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Satire
Giovenale nei cinque libri delle Satire (ritenute da Quintiliano il genere romano per eccellenza) lancia frecce infuocate contro i bersagli più disparati, di ogni ceto e di ogni sesso. Dipinge il quadro di una società romana senza speranza, persa nelle sue mollezze decadenti e corrotte. I rampolli debosciati dell’aristocrazia si abbandonano ai vizi, la plebe resta mansueta e imbelle e si accontenta di panem et circenses. Le donne emancipate vengono ridotte da Giovenale a ninfomani fuori controllo. Orientali, Graeculi, Egiziani occupano i gradini più bassi dell’umanità, restando di poco superiori alle bestie. Le Satire contengono, in nuce, i semi di una rabbia civile sopravvissuta fino ai nostri tempi. E, al contempo, restano uno dei grandi capolavori della lirica classica.
411 pages, Paperback
First published January 1, 127
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About the author
Juvenal
829 books99 followersDecimus Iunius Iuvenalis, known commonly by the shortened Anglicized version of his name Juvenal, was a Roman poet of the late first and early second centuries AD/CE. He is the author of The Satires, a series of sixteen short poems in dactylic hexameter on a variety of subjects.
Date of birth: ca. 55 A.D.
Date of death: ca. 138 A.D.
Date of birth: ca. 55 A.D.
Date of death: ca. 138 A.D.
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March 30, 2018
Juvenal’s Top Tips to Make Rome Great Again:
1. Get rid of the damn foreigners
2. Get rid of those effeminate queers
3. Make sure women Know Their Place
4. Get rid of the rich snobs
5. And the bloody nouveau riche
6. Return to the Good Old Days and the Simple Life
7. More people should be farmers and soldiers
8. Get back the sanctity of Family Life with parents teaching their children virtue and morality
9. Pay poets more money
1. Get rid of the damn foreigners
2. Get rid of those effeminate queers
3. Make sure women Know Their Place
4. Get rid of the rich snobs
5. And the bloody nouveau riche
6. Return to the Good Old Days and the Simple Life
7. More people should be farmers and soldiers
8. Get back the sanctity of Family Life with parents teaching their children virtue and morality
9. Pay poets more money
April 8, 2017
These are a collection of sixteen satiric monologues where Juvenal does his best to poke his finger in the eye of the Roman society of his day for not living up to its heritage.
This armchair classicist found Juvenal to be grossly over-rated. Maybe he has been given such scholarly acclaim because he wrote his complaints in verse? I can find no other reason.
This armchair classicist found Juvenal to be grossly over-rated. Maybe he has been given such scholarly acclaim because he wrote his complaints in verse? I can find no other reason.
March 8, 2022
Juvenal sounds a little bitter. His complaints seem pretty relevant today, though.
These Sixteen Satires made me think about how every generation thinks its the last, thinks it's the end of the world. Many individuals of any generation, ancient or contemporary, having achieved a certain age, believe things are getting worse, believe that perhaps one day soon it will be the end for humanity.
At first glance, they were all wrong, and those of us currently proclaiming species-wide impending doom are simply another chapter in the long line of erroneous whiners and naysayers. Steven Pinker can tell you how silly you are for thinking this way.
But I believe every generation was correct, and that the current pessimists are right on track. We are all part of our own little portion of the great decline. Since the dawn of civilization, we have been on this course to total destruction. Long before our star explodes, long before an asteroid causes the extinction of humanity, we will create our own demise. Pollution and climate change, ecological disintegration, nuclear catastrophe--all these things and more will likely contribute. And in the meantime, our crap culture chugs along.
Humanity will eat itself alive until it is all gone, and every other species on this planet will breathe a sigh of relief.
These Sixteen Satires made me think about how every generation thinks its the last, thinks it's the end of the world. Many individuals of any generation, ancient or contemporary, having achieved a certain age, believe things are getting worse, believe that perhaps one day soon it will be the end for humanity.
At first glance, they were all wrong, and those of us currently proclaiming species-wide impending doom are simply another chapter in the long line of erroneous whiners and naysayers. Steven Pinker can tell you how silly you are for thinking this way.
But I believe every generation was correct, and that the current pessimists are right on track. We are all part of our own little portion of the great decline. Since the dawn of civilization, we have been on this course to total destruction. Long before our star explodes, long before an asteroid causes the extinction of humanity, we will create our own demise. Pollution and climate change, ecological disintegration, nuclear catastrophe--all these things and more will likely contribute. And in the meantime, our crap culture chugs along.
Humanity will eat itself alive until it is all gone, and every other species on this planet will breathe a sigh of relief.
November 28, 2020
Juvenal lived to a ripe old age, was appointed to lead troops in Egypt as he neared age eighty, my marginal note to his wonderful Satire XI, "With an Invitation to Dinner" (Loeb titles, “Extravagance and Simplicity of Living.”)
Heavily notated, my copy bought in grad school, Dinkytown near U Minnesota, the translator having taught my undergraduate Freshman Humanities back at Amherst College. He loaned me Loeb editions off his office shelf at the end of the old brick Appleton Hall where my Shakespeare prof —38 plays, full year course— Theodore Baird had once climbed in the window, to challenge his students by using it as a door.
My freshman comp prof was Dept Chair G Armour Craig. Craig wrote the 30 assignments my freshman year, and I recall in class he stared out the window, “Do any of you see drumlins out there?” No. Craig, “You can’t see them if you don’t know the word.” Lesson for the day, and for the semester. Language is a way, the way of seeing. (Frost of course, has a poem on “A Drumlin Woodchuck.”)
All freshman Amherst Humanities classes, like many throughout the U.S., used Humphries’ translation of the Aeneid. (See my review.) Humphries recommended me and a classmate who graduated 2nd in our class (slightly above the classmate astronaut who fixed the Hubble, Jeff Hoffman) to a one-night weekly Humanities seminar where we heard the Chair of Greek and Latin speak on a play by Sophocles, or we read Birth of Tragedy. In Freshman Humanities, we read Plato’s Republic in English; otherwise, translations were frowned on. Read in Latin, or not at all. Humphries' Introduction summarizes Latin hexameters, "Buckety Buckety Buckety Buckety Buckety Bump Down."(11) His translation iscloser to English "fourteeners," though they can scan as half a ballad stanza.
Juvenal’s most famous translator was Samuel Johnson, in “Vanity of Human Wishes." Juvenal begins,
"Omnibus in terris, quae sunt a Gadibus usque
Aurorum et Gange, pauci dinoscere possunt
vera bona…"
In all the lands from Cadiz to Ganges
And Dawn, few can discern their own good
Sam Johnson starts,
"Let observation with extensive view
Survey mankind, from China to Peru…
How rarely Reason guides the stubborn choice… (line 11)
How nations sink, by darling schemes oppressed,
When vengeance listens to the fool’s request" (line 14)
[When the Fool is US president, all he takes is vengeance—on his own appointees, not to mention the “losers and suckers” buried in France, martyrs to WWII and the cause of Freedom.]
In Humphries,
"In all the lands that reach from China to the Euphrates
Few indeed are those who can tell a curse from a blessing."
Juvenal lists many things that lead to death, including “facundia,” eloquence, and wealth, which caused the head of Lateran family to be executed by Nero for conspiracy. Juvenal’s advice against wealth no longer applies, when he says,
“cantabit vacuus coram latrone viator” (line 22)
Penniless the passerby can whistle at a thief, or Humphries, “Your poor man sings a song in the face of a robber”(p.122).
Speaking of petty spoils of war (part of an enemy’s helmet) that all Greeks and Romans keep, Juvenal concludes, “tanto maior famae sitis est quam/ virtutis”(line 140). Fame is so much more attractive than virtue, or Sam Johnson,
“This power has praise that virtue scarce can warm,
Till fame supplies the universal charm” (line 184)
Humphries,
“… To this height each general, Roman,
Greek or barbarian, strains; for this he endures toil and danger,
Thirsting far more for renown than ever he thirsted for virtue”(p.126)
Sam Johnson considerably improves Juvenal’s conclusion, starting twenty lines from the end, with a great literary-critical line on suspense which glues us to BritMysts:
“Where then shall Hope and Fear their objects find?
Must dull Suspense corrupt the stagnant mind?
Must helpless man, in ignorance sedate,
Roll darkling down the torrent of his fate?…
With these celestial Wisdom calms the mind,
And makes the Happiness she does not find.”
Juvenal concludes more simply, if we were wise, Fortune would be no goddess; our hopes and greed create her.
Humphries titles Satire VII, “On Poets, Pedagogues, and Poverty,” which says stingy patrons don’t give poets enough to visit the temples of Apollo and the Muses, while the rich patron, “ipse facit versus, atque uni cedit Homero / propter mille annos”(line 39). “He writes verses himself, of course, and will grant you that Homer,
After a thousand years, has a following somewhat greater”(p.92).
“Sed vatem egregium” but the true poet (accusative case, maybe subject of infinitive), to whom runs no common vein,”cui non sit publica vena,” he mints a song in a better mint: “nec feriat carmen triviale moneta”(line 55).
Satire IX, "The Griefs of a Career Man," actually concerns a powerful "boss" who's gay, a "fairy"; he complains, "Does he think that this job is so easy,/ Shoving it in to the point where it meets with yestersay's dinner?" Calling his boss cheap, he asks, "Is it nothing to you, / That your little son and daughter descend from my kindness?...Why not let me complete the tally, and give you three children?"(116) But he warns,
"Don't think him worthy of scorn, not altogether. The fact is
He can afford to pay any price if he wants to buy poison.
Keep this to yourself, like the Council of Ares in Athens."
He concludes, "Poor little household gods, whom I invoke with a tiny pinch/ Of incense or meal...." I've seen small household god statues in the wall just outside the front door of houses in Pompei, or if not there, by the fireside or interior court.
*After climbing in the window, Baird pointed to it, asking his Freshman English class, “What’s that?” The class, “A window?” Baird, “”It’s a door, can’t you see I just came in through it?” Then, throwing his hat into the wastebasket, “What’s that?” Class, “A wastepaper basket?” TB, “It’s a hatrack, can’t you see I store my hat there?”
Baird also designed daily Freshman Writing assignments (3 a week) at Amherst, a course every English teacher taught. (I later taught such a daily Freshman Comp at U Minnesota, starting with, “Tell of a time when you lied.” (My best student in one class, Judy Mendenhall, went on to Flute concertizing, joining the final three for Miss America. I took credit for her not getting the prize, since she actually considered the judge’s stupid question, “Do you think there will ever be a woman president of the US, and why not?”)
Baird, by the way, had the only FL Wright house in New England, built in 1940 for $5,000. Frost visited there often, and when Baird took a sabbatical (avoiding Europe) on the Mississippi River, Frost visited and threw a stone into the river. Baird’s house is still there, 37 Shays Street, Amherst.
Heavily notated, my copy bought in grad school, Dinkytown near U Minnesota, the translator having taught my undergraduate Freshman Humanities back at Amherst College. He loaned me Loeb editions off his office shelf at the end of the old brick Appleton Hall where my Shakespeare prof —38 plays, full year course— Theodore Baird had once climbed in the window, to challenge his students by using it as a door.
My freshman comp prof was Dept Chair G Armour Craig. Craig wrote the 30 assignments my freshman year, and I recall in class he stared out the window, “Do any of you see drumlins out there?” No. Craig, “You can’t see them if you don’t know the word.” Lesson for the day, and for the semester. Language is a way, the way of seeing. (Frost of course, has a poem on “A Drumlin Woodchuck.”)
All freshman Amherst Humanities classes, like many throughout the U.S., used Humphries’ translation of the Aeneid. (See my review.) Humphries recommended me and a classmate who graduated 2nd in our class (slightly above the classmate astronaut who fixed the Hubble, Jeff Hoffman) to a one-night weekly Humanities seminar where we heard the Chair of Greek and Latin speak on a play by Sophocles, or we read Birth of Tragedy. In Freshman Humanities, we read Plato’s Republic in English; otherwise, translations were frowned on. Read in Latin, or not at all. Humphries' Introduction summarizes Latin hexameters, "Buckety Buckety Buckety Buckety Buckety Bump Down."(11) His translation iscloser to English "fourteeners," though they can scan as half a ballad stanza.
Juvenal’s most famous translator was Samuel Johnson, in “Vanity of Human Wishes." Juvenal begins,
"Omnibus in terris, quae sunt a Gadibus usque
Aurorum et Gange, pauci dinoscere possunt
vera bona…"
In all the lands from Cadiz to Ganges
And Dawn, few can discern their own good
Sam Johnson starts,
"Let observation with extensive view
Survey mankind, from China to Peru…
How rarely Reason guides the stubborn choice… (line 11)
How nations sink, by darling schemes oppressed,
When vengeance listens to the fool’s request" (line 14)
[When the Fool is US president, all he takes is vengeance—on his own appointees, not to mention the “losers and suckers” buried in France, martyrs to WWII and the cause of Freedom.]
In Humphries,
"In all the lands that reach from China to the Euphrates
Few indeed are those who can tell a curse from a blessing."
Juvenal lists many things that lead to death, including “facundia,” eloquence, and wealth, which caused the head of Lateran family to be executed by Nero for conspiracy. Juvenal’s advice against wealth no longer applies, when he says,
“cantabit vacuus coram latrone viator” (line 22)
Penniless the passerby can whistle at a thief, or Humphries, “Your poor man sings a song in the face of a robber”(p.122).
Speaking of petty spoils of war (part of an enemy’s helmet) that all Greeks and Romans keep, Juvenal concludes, “tanto maior famae sitis est quam/ virtutis”(line 140). Fame is so much more attractive than virtue, or Sam Johnson,
“This power has praise that virtue scarce can warm,
Till fame supplies the universal charm” (line 184)
Humphries,
“… To this height each general, Roman,
Greek or barbarian, strains; for this he endures toil and danger,
Thirsting far more for renown than ever he thirsted for virtue”(p.126)
Sam Johnson considerably improves Juvenal’s conclusion, starting twenty lines from the end, with a great literary-critical line on suspense which glues us to BritMysts:
“Where then shall Hope and Fear their objects find?
Must dull Suspense corrupt the stagnant mind?
Must helpless man, in ignorance sedate,
Roll darkling down the torrent of his fate?…
With these celestial Wisdom calms the mind,
And makes the Happiness she does not find.”
Juvenal concludes more simply, if we were wise, Fortune would be no goddess; our hopes and greed create her.
Humphries titles Satire VII, “On Poets, Pedagogues, and Poverty,” which says stingy patrons don’t give poets enough to visit the temples of Apollo and the Muses, while the rich patron, “ipse facit versus, atque uni cedit Homero / propter mille annos”(line 39). “He writes verses himself, of course, and will grant you that Homer,
After a thousand years, has a following somewhat greater”(p.92).
“Sed vatem egregium” but the true poet (accusative case, maybe subject of infinitive), to whom runs no common vein,”cui non sit publica vena,” he mints a song in a better mint: “nec feriat carmen triviale moneta”(line 55).
Satire IX, "The Griefs of a Career Man," actually concerns a powerful "boss" who's gay, a "fairy"; he complains, "Does he think that this job is so easy,/ Shoving it in to the point where it meets with yestersay's dinner?" Calling his boss cheap, he asks, "Is it nothing to you, / That your little son and daughter descend from my kindness?...Why not let me complete the tally, and give you three children?"(116) But he warns,
"Don't think him worthy of scorn, not altogether. The fact is
He can afford to pay any price if he wants to buy poison.
Keep this to yourself, like the Council of Ares in Athens."
He concludes, "Poor little household gods, whom I invoke with a tiny pinch/ Of incense or meal...." I've seen small household god statues in the wall just outside the front door of houses in Pompei, or if not there, by the fireside or interior court.
*After climbing in the window, Baird pointed to it, asking his Freshman English class, “What’s that?” The class, “A window?” Baird, “”It’s a door, can’t you see I just came in through it?” Then, throwing his hat into the wastebasket, “What’s that?” Class, “A wastepaper basket?” TB, “It’s a hatrack, can’t you see I store my hat there?”
Baird also designed daily Freshman Writing assignments (3 a week) at Amherst, a course every English teacher taught. (I later taught such a daily Freshman Comp at U Minnesota, starting with, “Tell of a time when you lied.” (My best student in one class, Judy Mendenhall, went on to Flute concertizing, joining the final three for Miss America. I took credit for her not getting the prize, since she actually considered the judge’s stupid question, “Do you think there will ever be a woman president of the US, and why not?”)
Baird, by the way, had the only FL Wright house in New England, built in 1940 for $5,000. Frost visited there often, and when Baird took a sabbatical (avoiding Europe) on the Mississippi River, Frost visited and threw a stone into the river. Baird’s house is still there, 37 Shays Street, Amherst.
February 20, 2008
There is something strangely satisfying about reading a book from a couple thousand years ago and being able to shout out things like, "Oooh, burn," and "Bitch, you got schooled," every couple of pages. Juvenal is one of the earliest masters of snark, and therefore, one of my heroes. Unfortunately, this type of humor tends to be closely linked to the political and cultural context in which it was written, and having to read page-long endnotes to get the joke sometimes took the oomph out of the punchlines. But I view that as a fault in myself, for not being educated enough. And it was a huge ego boost when I actually did understand the political and cultural references, so it all evens out in the end.
April 15, 2012
I've long been sceptical of contemporary novels that are advertized as satires. Consider Jonathan Coe's 'Rotters' Club,' which was okay, but compared even to a supposedly realistic novel like 'The Line of Beauty,' contained little satire beyond its propensity for pointing out that people ate some really bad food in the seventies. So I finally got around to reading Juvenal, and my scepticism has been gloriously affirmed: yes, satire can be really, really mean; it can be full of almost explosive moral indignation.
'For what is disgrace if he keeps the money?'
'What can I do in Rome? I can't tell lies!'
'Of all that luckless poverty involves, nothing is harsher/ than the fact that it makes people funny.'
'A poor man's rights are confined to this:/ having been pounded and punched to a jelly, to beg and implore/ that he may be allowed to go home with a few teeth in his head.'
'When power which is virtually equal/ to that of the gods is flattered, there's nothing it can't believe.'
'You must know the color of your own bread.'
'that which is coated and warmed with so many odd preparations... what shall we call it? A face, or an ulcer?'
'If somebody owns a dwarf, we call him/ Atlas; a negro, Swan; a bent and disfigured girl/ Europa. Curs that are listless, and bald from years of mange/ and lick the rim of an empty lamp for oil, are given/ the name of Leopard.'
'However far back you care to go in tracing your name/ the fact remains that your clan began in a haven for outlaws.'
'Do you think it's nice and easy to thrust a proper-sized penis/ into a person's guts, encountering yesterday's dinner?/ The slave who ploughs a field has a lighter task than the one/ who ploughs its owner.'
'Don't you attach any value to the fact that, had I not been/ a loyal and devoted client, your wife would still be a virgin?'
'Shame is jeered as she leaves the city.'
'The whole of Rome is inside the Circus.'
'What other man these days... could bear to prefer his life to his plate, and his soul to his money?'
'If I happen to find a totally honest man, I regard/ that freak as I would a baby centaur.'
'Tears are genuine when they fall at the loss of money.'
Not to mention the classics, 'it's hard not to write satire,' 'who watches the watchmen,' 'bread and circuses,' 'healthy mind in a healthy body' (all translated slightly differently here).
All of these are funnier or crueler in context.
Rudd's translation (in the Oxford World's Classics edition) seems solid; I haven't compared it to the Latin. He translates line for line, which I imagine will make it easier to follow the original language, and in a loose meter which allows him to make everything make sense. It's rarely pretty, but it is readable. And his notes are excellent.
'For what is disgrace if he keeps the money?'
'What can I do in Rome? I can't tell lies!'
'Of all that luckless poverty involves, nothing is harsher/ than the fact that it makes people funny.'
'A poor man's rights are confined to this:/ having been pounded and punched to a jelly, to beg and implore/ that he may be allowed to go home with a few teeth in his head.'
'When power which is virtually equal/ to that of the gods is flattered, there's nothing it can't believe.'
'You must know the color of your own bread.'
'that which is coated and warmed with so many odd preparations... what shall we call it? A face, or an ulcer?'
'If somebody owns a dwarf, we call him/ Atlas; a negro, Swan; a bent and disfigured girl/ Europa. Curs that are listless, and bald from years of mange/ and lick the rim of an empty lamp for oil, are given/ the name of Leopard.'
'However far back you care to go in tracing your name/ the fact remains that your clan began in a haven for outlaws.'
'Do you think it's nice and easy to thrust a proper-sized penis/ into a person's guts, encountering yesterday's dinner?/ The slave who ploughs a field has a lighter task than the one/ who ploughs its owner.'
'Don't you attach any value to the fact that, had I not been/ a loyal and devoted client, your wife would still be a virgin?'
'Shame is jeered as she leaves the city.'
'The whole of Rome is inside the Circus.'
'What other man these days... could bear to prefer his life to his plate, and his soul to his money?'
'If I happen to find a totally honest man, I regard/ that freak as I would a baby centaur.'
'Tears are genuine when they fall at the loss of money.'
Not to mention the classics, 'it's hard not to write satire,' 'who watches the watchmen,' 'bread and circuses,' 'healthy mind in a healthy body' (all translated slightly differently here).
All of these are funnier or crueler in context.
Rudd's translation (in the Oxford World's Classics edition) seems solid; I haven't compared it to the Latin. He translates line for line, which I imagine will make it easier to follow the original language, and in a loose meter which allows him to make everything make sense. It's rarely pretty, but it is readable. And his notes are excellent.
January 28, 2015
If you would like a glimpse of everyday life in Ancient Rome, you could hardly do better than read The Sixteen Satires of Juvenal. There, like a National Lampoon chiseled in stone, are all the everyday flaws -- that are still flaws today -- that mess up people's lives. It is all done with a light touch. At one point, talking about the fate of Aelius Sejanus, who was the Emperor Tiberius's number one man, he writes:
Peter Green's translation in this Penguin edition is a keeper.
Some men are overthrown by the envy their great powerThis passage is a good example of Juvenal's picturesque speech as he shows it is best not to rise too high, less one fall ingloriously like Sejanus.
Arouses; it's that long and illustrious list of honours
That sinks them. The ropes are heaved, down come the statues,
Axes demolish their chariot-wheels, the unoffending
Legs of their horses are broken. And now the fire
Roars up in the furnace, now flames hiss under the bellows:
The head of the people's darling Sejanus
Crackles and melts. he face only yesterday ranked
Second in all the world. ow it's so much scrap-metal.
To be turned into jugs and basins, frying pans, chamber-pots.
Peter Green's translation in this Penguin edition is a keeper.
November 25, 2014
"É preciso ser-se rico para poder dormir sem barulhos,em calmas moradias(...).A passagem de carroças nas ruas estreitas ou as discussões por causa de um rebanho(...) tiram o sono a qualquer um.(...)E,se se isto não bastasse,há ainda outro género de perigos aos quais estamos expostos,quando caminhamos,de noite,pelas ruas:frequentemente,das janelas,das varandas ou dos telhados tombam tijolos,vasos ou telhas,que nos podem esmagar os crânios (...).Podemos dar-nos por felizes se apanharmos com o conteúdo de uma bacia em cima."
December 5, 2013
Juvenal was an angry, angry man. If he were living today, he would probably be a regular caller to radio talk shows, blathering on about how kids today have no respect and gays and liberals and Obamacare are ruining this great country. Instead, he lived in the 1st Century CE and wrote satires. Fortunately, in addition to the anger, he had a deadly sense of humor. From a modern perspective, many of these screeds are politically incorrect: Juvenal goes after homosexuals, women and foreigners. On the other hand, he also criticizes greed, corruption, abuse of power and special privileges for the rich and famous (including the military!). Each of the 16 satires (actually 15 1/2 because Satire XVI is unfinished) is unique, although they share common features. Most are in Juvenal's voice, but Satire III tells its story almost completely through another character's words. Most of the satires ramble on through a list of horrors, addressed one by one, but Satire IV tells a story about a giant fish to make its points. There are certain commonalities, however. Each satire gives very specific examples of the problem being addressed, using contemporary people and situations (although to avoid exile, jail or execution, Juvenal tries to avoid mentioning living people - it didn't work: he was exiled after the first book came out and only returned to Rome after a new emperor took over). This gives the 21st Century reader a fascinating, if jaundiced, glimpse into the details of Roman life during that era. (In Satire VI, you learn, for example, that some women trained as gladiators - to Juvenal's dismay, of course.) A second common thread is Juvenal's reference to historical exemplars to ground his work in an ongoing literary tradition. Here is one quibble I have with Rolphe Humphries' late 1950s translation. Most of us are no longer immersed in the classics during our elementary and secondary education, so Juvenal's references to other Greek and Roman writers, myths, or historical events could have benefited greatly from explanatory footnotes. Finally, I found the translation a pleasure to read. I confess that I didn't consciously appreciate the poetry, although the rhythms may have had some unconscious effect, presumably positive. Like another reviewer, I didn't mind the anachronisms, which are used for comedic purposes, whereas I usually have a problem with modern references in older works (see my Aristophanes review). Juvenal's attitude seems so contemporary that a few well-placed modernisms (the reference to a Roman singer named Elvius, e.g.) fit right in. For those interested in where old sayings come from, Juvenal contributed a few to the lexicon, such as: "It is hard not to write satire"; "Who guards the guardians?" (a.k.a., "Who watches the watchmen?"); "A sound mind in a sound body"; and "The people long for two things: bread and circuses."
March 24, 2025
JUVENAL - (45 to 128)
Lived and worked in Rome from Nero to Domitian, and he spent his last year exiled to Egypt, where he died.
The collection of these (almost) 16 SATIRES can be read like a collection of short stories, but they were not written in a short time, out of imagination.
According to his observation, it took his lifetime, and the substance is real life.
My French translation is in prose, the rhymes in the original Latin version are lost in translation, but since this is not romantic poetry, the loss is not so great, except for the fun and the wit maybe.
His style is not romantic either, rather acid and sharp like a razor blade, his ink would be green poison and some phrases dripping with blood and paragraphs with a foul smell.
He aims at all the upper classes in Rome, old and degenerate families, as well as nouveau riche and parvenus, from all walks of life, avoiding any living emperor for safety's sake.
He would pick at lawyers, judges, unfaithful wives and prostitutes, homosexuals, alcoholics, liars, crooks, thieves, and whoever caught his eye when he rumbled about in Rome by day and by night.
We would know the names of numerous emperors during his lifetime but would be at a loss with all the other names of the people he is addressing.
He knows his classical literature, as he often refers to Cicero, Seneca, Ovid, Horace and others.
For me this is another lesson of history and everyday life in Ancient Rome, which I appreciate.
Lived and worked in Rome from Nero to Domitian, and he spent his last year exiled to Egypt, where he died.
The collection of these (almost) 16 SATIRES can be read like a collection of short stories, but they were not written in a short time, out of imagination.
According to his observation, it took his lifetime, and the substance is real life.
My French translation is in prose, the rhymes in the original Latin version are lost in translation, but since this is not romantic poetry, the loss is not so great, except for the fun and the wit maybe.
His style is not romantic either, rather acid and sharp like a razor blade, his ink would be green poison and some phrases dripping with blood and paragraphs with a foul smell.
He aims at all the upper classes in Rome, old and degenerate families, as well as nouveau riche and parvenus, from all walks of life, avoiding any living emperor for safety's sake.
He would pick at lawyers, judges, unfaithful wives and prostitutes, homosexuals, alcoholics, liars, crooks, thieves, and whoever caught his eye when he rumbled about in Rome by day and by night.
We would know the names of numerous emperors during his lifetime but would be at a loss with all the other names of the people he is addressing.
He knows his classical literature, as he often refers to Cicero, Seneca, Ovid, Horace and others.
For me this is another lesson of history and everyday life in Ancient Rome, which I appreciate.
January 18, 2022
This is a collection of satires about Roman society in I-II AD.
Plot. Rating 4
Usually, each satire is devoted to some general topic and does not have a thorough plot, but is a set of situations or thoughts. However, the satire about fish has a good plot. At this point, it is necessary to take into account the form of the book.
Characters. Rating 4
This is a rather evil and caustic satire. The book features a large number of negative characters. There are a few good characters. All characters are episodic, although they are varied with many showing different archetypes.
Dialogues. Rating 3
The characters’ dialogue often blends into the overall narrative as the author also engages in dialogue with readers and various interlocutors to whom he gives instructions.
Writing style. Rating 3
I had a little difficulty reading this book. The writing style seemed to me instructive and monotonous. Easier reading requires knowledge of Greek and Roman mythology, culture, history, as well as various Roman customs and contemporaries of Juvenal.
Worldbuilding. Rating 5
The satires show the daily life of the Romans in detail. I was interested in noticing Roman customs from various professions and walks of life. The narrative focuses on bad deeds and crimes, as befits this genre. Nevertheless, Juvenal provides moral guidance for his readers, condemning and challenging many unseemly acts.
Conclusion. Overall rating 4
There are good jokes in this collection, but they are more of an exasperated admonition. I believe Juvenal was overly pessimistic and his depiction of Rome is inaccurate.
Plot. Rating 4
Usually, each satire is devoted to some general topic and does not have a thorough plot, but is a set of situations or thoughts. However, the satire about fish has a good plot. At this point, it is necessary to take into account the form of the book.
Characters. Rating 4
This is a rather evil and caustic satire. The book features a large number of negative characters. There are a few good characters. All characters are episodic, although they are varied with many showing different archetypes.
Dialogues. Rating 3
The characters’ dialogue often blends into the overall narrative as the author also engages in dialogue with readers and various interlocutors to whom he gives instructions.
Writing style. Rating 3
I had a little difficulty reading this book. The writing style seemed to me instructive and monotonous. Easier reading requires knowledge of Greek and Roman mythology, culture, history, as well as various Roman customs and contemporaries of Juvenal.
Worldbuilding. Rating 5
The satires show the daily life of the Romans in detail. I was interested in noticing Roman customs from various professions and walks of life. The narrative focuses on bad deeds and crimes, as befits this genre. Nevertheless, Juvenal provides moral guidance for his readers, condemning and challenging many unseemly acts.
Conclusion. Overall rating 4
There are good jokes in this collection, but they are more of an exasperated admonition. I believe Juvenal was overly pessimistic and his depiction of Rome is inaccurate.
October 8, 2016
Again, like some other Penguin translations of the classics; too modern, too anachronistic. Aside from that, excellent introduction and footnotes.
Bit I liked a lot:
" Consider the spoils of war, those trophies hung on tree trunks
a breastplate, a shattered helmet, one cheekpiece dangling,
a yoke shorn of its pole, a defeated trireme’s figurehead, miserable prisoners on a triumphal arch
such things are reckoned the zenith | of human achievement; these
are the prizes for which each commander, Greek,
Roman, barbarian,
has always striven; for them he’ll endure hard toil
and danger. The thirst for glory by far outstrips
the pursuit of virtue. Who on earth would embrace poor Virtue naked
if you took away her rewards? Yet countries have come to ruin
through the vainglory of a few who longed for
renown, a title
that would cling to the stones set over their ashes – although
a barren fig-tree’s strength would suffice to crack
these open,
seeing that sepulchres, too, have their allotted fate. "
Bit I liked a lot:
" Consider the spoils of war, those trophies hung on tree trunks
a breastplate, a shattered helmet, one cheekpiece dangling,
a yoke shorn of its pole, a defeated trireme’s figurehead, miserable prisoners on a triumphal arch
such things are reckoned the zenith | of human achievement; these
are the prizes for which each commander, Greek,
Roman, barbarian,
has always striven; for them he’ll endure hard toil
and danger. The thirst for glory by far outstrips
the pursuit of virtue. Who on earth would embrace poor Virtue naked
if you took away her rewards? Yet countries have come to ruin
through the vainglory of a few who longed for
renown, a title
that would cling to the stones set over their ashes – although
a barren fig-tree’s strength would suffice to crack
these open,
seeing that sepulchres, too, have their allotted fate. "
December 22, 2022
Read at High School in Classics.
July 23, 2011
La Rome impériale voit arriver le règne de l'argent roi, de la luxure, des inégalités sociales, de la gloutonnerie, des excès les plus divers. Juvénal, outré par les turpitudes de ses contemporains se livre ici à une exécution en réglé de ceux qui excitent son indignation en déchirant à belles dents la respectabilité dont ils veulent commettre l'imposture de se parer. Il en évoque sans ménagement l'écart abyssal entre les héros et les valeurs de l’ancien temps et les mesquineries de leurs descendants.
March 2, 2012
The conservative's lament. Juvenal, in his Satires, reminded me of nothing quite so much as an angry right-wing talk show host, feet firmly planted on the soapbox and mic in hand, sarcastically excoriating modern society. The government, women, foreigners, gays, city-dwellers, philosophers, the rich, all of these at various points get the sharp end of Juvenal's literary stick. He doesn't have his own particularly clear philosophy on what defines the good life, but he is happy to mock and sneer and pick apart others for their sins and peccadilloes.
Despite being at this point about nineteen centuries old, the book does not feel especially dated. Juvenal chose targets that stand the test of time well; I suppose at any point in human history there have always been people grumbling about the promiscuity of women, the effeminacy of urban intellectuals, or the hangers-on of the wealthy. He is not above some rather deliciously vicious turns of speech and rarely settles for just landing one punch, extending each criticism with a few more unfavorable comparisons or imagined despicable actions. The strength of his literary bitterness is enough for me to give it three stars. Although I'm hardly in agreement with his social stances, it is kind of fun to read a skillfully-written piece of vitriol.
The text is dense with references to Roman history, culture, and mythology, and translator Peter Green does an able job providing explanatory footnotes, although in fact I think sometimes he goes too far and over-analyzes literary minutiae. It does make for some slogging if you're not already familiar with the classics, as you have to constantly flip to the endnotes.
Despite being at this point about nineteen centuries old, the book does not feel especially dated. Juvenal chose targets that stand the test of time well; I suppose at any point in human history there have always been people grumbling about the promiscuity of women, the effeminacy of urban intellectuals, or the hangers-on of the wealthy. He is not above some rather deliciously vicious turns of speech and rarely settles for just landing one punch, extending each criticism with a few more unfavorable comparisons or imagined despicable actions. The strength of his literary bitterness is enough for me to give it three stars. Although I'm hardly in agreement with his social stances, it is kind of fun to read a skillfully-written piece of vitriol.
The text is dense with references to Roman history, culture, and mythology, and translator Peter Green does an able job providing explanatory footnotes, although in fact I think sometimes he goes too far and over-analyzes literary minutiae. It does make for some slogging if you're not already familiar with the classics, as you have to constantly flip to the endnotes.
Read
October 24, 2025If Juvenal was British and around now he would be putting up those English flags on roundabouts is all I’m saying… he really comes for absolutely everyone but especially the feckin’ Greeks and women. Not an amazing read but still interesting to delve into the alleged humour of the Romans, and also the xenophobic fears which were ringing true to the curses that modern day racists are swinging around. A lot of quotes from Roman schiz comes from Juvenal so it was interesting to see these in context. Panem et circenses etc etc.
Read this at work and attempted to get myself some stimulation into the monotony… idk if it worked but still a fairly interesting book to read. Not as fun as I anticipated though.
Read this at work and attempted to get myself some stimulation into the monotony… idk if it worked but still a fairly interesting book to read. Not as fun as I anticipated though.
August 20, 2023
Not a fan. Some of his complaints felt relatable thousands of years on. Classism, problems of a big city, bad parents... but I guess I'm just not a fan of satires and their general bitterness and negativity cloaked as 'witty humour'. Not to mention feeling disgust for his misogynistic, anti-Semitic, racist, and just weird remarks. Satire Six should be renamed "I hate women". And was the cannibalism satire really necessary? His writing is good. The content of his works though kinda just makes me as a modern day reader uncomfortable.
August 11, 2016
Full of invective, rage, bitterness, caustic crustiness, misogeny, erotic inventiveness and a wicked sense of humor. This is heavy handed satire, not tongue in cheek kidding. But once you get used to it, quite bracing. Juvenal was disgusted by the licentiousness, gluttony, double-dealing, greed and various other vices that he saw around him in an unthreatened city--far different from the embattled Rome that bred men (and, presumably, respectable matrons) of the Republic. Question: would Juvenal have like a traditional Republican woman, or was his misogeny closer to the bone?
The translation is quite readable. (Rolfe Humphries that is, since Goodreads jumbles all reviews together and references to ‘this translation’ lose their meaning.) I actually listened to it, in an Audio Conoisseur recording by Charlton Griffin , and the poetry and sense were excellently conveyed. I think that listening gives a sense of how its first audience would have experienced it, for according to the introduction Juvenal trained mainly as an orator. For purists, be warned that there are anachronisms, which I usually dislike. But they are inserted lightly and judiciously, where a modern phrase captures Juvenal’s meaning.
The translation is quite readable. (Rolfe Humphries that is, since Goodreads jumbles all reviews together and references to ‘this translation’ lose their meaning.) I actually listened to it, in an Audio Conoisseur recording by Charlton Griffin , and the poetry and sense were excellently conveyed. I think that listening gives a sense of how its first audience would have experienced it, for according to the introduction Juvenal trained mainly as an orator. For purists, be warned that there are anachronisms, which I usually dislike. But they are inserted lightly and judiciously, where a modern phrase captures Juvenal’s meaning.
June 27, 2016
Olaylara gerçekçi bir bakış açısıyla yaklaşarak dönemin karanlık yanlarını keskin bir dille eleştiren Juvenal / Iuvenalis'in tüm yergilerini okuyucuya sunan "Satires / Yergiler - Saturae", toplumun üst sınıfından alt sınıfına kadar her kesimden insanı inceleyen eğlenceli ve ders verici bir eser; fakat çok fazla özel isim barındırması ve yergi türünde yazılması nedeniyle okumasının oldukça zor olduğunu belirtmek gerek. Bu yüzden kitabın akıcı olmadığının ne yazık ki altını çizmeliyim; okuması gerçekten fazlasıyla sabır istiyor. Buna rağmen, dönemin şartlarını görmek ve şiir türünün ne şekilde evrim geçirdiğine tanıklık etmek açısından oldukça önemli bir yere sahip olan "Yergiler"de bir yandan Iuvenalis'in Homeros, Cicero ve Catullus gibi yazarlara dair referanslarını okurken diğer yandan da cinsiyetçi ve ırkçı yaklaşımını görme şansı buluyoruz. Bu arada, hayata, yaşlılığa, eğitime, yoksuluğa ve zenginliğe dair olan 10., 11. ve 14. Yergiler favorilerim. Kısaca, Roma Edebiyatını yakından tanımak ve şiir türünün ne yollardan geçtiğini görmek isteyenlerin mutlaka göz atması gereken eserlerden biri.
27.06.2016
İstanbul, Türkiye
Alp Turgut
27.06.2016
İstanbul, Türkiye
Alp Turgut
February 21, 2024
Much more fun than you might think - horrendously bigoted even by the standards of the 1st century AD but fascinating in its technique; usually a sort of omiscient view of the urban Roman crowd which descends, picks out some appalling character, has a splenetic, mouth-foam-flecked go at him or her in verse for a few pages, and then moves on.
July 25, 2025
Mi amigo Antoñete se extasía (y yo con él) con la ingeniería romana. La sátira es una creación igual de romana e igual de asombrosa. Hoy las sátiras resultan tan obvias como el uso de los vasos comunicantes para el transporte del agua, pero hasta que los romanos no las desarrollaron, a nadie se le había ocurrido elevar a género literario la composición de escritos mordaces para ridiculizar algo o a alguien, igual que a nadie se le había ocurrido elevar el agua de las fuentes colocando los depósitos en la zona más alta de la ciudad.
La ironía, el sarcasmo, la malignidad de las sátiras de Juvenal se han desgastado con los siglos, porque la risa es más esclava del tiempo que el dolor y el llanto. Tampoco las comedias de Aristófanes son muy graciosas hoy, honestamente, mientras que las tragedias de Eurípides siguen conmoviendo.
Pero aunque los ingredientes hayan perdido sabor, la receta sigue siendo válida. La fórmula magistral que patenta Juvenal es la que siguen usando las sátiras modernas. Está todo ahí: exageraciones, monstruosidades, anécdotas y mucha, mucha variedad de temas, personas y ejemplos para que la ridiculización surta efecto, sea divertida y haga daño a su objetivo. Ya el propio nombre lo dice: "sátira" significa, etimológicamente "plato de muchas viandas". Esto debe ser otro ejemplo de pragmatismo romano: llamar a las cosas por su nombre.
La ironía, el sarcasmo, la malignidad de las sátiras de Juvenal se han desgastado con los siglos, porque la risa es más esclava del tiempo que el dolor y el llanto. Tampoco las comedias de Aristófanes son muy graciosas hoy, honestamente, mientras que las tragedias de Eurípides siguen conmoviendo.
Pero aunque los ingredientes hayan perdido sabor, la receta sigue siendo válida. La fórmula magistral que patenta Juvenal es la que siguen usando las sátiras modernas. Está todo ahí: exageraciones, monstruosidades, anécdotas y mucha, mucha variedad de temas, personas y ejemplos para que la ridiculización surta efecto, sea divertida y haga daño a su objetivo. Ya el propio nombre lo dice: "sátira" significa, etimológicamente "plato de muchas viandas". Esto debe ser otro ejemplo de pragmatismo romano: llamar a las cosas por su nombre.
July 14, 2025
Seneca points out in his wonderful De Tranquillitate Animi (X, 4-7) that "many people, lacking even the most basic education, own books not to engage their minds, but to adorn their dining rooms.”
Wisdom isn’t measured in shelf space. Seneca scoffs at book collectors who flaunt volumes they will never unroll, their homes decked out with unread ideas. What matters isn’t the stack—it’s the spark. That same spirit roars through Juvenal: just sixteen satires survive, yet each one slices into Roman hypocrisy like a dagger. His legacy proves that a single well-honed blade cuts deeper than a room full of dull ones. In both cases, it’s not how much you have—it’s what you do with it that makes a difference.
Seneca reads to sharpen the mind. Juvenal writes to cut it open.
Roman hypocrisy? We'd better say human hypocrisy! Juvenal’s pokes in the eye may well have been aimed at second-century Romans, but their sting hasn’t faded. Human flaws are timeless. What was true under Juvenal's stylus still is today, and will be tomorrow.
Hypocrisy isn’t Roman. It’s human. And Juvenal sees it better than most.
As for me, by way of a personal definition, I'd say that hypocrisy always blossoms in the heart of he who is just a man passing himself off as a just man.
And of course Juvenal lambasts his fellow-citizens, often fiercely, offering us precious insight into how the elite of then viewed values and virtues. Scathing comments, straight-shooting ironic quips, condemnations out of hand, can we chalk it all up to that same old lament, the timeworn appraisal that this world is going topsy-turvy with every imaginable wrong and as many misfits? Because let's face it: Juvenal is a hollier-than-thou writer who doesn't suffer fools gladly. And in his book, it doesn't take much for you to be a fool -for example, women, homosexuals and new money fit the bill. It really is a pity that sources about him are so scarce, I would have liked to know so much more about him. For I am totally on board with him on this: “The people that once bestowed commands, consulships, legions, and all else, now concerns itself no more, and longs eagerly for just two things: bread and circuses.” The bitter observation still stands today. Just look at us. We are inches away from the tipping point threshold of global climate pandemonium, and yet, all we're interested in is bread and circuses. I say humans suck!
So at the end of the day, yes, only sixteen satires, that's all we have left of Juvenal's sharp brevity. So we may once again take comfort in Seneca's words of wisdom:“As is a tale, so is life: not how long it is, but how good it is, is what matters.”
Wisdom isn’t measured in shelf space. Seneca scoffs at book collectors who flaunt volumes they will never unroll, their homes decked out with unread ideas. What matters isn’t the stack—it’s the spark. That same spirit roars through Juvenal: just sixteen satires survive, yet each one slices into Roman hypocrisy like a dagger. His legacy proves that a single well-honed blade cuts deeper than a room full of dull ones. In both cases, it’s not how much you have—it’s what you do with it that makes a difference.
Seneca reads to sharpen the mind. Juvenal writes to cut it open.
Roman hypocrisy? We'd better say human hypocrisy! Juvenal’s pokes in the eye may well have been aimed at second-century Romans, but their sting hasn’t faded. Human flaws are timeless. What was true under Juvenal's stylus still is today, and will be tomorrow.
Hypocrisy isn’t Roman. It’s human. And Juvenal sees it better than most.
As for me, by way of a personal definition, I'd say that hypocrisy always blossoms in the heart of he who is just a man passing himself off as a just man.
And of course Juvenal lambasts his fellow-citizens, often fiercely, offering us precious insight into how the elite of then viewed values and virtues. Scathing comments, straight-shooting ironic quips, condemnations out of hand, can we chalk it all up to that same old lament, the timeworn appraisal that this world is going topsy-turvy with every imaginable wrong and as many misfits? Because let's face it: Juvenal is a hollier-than-thou writer who doesn't suffer fools gladly. And in his book, it doesn't take much for you to be a fool -for example, women, homosexuals and new money fit the bill. It really is a pity that sources about him are so scarce, I would have liked to know so much more about him. For I am totally on board with him on this: “The people that once bestowed commands, consulships, legions, and all else, now concerns itself no more, and longs eagerly for just two things: bread and circuses.” The bitter observation still stands today. Just look at us. We are inches away from the tipping point threshold of global climate pandemonium, and yet, all we're interested in is bread and circuses. I say humans suck!
So at the end of the day, yes, only sixteen satires, that's all we have left of Juvenal's sharp brevity. So we may once again take comfort in Seneca's words of wisdom:“As is a tale, so is life: not how long it is, but how good it is, is what matters.”
May 27, 2022
The star of Juvenal's Sixteen Satires is number six, Against Women. Juvenal goes on and on about how untrustworthy the women of Rome have become in the second century and how he wishes for the girls of yester-year. He actually provides the example of the perfect woman but he cannot take even her because she is too proud. Essentially, Juvenal could find no solace in any woman. Is that the case? OR was he just a master Roman satirist and could make up incredible characters to prove his points? It is certainly a possibility, however all good satire is based in truth, otherwise it is ineffective and unfunny. Juvenal was most likely just a misogamist, however it does not necessarily follow that misogamy falls hand in hand with misogyny. It's just that the character that Juvenal has put to speak in the Sixth Satire is both and it is unfortunate that this voice is likely the voice of the author.
The other ten satires are sort of culturally nonconsequential since, well, we are not living in second century Rome... Ultimately, these other long-form poems fail to stand out in the shadow of the sixth satire. One that stands out is the first one, It is not hard to write satire, where Juvenal basically says that anyone who is living in second century Rome could write a scathing Yelp review of the city, or empire I suppose.
The other ten satires are sort of culturally nonconsequential since, well, we are not living in second century Rome... Ultimately, these other long-form poems fail to stand out in the shadow of the sixth satire. One that stands out is the first one, It is not hard to write satire, where Juvenal basically says that anyone who is living in second century Rome could write a scathing Yelp review of the city, or empire I suppose.
November 23, 2024
I really Loved Juvenal's style of writing!! I enjoyed the Satires!
September 17, 2021
Juvenal lashes degenerate Rome with a whip of indignation, scorn and wit. Is the world always thus?
June 2, 2012
Juvenal was foulmouthed, cynical, and embittered, his mind a veritable cesspool of wealth-envy and entitlement. But he was a keen observer of the human condition, and the effete, decadent Rome he satirizes is eerily similar to modern America. There is truly nothing new under the sun. Could Juvenal’s satirical commentary on his own time serve as a cautionary tale for our own?
Probably not. "We’re an empire now -- we create our own reality…"
Or do we?
Composed in the first century AD,(and mangled over time), this collection of satires has to be read to be believed. Juvenal, in my opinion, was hardly an admirable character, but he was damned good at what he did. And did it with a vengeance. The date of its authorship notwithstanding, Satires is a vicious, razor-sharp poem-as-polemic, a vitriolic lampoon; not only of the effete, decadent cesspool that was first century Rome, but of human nature in general.
Juvenal’s rogues’ gallery of deviants, drunks, ersatz tough-guys, nouveau riche vulgarians, greedy merchants, street thugs and decadent aristocrats is as familiar to the modern eye as to the ancient – and as contemptible. His satires fairly radiate scorn and loathing for their objects; scorn and loathing rendered all the more acid and effective by their author’s attention to detail and choice of verbiage. It’s tempting to say that Juvenal renders perversion and peccadillo alike in loving detail – but "shockingly unflattering detail" is far more accurate. His idiom of choice -- quite appropriately -- is likewise shocking and unflattering.
I’ve heard Dante referred to as “the master of the disgusting,” and rightly so – to a certain extent. Skilled though he was, he couldn’t hold a candle to Juvenal, whose gutter language and revolting imagery are as hilarious as they are nauseating. Moreover, like Dante, Juvenal possesses a rare gift: the ability to make “a silk purse from a sow’s ear” – or, more accurately, from an entire pigsty and its occupants. In other words: Juvenal takes the repulsive and sickening, and through some twisted alchemy of his own, renders them strangely beautiful.
Making gold from lead or other base metals is one thing – making it from “bulldagger” gladiators; cross-dressing, homosexual Ceres cultists; cheating wives; husbands who double as “political pimps”; and oily, favor-purchasing foreign merchants is another entirely.
And yet Juvenal succeeds admirably.
We're in serious trouble, boys and girls...
Probably not. "We’re an empire now -- we create our own reality…"
Or do we?
Composed in the first century AD,(and mangled over time), this collection of satires has to be read to be believed. Juvenal, in my opinion, was hardly an admirable character, but he was damned good at what he did. And did it with a vengeance. The date of its authorship notwithstanding, Satires is a vicious, razor-sharp poem-as-polemic, a vitriolic lampoon; not only of the effete, decadent cesspool that was first century Rome, but of human nature in general.
Juvenal’s rogues’ gallery of deviants, drunks, ersatz tough-guys, nouveau riche vulgarians, greedy merchants, street thugs and decadent aristocrats is as familiar to the modern eye as to the ancient – and as contemptible. His satires fairly radiate scorn and loathing for their objects; scorn and loathing rendered all the more acid and effective by their author’s attention to detail and choice of verbiage. It’s tempting to say that Juvenal renders perversion and peccadillo alike in loving detail – but "shockingly unflattering detail" is far more accurate. His idiom of choice -- quite appropriately -- is likewise shocking and unflattering.
I’ve heard Dante referred to as “the master of the disgusting,” and rightly so – to a certain extent. Skilled though he was, he couldn’t hold a candle to Juvenal, whose gutter language and revolting imagery are as hilarious as they are nauseating. Moreover, like Dante, Juvenal possesses a rare gift: the ability to make “a silk purse from a sow’s ear” – or, more accurately, from an entire pigsty and its occupants. In other words: Juvenal takes the repulsive and sickening, and through some twisted alchemy of his own, renders them strangely beautiful.
Making gold from lead or other base metals is one thing – making it from “bulldagger” gladiators; cross-dressing, homosexual Ceres cultists; cheating wives; husbands who double as “political pimps”; and oily, favor-purchasing foreign merchants is another entirely.
And yet Juvenal succeeds admirably.
We're in serious trouble, boys and girls...
August 3, 2016
Let's be honest, from a reader's point of view, I found Juvenal's satires often repetitive, imbued with a bitter conservatism that leads him to fire in all directions at those he accuses of debasing the Roman society and contributing to a spirit of general decadence.
Long story short: It was better before, and lemme tell ya that back in mah time... ET.CAETERA.
It is to be noted that when Juvenal takes his stylus to complain that moderation and moral rigor are no longer rewarded int his wretched society and men really need to stop wearing gauze and being huge pussies, we're at the very dawn of the second century AD. Notorious homosexual and raging warlord Trajan has a few good years left, Hadrian, Antoninus and Marcus Aurelius will succede him, prolonging the blessed era of the "five good emperors" for almost a century. Elagabalus and his homemade brothel built directly in the imperial palace won't imprint themselves in the pages of history books until 218.
It is therefore in utter good faith and complete historical myopia that Juvenal vents against his times for our enjoyment. If he only knew what was to come...
Now, from a purely documentary point of view, this is a gem, a direct dive into the mind of an ancient Roman blogger. Politicians, hipsters, rivals: an entire society takes life, preserved in this literary amber. Vivid details survive, famous and obscure references teach us what made the conversations at the time.
A necessary read for Roman history lovers (But, being the mediocre mind I am, I prefer Martial, because latrines jokes make me laugh. Please don't stone me.)
Long story short: It was better before, and lemme tell ya that back in mah time... ET.CAETERA.
It is to be noted that when Juvenal takes his stylus to complain that moderation and moral rigor are no longer rewarded int his wretched society and men really need to stop wearing gauze and being huge pussies, we're at the very dawn of the second century AD. Notorious homosexual and raging warlord Trajan has a few good years left, Hadrian, Antoninus and Marcus Aurelius will succede him, prolonging the blessed era of the "five good emperors" for almost a century. Elagabalus and his homemade brothel built directly in the imperial palace won't imprint themselves in the pages of history books until 218.
It is therefore in utter good faith and complete historical myopia that Juvenal vents against his times for our enjoyment. If he only knew what was to come...
Now, from a purely documentary point of view, this is a gem, a direct dive into the mind of an ancient Roman blogger. Politicians, hipsters, rivals: an entire society takes life, preserved in this literary amber. Vivid details survive, famous and obscure references teach us what made the conversations at the time.
A necessary read for Roman history lovers (But, being the mediocre mind I am, I prefer Martial, because latrines jokes make me laugh. Please don't stone me.)
December 11, 2012
I wasn't expecting a ton from this collection, so I wasn't really surprised by it. Juvenal was a Roman poet back in the first century AD and his 16 existant satires are blistering broadsides against his society, one which he thinks is filled with decadence, corruption, vice and foreign (especially Greek) influences (If only he lived to see the Byzantines!).
It's an interesting collection. Juvenal's stuff occasionally drifts into complete bitterness, but a few images have stuck with me: the pedestrian crushed by a load of rocks, soldiers terrorizing commoners, the storm at sea in satire XII. But by and large, he just rages against anything and everything, completely full-bore. Here's where the familiar phrase "bread and circuses" came from and it's one of his milder moments, too.
I read an older Penguin edition, but even here Peter Green's notes were plentiful and helpful. His translation was nice, although he tried to modernize it a bit (changing money to pounds sterling, changed the name of a few fish, etc). He drops some harsh language, too, which I didn't really expect; this isn't as sanitized as Penguin's edition of Catullus. I'd like to check out the revised edition that came out a while back and see how it's changed, not to mention the other translations out there.
All in all, the unrelenting bitterness can get a little repetitive and frankly, my tastes run more towards poets like Martial. But I won't deny his historical importance, either.
It's an interesting collection. Juvenal's stuff occasionally drifts into complete bitterness, but a few images have stuck with me: the pedestrian crushed by a load of rocks, soldiers terrorizing commoners, the storm at sea in satire XII. But by and large, he just rages against anything and everything, completely full-bore. Here's where the familiar phrase "bread and circuses" came from and it's one of his milder moments, too.
I read an older Penguin edition, but even here Peter Green's notes were plentiful and helpful. His translation was nice, although he tried to modernize it a bit (changing money to pounds sterling, changed the name of a few fish, etc). He drops some harsh language, too, which I didn't really expect; this isn't as sanitized as Penguin's edition of Catullus. I'd like to check out the revised edition that came out a while back and see how it's changed, not to mention the other translations out there.
All in all, the unrelenting bitterness can get a little repetitive and frankly, my tastes run more towards poets like Martial. But I won't deny his historical importance, either.
April 2, 2013
. . . . The breadth of poetic tones Humphries confronts in his translations and the apparent effortlessness of his execution is nothing short of breath-taking. From the high dignity of Virgil, through the hilarious vulgarity of Martial and back to the Wordsworthian philosophizing (without the Wordsworthian pomposity) of Lucretius. From Ovid’s serious and finally tragic playfulness to all the well-placed grumpiness of that curmudgeon Juvenal. Humphries achieved a feat of poetic translation I would argue unequalled in English since the age of Dryden and Pope – if even then – and, unlike the heroic-couplet masters, Humphries did it all on his own. I stand in awe, wondering what he might have done with Catullus. And, if ever a scrap of paper is turned up in the storage rooms of Amherst College with idle bits of a translation of Tibullus’ first elegy, I’ll be at the head of the line for my copy when it’s published, squealing like it’s 1964 and the Beatles – or Elvius — have stepped off the plane.
The rest of my thoughts on the Latin Translations of Rolfe Humphries can be found here: http://behindthehedge.wordpress.com/2...
The rest of my thoughts on the Latin Translations of Rolfe Humphries can be found here: http://behindthehedge.wordpress.com/2...
April 11, 2013
Juvenal should be compulsory reading for grumpy old men as the ancient satirist attacks the many failings of Roman society in much the same manner as the better comedians attack our own moral decline.
Here's a comment from Satire VI on a friend's decision to get married:
'You were once the randiest Hot-rod-about-town, you hid in more bedroom cupboards then a comedy juvenile lead.'
If you're an extreme feminist I might avoid Juvenal unless you want a support for the retrenchment of your opinions - otherwise this is more fun than most modern comedy.
Peter Green's erudite and insightful commentary and translation is worth every dinar.
Here's a comment from Satire VI on a friend's decision to get married:
'You were once the randiest Hot-rod-about-town, you hid in more bedroom cupboards then a comedy juvenile lead.'
If you're an extreme feminist I might avoid Juvenal unless you want a support for the retrenchment of your opinions - otherwise this is more fun than most modern comedy.
Peter Green's erudite and insightful commentary and translation is worth every dinar.
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