Under the Big Black Sun: A Personal History of L.A. Punk

by John Doe (Contributor)

Under the Big Black Sun explores the nascent Los Angeles punk rock movement and its evolution to hardcore punk as it's never been told before. Authors John Doe and Tom DeSavia have woven together an enthralling story of the legendary west coast scene from 1977-1982 by enlisting the voices of people who were there. The book shares chapter-length tales from the authors along with personal essays from famous (and infamous) players in the scene.

Genres: Music, Nonfiction, History, Punk, Memoir, Audiobook, Biography

288 pages, Unknown Binding

First published April 26, 2016

About the author

John Nommensen Duchac (born February 25, 1953), known professionally as John Doe, is an American singer, songwriter, actor, poet, guitarist and bass player. Doe co-founded LA punk band X, of which he is still an active member. His musical performances and compositions span rock, punk, country and folk music genres. As an actor, he has dozens of television appearances and several movies to his credit, including the role of Jeff Parker in the television series Roswell.

In addition to X, Doe performs with the country-folk-punk band the Knitters and has released records as a solo artist. In the early 1980s, he performed on two albums by the Flesh Eaters.

(Source: Wikipedia)

Reviews

[Wil Wheaton · Rating 5 out of 5]

This is the best audiobook I have ever listened to.

[Quentin Montemayor · Rating 5 out of 5]

(Disclaimer: this review is for the audiobook) This is a great fucking book. And if you don't listen to the audiobook you're doing yourself a disservice. All the chapters are read by the people who were there and experienced it all. What a great piece of history told in their own voices. John Doe has the perfect tone of voice for this. He should become a voice actor or something. There's a great Jack Grisham chapter. And I wouldn't want to spoil all that sex for you...so go listen. Do not wait.

[Lynx · Rating 5 out of 5]

This isn't a memoir by John Doe, nor is it an oral history like Please Kill Me. This is a collection of personal short stories from an array of amazing, talented people who came into their own in the centre of the LA punk scene. While the overall theme of finding a place they finally felt they belonged is found in each chapter, it's the personal memories, interactions, and how it all shaped them and the art they would create that makes it all fascinating.

This was my first ever audiobook and I'm so happy I chose that way to experience this collection. Doe chose some awesome subjects to share their stories and hearing them all share their experiences in their own voice greatly enhanced the book for me. I also loved that he made sure to include plenty of incredible women considering how often their contributions have been overlooked.

One incredible woman featured in this book is Pleasant Gehman. I had the immense pleasure of chatting with her on my podcast, and those who wish to hear some more fantastic tales from the LA Punk scene can check it out at Muses and Stuff.

[Jim · Rating 4 out of 5]

As a superfan of L.A. punk rock I was somewhat let down by Under the Big Black Sun. It's not a memoir, nor is it an oral history, and it's kind of a stretch to call it an anthology. It's a loose collection of essays that covers, more or less, the same ground as Forming: The Early Days of L.A. Punk, Make The Music Go Bang!: The Early L.A. Punk Scene, and We Got the Neutron Bomb: The Untold Story of L.A. Punk. That's fine. The voices collected here all add interesting insights to a story that's been told many times before despite co-author Tom DeSavia's claims that LA punk rock is underdocumented. Interspersed between these pieces are shorter remembrances by John Doe and DeSavia that add little to the collection. I think I would have preferred if they'd stuck to being editors and made it a proper anthology and added more voices to the conversation. If I sound a bit jaded you can thank Allan MacDonell's Punk Elegies: True Tales of Death Trip Kids, Wrongful Sex, and Trial by Angel Dust and Alice Bag's Violence Girl: East L.A. Rage to Hollywood Stage, a Chicana Punk Story, which are both real and raw and burst the balloon that would have you believe that the early LA punk scene was a magical time of creativity and diversity. There were drugs addicts, hustlers, prostitutes, rapists and rape victims, violence against women and STDs aplenty but you won't find any of that here.

[Al · Rating 5 out of 5]

Instead of a John Doe book, this is set up as John Doe curating a book about the LA punk scene. The stated objective of the book is that the Los Angeles punk scene of the late 70s doesn’t get enough respect and attention in comparison to the London and New York scenes.
I admire working towards that end, although for me, it’s impossible to beat the UK and NYC for depth and quality, as well as diversity. Still, LA is very important. For starters, Doe’s band X is despite many plaudits, still underappreciated. As is so many of the bands that former the LA scene- the Go-Gos, Fear, TSOL, the Weirdos, the Dickies, the Germs- and there is a wealth of diversity and thought- Black Randy and the Metro Squad, the Blasters, the Bags, the Polecats, the Zeros, the Plugz, the Screamers and many more.
The book are short pieces –about 20 or so from 15 of the scene’s members- musicians, journalists, film makers. Billie Joe Armstrong with the introduction, and pieces written by Henry Rollins, Exene Cevenka, and more. The best in my opinion were the ones written by Doe, and Jane Weidlin and Charlotte Caffey of the Go-Gos. They really captured that period of youth where you discover others with the same tastes as you, and start making towards a scene, capturing the energy and the lack of money, no car, dead end jobs but also as the scene evolves over time. I was very inspired to think of my teenage years and early 20s and surely others will be reminded of their local scenes. Maybe not everyone we knew ended up on MTV, but we were inspired and created and made the scene in our lives.
Mike Watt has an excellent piece which is a fitting tribute to D Boon but also captures that feeling of being a lonely outsider and is written in the captifying way of ‘wattspeak” like only he can. El Vez (and others) pointed out the openness of the scene and that it was not just a white male scene, but everyone was equal, and the scene was accepting of women, gays, Latinos and everyone.
I found Dave Alvin’s piece worthwhile in that it argues over what punk is. If punk is ‘do what you love no matter what’ then the Blasters were indeed punk; but if punk is a haircut or a uniform , his band did not fit in. The Blasters shared stages with acts as diverse as Queen, Fear, Los Lobos, Bo Diddley, and Dwight Yoakam. It was cool that Lee Ving had the band’s back, and that their rockabilly-influenced sound fit in a scene where they did not sound like anyone else. I also really appreciated Jack Grisham’s piece. Most of the book follows the same thread- there was this magical group of outsiders who came together to form art, then hardcore came in, hard drugs were introduced, the scene was violent and testosterone driven. Grisham offers a great rebuttal on what drove bands like TSOL and others to do what they did. They were coming into a scene that had become the establishment it once railed against.
Journalist Kristine McKenna and Doe end the book with two pieces that sum up the chapters before. McKenna is a great writer, though I think she is a bit off with postulating that the scene wouldn’t have been created in world of social media. This to me hits a bit too much “Get off my lawn” for me. I get her point, but scenes involve. Now, there are blogs, sites like Bandcamp, kickstarter campaigns, guerilla marketing, and people across the world with similar tastes can connect, and artists like car Seat Headrest can go from home recordings to national stardom without leaving the bedroom. Her other contention borders on the “youth is wasted on the young” meme, which is mostly true. Without being ageist, many of her points are valid. The young have the time and energy and drive, before worrying about bills and families set in, and other motivations drive decisions. Another point made is that the scene once rebellious and considered something the mainstream would ridicule turned into something that corporations like record labels and MTV embraced because they saw financial implications. What was pure art was now being tinged by the greed of Capitalism. Doe ties it all together, capturing the points where the scene moved from a collection of creative souls to where it loses the plot- Go Gos Top 10 success, X’s major label signing and national tour, Darby Crash’s death. These things led to the scene no longer being this pure uncorrupted thing.
For me, this book was really powerful, and reminded me so much of my younger years and “the scene”, and I think friends of mine would say the same. Granted, we may not have the level of fame, but the scene for us was just as important to shaping our lives. To McKenna’s point, it was a time that you could get beat up for the way you looked, a nostalgia that the alt-right apparently wants to bring back. When I look at the reviews, they seem mixed. I think it may help that I know these bands very well. For me, this book was perfect for what Doe wanted to accomplish.

I would be remiss if I didn’t end this review with a glowing appreciation of my local library. In the last year or so , they have brought in not only this book, but a bunch of significant music biographies- Unfaithful Music, Porcelain, Trouble Boys, How Music Works as well as this book. Not to mention a lot of other cool books like Richard Zacks’ Mark Twain book. This is an amazing selection that I doubt my Big Box store can compete with. Way to go local library!

[Aengus · Rating 3 out of 5]

One could make a pretty good argument that the L.A. punk scene of the late '70's/early '80's was every bit as culturally influential as the London and New York punk movements, if not more so. Besides the music, SoCal popularized the D.I.Y. ethos, gave us the art of Raymond Petttibon, and the documentaries of Penelope Spheeris. It's fairly crying out for a good book about it.
"Under the Big Black Sun" is not that book.
What is it? A collection of short essays about L.A. in the late '70's, written by several of the musicians and scenesters from those days. It's pretty hit or miss. Most of theses pieces follow the same narrative, and tell the same stories, to wit:
1) "I came here when I was 16, and met others like myself who didn't fit in."
2) "The parties were crazy. Tomata du Plenty made gross appetizers @ the Disgraceland Party and we smoked pot with Tony Curtis!!" (There's a lot of name dropping going on here).
3) "The music was great!!! The first Plugz/Weirdos/Germs show I went to was like nothing I'd ever experienced!!! It was so raw!!
4) "Drugs and Orange County skinheads came and ruined it for everyone, so I moved on."
There's not a lot of insight into what made punk music from that time and place so powerful.
The best part of the book is Mike Watt's story of the birth of the Minutemen. Written without capital letters, and strewn with teenageisms (prolly, dealio), Watt's essay is a tender paean to his best friend and bandmate, D. Boon, who died in a car accident just when the band was about to take off. It's funny and heartbreaking.

[Craig J. · Rating 4 out of 5]

Great read about the original Los Angeles punk scene. Really enjoyed the emphasis on the creativity, inclusiveness, and intellect of the scene (which has always been the most most attractive thing about punk to me) rather than just tales of debauch and nihilism, although those are scattered throughout as well. It offers a very nice counter to all the current hype about the early New York punk scene, and successfully documents some great moments illustrating the unique feel the early LA artists brought to punk while remaining true to the voices of those who participated in creating it. Many of the vignettes are touching eulogies to a brief time that left an impact still felt in music and art today.

[Lisastrawberry · Rating 5 out of 5]

Excellent history, in a quirky random manner that perfectly suits the subject. Many writers co-authored the book with John Doe. I want to check out The Flesheaters and the Minute Men after hearing Jason and Mike give their accounts of the bands, respectively.

[Angela(Angie) · Rating 5 out of 5]

Fabulous!! This is an amazing punk rock history. I enjoyed it in both formats: as an audiobook and as a print book. I recommend both formats--they each offer different appeals. The audiobook was everything I have always wanted from a music biography audiobook-- each chapter was read by the author of that chapter, and there were musical excerpts in between chapters. But of course the print book offers a better way to pore over the lyrics, and also has great photos. We were lucky enough to go the book signing in Austin, and we had a chance to chat with John Doe and thank him for this book. He was charming as always, and also said he hopes to do a follow up book. Can't wait!

[Thom · Rating 5 out of 5]

This book is a collection of short histories by the people who were there, along with some great photos from the time. Better still is the audio book, where each of the authors reads their own section - telling their story. Combining the two - awesome!

John Doe writes (and narrates) the majority of the chapters, and they do a nice job of covering history from early LA punk - from glam to hardcore. This sets the scene for the other authors - Dave Alvin, Charlotte Caffey, Exene Cervenka, Teresa Covarrubias, Pleasant Gehman, Jack Grisham, Robert Lopez (aka El Vez), Kristine McKenna, Chris Morris, Henry Rollins, Mike Watt, and Jane Wiedlin.

If you have *any* interest at all in this subject or this music, go get the book and the audiobook (probably both available at the library) and dig in!

[Jessie McMains · Rating 4 out of 5]

A few of the chapters were a little meh, which is to be expected in a book written by many different people, but overall it was an excellent look back at the first wave of L.A. punk, from many of the main players.

[Aimee · Rating 5 out of 5]

If you are interested in this, may I suggest the audio book! So fun! And so much LA punk history!! I had no idea the Go Go's were involved in the LA punk scene.

[Sean · Rating 4 out of 5]

I loved John Doe's vantage of LA during the early years of punk rock. His appreciation of the music before him, the city itself, poetry, noir fiction, art, cars, beaches, and the culture of Los Angeles (he bristles when it is suggested that the city has no culture) made for a quick, enjoyable read. If you're a fan of John Doe, X, or that scene: I have no doubt you'll love the book, too. If you're looking for some encyclopedia of punk rock in LA: look elsewhere, and notice that this book's title includes the words "personal history." It's not meant to be a text book...it's John's stories, and the stories of Exene Cervenka (X), Henry Rollins (Black Flag), Mike Watt (The Minutemen), Jane Wiedlin and Charlotte Caffey (The Go-Go’s), Dave Alvin (The Blasters), Jack Grisham (TSOL), Teresa Covarrubias (The Brat), Robert Lopez (The Zeros, El Vez), Pleasant Gehman, Kristine McKenna, and Chris Morris. Nobody here is trying to write a be all/end all compendium of the time and place...just telling their stories.

[Steve · Rating 5 out of 5]

Over twenty-four chapters from a host of scenesters from the emergent punk scene of Los Angeles in the late 70s and early 80s, John Doe et al relate their personal histories and various manifestos in “Under the Big Black Sun,” a “personal history of L.A. punk.” It’s an engaging and endearing read, if at times predictably repetitive. Then again, the people, places, and events might mesh into one, but the individuality of the memories is what makes each one special and unique.

Doe’s name is in big print on the cover, but the stories are told by a variety of folks (Doe contributes a little over a third) including his partner in crime Exene Cervenka, Go-Go’s alumni Charlotte Caffey and Jane Wiedlin, Henry Rollins, Dave Alvin, and a handful of others. Some stories are band histories while others tell of how they ended up in the scene. Doe writes a wonderfully comprehensive chapter about the punk ethos that was at the core of the scene while Mike Watt of the Minutemen writes a fascinating stream-of-consciousness piece about the beginning, short life, and quick end of his infamous band. It’s touching how much he still misses D. Boon some thirty years gone. If you don’t know who D. Boon or the Minutemen are, then I’m not really sure why you’d want to read this book because, at heart, this is a love letter written by the people who made it happen to both themselves and their audience. Then again, maybe reading it for the uninitiated will open doors to this music and remind people of the critical role punk plays in the survival of rock music.

I love X and I’ll never forget meeting them outside a show in Pittsburgh moons ago in which I stammered something about how incredible it was to finally meet them in person. John Doe deadpanned with charm and his quick smile, “Well, here we are.” He and the band were humble and genuinely appreciative that a nobody had taken the time to wait alone in the dark alley outside their show just so he could say thanks for making his life better with their music. In that brief yet unforgettable moment before they climbed the step into their bus, my long-held belief that X was a great band full of great people was solidified.

As I stood outside yet another small club venue the band has played over their decades in the business, watching their bus back out and waving like a dorky fan, I realized the thin line between those who are committed and those who aren’t. I would’ve given anything to be a part of the L.A. punk scene described in this book (or the similar movements in NYC or London), but I didn’t have the courage or the dedication. It’s a bitter pill to keep swallowing, but if we can’t be honest with ourselves, then we have bigger problems than lamenting days gone by. In this book, John Doe and friends at least provide an outsider like me a personal insight into the environment, and from that I take comfort and crank up Under the Big Black Sun once again.

[Diana · Rating 4 out of 5]

I like John Doe. I mean, I LIKE like him. So when I heard he’d written a book about the LA punk scene in the late 1970s, I immediately checked to see if it was available on audiobook-- and it was. Hurray!

This is a great listen, not only because of my rockstar boyfriend, but also because aside from writing a number of chapters himself, Doe got a lot of other people involved in the scene to contribute chapters as well, and all these contributors read their chapters themselves. So the last couple of days, I’ve been taking long walks and cleaning my house with John Doe, Dave Alvin, Henry Rollins and many more. I especially like the chapter by Jane Weidlin of the Go-Gos, who was good reader and revealed lots of saucy details, and the chapter by Robert Lopez of the Zeros and El Vez, who talked about the strong Latino part of the scene.

Now I want to go back in time to the summer of 1979 to see X play the Whiskey a Go Go.

[Sandy Plants · Rating 3 out of 5]

Every chapter is written by a different influencer of the early punk scene in LA, and, for me, it felt like a double-edged sword: some of the chapters were AMAZING and others were bland, dull and forgettable. Nevertheless, I respect that it was a group effort and not just one person’s story. Worth a read!

[Mel · Rating 4 out of 5]

Totally rad. I love these oral history books- and it was especially great on audio- because I get to learn more about a time I didn't get to live through myself, and straight from the mouths of the people who were at the center of it. Most of the recollections weren't very pretty, but that's punk.

[Leenda dela Luna · Rating 4 out of 5]

A collection of short memoirs from people who were part of the early LA Punk scene.

Have only read 4 chapters so far but I am LOVING this book!

[Craig D. Mitchell · Rating 4 out of 5]

The “personal history” part of the title is correct because it’s a collection of essays not just from John Doe and Exene, but from the other bands, and scenesters as well. It was of great value to be able to see those moments in time through so many different people’s eyes.

The only downside was that some of those that contributed saw the exact same thing. However, while some of their essays might have contained few new details, they provided confirmation, and generally included at least one wild story no one else had mentioned.

Let me be clear on one thing. All of those wild, perverted Go-Go’s stories you might have heard over the years? They’re apparently true.

That cute, adorable, and seemingly innocent lil’ Jane Wiedlin of The Go-Go’s I was so smitten by in high school? As she tells her story, well... not even close to innocent. Nowhere in the same neighborhood as innocent, ok? I won’t ruin it for you but let’s just say she would have been a very, VERY interesting girl to know or date back then. Sheezus.

They have a bunch of those wonderful, thrown together or drawn, last minute, and often brilliant punk flyers between every essay— of the same type I remember from my midwestern punk days.

And I believe the history goes no further than Black Flag— those guys many of the writers were in full agreement on: “And then Black Flag came along, and then you had the utter violence that always seemed to follow them around.”

I guess The Minutemen were in there, and quite a few others— too many to mention.

I liked this book enough that it actually made me turn around and decide to see X when they’re in town next month— all of the original members including Billy Zoom!

I read a few reviews of the shows they’ve played in recent years, and if there was one thing everyone agreed on: “X can still bring it!”

[Jim · Rating 5 out of 5]

At the reading John Doe gave at Diesel Books in Oakland (June 2016), I asked him "Are we sure the Go-Gos were punk?" Some people laughed but John assured us all - yes, punk.

Finally, nearly two years later I read the book. He's right, and I asked a naive question! The Go-Go's came out of the same community stew that gave us X, The Blasters, Los Lobos, The Flesh Eaters, The Germs, El Vez, and The Minutemen.

The history of L.A's punk scene as told here starts with a communal fun vibe of DIY everything. It connected East L.A to Hollywood and mixed rock, latin, bluegrass, & roots. And then around 1982 (the year I arrived in L.A) it gave way to an angry and violent expression lead by Black Flag.

This collection of memoirettes gives a nice oral history of the L.A music scene as it moves from its fun, bohemian, indulgent party days to its serious, angry, thrasher indulgent party days.

The majority of the memoirrettes chronicle the happy fun days of 1975-1979. Henry Rollins' piece introduces a change in the narration. I bet Rollins knew he was going to be seen as the bad guy in this book, and so he keeps it short: his view of L.A of 1981 is not flattering, he doesn't see the fun community that John Doe, Exene, and Jane Wiedlin saw. He's not impressed at all.

Then the writing by Jack Grisham (lead singer of TSOL) reads like a rebuttal to all the "happy days" memoirs. He chronicles an L.A of police violence, relentless harassment, and communal rejection. Yeah, he makes his case for the violent side of punk. No apologies from him!

The two who seemed to really bridge the divide and enjoyed both eras (the happy & the angry) were Mike Watt (The Minutemen) & Dave Alvin (The Blasters).

And their stories (Watt's and Alvin's) were the best in this collection.

[Dean Jones · Rating 5 out of 5]

I loved this book so much. I listened to the Audiobook version and as a result, was able to hear the author of the work and it's contributors voices as they read their memoirs. There were many of the big names of the early LA Punk scene(1977-1982) John Doe, Exene Cervenka, Jane Weidlin, Dave Alvin, Henry Rollins, Alice Bag, and many many more people lent their perspective to this work.
I HIGHLY recommend this work to anyone who loves punk, it's a completely great time.
I felt like I knew punk pretty well but was introduced to bands like "The Brat", "The Weirdo's" and more than I wish I had heard years ago.
Even though the punks who penned this work are the narrators the Star of this work seems to be LA herself, in all her hard glory. Henry Rollins in this work described LA as a stucco-covered killing field, what a great and perfect description.

The Weirdo's Helium Bar
https://youtu.be/WWjyxtTpfRA

[Lauren · Rating 4 out of 5]

So, so so Great!

I'm so glad @wilwheaton recommended it and the audio version at that. 99% of the contributors had interesting and profound things to say about this time and did it so well. Some write better than they read but that's to be expected. Just listen for content, not professional tone and modulation. And I'm so surprised they can all remember so much from these crazy days!

I was not in LA in the late 70s or early 80s when this is centered but got to San Diego in 84 and could see a lot of what the authors mention as how things were changed or changing by that time.

Blast from the past is right. Nostalgic in all the right ways. Good mix of collaborators. Only music included is X and it would be nice if there had been other excerpts by each band but oh well.

If listening, stay till the very, very end! ;-)

[Brian Johnson · Rating 4 out of 5]

The approach in writing about the early punk rock movement in L.A. is refreshing. I enjoyed hearing the multitude of perspectives, the accounts, memories, and stories told through the eyes of the people who were there. I have read a lot and have been told many stories from people who were in LA through those years and still I came away with having a clearer picture of what it was like then and how the first wave of Punk rock was a more bohemian lifestyle, before hardcore sort of took over. Great read. I recommend this for anyone interested in the subject.

[François Blanchette · Rating 3 out of 5]

3.5/5*

Reading this collection of testimonies offers a great guided tour among Los Angeles’ past punk institutions. Collaborators try their best to epitomize the magic those places provided an altar for. It also displays how punk was tight-knit community in its incubacy. Each and every chapter states in its own way the importance to cherish passions through the magnifiscence they may bring, but also through their inevitable doldrums. Even if punk-rockers aimed at destroying narratives through the catharsis of their sound, there’s a universal truth rearing back from their noise: they needed a place to belong too.

[James Buckley · Rating 5 out of 5]

A fascinating travelogue through the early days of L.A. punk, the artists who fed the flame, and the evolution and/or devolution of said scene. The vignettes, by everyone from members of X to the Go-Gos, range from hilarious to sad and introspective. Highly recommended for all fans of old-school punk and just music in general.

[Tanya · Rating 3 out of 5]

Had been wanting to read this for a long time so was thankful it was finally available through Hoopla. I imagine the audiobook would be a lot of fun, too. Best discovery was The Brat; I had not been familiar with them the way I was the Alley Cats and other mid-range Cali punk bands. But I love them.

John Doe....laws, the things I would do to this man.

[Sebastian Beltran · Rating 5 out of 5]

excellent and authentic first hand accounts of the first wave of LA punk. shows how vast and diverse sonically and demographically the scene was. gets me in the mood to think about solidifying a scene up in berk/ oakland or back in the SGV of LA

[Mike Kohli · Rating 4 out of 5]

A great oral history of the early LA punk scene told by many of those who lived it. You'll hear commentary from members of X, the Go-Gos, The Blasters, Black Flag and more.

If you're into music history, this is a great read.

[Gema · Rating 5 out of 5]

The life I was too young to have

Luckily, some of these bands were still playing when I was old enough to go see them. I listened to the book and it was awesome to hear the artists themselves telling their own history. It was great to hear from several of them about the rush of the discovery of music, from mags to radio to record shops.

[Demelza · Rating 4 out of 5]

I enjoyed the diversity of voices from the scene, hearing stories read by those who wrote them, about their experiences.