7 Greeks

by Guy Davenport (Translator), Archilochus, Sappho

Here is a colorful variety of works by seven Greek poets and philosophers who lived from the eighth to the third centuries BC. Salvaged from shattered pottery vases and tattered scrolls of papyrus, everything decipherable from the remains of these ancient authors is assembled here. From early to later, the collection contains: Archilochos; Sappho; Alkman; Anakreon; the philosophers Herakleitos and Diogenes; and Herondas. This composite of fragments translated by Guy Davenport is the most complete collection of its kind ever to appear in one volume.

Genres: Poetry, Philosophy, Classics, Greece, Literature, Nonfiction, Ancient

242 pages, Paperback

First published January 1, 451

Reviews

[BAM doesn’t answer to her real name · Rating 4 out of 5]

I don’t think this is supposed to happen, but these fragments are cracking me up! You go from praising the gods to “I wore out my pizzle “ . No lie. I’m so disheartened that we lost such great stuff.

[Eddie Watkins · Rating 5 out of 5]

99. Boil in the crotch.

149. Seam of the scrotum.

209. A hummock
Of a bulge
At the crotch,
That diner
On eyeless eels.


Archilochos




15. Desire has shaken my mind
As wind in the mountain forests
Roars through trees.

31. Bride with beautiful feet.

72. And I yearn
And I hunt.

108. You make me hot.

120. Dawn with small golden feet.


Sappho




13. Girls scattered helterskelter,
Chickens and hawkshadow.

46. I can whistle
Every bird's song.


Alkman




12. The talents that tantalized
Talented Tantalos [tantalize me:].

42. I come from the river
With bright things in my arms.

70. Garlands of celery around our brows,
We're off to celebrate the Dyonysia.

93. I become misty-eyed and ready
When you want me.

131. Sauce.


Anakreon




6. Knowledge is not intelligence.

8. I have looked diligently at my own mind.

40. The most beautiful order of the world is still a random
gathering of things insignificant in themselves.

52. If every man had exactly what he wanted, he would be no
better than he is now.

67. In death men will come upon things they do not expect,
things utterly unknown to the living.

124. Even sleeping men are doing the world's business and
helping it along.


Herakleitos




8. We are not as hardy, free, or accomplished as animals.

20. The art of being a slave is to rule one's master.

42. There is no stick hard enough to drive me away from
a man from whom I can learn something.

57. The luxurious have made frugality an affliction.

106. We have complicated every simple gift of the gods.


Diogenes




You sleep so hard it makes you tired. Get up!


Herondas

[David · Rating 4 out of 5]

Excellent introduction, and the translations are powerful and have a lot of character. Though I enjoyed some of the fragments, I would have given five stars if the author had been able to expand on some of the more broken fragments, as there is little sense of poetry to random words that could have been taken from a newspaper account just as well as a piece of verse. I realize that this is not the translator's intention, as he states in the introduction, he wants to give the poets only insofar as we can read what they truly wrote, but so far as pleasurable reading experiences go, I think I would have preferred some fullness or at least footnotes to the individual fragments themselves, as is done with the Penguin edition of Sappho.

[Thomas · Rating 4 out of 5]

I was familiar with Heraclitus and Diogenes, and had a passing familiarity with Sappho, but Archilochos, Anakreon, and Herondas were all new to me. And Alkman (who I liked the least.) I would expect that many translators of fragments have to resist the urge to extrapolate, but Davenport doesn't hesitate to fill his verses with brackets and ellipses with little explanation for the erosion of the texts. (Though I wonder how much of the stage direction is in the original.) More importantly, his translations are vibrant, saucy, and decisive.

[Alexander · Rating 5 out of 5]

"The only place to spit in a rich man's house is in his face."--Diogenes.

I find I often memorize what I find in this book automatically---it goes right into me.

[JV]

Seletas de poemas gregos, se assim Deus o permitir, continuarão surgindo com novas linhas. Conquanto a indústria do papiro desde a era alexandrina até a romana tenha evoluído, o papiro ainda era caro de modo que depois de rolo para leitura ele ainda servia para enrolar o peixe, o pão, embalsamar múmia ou até escrever outros rolos para a leitura. Muitos dos poemas saíram de sarcófagos, citações em outros livros, inscrições em paredes e jarras. Estes fragmentos, migalhas na verdade, servem para evidenciar a grandeza desses poetas que escreveram em época tão feliz para a Grécia antiga.

Poetavam com tanta naturalidade que o metro lhes ganhou o nome. Criaram também os modelos de amar e se cantar o amor que nos vem desde a Grécia antiga. O lugar-comum de poeta e guerreiro já se acha em Arquíloco:

Sergeant to Enyalios,
The great god War,
I practice double labor.
With poetry, that lover's gift,
I serve the lady Muses.

Comparemos também a resposta que Arquíloco (ing) e Ovídio (pt) dão aos que chamam amor de indolência e preguiça:

Be bold! That's one way
of getting through life.
So i turn upon her
And point out that,
Faced with the wickedness
Of things, she does not shiver.
I prefer to have, after all,
Only what pleases me.
Are you so deep in misery
That you think me fallen?
You say I'm lazy; I'm not,
Nor any of my lin-people.
I know how to love those
Who love me, how to hate.
My enemies I overwhelm
With abuse. The ant bites!
*******

Portanto, quem chamava preguiça ao amor, desista; é próprio de um engenho experimentado o amor.
(...)
espicacou-me a moleza o amor por uma formosa jovem e ordenou-me que ganhasse o meu soldo nos seus campos.
Desde então tu me vês sem paranca e a travar noturnos combates.
Quem não quiser tornar-se indolente, entregue-se ao amor!

Embora ambos os versos excelentes, não deixo de notar a maior vivacidade e poder do grego. Até aos romanos o amor de Ovídio recende a cinismo.

Comparando com o Oriente médio no mesmo período onde os Impérios da Assíria e Egito ameaçavam destruir tudo entre si; onde o ambiente urbano sufocava as pessoas; onde revoluções religiosas aprofundavam a alma, as ilhas gregas viviam feliz isolamento. Sob pequenas monarquias os poetas tinham proteção e vida na corte, seus esportes, diversões e escaramuças. Essa vida em comum em barracas, tabernáculos, tendas etc que foi a inspiração essencial dessa lírica, uma motivo tão forte que parecia engolfar a pessoa do poeta e a incorporar em Afrodite. Assim Safo:

Aphródita dressed in an embroidery of flowers, Never to die, the daughter of God, Untangle from longing and perplexities,
O Lady, my heart.

But come down to me, as you came before,
For if ever I cried, and you heard and came,
Come now, of all times, leaving
Your father's golden house

In that chariot pulled by sparrows reined and bitted,
Swift in their flying, a quick blur aquiver,
Beautiful, high. They drew you across steep air
Down to the black earth;

Fast they came, and you behind them,
O Hilarious heart, your face all laughter,
Asking, What troubles you this time, why again
Do you call me down?

Asking, In your wild heart, who now
Must you have? Who is she that persuasion
Fetch her, enlist her, and put her into bounden love?
Sappho, who does you wrong?

If she balls, I promise, soon she'll chase,
If she's turned from gifts, now she'll give them.
And if she does not love you, she will love,
Helpless, she will love.

Esse tipo de vida em comum e alegria ingênua é muito rara no ocidente e a lírica grega que nos foi legada pelos romanos foi transmutada no nosso amor.

Desde “Every Force evolve a form” que admiro Guy Davenport e a tradução desses poemas é excelente bem como o ensaio introdutório. Resolvi finalmente lê-lo por cruzar perfeitamente minhas leituras de Hölderlin e de Esopo em grego.

[Architeacher]

Delivering a eulogy at the memorial service of an old friend, I built my words on a quote from the ancient Greek writer Archilochos, whose works I did not know except through the lens of Isaiah Berlin. So I just acquired Guy Davenport's compendium of seven Greek writers from the 7th through the 4th centuries BCE. Quite aside from having access to all the known fragments of these seven, Davenport's essay is worth the price of admission; what a creative and self-effacing point of view for a translator. I, for one, would like to have known this man.

[Saige · Rating 5 out of 5]

Damn, Sappho owns by dumb, gay heart. Beautiful, slightly horny lesbian poetry? Food for my soul. Diogenes had some sick burns, and Herakleitos did too. I'm all in for the ancient Greek sass. It will always make me sad that so much of this ancient poetry has been lost forever, but I'm still grateful for what we do have. This was a brilliant compilation of ancient verse. The introduction did a great job giving context and describing the translator's goals in his translation. A great read for all those interested in old literature, or just those looking for some truly sweet insults!

[māris šteinbergs · Rating 3 out of 5]

why some of these were like something almost out of a business guys self help book? the better part I had already read, but the new ones I didn’t care for at all

[Giovanna · Rating 4 out of 5]

Davenport transported me to Ancient Greece in spirit while I was physically stewing in the corner of a crammed rush hour train. I'd recommend this collection to anyone interested in Ancient Greek literature. The translations are accessible and include poetry, philosophy and some humorous theatrical skits (mimes!).

I also appreciated the inclusion of so many fragmented texts; while they seem to say little, they combine to create a sense of time and place and loss. Yet this is a loss without grief - it is instead a celebration of the curious endurance of thought.

[slp · Rating 5 out of 5]

Didn't finish reading it, since excerpted for class - but would go procure it if I had the money and go start to finish. Complicated human wisdom from way back.

[Al Maki · Rating 4 out of 5]

Four poets, two philosophers and a comic playwright all from preclassical Greece, together presenting a good picture of the roots of the Ancient Greek sensibility. I very much liked the selection because it gave a good idea of the range of Greek culture at the time, which usually looks uniform to us at this distance, but the uniqueness of each point of view comes through clearly. I got it because I had read that Archilochos, who is included, was the first person we have record of who actually expressed his own personal experience and feelings in writing and I was curious to see what those were. Who else is included? Sappho, one of the best of lyric love poets; Alkman, a writer of ritual invocations; Anacreon, another love poet who I'd heard of but never read and found to be a forerunner of Konstantin Kavafy, my favourite modern Greek poet; Herakleitos and Diogenes, two very different philosophers, the first interested in physics and real politik, the second a sort of wise cracking Buddhist and finally some ancient mime skits that read like Commedia dell'Arte by Herondas, of whom I'd never heard.

[Wendy · Rating 5 out of 5]

A fabulous collection. So few translations of ancient Greek manage to convey a voice that sounds contemporary without sacrificing accuracy, but Davenport does it. My favorite poet was Archilochus, a soldier, whom I knew nothing about before. The introductory essay is Davenport at his most riveting, utterly at home in his field and full of fascinating insights.

[JAck SøN]

I'd like to meet Guy Davenport, he's a gem.

This is such a great exploration of Greek thought and writing over several decades. Such great translations. Really cracked me up in parts, as well as deeply moving in others.

[David · Rating 4 out of 5]

This collection of translated poems and fragments gathers together seven beloved Greek writers of the 7th to the 3rd century BCE. In some cases more is known about the poet than by them, but since they are all key figures in the ancient Grecco-Roman world it's nice to have even the small amounts to look over. Some of the surviving texts are too fragmented to make sense of, but there is still plenty to develop a decent appreciation for each author. All these writings are in poetry form except for Herodas whose surviving short comic skits come at the end of the book. The mix of writers is truly varied and with a couple exceptions each stands out with a unique style and subject matter than the next, thanks to the work of the translator.

The book starts off with one of the oldest poets, Archilocus, who is famous for his ruffian, melancholy humor and biting satire. He was scorned by some of the more famous writers and praised by others and quoted by Plato/Socrates for the part about "dropping my shield and running away from the battlefield". I picked this book solely out of interest in him and I feel the author did a great job of helping to paint a vividly unique picture of this early writer.

Sappho was an admired love poet who greatly impacted later writers and a considerably large amount of her work is preserved here. I had a little trouble appreciating her writings in the manner you typically approach love poetry, but perhaps that's something that will change if I ever learn Greek and read it in its original linguistic rhythm. The sections on the next two poets are considerably shorter and much more fragmented and the section on Anacreon isn't even the work most familiar by that name. This isn't a flaw on the part of the book, just that the more well known works were later discovered to by imitative "hoaxes" of the Alexandrian era, so only the true (and fragmented) works of Anacreon are included in this volume.

The first of the philosophical poets follows next, and reading Heraclitus turned out to be the high point of this book for me. The section is not as long as those of the first two love poets in this book, but it is extremely well-preserved and lucid. When reading his writings you get the feeling you're peering at one of the earliest roots on the tree of western philosophy and spirituality. I personally see a heavy similarity to portions of the writings of the gospel according to St. John, with references to the logos (word) preceding and being responsible for all things and the need to abide in it, etc. But this is far from a collection of religious aphorisms, it is of a personally and socially pragmatic nature and has hints of early stoicism as well.

Diogenes is the last of the poetic writers and his philosophical aphorisms are quite unique. He has the personality of a man who has resigned himself to homelessness and poverty, lightheartedly scorning everyone else for their attachment to the world. He pokes fun at ritual, responsibility, social convention, and manners, seeks wholeness through detachment from material life. The writings are interesting, fairly entertaining, but he seems to have more to say about what others are doing wrong than what is right, so it's hard to develop a picture of the philosophy he's embodying.

The book finishes up with the short comic mimes of Herodas whose writings are interesting to compare against those of someone like Aristophanes. Unlike the latter, they lake any real social or political message and are simple comic interactions that revolve heavily around the mundane domestic situations. He pokes fun most at slaves, but there is a good variety of material in these 10+ plus skits (though the last couple are extremely fragmented).

The only complaints I have on this book are just technical details on the translation. The poems themselves have no markings to indicate there are translated notes to accompany them, so you need to constantly check back to the notes section and then remember the poem number for the next translator note, and then remember to jump back to the notes when you encounter that numbered poem. Also, these types of books typically preface the reader with an explanation on how they translated the work, why and when they opted for a more literal vs embellished translation, what certain symbols like brackets may mean in the text, and other similar technical notes. This book has little to none of that and though the introduction is interesting at times, it often reads as if one point doesn't quite link to the next point smoothly.

Although I felt this book lacked a few technical enhancements typical to works of ancient translated poetry it makes up for it in the quality of the translation. It's uncommon to feel the profile of each author is so distinct from the next and a true personality of each can emerge, yet this is just such a work.

[AB · Rating 5 out of 5]

Not surprised by my love of Archilochus' fragments. He has always been one of my favourite Greek poets (and one of the first that I had read in the original Greek). Sappho and company are good too but the real surprise was Diogenes. His fragments were just what I was looking for.

[Kyle · Rating 3 out of 5]

Obviously the writers collected in this text are significant: two thousand, in some cases almost three thousand years after their deaths they are still being read.

But to speak about this collection. I cannot read ancient Greek (hence why I picked this up) so I cannot speak to the quality of Davenport's translation. But it seems to be well regarded by readers on the Internet. A blurb on the back of the book, written by none other than D.S. Carne-Ross, reads, "If you don't read Greek, read Davenport; if you do, read Davenport and learn to read Greek better." Some heavy praise.

I bought this mainly for the Heraclitus selections. Every other translation of Heraclitus I found in a popular press seemed to be littered with reviews about its inconsistency with the actual Greek text. Davenport is, supposedly (via: reviewers on those reputable critical websites like Amazon.com and Goodreads), more faithful to the H-man's original text.

The selections of Heraclitus are strong. So are the ones of Diogenes — (not written by him, since no copies of his writings still exist, but things others say he said). My favorite lines in the book comes from him:

27. "When Plato said that if I'd gone to the Sicilian court as I was invited, I wouldn't have to wash lettuce for a living, I replied that if he washed lettuce for a living he wouldn't have had to go to the Sicilian court."

or

73. "I pissed on the man who called me a dog. Why was he so surprised?"

The problem with the majority of the other selections — Sappho, Archilochos, Alkman, and Anakreon — are that they are often too fragmented to be useful. I appreciate Davenport's scholastic integrity: when a fragment of a poem is missing, he just puts empty brackets to signify it; he doesn't try to complete the line.

The problem is that for a huge number of these poems — maybe even the majority — they are so fragmented that they are virtually meaningless. Look at these examples from Sappho:

13. "The gods [...............] tears [.......]
[..............]"

60. "Rose
[.....]
Speak
[.....]
Yearning
[.....]
Sweat."

122. "]him[
[......]
]becomes["

These fragments are certainly interesting from a scholarly point of view; but I wonder what the point of translating them into English is? If someone is going to do a scholarly study of Sappho, why would they be reading translations of broken lines found on fragments of parchment and pottery? Wouldn't it make more sense to study the parchment, the pottery itself? These English translations are, in essence, meaningless. Look at it this way: the original Greek fragments are already broken to the point of incomprehensibility: the poem is incomplete, open-ended: it is always and forever going to remain a mystery what the "actual" text of poem is. The fragmented Greek poem, then, is already a shadow of its former, original self. And this shadow, this thing whose meaning is already mutated from and essentially different and distinct from the "original," complete poem, is further mutated into something else, something completely different, when Davenport (or anyone for that matter) translates it into English. We are not reading Sappho: we are reading Davenport. And I don't understand the significance of reading incomprehensible fragments of Davenport.

But occasionally through all of the broken, senseless fragments, a complete, solid, beautiful thought is produced. And these moments really shine. Davenport can make these poets write wonderful English when he is given a complete thought to work with — I just wonder why he spent so much time translating gibberish.

[Lisa (Harmonybites) · Rating 4 out of 5]

Spanning from the eighth to the third century B.C., included here are four poets (Archilochos, Sappho, Alkman and Anakreon), two philosophers (Herakleitos and Diogenes, the Cynic philospher), and Herondas, who wrote comic skits. Almost all of the above survive only in fragments found in pot shards, scraps of papyrus used to wrap mummies and quotations by grammarians and others. Davenport puts brackets in the gaps where missing and illegible words were found. Some fragments consist of only one word: rhinoceros, nightingale, imposter, grape, plums, naked. It lends a poignancy to many of these ruins of once magnificent structures.

Among the poets represented I regret most those gaps with Archilochos and Sappho. Both of them despite the fragmentary nature of what survived come through as personalities and amazing poets--in what couldn't be a wider contrast. Archilochos was a mercenary with what Davenport calls a "nettle tongue;" there was a legend wasps hovered over his grave. I definitely can see the soldier here--often biting, crude, lewd, blunt. The most striking (and possibly complete) poem, Number 43 is comic and frankly erotic at once. Sappho is the great lyric poet of antiquity. Plato called her the "tenth muse." She's Archilochos opposite pole, vernal, refined--but like him at times frank in speaking of desire.

Both philosophers were standouts, despite that all that Davenport can provide are a couple of lines or short passages. Herakeitos, according to Karl Popper a forerunner of Plato, wrote on the theme of change. His sayings remind me of Ecclesiastes, or a Buddhist sage: One cannot step twice into the same river, for the water into which you first stepped has flowed on. And I loved, loved, loved Diogenes, who often made me smile madly with delight. What he said about, and to, such people as Plato and Alexander the Great! ("I've seen Plato's cups and table, but not his cupness and tableness.")

I wasn't impressed with the 7 complete and fragments of skits by Herondas, and the verse of Alkman and Anakreon didn't speak to me the way those of Archilochos and Sappho did. But this is definitely a book I consider a keeper.

[Howard Mansfield · Rating 5 out of 5]

Guy Davenport's translations are fresh. This is a book you'll keep returning to.

[Χρύσα Ράπτου · Rating 5 out of 5]

A careful selection of seven ancient Greek philosophers who shaped and influenced the history of poetry until today!

[nick · Rating 4 out of 5]

An eccentric grouping; who else would think to slot the bawdy mimes of Herondas next to the epithalamia of Sappho? But, then again, you could say that Archilochos sits right in between the two, with his terse, brilliant filth that sometimes reads like a premonition of Imagism. Speaking of Sappho, the translation here is worth comparing to the famous Carson one: where she builds a convincingly coherent tonality from the fragments, Davenport's version is less stable and apparently more transparent. They complement each other, and I appreciate his willingness to provide the reader with alternate translations. So although this isn't the most artfully arranged anthology, it's maybe all the better for it, a weird grab-bag book that will probably live on my shelves 'til I die.

[Pushpa Jhawar · Rating 4 out of 5]

This was a great collection of fragments of 7 Greek philosophers, poets.
I absolutely loved Diogenes, I so wish he were around today. He would have had a cult following. To be that brash to insult everyone from Plato to Alexander the Great! What a man!
Must read.

[Matt · Rating 5 out of 5]

Guy Davenport is a magus of literary scholarship, and this book is a gift to us all. I love the translations of Archilochos and Diogenes in particular.

[Kat · Rating 4 out of 5]

Worth it even if just for the introduction.

[Pranav Narayan · Rating 4 out of 5]

wish some of the fragmentation was more clearly demarcated

[Ibn Cereno · Rating 4 out of 5]

Very nice—I like that it's mix of genres and not just poetry.

[Graychin · Rating 4 out of 5]

With original texts lifted from still-legible mummy-wrappings and scraps of ancient scrolls, this book includes all existing known fragments and poems by Heraclitus, Diogenes, Archilochus, and Sappho, among others. The translations by Guy Davenport (author of Geography of the Imagination, etc.) are superb, as far as I can tell. Heraclitus and Diogenes are the best part of the volume. Some of the scraps are unintelligible for lack of context, but there’s enough to promise almost infinite fascination. If only some patient archaeologist would dig up a complete and fully-preserved collection of Heraclitus. Alas.

I had been hunting for a copy of this book for ages. Davenport is a minor hero of mine so it was a real treat to discover that this yellowing, dog-eared copy included an old signature slip from a New York bookshop with Davenport’s signature on it.

[Erik · Rating 4 out of 5]

Translations of ancient Greek poetry. Much of it is from fragments that are sometimes not much more than a single line (Or even a single word!) but Davenport gives a straight-forward translation - - especially interesting is his unexpurgated translation of Archelochus, which is primarily military-related poetry. You can see why Archilochus is credited as being the originator of "satire" in verse.

[Kyle Muntz · Rating 5 out of 5]

These translations from Guy Davenport are easily the most beautiful poetry I've read in years. The most interesting thing is that all of them feel utterly contemporary, despite being more than 2000 years old--it has to be read to be believed.

[Jacob · Rating 5 out of 5]

Herakleitos: "Lightning is the lord of everything."