a person actually handled it from a first-person perspective.
Worth reading, particularly if you are newer to hearing from Spirits or have questions about how to sort what you are hearing out.
A lot of problematic behaviors are talked about and a lot of the folks quoted talk about how other people have done , but no one really owns making those mistakes--whether they are misinterpreting a message or getting caught up in ego and thinking you are the only person who can do or not getting outside checks done. It happens because we all do it, whether we want to admit it or not, and I wish there had been an exploration of what it is like to screw up, what the fallout is, and how it a person actually handled it from a first-person perspective.
Worth reading, particularly if you are newer to hearing from Spirits or have questions about how to sort what you are hearing out.
July 19, 2017
Taught me everything except what I picked it up for: "how do speak to gods??"
But seriously it was a very good book, that was very intelligent and mostly easily read. Each example was carefully chosen. I think I may have had some minor complaints in the book- perhaps in a couple of the choices, maybe the placements of huge quotes in the middle of chapters; maybe using a few people a bit too much. But I read this maybe a year ago, and I mostly remember this as a very good book.
But seriously it was a very good book, that was very intelligent and mostly easily read. Each example was carefully chosen. I think I may have had some minor complaints in the book- perhaps in a couple of the choices, maybe the placements of huge quotes in the middle of chapters; maybe using a few people a bit too much. But I read this maybe a year ago, and I mostly remember this as a very good book.
August 16, 2018
Started off interesting, but became a little dry in the middle. As a solo practitioner, the many chapters on group interactions were a bit useless to me personally.
August 2, 2014
The first time I ever heard of an "Unverified Personal Gnosis" or UPG, I was responding to a post on John Beckett's blog. After a little back and forth, I realized I needed to get to know a bit more about the term, as well as the underlying definitions - especially since it seemed to apply directly to me. Some short searching on Amazon's website turned up the title: "Talking to the Spirits: Personal Gnosis in Pagan Religion" by Kenaz Filan & Raven Kaldera. The price was affordable as a Kindle book, so I downloaded it. And it sat on my reader for nearly a year before I finally started reading it.
The first two chapters satisfied my desire to understand the definitions surrounding the area of Personal Gnosis, as well as showcasing some of the differences between Verified and Unverified PG. But shortly after this, the book took a massive turn into the area of overkill. Concepts were presented which revolve around the area of VPG and UPG, particularly in trying to determine what was "real" and "correct" concerning the area of verification. Adding to this was the endless parade of material from other people on the various topics. I'm quite sure that this works for other folks, but for me it was quite the distraction. In fact, the material did nothing to answer questions, and only raised the question of why the authors had chosen to write the book this way. Until I came to the very last chapter of the book.
"The Rocky Road to Intrafaith Dialogue" was honestly the meat that I needed to get. One particular passage has now been added to my little book of quotes:
"Discussion involves an exchange of ideas and discourse about their ramifications. It may get intense, even heated at times, but this is fine so long as everyone remains respectful and the questions focus on ideas rather than individuals. Smiling, nodding, and saying "Everyone's truths are true for them, and every belief is just as good as every other belief" is not interfaith discussion. Rather, it is a way of avoiding questions about the substance and foundation of your beliefs and about the level of your commitment. Instead of sparking conversation, it shuts it down or reduces it to polite superficialities." --Filan & Kaldera
This one little passage has me rethinking a particular part of the way I approach discussions about my beliefs with others. That the focus could be narrowed or widened as necessary. And its statements like this - throughout the book - which had me reading at a pace far slower than I am accustomed to. It took me nearly two months to finish reading this book. I kept putting it down, and thinking about what had just been presented to me.
If you are looking for a book that will not only challenge the way you think about beliefs of others, as well as challenge the way you approach discussing that particular touchy area of individual life - this is definitely the book for you. If you are wanting to find out more about the concept of Personal Gnosis, as well as understanding the differences between verified and unverified PG -- this is definitely a good starting point. While others may appreciate the infusion of other perspectives from various individuals - I thought the book would have been far better without these interspersed throughout the chapters. Instead, I would have preferred these to have been confined to an Addendum of some sort, but that's my personal preference.
The first two chapters satisfied my desire to understand the definitions surrounding the area of Personal Gnosis, as well as showcasing some of the differences between Verified and Unverified PG. But shortly after this, the book took a massive turn into the area of overkill. Concepts were presented which revolve around the area of VPG and UPG, particularly in trying to determine what was "real" and "correct" concerning the area of verification. Adding to this was the endless parade of material from other people on the various topics. I'm quite sure that this works for other folks, but for me it was quite the distraction. In fact, the material did nothing to answer questions, and only raised the question of why the authors had chosen to write the book this way. Until I came to the very last chapter of the book.
"The Rocky Road to Intrafaith Dialogue" was honestly the meat that I needed to get. One particular passage has now been added to my little book of quotes:
"Discussion involves an exchange of ideas and discourse about their ramifications. It may get intense, even heated at times, but this is fine so long as everyone remains respectful and the questions focus on ideas rather than individuals. Smiling, nodding, and saying "Everyone's truths are true for them, and every belief is just as good as every other belief" is not interfaith discussion. Rather, it is a way of avoiding questions about the substance and foundation of your beliefs and about the level of your commitment. Instead of sparking conversation, it shuts it down or reduces it to polite superficialities." --Filan & Kaldera
This one little passage has me rethinking a particular part of the way I approach discussions about my beliefs with others. That the focus could be narrowed or widened as necessary. And its statements like this - throughout the book - which had me reading at a pace far slower than I am accustomed to. It took me nearly two months to finish reading this book. I kept putting it down, and thinking about what had just been presented to me.
If you are looking for a book that will not only challenge the way you think about beliefs of others, as well as challenge the way you approach discussing that particular touchy area of individual life - this is definitely the book for you. If you are wanting to find out more about the concept of Personal Gnosis, as well as understanding the differences between verified and unverified PG -- this is definitely a good starting point. While others may appreciate the infusion of other perspectives from various individuals - I thought the book would have been far better without these interspersed throughout the chapters. Instead, I would have preferred these to have been confined to an Addendum of some sort, but that's my personal preference.
March 1, 2013
A practical look at how personal gnosis (through intuition, visions, etc) is approached by the religions which fall under the modern Pagan umbrella. I found the quotes from representatives of different faiths to be of particular value, giving a well-rounded sketch of attitudes toward incorporation of personal knowing in community work.
Thoughtful and well-written; I hope to see more interfaith work in this vein.
Thoughtful and well-written; I hope to see more interfaith work in this vein.
February 13, 2016
This is everything one might want to know about personal gnosis in a Pagan framework from ways to verify messages, and how to handle them internally, and communally.
November 26, 2016
i liked the nuanced discussion of psych meds' potential effects on spirituality in particular.
Displaying 1 - 11 of 11 reviews