O Cristianismo Primitivo

by Friedrich Engels, Rosa Luxemburg

Dois textos que tratam do cristianismo original, dos séculos I e II.

Genres: History, Religion, Politics, Theory, Nonfiction

57 pages, Kindle Edition

First published January 1, 1894

About the author

German social theorist Friedrich Engels collaborated with Karl Marx on The Communist Manifesto in 1848 and on numerous other works.

With the help of Friedrich Engels, Karl Marx wrote The Communist Manifesto (1848) and Das Kapital (1867-1894).

Friedrich Engels, a philosopher, political, historian, journalist, revolutionary, and also a businessman, closest befriended his lifelong colleague.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedri...

Reviews

[Hinch · Rating 4 out of 5]

Dry but interesting if you have a vague interest in this period of history

[Daniele Palma · Rating 5 out of 5]

Engels grazie ad uno studio durato oltre mezzo secolo ci permette di conoscere il contesto storico e sociologico nel quale nasce il Cristianesimo, si sofferma su un libro specifico del Nuovo Testamento ed in modo onesto ne fornisce un analisi sopra le parti; c'è sicuramente qualche sfumatura scettica, ma io propendo per accettarla come una schietta valutazione storica di un movimento che ha influenzato la nostra storia per i successivi duemila anni, lo si voglia o meno, ed infatti Engels lo ammette dandone anche delle spiegazioni concrete e scientifiche. Una ragionamento però mi fa pensare al fatto che anche chi non ammette l'influsso divino nella corrente di pensiero deve per forza ammetterne la potenza del messaggio e di fronte ad una tale potenza io concedo anche il carattere divino, nessun imperatore o governatore ha saputo riunire milioni di persone sotto una stessa bandiera, che poi l'idea sia divina o un insieme di grandi pensieri elaborati nei secoli a me poco importa, hanno carattere divino anche se di forgia totalmente umana.
In un passaggio di un articolo Engels dice che non possiamo essere certi nemmeno dell'esistenza del Cristo ma io esagerando dico che per me potrebbe essere anche indifferente sapere o meno che sia esistito fisicamente in quanto la certezza quotidiana mi dice che ne è vivo il suo messaggio. Engels trova delle somiglianze tra i primi Cristiani e i movimenti operai e lo credo certamente in quanto il concetto di fondo, rivoluzionario in Cristo come nei pensieri un po' più teneramente (nel senso del sentimento di una positiva tenerezza nel vedere gli sforzi fatti) terreni dei proletari uniti.

[Σταμάτης Καρασαββίδης · Rating 1 out of 5]

This was insulting to both history and the theology of Christianity. Usually people that consider this a good writting are people who have no touch with christianity or western christians.

I dont even know where to start critiquing this, its simply all wrong and would take many pages to mention everything.

His position that 'christianity places salvation in a life beyond after death' and that 'christianity did not want to accomplish the social transformation in this world, but beyond it, in heaven" is straight up wrong and anti christian. Christian tradition holds exactly the opposite. Christian tradition exclusively cares explicitly only about the current world and does NOT care about the afterlife. Jesus came to earth heal the sick and show us that its possible, not tell them that they will be healed in the after life. Christianity is not the religion of suffering like catholic and protestant heretics believe, instead its the religion of joy, the religion which recognizes suffering exists and must be cured and overcome by any means necessary.

He literally also mentions 'German ciriticism of the Bible so far the only scientific basis of our knowledge of history of early christianity' when for centuries some of the world's best universities in Constantinople were holding major debates and research on the nature and history of early christianity, but Engels completely ignores Constantinople which is the city of Christiandom and falsely claims that "whether the truth can be defined with the means at our disposal today is very dooubtful' when speaking about the research material about early christianity. Strange how Engels didnt consider that Constantinople and the Patriarchate was a simple train ride at the time.

The way westerners viewed and view our ancient societies is very goofy. Engels mentions how in Macedonian and Roman east, suddenly and magically, from the 'wise ancient greece' everyone became a 'superstitious charlatan', 'charlatans' which society was full somehow despite the immense scientific research and widely available knowledge being distributed among the people in the macedonian and roman alexandria, ephessos, jerusalem antioch.

There are so many other shit takes like where he mentions that 'early christianity had nothing in common with the later *dogmatically fixed universal religion of the Nicene creed* despite the common knowledge that the nicene council followed so many previous councils of countless debates of the best scholars, philosophers, rhetoricians and scientists of the roman empire to be able to come to more correct understanding of faith and even after Nicene council there were many different intepretations of the faith like the difference between Palamas and the hesychasts and Theophanes of Nicaea on the nature of heaven and hell.

His take on the 'impossibility of a forming of the trinity' as well as his take that 'nations were only able to form after the fall of the roman empire and his take that 'to live on after death was considered by the Greeks rather a misforture' are some other takes that Engels probably cited his stomach as a source

The one star is for some interesting parts about 666 and Nero and the few correct paralelizations of
christianity and socialism from time to time


1/5

[Simon · Rating 4 out of 5]

Very interesting reading on the foundations of Christianity and how it relates to the foundations of Marxism. There is a direct link. Contains an especially interesting hermeneutic of the Apocalypse of John, dives deep into history of the era, and provides eye-opening concepts related to early Communist thought

[Harvey Hênio · Rating 5 out of 5]

Este breve livro traz dois textos de autoria dos pensadores socialistas Friedrich Engels (1820/1895) e Rosa Luxemburgo (1871/1919). Em ambos os textos o assunto é mesmo: o cristianismo primitivo e suas tendências comunistas na percepção dos dois autores.
De acordo com Engels e Luxemburgo o cristianismo dos dois primeiros séculos seria o abrigo dos empobrecidos e oprimidos pela elitista estrutura de poder existente no Império Romano. Tal comunismo baseado numa pregação explícita da divisão igualitária dos bens e riquezas não teria, como característica intrínseca, a defesa da revolução armada para a sua consecução. Esta divisão igualitária deveria ser baseada na conscientização acerca das injustiças e a palavra de cristo deveria ser o elemento que despertaria as consciências.
Ambos os pensadores, a despeito da consideração deste cristianismo primitivo como uma espécie de pensamento utópico, valorizam o pioneirismo destes primeiros socialistas e sustentam que à medida que o poder da Igreja Católica foi aumentando e sua estrutura burocrática e hierarquizante foi se impondo, as suas origens entre os pobres e humildes foi sendo esquecida e até mesmo reprimida.
A argumentação dos dois pensadores é muito bem construída e o tema – polêmico – é capaz de despertar intensas discussões.

[Imanol Faya]

Me quedé con ganas de leer más de Engels hablando sobre el tema. Hay dos elementos que me parecen curiosos de esta triada de textos: 1) el planteamiento de necesidad historica de superación de la religión, que solo puede plantearse en el contexto de la modernidad y, en particular del movimiento obrero del siglo XIX, solo puede darse a partir de la explicación historica del surgimiento del cristianismo como tal, lo cual es un progreso con respecto a la crítica ilustrada que no era más que una crítica humanista al concepto de religión. Teniendo esto en cuenta, no sorprende tanto los paralelismos que Engels traza entre el cristianismo primitivo y el movimiento comunista del siglo XIX; 2) el caracter revolucionario del cristianismo con respecto al imperio romano, y las relaciones económicas de opresión entre el imperio y los pueblos subyugados. Abre la puerta a pensar las relaciones entre la fe y el movimiento revolucionario, y si realmente son tan antagonicos como en los circulos de izquierda se suele creer. Aquí se presenta al cristianismo como la reacción espiritual de una opresión material, necesaria frente al vació dejado por el fracaso las religiones y filosofías greco-romanas (propias del helenismo, especialmente el estoicismo), que ubica la emancipación humana en el interior del Hombre, en el arrepentimiento del pecado y en la perspectiva de salvación en el reino de los cielos, más allá de este "valle de lágrimas".

[vorona · Rating 3 out of 5]

interesting and short but by no means agreeable; Engels takes the (in my opinion) shaky and bizarre position of declaring Revelations the only verifiably antiquated Christian work by gematriacally rooting the number 666/616 to Nero and asserting Bauer's notion that Christianity is not merely imported from or native to the region of Judea but muddied with Greco-Roman values and constructs. In this way, rather than maintaining the theme of pluralistic sacrifice common to paganism, Christianity was able to forge itself into a universal religion across the Roman Empire by means of the single universal sacrifice analogous to the Marxist conception of universal liberation. Engels further asserts that the post-Constantine interpretations of dogma (such as the Trinity, not present in antiquity according to Engels) are wholly perversions to utilize Christianity in the name of the state and that attempts at resurrecting true Christian values, such as the Bohemian Taborites and the great German peasant revolt, have been repeatedly squashed in the name of this perversion. Both the workers' movement and early Christianity have a "spirit of struggle" but the latter, in Engels' eyes, capitulates to a notion of paradise in anticipation rather than in the tangible world. Also interesting to note the sexual freedom, misogyny and lack of moralisms present in that early Christianity that he points out; 144,000 Jews in heaven "not defiled" by the touch of woman, the doctrine of love being turned on its head in favor of revenge, etc. It's an odd little work though I'd say worth the short read.

[Stephen Wellbow · Rating 3 out of 5]

Engels draws parallels between socialism and Christianity in the struggle against centralization of wealth and power. However, he also distinguishes between Christianity's value of martyrdom and the afterlife's rewards vs. the more immediate benefit of socialism.

I don't feel that I'm knowledgeable enough of the subject matter to question or criticize his claims, hence the neutral rating. I will say that it is very interesting material at face value, particularly the discussion of the gematriah/mathematici, as well as his explanation of the numerical significance of the content found in the book of Revelations.

[Tuan Nguyen · Rating 3 out of 5]

I only listened to this audiobook randomly, during my free time. His premise seems intriguing. I'll have to return to this book after deep-reading some of his foundation texts like Origin.

[Luís · Rating 3 out of 5]

Análise e crítica do cristianismo associado ao Novo Testamento, com comparações históricas entre o seus textos e a realidade política do Império Romano daquela altura, e a maneira como este influenciou fortemente a religião pregada ainda nos dias de hoje.
Contém também um estudo histórico das suas origens, em comparação com as origens da divulgação do socialismo, pois em muitos aspetos, as pessoas em situação vulnerável eram as que mais tinham condições para aderir a estes movimentos religiosos ou políticos, tal como por exemplo, os escravos.
Termina com extratos de "A Ideologia Alemã" com referências à oposição entre o idealismo e o materialismo.