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Quag Keep (Greyhawk) #2
Return to Quag Keep
They were role-playing gamers from different places and backgrounds. Summoned together by an unknown magical force, they found themselves swept into the heart of the very game that they were playing. Thirty years ago Andre Norton wrote the first novel based in the now-bestselling Dungeons & Dragons universe. In Return to Quag Keep, her intrepid adventures must once again band together to unlock the secret of their summoning. They must revisit the legendary Quag Keep to rescue someone who may be able, in turn, rescue them. They could be returned safely home… But even having the strength of a mighty warrior of the craft of a cunning thief may not be enough to save them. There are dark forces plotting their deaths, and not everyone seems to be playing by the rules.
305 pages, Kindle Edition
First published January 10, 2006
23 people are currently reading
218 people want to read
About the author
Andre Norton
690 books1,371 followersAndre Norton, born Alice Mary Norton, was a pioneering American author of science fiction and fantasy, widely regarded as the Grande Dame of those genres. She also wrote historical and contemporary fiction, publishing under the pen names Andre Alice Norton, Andrew North, and Allen Weston. She launched her career in 1934 with The Prince Commands, adopting the name “Andre” to appeal to a male readership. After working for the Cleveland Library System and the Library of Congress, she began publishing science fiction under “Andrew North” and fantasy under her own name. She became a full-time writer in 1958 and was known for her prolific output, including Star Man’s Son, 2250 A.D. and Witch World, the latter spawning a long-running series and shared universe. Norton was a founding member of the Swordsmen and Sorcerers' Guild of America and authored Quag Keep, the first novel based on the Dungeons & Dragons game. She influenced generations of writers, including Lois McMaster Bujold and Mercedes Lackey. Among her many honors were being the first woman named Gandalf Grand Master of Fantasy and SFWA Grand Master. In her later years, she established the High Hallack Library to support research in genre fiction. Her legacy continues with the Andre Norton Award for young adult science fiction and fantasy.
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Displaying 1 - 22 of 22 reviews
October 5, 2008
Talk about a sequel that completely trashes the original. Author (co-author technically I suppose) obviously a gaming person. I can't remember, is it two or three chapters into the story before she starts offing the main characters? It reads like a D&D campaign run by a malicious older brother intent on discouraging his younger siblings and therefore taking delight in how many he can cut down (only fighters will live!!!) and how quickly.
I loved Quag Keep. It had Norton's trademark alien tone. The details were not explained, but then, life very rarely explains itself either. She'd crafted this mismatched group and created a goal that only all of them together could achieve. It was the group dynamics as much as the plot that mattered.
This piece of trash would have been merely uninteresting if it hadn't tried to follow. So disappointing.
I miss Andre's writing of course, but I don't mind that she got tired and more interested in other things. I just wish that any of the people she trusted to hand stories off too had an individual flavor instead of all feeling shallow and ... how to put it... bland?
I loved Quag Keep. It had Norton's trademark alien tone. The details were not explained, but then, life very rarely explains itself either. She'd crafted this mismatched group and created a goal that only all of them together could achieve. It was the group dynamics as much as the plot that mattered.
This piece of trash would have been merely uninteresting if it hadn't tried to follow. So disappointing.
I miss Andre's writing of course, but I don't mind that she got tired and more interested in other things. I just wish that any of the people she trusted to hand stories off too had an individual flavor instead of all feeling shallow and ... how to put it... bland?
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
October 9, 2017
I remember being very excited, 30 years ago or so, when I learned that there was a novel based on the "really, really cool" game my friends and I were playing every weekend. Even at the tender age of 11, I had been reading Andre Norton for a couple of years and liked her work. Quag Keep was a good example of Norton creating a suitably exotic locale and likable characters who were not entirely cut from the same cloth. (Though I still haven't a clue as to how one pronounces "Ingrge".) And, yes, the ending was frustrating since she never wrote the obviously necessary sequel.
Until now...the quondam Ms. Norton's habit of co-authoring novels in her later years was always a hit-or-miss proposition, and this time it missed. First off, if Jean Rabe is going to write a sequel to Ms. Norton's book she should make sure she's done some research and gets the characters' names right -- the pseudo-dragon's name is "Afreeta" not "Alfreeta" (which sounds like some faux Italian pasta dish). Even a cursory reading of the first novel makes that clear.
There's also no context and, with the exception of the 7 original characters and Quag Keep, almost no reference to the first book. The story begins in a nameless city where the group is hard up for cash, meanders through nameless (and geographically confusing) countryside (whatever happened to the Sea of Dust which surrounds QK?, for example), suffers some rather arbitrary plot devices to get the characters back together after they have been separated, and then ends up with a lackluster ending. And I was disturbed by the callous death and dismemberment of several of the characters. I'll refrain (though just) from spoiling things entirely but one character gets "offed" in the first few chapters; and another has his arm sliced off. Now, don't get me wrong, I've read (and enjoyed) novels where fairly important characters die, sometimes even arbitrarily, but the original QK was a young-adult novel and its "atmosphere" was not a serious theme but an adventure story -- the heroes aren't supposed to die or, if they do, it's for a fine, suitably epic cause (Boromir's death in LOTR comes to mind). Perhaps I'm getting old, but if this is what passes for young-adult fantasy nowadays, let me return to the old stuff like Norton's own original Witch World novels or her Solar Queen stuff.
Finally, the villains in this piece just don't measure up. I was hoping to find out who was behind the mysterious and sinister QK Productions. Were they Earth men who had discovered how to pass between worlds? Were they natives of the game characters' world? Were they from both? What was their purpose? And whatever happened to the master dice and the gamemaster's notes that Milo and the others captured at the end of the first novel? Instead, we have a stereotypically black-cloaked villain named Fisk and his master, the distilled quintessence of the evil Ids of the sorcerors who built QK (shades of Forbidden Planet), Pobe.
Pobe?...Pobe? How is this pronounced? Like "Job" from the Bible, or are both syllables pronounced so it's like "Po-bay"? Either way, it doesn't inspire much in the way of fear. Where's the menace inherent in names like Sauron or Morgoth or Lord Foul the Despiser? "Pobe" is the facial cream my girlfriend uses.
Read the original Quag Keep and, if you like it, read Norton's older fantasy like the Witch World (before she began farming it out to other authors). And if you want more adult-oriented fantasy, try authors like Robert Jordan, George Martin, Glen Cook, or Steven Erikson. I am not looking forward to anymore QK sequels from Ms. Rabe's pen, I'm sad to say.
Until now...the quondam Ms. Norton's habit of co-authoring novels in her later years was always a hit-or-miss proposition, and this time it missed. First off, if Jean Rabe is going to write a sequel to Ms. Norton's book she should make sure she's done some research and gets the characters' names right -- the pseudo-dragon's name is "Afreeta" not "Alfreeta" (which sounds like some faux Italian pasta dish). Even a cursory reading of the first novel makes that clear.
There's also no context and, with the exception of the 7 original characters and Quag Keep, almost no reference to the first book. The story begins in a nameless city where the group is hard up for cash, meanders through nameless (and geographically confusing) countryside (whatever happened to the Sea of Dust which surrounds QK?, for example), suffers some rather arbitrary plot devices to get the characters back together after they have been separated, and then ends up with a lackluster ending. And I was disturbed by the callous death and dismemberment of several of the characters. I'll refrain (though just) from spoiling things entirely but one character gets "offed" in the first few chapters; and another has his arm sliced off. Now, don't get me wrong, I've read (and enjoyed) novels where fairly important characters die, sometimes even arbitrarily, but the original QK was a young-adult novel and its "atmosphere" was not a serious theme but an adventure story -- the heroes aren't supposed to die or, if they do, it's for a fine, suitably epic cause (Boromir's death in LOTR comes to mind). Perhaps I'm getting old, but if this is what passes for young-adult fantasy nowadays, let me return to the old stuff like Norton's own original Witch World novels or her Solar Queen stuff.
Finally, the villains in this piece just don't measure up. I was hoping to find out who was behind the mysterious and sinister QK Productions. Were they Earth men who had discovered how to pass between worlds? Were they natives of the game characters' world? Were they from both? What was their purpose? And whatever happened to the master dice and the gamemaster's notes that Milo and the others captured at the end of the first novel? Instead, we have a stereotypically black-cloaked villain named Fisk and his master, the distilled quintessence of the evil Ids of the sorcerors who built QK (shades of Forbidden Planet), Pobe.
Pobe?...Pobe? How is this pronounced? Like "Job" from the Bible, or are both syllables pronounced so it's like "Po-bay"? Either way, it doesn't inspire much in the way of fear. Where's the menace inherent in names like Sauron or Morgoth or Lord Foul the Despiser? "Pobe" is the facial cream my girlfriend uses.
Read the original Quag Keep and, if you like it, read Norton's older fantasy like the Witch World (before she began farming it out to other authors). And if you want more adult-oriented fantasy, try authors like Robert Jordan, George Martin, Glen Cook, or Steven Erikson. I am not looking forward to anymore QK sequels from Ms. Rabe's pen, I'm sad to say.
April 23, 2008
I WISH IT WAS POSSIBLE TO GIVE NEGATIVE STARS. THIS BOOK IS A NEGATIVE ONE.
It may have Andre Norton's name on top, but except for the characters and their names, nothing much about this book seems related to the original Quag Keep. That book was mysterious. Why were the players transported to another world? Who did it, what did it mean? Could they ever get home...and if they could, would they want to? In this book it all comes down to Billy Joel songs and then the space ship landing and the leprechauns come out and dance a jig and it's all hideous and embarrassing. I read less than half the book and wanted to spit on it and run it over with my car.
This reminds me of the novelizations of movies that are based on books. "Based on the movie that was based on the book." You start out with Shakespeare and wind up with a sweet little story of a couple of young kids whose families don't want them to date. And all ends happily ever after.
Another comparison: Starting with the French film La Femme Nikita and ending with the unbelievably bad Bridget Fonda version.
Ms. Rabe, whoever you are, shame on you.
It may have Andre Norton's name on top, but except for the characters and their names, nothing much about this book seems related to the original Quag Keep. That book was mysterious. Why were the players transported to another world? Who did it, what did it mean? Could they ever get home...and if they could, would they want to? In this book it all comes down to Billy Joel songs and then the space ship landing and the leprechauns come out and dance a jig and it's all hideous and embarrassing. I read less than half the book and wanted to spit on it and run it over with my car.
This reminds me of the novelizations of movies that are based on books. "Based on the movie that was based on the book." You start out with Shakespeare and wind up with a sweet little story of a couple of young kids whose families don't want them to date. And all ends happily ever after.
Another comparison: Starting with the French film La Femme Nikita and ending with the unbelievably bad Bridget Fonda version.
Ms. Rabe, whoever you are, shame on you.
July 4, 2012
This is the worst book I have ever read. It deserves negative five stars. Terrible writing, a plot that makes no sense and relies on coincidences and deus ex machinas, interchangeable characters, and no connection whatsoever to the original book except the names (some of which Jean Rabe got wrong; how hard is it to flip through the first book to check something so simple?). I doubt very much that Andre Norton had anything to do with the book's writing except signing a contract; she was at the end of her life when this book was written. Terrible, terrible book. Terrible book.
October 5, 2015
I'm sorry I can't give this book a negative rating.
That said, I was curious to read the sequel to the original. I wanted answers to the questions that were left hanging at the end of the original and I wanted to see what happened next and if the characters made it back home again. What I got was worse than what I had been left with.
The novel feels more like a rough draft of possible concepts that had been stitched together by someone else entirely to make a completely bad story. Upon further review, I discover that this book was published the year after Andre Norton, the first listed author, died. Thus the second listed author obviously must have finished the book based on the previous work of Ms. Norton.
Unfortunately for the reader, the second listed author is Jean Rabe. Ms. Rabe writes works within the same genres as Ms. Norton did, and has done some above average work with some of it. Unfortunately her efforts here give me the feeling that she was paid a flat fee to finish this work as quickly as possible, so she made the minimal effort and collected her pay, leaving us with a barren conglomeration of what in places is good prose melded with horrible transitions and filler. The movie version of Dr. Frankenstein did a much better job knitting together the movie Frankenstein monster, and like that monster this beast of a book lumbers awkwardly through the pages until it is met with torches and pitchforks at its end. Some questions are answered dismissively or forgotten, certain semi-important aspects of the story are completely ignored for brevity's sake, and when one reaches the end of this novel the urge to throw the book is overwhelming.
Don't buy, don't read, because you likely won't enjoy.
That said, I was curious to read the sequel to the original. I wanted answers to the questions that were left hanging at the end of the original and I wanted to see what happened next and if the characters made it back home again. What I got was worse than what I had been left with.
The novel feels more like a rough draft of possible concepts that had been stitched together by someone else entirely to make a completely bad story. Upon further review, I discover that this book was published the year after Andre Norton, the first listed author, died. Thus the second listed author obviously must have finished the book based on the previous work of Ms. Norton.
Unfortunately for the reader, the second listed author is Jean Rabe. Ms. Rabe writes works within the same genres as Ms. Norton did, and has done some above average work with some of it. Unfortunately her efforts here give me the feeling that she was paid a flat fee to finish this work as quickly as possible, so she made the minimal effort and collected her pay, leaving us with a barren conglomeration of what in places is good prose melded with horrible transitions and filler. The movie version of Dr. Frankenstein did a much better job knitting together the movie Frankenstein monster, and like that monster this beast of a book lumbers awkwardly through the pages until it is met with torches and pitchforks at its end. Some questions are answered dismissively or forgotten, certain semi-important aspects of the story are completely ignored for brevity's sake, and when one reaches the end of this novel the urge to throw the book is overwhelming.
Don't buy, don't read, because you likely won't enjoy.
May 29, 2023
This book is frustrating. Like Quag Keep before it, the premise of D&D players being pulled into a 'real' D&D world and having to find their way home isn't a particularly new idea (for Quag Keep in published in 1978 this actually was a new idea but reading them in 2022-2023 kind of takes away from the magic). Both books execute on the mystery of their transportation, the way they adapt to the world, how they adjust to their new lives and how they learn how to 'play their character' in a very well written way. What makes both of these books frustrating, Return even more so than the original, is that their isn't any real payoff at the end of the book. At the end of Original the heroes defeat the villain but nothing happens....they don't return home, they don't really get anything other than the quest is over. In Return, its more of the same. Characters from the original book meet others pulled from their world and return to Quag Keep to defeat a new BBEG. Again the evil plot is foiled, but again the heroes don't really realize their goal and the book just ends flat.
If I could split my rating, it would be a 4 for the first 28 chapters of the book which contain an engaging story split amongst several different party members and a 1 for the last chapter and epilogue which doesn't reveal anything and reads as if it was written the night before the book was due.
If I could split my rating, it would be a 4 for the first 28 chapters of the book which contain an engaging story split amongst several different party members and a 1 for the last chapter and epilogue which doesn't reveal anything and reads as if it was written the night before the book was due.
February 6, 2016
This was a lackluster turd written by someone who must not have read the original. Many things differ from the original and it reads almost like Jean Rabe wrote her own interpretation not a direct sequel. Sad that I spent money on it. Sad I took time to read it. Mostly sad that it had one of my favorite author's names on it: Andre Norton. Much like her later Witch World books, this book doesn't seem like it was written with her at all; putting her name on something to make a quick sale. Shameful.
April 13, 2010
OK, fantasy role-playing games are fun. Books about people who play role-playing games are interesting. Fictional books about people playing role-playing games and being dragged into the game are stupid. Especially when there is no closure for the characters. Will the poor earthlings ever make it back from Aerth [sic:]? Honestly, the only reason I read this was to find out the answer to that question. The answer is a definite maybe but not this time...Blegh!
August 5, 2011
This is the sequel to the first novel based on the Dungeons and Dragons game. Unfortunately it is also one of the worst.The authors tried to include gaming aspects which ruined the story. If you want a piece of D&D history, add it to your collection,but if you want to read a D&D story go with one of the later novels.
July 27, 2011
It has nostalgic value and it wants to be so much more than it is, so I wish I could love it, alas...
October 9, 2017
An unusual sequel to an unusual book . . .
So, a little history: Andre Norton's books helped inspire D&D (on Gygax's "Appendix N" list), she met Gygax and played in a game set in Greyhawk, she wrote "Quag Keep" based on the game she helped inspire (it was not her best work). Andre Norton certainly left the book open for a sequel back in the 70s, and apparently had one in mind for a while, but never really got to it. She had begun something when she passed away in 2005, and Jean Rabe (a long-time member of the D&D community) finished the novel. It is probably a better book than the original "Quag Keep," but not a very good sequel - the geography of the story seems to have changed, the pseudodragon's name changed from Afreeta to Alfreeta with no explanation, and it just seemed like an odd attempt at continuity. Also, there is simply some weirdness here (is it D&D or not? In this book, so much is "not like the game"), the villain seems to be ripped off from a Star Trek: The Next Generation episode . . . so many problems. It is not, in and of itself, a terrible book, but it fails at being a sequel to the first book!
So, a little history: Andre Norton's books helped inspire D&D (on Gygax's "Appendix N" list), she met Gygax and played in a game set in Greyhawk, she wrote "Quag Keep" based on the game she helped inspire (it was not her best work). Andre Norton certainly left the book open for a sequel back in the 70s, and apparently had one in mind for a while, but never really got to it. She had begun something when she passed away in 2005, and Jean Rabe (a long-time member of the D&D community) finished the novel. It is probably a better book than the original "Quag Keep," but not a very good sequel - the geography of the story seems to have changed, the pseudodragon's name changed from Afreeta to Alfreeta with no explanation, and it just seemed like an odd attempt at continuity. Also, there is simply some weirdness here (is it D&D or not? In this book, so much is "not like the game"), the villain seems to be ripped off from a Star Trek: The Next Generation episode . . . so many problems. It is not, in and of itself, a terrible book, but it fails at being a sequel to the first book!
April 20, 2018
First incorrect word usage was on page 10--"tact" rather than "tack."
"Desert" rather than dessert.
Tone and language are jarringly different for a book that's supposed to have the same characters and setting.
Characters suddenly remember intricate details of their real-world selves, when before they could barely remember that they *had* past selves.
Characters who left Earth in 1979 suddenly remember things like Red Hot Chili Peppers, CDs, and the 1980 US release of Mad Max. Maybe the original 1979 book took place in in its own future, but nothing has actually suggested this.
Ends abruptly when characters return to the real world after completing a vague quest and defeating an enemy or enemies whose motivation(s) are extremely unclear.
"Desert" rather than dessert.
Tone and language are jarringly different for a book that's supposed to have the same characters and setting.
Characters suddenly remember intricate details of their real-world selves, when before they could barely remember that they *had* past selves.
Characters who left Earth in 1979 suddenly remember things like Red Hot Chili Peppers, CDs, and the 1980 US release of Mad Max. Maybe the original 1979 book took place in in its own future, but nothing has actually suggested this.
Ends abruptly when characters return to the real world after completing a vague quest and defeating an enemy or enemies whose motivation(s) are extremely unclear.
June 8, 2023
What can I say that hasn't already been said in the other reviews?
Disappointing; continuity errors abound; plot lines from the first book left unanswered, plot lines from the sequel unanswered, characters forgotten... and one of the most unsatisfying endings to a book I've ever read.
There needs to be a third book (but NOT written by Jean Rabe) just to wrap up all the stuff left hanging. It was really infuriating.
Disappointing; continuity errors abound; plot lines from the first book left unanswered, plot lines from the sequel unanswered, characters forgotten... and one of the most unsatisfying endings to a book I've ever read.
There needs to be a third book (but NOT written by Jean Rabe) just to wrap up all the stuff left hanging. It was really infuriating.
December 5, 2012
Yes I have 2 versions of this book. Together I was very disappointed, although others enjoyed it.
January 25, 2011
A sequel with none of the charm of the original, a directionless plot, and when felt like a deliberate mission to destroy the characters.
January 28, 2018
Not as good as I was expecting. It was fairly standard fantasy fare. =)
November 23, 2022
Solid D&D fare. This one is a tad odd. It does have great encounters, clichee characters and lots of nice depictions of locales and such. The weird meta-plot (which might have been the best way to go about LitRPG at that time) feels forced. Some people have criticised the huge amount of typos etc. and anachronism - granted, that is unusual in this day and age, but does not really matter to me. To me, the last two chapters were a real let down and diminished my rating to three stars. An endless description of caves and dungeons and very anti-climatic ending. Still, I enjoyed it, but I am D&D and classic fantasy fanboy, so dont take my word for it.
August 19, 2025
My rating is a result of the appreciation I have for what Quag Keep began for D&D novels.
My first issue is that there is a single female character in this novel, and every party member thirsts after her. It's insulting in a space that's already male dominated (TTRPGs).
Second is that this clearly was intended to have at least a third entry. The epilogue isn't satisfying in the slightest.
My first issue is that there is a single female character in this novel, and every party member thirsts after her. It's insulting in a space that's already male dominated (TTRPGs).
Second is that this clearly was intended to have at least a third entry. The epilogue isn't satisfying in the slightest.
May 9, 2020
“Better than the first because the bard dies.”-Geralt of Rivia
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
June 21, 2025
2.5. Feeble and hurriedly written but likeable for the vast amount of irony. The thief was amusing. For passing an hour...
March 10, 2019
I'm not sure what to think about this book. Yes, it keeps to the D&D premise, but I'm not sure I liked the ending. On the plus side, the ending leaves room for another sequel, but with Andre gone, I doubt that's going to happen. Overall, I liked the book.
May 18, 2015
I absolutely enjoyed this book. I was a huge fan of the first book and the second, written with Jean Rabe, was a blast to read.
Displaying 1 - 22 of 22 reviews