Mary: A Catholic-Evangelical Debate

by Dwight Longenecker, Richard John Neuhaus (Foreword), J.I. Packer (Foreword)

What happens when an Evangelical and a Catholic get into a discussion about Mary? Believe it or not-something wonderful. We invite you to eavesdrop on Dwight Longenecker and David Gustafson in Mary: A Catholic-Evangelical Debate. This engaging exchange between two laymen tackles the most controversial doctrines and practices surrounding Mary. The conversation, while expertly researched and rigorously argued, is witty and accessible. It is a fine model of the honesty and humble reflection required for successful communication between evangelicals and non-evangelical believers. Ultimately, we might find that to better understand Mary is to better understand our incarnate Lord. Mary features questions at the end of each chapter for study, discussion and reflection, as well as a useful bibliography for further reading on the topic. Forewords by J. I. Packer and Richard John Neuhaus are included.

Genres: Theology, Catholic, Nonfiction

240 pages, Paperback

First published August 1, 2003

About the author

Dwight Longenecker was brought up an Evangelical, studied at the fundamentalist Bob Jones University, and later was ordained an Anglican priest in England. After ten years in the Anglican ministry as a curate, a chaplain at Cambridge, and a country parson, in 1995 Dwight was received into full communion with the Catholic Church. He has published in numerous religious magazines and papers in the UK, Ireland, and the USA, writing on film and theology, apologetics, Biblical commentary and Catholic culture.

Reviews

[Steven H · Rating 5 out of 5]

A CATHOLIC CONVERT AND AN EVANGELICAL DISCUSS MARIAN DEVOTIONS AND DOCTRINES

Dwight Longenecker was brought up as an evangelical (attending Bob Jones University, and later becoming an Anglican priest), but converted to Catholicism; he works as a freelance writer and broadcaster. He also previously participated in 'Challenging Catholics: A Catholic Evangelical Dialogue.' David Gustafson is an assistant chief in the U.S. Department of Justice.

DL says in the Introduction to this 2003 book, "I hope to show in these discussions what a joy it is to include Mary in the whole range of out love for the Lord. I want to show how ancient and universal the Marian devotions and doctrines are..." DG replies, "I resolve to listen. And ... when it's my turn to speak, I hope not to just assert a negative---a minimizing view of Mary---but to hold up a positive idea of undistracted devotion to our Lord." (Pg. 20)

DG points out, "The Gospels do not show Jesus creating for Mary a place of attention for special honor. They do not record him commending Mary to his followers, promoting her intercession, or holding her up as of continued importance to them (or even to him). He seems, in fact, to have done the opposite." (Pg. 24)

DL says, "It is true that Saint Paul says very little about Mary, but then have you considered that he actually says very little about Jesus as well? He writes to the churches but barely mentions the actual events of the Gospels. Instead he assumes that his hearers know the basic gospel facts." (Pg. 27)

DG states, "I admit that from the fifth century on, my view is all but unheard of until after the Reformation. Your position would have more persuasive force for me, though, if the Church's dogma stopped where that consensus ended---i.e., at Mary's sinlessness. But the Catholic Church has defined as dogma a refinement of doctrine that some of the Church's own heroes resisted; this aggressiveness shows that this doctrinal development is regulated not by what is ancient and apostolic, but by something else---a Marian fascination that is hard to understand because it is so alien to my own spirituality." (Pg. 110)

DL says, "To simply dismiss the apocryphal writings as fantastic fables and then to dismiss the Christians of the fourth and fifth century for believing them is too simplistic. Remember, this is a time when there was still some uncertainty about the New Testament canon. The apocryphal writings were in circulation with many other Christian writings, and most of them claimed apostolic authorship... This is not to denigrate the books of the New Testament... It is simply to make the point that in the fourth and fifth century it was quite easy to believe that the apocryphal accounts of the Assumption were more solid than we now know them to be." (Pg. 122-123)

He also admits, "you should remember that the rosary is not the only prayer Catholics use. It is one part of a vast treasury of prayer and worship. I should also point out that the rosary is not required for Catholics. Many Catholics don't find it a helpful form of prayer at all." (Pg. 177)

This is a very interesting dialogue, that will be of considerable value to anyone studying Catholic/Protestant dialogue.

[Chaffee Viets · Rating 4 out of 5]

Really enjoyed this book. As a former Evangelical who still has some reservations about Catholic (and Orthodox) views of Mary, I found the discussion quite engaging. Devotees of the Blessed Virgin might find this book hard to read, as it will convey as alien if you are a cradle Catholic or originally Orthodox Christian. While it will help you understand Evangelical and Protestant views, it will feel like your own mother is being attacked. If you can try not to be offended, you'll find this book enlightening.

For Evangelicals, the greater value will be in seeing that honoring Mary and several doctrines and practices about Mary have not been invented in modern times, but go back to the earliest centuries of the Church. Furthermore, false ideas like that Catholics and Orthodox worship Mary or see her as a goddess or equal to God will be exposed. Mary is always one who points others to Christ, and when she does not, it is because individual devotees get confused and misled.

Again, I highly recommend this book. I also encourage reading one chapter at a time and then digesting and discussing with a friend. Reading the entire book at once, especially if you are new to discussions about the Blessed Mother/Mary will be overwhelming otherwise.

[Patricia Mckenna · Rating 5 out of 5]

Having been raised Protestant and converted to Catholicism, I was curious about the topic in debate about Mary. I dove into this debate discussion in an effort to deepen my devotion to Mary. I am very much for Christian unity and I know it is important to have a polite dialogue. Marian theology has always been a point of contention for our Evangelical brothers and sisters about the Catholic Faith.
The debate is between two friends that went to Bob Jones University and then one became a married minister in the Church of England who converted to be a Catholic Priest and the other is an Evangelical lawyer with the Justice department of the government. The debate covers Catholic doctrine on Mary such as Mary’s perpetual virginity, Immaculate Conception, and Assumption. Prayers such as the Rosary and titles such as Co-redeemer and God’s mother are also discussed.
This book has strengthened my faith and devotion to Mary. It will also help me to be able to evangelize and speak up for my faith and for Mary in a polite, intelligent way. I definitely recommend this book for all Christians to be able to take a more critical intellectual, reasoned approach to how Mary always leads us to her son Jesus.

[Jefferson · Rating 2 out of 5]

This book could have been so much better.

Out of the two interlocutors, David tends to make careful moderate statements and asks intelligent questions without getting his dander up. I do not think he takes offense a single time. He is substantially more open to Marian devotion than is normal for an Anglican Evangelical.

Unfortunately, Dwight repeatedly discounts David's participation by constant appeals to Papal authority (not recognized by David), by suggesting that those who disagree with his position are not genuine in their concern, and by refusing to mount a substantive defense and railing to the attack.

Perhaps these tactics work in courts of law or impressing friends at the bar. With only one side mounting a mature and considered view, this dialogue becomes a tedious and tendentious exercise. Reading two introductory books from both sides would work better for an interested explorer of "a Catholic-Evangelical debate" on St. Mary.

[Billy Wint · Rating 4 out of 5]

It's a very good read, as an "evangelical Catholic" in the Anglican Church I have a somewhat more accepting view of Marian devotion than some other evangelicals would. I started the book with the Immaculate conception of Mary being the one thing that I cannot reconcile with and I'm finishing the book even more convinced that Rome is misguided in that doctrine. However, I now have an even better understanding and more conciliatory view of some of the other Marian dogmas. It's a well written book and was a joy to read.

[Mark · Rating 3 out of 5]

Very informative and well researched. Lots of depth in Catholic devotion to Mary and comparable Protestant criticism, but I felt it was too heady and not enough heart for me. The constant back-and-forthness of the discussion wore on too long. But again, that was the intented structure of the dialog.

[Kristine · Rating 4 out of 5]

This is an honest debate between an Evangelical Christian and a former Evangelical turned Catholic about the importance Mary plays in the Catholic Church.