Ragionamenti. Sei giornate

Ragionamenti #1-2

by Pietro Aretino

Pietro Aretino (1492-1556) was one of the most important figures in Italian Renaissance literature, and certainly the most controversial. Condemned by some as a pornographer, his infamy was due largely to his use of explicit sexuality and the vulgar tongue of ordinary speech in much of his work.

Dialogues centres around a conversation between two rather frank, experienced, and sharp-tongued women on the topic of women's occupations. We learn that at the time there were only three: wife, whore, or nun. Their discussion is a rollicking account of the advantages, perils, and pleasures each profession offers.

Not only was Dialogues the first erotic book in the Christian world to be written in the common vernacular, it was but one of the few to describe the obscenity of commercial love, and is thus a cornerstone of both Italian literature and Counter-Renaissance vigour. Raymond Rosenthal's English translation first appeared in 1971, and this edition contains his original preface as well as a new introduction by Margaret Rosethal. Also included, as a preface, is a review of the translation by Alberto Moravia from the New York Times Book Review.

Genres: Italian Literature, Fiction, Italy, Literature, Renaissance, Erotica, Classics

Paperback

First published January 1, 1536

About the author

Pietro Aretino was an Italian author, playwright, poet and satirist who wielded immense influence on contemporary art and politics and invented modern literate pornography.

Reviews

[Zadignose]

A thoroughly excellent novel in dialog--or, rather, six dialogs--that is vulgar to an extreme, cynical, scornful, vicious, witty, and inventive. In analyzing a life of whoredom, Aretino exposes the hypocrisies, vanities, and brutish idiocy of the supposedly better parts of society, including but not limited to the clergy, nobles, merchants, royals, and poets. He scandalizes simply everyone, and along the way, while at first it appeared that he set out only to jest and jeer, Aretino seems half-persuaded through his own rhetoric to genuinely respect the "art" of the whore and her ability to give back to society some share of the hell they've given her.

Aretino's writing moves quickly, but it is packed with substance--a kind of dense, dynamic, economical form that is somehow maximalist without superfluity. (Does that make sense? Fuck if I know.) Its a style that says, Why give one example when you can give thirteen? Why give two common metaphors when you can supplement them with three more unheard-of metaphors? Why be hyperbolic when you can be super-hyperbolic? But when a story's finished, it's finished, let's move on, no time to beat around the bush, there are three-times-thirty-one more stories waiting impatiently in line and they're ready to bust down the door.

The dialogs were published in two volumes with about nine years in between--I won't look it up to confirm. I read them with a hiatus between the two volumes. I was a little worried when I returned to take up dialog four (or 2.1?), fearing that it might be good but might also just be more of the same. I needn't have feared. The first three dealt with the three professions of women: nun, wife, and whore, reaching the reasonable conclusion that whore is the most respectable, rewarding, and dignified. The fourth takes up the topic again, as Nanna is now teaching the tricks of the trade to her daughter, to prepare her for whoredom, to make her a pastmistress of the art, and to supply her with the necessary cautions to minimize the chances of her being utterly ruined. But, as I noted above, here is where I find Aretino becoming notably persuasive, i.e. facetious as ever, but also seemingly semi-sincere in elevating the status of the whore and admiring her resourcefulness, considering her no less dignified than all the other denizens of that stinking human cesspool known as Rome. Or perhaps not--perhaps he only wants to sully us all.

Dialog five gives greater justification for women to exploit, plunder, ruin--and why stop short of murder?--that frightful species known as men. For this is the chapter which treats the abuses of women and whores of all stations by all the legions of deceitful male devils. And without changing the tone or style of presentation, this dialog confronts us with some shocking abuses that we only thought the first four dialogues had made us too jaded to be moved by. Then, in the final dialog there is a shift to one more perspective, that of the bawds, which serves as an elucidation as well as a warning to both the men and whores who can be trapped and tricked by these ultra-trickster middle-women. And thus our survey is concluded.

What perspective should you take on all this? I can't tell you, but I will suggest it's likely that you will find many occasions to laugh and a few to wince in psychic agony, and it will be up to you to figure out who you are laughing with or at, and who you're feeling sorry for. In any case, it's a literary gauntlet tossed down at your feet. Don't be emasculated/efeminated by declining the challenge. Unless you have something better to do.

[Excerpts may come later, folks, but right now I'm burnt out. Cheers.]

[Roman Clodia · Rating 4 out of 5]

Aretino was both famous and infamous for his writings which forced him to leave Rome in 1527 after he published a set of obscene sonnets to accompany some sexually explicit engravings - the whole book later known as Aretino's Postures. Rather ironically the book was placed on the Papal Index and burned publically, which only led to it being re-published in more liberal Venice and made famous throughout Europe.

The Dialogues contained here are in the same tradition: they are in two sets of three days each - the first retell the conversations between Antonia and Nanna, a pair of Italian prostitutes; and the second set the conversations between Nanna and her daughter Pippa who wants to become a prostitute.

Deliberately mocking the classical dialogue form of Plato, these are written in the venacular and in street language. Mocking, bawdy, witty and scurrilous, they rip into the institutions of the Italian establishment, particularly the church and papal court. Using the voices of women who are deliberately excluded from social power, this takes an outsider's stance and uses it to attack the attackers.

Aretino has been called the father of 'pornography' (which didn't exist, arguably, as a separate category in the C16th) but if you're just looking for that then I suspect you'll be disappointed. This does contain some great set pieces including the initial orgy in the monastery, but sexual discourse here also has a serious political function.

This seems to be the only English translation of Aretino's dialogues and really needs to be available in a cheaper edition. Day 4 is available alone as The School of Whoredom (Hesperus Classics) but it seems an odd choice to have taken that one dialogue out of context.

[Greg · Rating 3 out of 5]

Pornographic Renaissance satire. I can't say anything more about it, or I'll get embarrassed.

[Pierre · Rating 3 out of 5]

I Ragionamenti di Pietro Aretino sono divisi in due gruppi di tre giornate. Nel primo, Antonia e Nanna parlano della biografia di quest'ultima, che è stata prima monaca, poi moglie e infine prostituta; l'obiettivo è stabilire quale sia la strada migliore per Pippa, giovane figlia di Nanna.
Nella seconda triade, invece, Nanna insegna a sua figlia le arti della prostituzione (la strada scelta al termine della terza giornata).

La maggior parte dell'opera è istituita da aneddoti più o meno piccanti e più o meno divertenti. In tutti, emerge la schiettezza di Pietro Aretino, che senza timori dà la propria visione libera della sessualità adottando un punto di vista femminile smaliziato e concreto.

Sicuramente la parte migliore dell'opera è la prima giornata, dedicata alla vita monacale, di cui l'Aretino, attraverso le parole di Nanna, ci dà una visione demistificante, dalla quale emerge un monastero del vizio, in cui ogni forma di piacere sessuale è lecito (si usano persino i sex toys!). Il resto dell'opera risulta meno convincente, forse anche a causa del linguaggio di difficile decifrazione per il lettore moderno.
Divertente è anche l'ampiezza di sinonimi e di metafore utilizzate dall'autore per descrivere genitali e atti sessuali: un vero e proprio vocabolario sconcio, che non mancherò di utilizzare nelle mie conversazioni quotidiane d'ora in poi.

[La Pasión Inútil · Rating 3 out of 5]

Un clásico de la literatura del tardío Renacimiento italiano. Aretino revela aquí toda la mundanidad de personajes abocados a la sexualidad, el pecado, las intrigas y la hipocresía. Los primeros tres diálogos (acaso los mejores del libro) revelan un antecedente del estilo que caracterizará más tarde a Sade, si bien Aretino conserva en todo un lenguaje menos directo. El mayor valor de este libro parece reposar en el extremo escepticismo que transluce frente al lenguaje: la palabra es una invención desprovista de cualquier carácter sagrado y siempre está presta a servir a líos de alcahuetas, prostitutas y delincuentes. Un libro, a mi parecer, en exceso reiterativo, pero, en todo caso, esencial para descorrer las numerosas mentiras de la Edad Media europea.

[Irka · Rating 3 out of 5]

O ile rozmowy między Nanną a Antonią są śmieszne, o tyle Nanny szkolenie córki na kurtyzanę po pewnym momencie przestaje być zabawne a robi się irytujące.

[Sophia Iguana · Rating 3 out of 5]

✨ Renaissance porn. ✨
Bisschen zu absurd und man kann das nur durchlesen, wenn man wirklich dauer-horny ist. Gibt keine Handlung, wird nur erzählt wie der eine seine Rübe da reinsteckt und der andere seinen Pinsel im Farbtöpfchen dort zu tunkt. Kann man gönnen, historisch sicher wertvoll, aber wenn ich den Abend genießen will, nehm ich lieber was zeitgenössisches. 🌈🌶️

[Bert Huisman]

9

[Larsen Puch · Rating 3 out of 5]

Bataille afirma que el erotismo es la afirmación de la vida hasta en la muerte. Sin duda, desde tiempos antiguos, la temática erótica aparece en la literatura, más allá de los edictos o normas morales que predominen o intenten dominar. El erotismo es un impulso de vida que el arte ha recreado con ingenio desde tiempos pretéritos. La sonrisa vertical es una de las colecciones de literatura erótica más afamadas en el mundo hispanohablante contemporáneo.  Siguiendo esa huella,  Emecé Editores de Argentina  se animó el año 2001 a inaugurar una colección llamada "La noche mildós". Su primera publicación fue "Diálogo de Cortesanas". Esta obra fue publicada originalmente en dos partes, los años 1534 y 1536. Sin ninguna duda, su autor, Pietro Aretino, era conocedor del gran referente de este tipo de narraciones en esa época: El Decamerón, texto al que aluden las protagonistas de esta historia, para darle realce a sus historias. El Diálógo de Cortesanas se estructura en dos partes. Cada parte, a su vez, tiene tres jornadas. En la primera parte, el diálogo es entre dos prostitutas. Enana quiere contarle a Antonia sus experiencias vitales como monja, esposa y cortesana, con el fin de que Antonia le ayude a decidir el futuro de su hija. En la segunda parte, Enana aconseja a su hija para ejercer con provecho el oficio de cortesana, valiéndose del ingenio y del engaño. Además, le advierte de las vilezas de los hombres y de los malos tratos que le otorgan a quiénes ejercen el oficio más viejo del mundo. Por último, ambas mujeres escucharán el diálogo entre la Comadre y la Nodriza, donde se trata el tema de la rufianería o el oficio de las alcahuetas. Es un libro interesantísimo, con pasajes llenos de picardía, ingenio, desparpajo, realismo y humor, aunque en ciertos pasajes se torna un poco tedioso y repetitivo. La naturaleza humana es débil. Las mujeres deben usar de su astucia para sobrevivir en un mundo dominado por hombres, cuyo punto débil es el deseo sexual y la obsesión amorosa que deviene en lujuria o violencia. En parte misógino, en parte misántropo; en parte licencioso, en parte moralista; pero siempre crítico. Una cita que nos dice mucho de la humanidad de todos los tiempos: "ten por seguro que si se hiciera la cuenta de pillos y de imbéciles, no se hallarían menos de éstos que de aquéllos". La Comadre dixit.

[Joseph · Rating 4 out of 5]

Volume One of the edition edited by Samuel Putnam includes the Dialogues or Raggiomenti, and the text of the play The Courtesan.

The Dialogues are framed like Boccaccio’s Decameron or Chaucer’s The Canterbury Tales, and have an earthy, profane flavour.

The Courtesan is a play in Aretino’s bawdy style, about a pair of nobles, one, Messer Maco, who seeks to become a Courtesan and is instructed in this by Maestro Andrea, and one Signor Parabolano, who is in love. Rosso, a groom of Parabolano causes much grief and sows much confusion. Has a Jewish merchant, Romanello, who is cheated by Rosso and treated very poorly. A lesser play of the age, but notable for its setting, utilization of cross-dressing and other items of bawdy in the plot, and the strength of some of the characterization.

[Adam McPhee · Rating 3 out of 5]

Aretino's Dialogues aka The Ragionamenti. From The Works of Aretino, Translated into English from the original Italian, with a Critical and Biographical Essay by Samuel Putnam, Illustrations by The Marquis de Bayros in Two Volumes, Volume I., Chicago: Pascal Covici, 1926. Available online. I suspect this translation doesn't quite do it justice. But still, funny in parts.

[Lulu]

1534

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