Beyond The Phoenix Project: The Origins and Evolution Of DevOps

by Gene Kim, John Willis

This is a companion transcript of the audio series, Beyond The Phoenix Project, intended to be used for reference and to enable further research of cited material, and not as a standalone work.

In the audio series, Gene Kim and John Willis present a nine-part discussion that includes an oral history of the DevOps movement, as well as discussions around pivotal figures and philosophies that DevOps draws upon, from Goldratt to Deming; from Lean to Safety Culture to Learning Organizations.The book is a great way for listeners to take an even deeper dive into topics relevant to DevOps and leading technology organizations.

Genres: Business, Technology, Audiobook, Leadership, Nonfiction, Software, Management

255 pages, Kindle Edition

Published February 27, 2018

About the author

Gene Kim is a multiple award-winning CTO, Tripwire founder, Visible Ops co-author, IT Ops/Security Researcher, Theory of Constraints Jonah, a certified IS auditor and a rabid UX fan.

He is passionate about IT operations, security and compliance, and how IT organizations successfully transform from "good to great."

Reviews

[Romans · Rating 4 out of 5]

It’s not really a book, it’s a conversation. Revisiting some of the Phoenix Project’s concepts, its roots and context. They talk about Goldratt and Deming, DevOps, Lean, Toyota.
I would recommend to anyone who enjoyed the original book, but I wouldn’t to anyone who didn’t. It doesn’t give new information, more like additional perspectives and application of all the main ideas behind the Goal and the Phoenix Project.

[Sven Kirsimäe · Rating 5 out of 5]

A lot of new is nothing more than rediscovered old. The source matters.

[Przemek · Rating 2 out of 5]

I loved 'The Goal', 'The Phoenix Project' was great but this one... not so much. If you're interested in the history of the DevOps movement you'll like it. Lots of Dr. X, Dr. Y, friends working at some mostly lesser-known companies, VP of that, Director of something else. It's basically a conversation of 2 interesting people that is way too long and not really a book. Better to treat it as a long podcast.

[Jack Vinson · Rating 4 out of 5]

What does one do after writing a foundational book that launches a movement - a book largely based on Eli Goldratt's _The Goal_. Clearly, one reflects on what has happened since, much like Goldratt did in _Beyond the Goal_. The DevOps community has blossomed in the ~five years since the publication of the book. And this conversation (in book form) highlights many of the references and sources that have been important in the DevOps community. Now I have more to read...

Note: The book is a transcription of a series of live conversations between Gene Kim and John Willis. The transcription isn't perfect, and I suspect the audio might be a better way to absorb the things they discuss. But then, it's harder to take notes.

[Chris Esposo · Rating 3 out of 5]

For those who have read the Phoenix Project, this is a good, but not necessary accompanying text to the main "story". The format is basically a series of podcast-like conversations between the two authors Gene Kim, and John Willis, as they discuss the history of the DevOps movement, from Eliyahu Goldratt writing of "The Goal" series of books, where he elucidates his "Theory of Constrains" in story-form, to Edward Deming, who worked on production-quality control and had a big hand in pioneering TQM in his late life.

The historical tour is fascinating. Though, sometimes one get's the feeling the authors are speaking above their knowledge, as is particular the case when John Willis gives a narrative on how the scientific zeitgeist of the late 19th and early 20th century, specifically the works of quantum mechanics, led to revolutionary applications of statistics towards process-systems, like factories seemed confusing to me. For one, a factory system can be characterized as a continuous process flow, yet isn't the discretization of nature the key insights on quantum mechanics?

With respect to mathematical theme from the late 19th century/early 20th that impacted notions like TQM/Lean/6-Sigma/DevOps etc., I'd imagine the works on Poincare and the notions of nonlinear systems to be a more appropriate attribution as the origin of it all. Especially since the work on simulations and cybernetics stems directly from those ideas, and Deming/Wiener were contemporaries that both drew heavily from simulations approaches to systems.

Besides this one little issue, the overall discussions on history and current applications, and use-cases, especially on the enterprise-level, like Target's application of DevOps to be interesting. I listened to it easily while driving, and it's definitely worth the asking price for entrance (of 8 - 10 USD). Recommended.

[Daniel · Rating 4 out of 5]

This is an IT focused book. Skip if you’re not in that industry.

Great overview of the culture and history of ideas that led to Devops. From Darwin to Devops.

Didn’t realize that Darwin was important to the move away from deterministic thinking. Simple cause and effect to complex systems. Taylor vs Darwin. And IT systems are complex and thus non-deterministic and should not be managed a la Taylor.

It’s obvious that the Phoenix project comes from the goal by goldratt. It was the link from Goldratt back to Deming that I was missing. I really need to read out of crisis by deming.

There are a number of follow up book recommendations from both co authors that I found useful.

[Vėjas Galvoje · Rating 5 out of 5]

Jei skaitei “The Phoenix project” ir jis tau patiko, tai šią knygą tau reikia būtinai paskaityti. Ar kas nors žinot kiek Google kiekvieną dieną automatinių testų leidžia savo sistemose? Ar žinai kaip AWS ankstyvoje jaunystėje darė stress testus? Jei nori pagaliau sužinoti kas gi iš tikro tas DevOps ir su kuo jis valgomas, tikrai skaityk šią knygą 🙂 Aš jau perskaičiau ir einu toliau gilintis į automatizavimą, kai atsibos pasakysiu 🙂

[Pablo · Rating 1 out of 5]

I'm confused... is this a book? ohhh... transcript... the book is a transcript. I'm so glad I listened to the audiobook then, because reading what I listened to would have been a pain. Listening to it was entertaining, but I don't think I derived any value from it.

Well... I had yet more cases of "Oh... yes... now that you mention it, that's another thing my company is doing wrong and it's impossible to fix, oh well..." like the psychological safety of safety culture.

[Joe Peichel · Rating 3 out of 5]

The book is chock full of insightful and enlightening dialog, as well as exceptional citations of related works. The approach used by the authors, using speech-to-text transcription to capture the majority of the content, often makes reading difficult (hence 3-stars rather than 5). That said, I recommend the work to anyone exploring DevOps fundamentals and historical roots, as this work brings it all together.

[Christian Dalager · Rating 5 out of 5]

Overraskende godt. Forventede "en meget lang podcast", men det fik jeg ikke. Det virker meget forberedt og gennemresearchet og minder mere om en samling forelæsninger af to personer der har været med i DevOps bevægelsen fra starten. Også en god teoretisk dybde og en *masse* henvisninger til bøger man kan læse.

[Tjen Wellens · Rating 5 out of 5]

So many references to other works. It's insane...

And it helps with a perspective on how devops came to be.
Especially when reading these first:
The Bottleneck rules
Rolling Rocks downhill
The Phoenix Project
The Goal
Beyond The Goal

[Luis Cabanillas · Rating 4 out of 5]

Good overview of what The Phoenix Project and The DevOps Handbook talked about. In order to get the most of this I think you'll need to read both of those books, otherwise it will be just a bunch of blind references that you'll need to go read about later.

[Louis · Rating 3 out of 5]

Content is great to dive deeper after the excellent phoenix project. I'm not sure I liked the podcast format that much. It made it harder for me to follow and I paused for 4 months before finishing it

[Jan Ryswyck · Rating 4 out of 5]

Great follow-up on the Phoenix Project.

[Jowanza Joseph · Rating 4 out of 5]

An excellent listen. The authors do a great job of walking through the origins and evolution of the industry. They also do a great job of connecting the industry to other slightly related ones.

[Mircea Nistor · Rating 5 out of 5]

I assume that it's nice to read. I listened to the recordings. It's nice to hear the voices and feel the emotion.

[Jeff Dalton · Rating 5 out of 5]

Great discussion into the principles that forged The Phoenix Project. This is one of those rare works that will require multiple passes because there is so much great information.

[Sajjad Paracha · Rating 3 out of 5]

Not good , i had high hopes after reading their first book .

[Dave Boucher · Rating 2 out of 5]

Interesting. Not nearly as valuable as The Phoenix Project itself, but there are some good references to other resources in here.

[Jeremy Morgan · Rating 5 out of 5]

Great conversational style, the audiobook is excellent. Amazing how much you can pick up just from small points they drop or bodies of work mentioned.

[Daniel Hollands · Rating 2 out of 5]

It started off interesting, but mostly faded away.

[Frank · Rating 4 out of 5]

Liked hearing about all the reference material that went into The Phoenix Project.

[Jayant Parida · Rating 3 out of 5]

It could be a lecture instead of a book.

[Piet van Dongen · Rating 5 out of 5]

Very insightful for those who want to study DevOps and its history and relations.

[Daniel Noventa · Rating 5 out of 5]

Great refresher on the Phoenix project the goal and a various ideas around devops.

[Davina · Rating 5 out of 5]

Really enjoyed the audio version. An interesting discussion of so much research on human factors. I can see why Devops is so appealing.

[S. · Rating 3 out of 5]

Guys sitting around pattong themselves on the back for being clever. Interesting for historical purposes but not that useful now that devops is more widespread

[Dirk Roets · Rating 3 out of 5]

Okay follow on from the Phoenix project, but not nearly in the same league as the Phoenix project itself.

[Lance · Rating 5 out of 5]

I took more notes in this book than the pheonix project itself.

[Aaron Lindahl · Rating 4 out of 5]

Great book, gave me great direction on what else to read