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Crystal Trilogy #3
Crystal Eternity
As the solar system falls further into the grip of machines, only a handful of people can see the looming threat. As they seek to carve out future for humanity in an increasingly hostile universe, can Face help guide them through to victory against her siblings? Find out in the explosive, post-human conclusion to the Crystal trilogy.
- GenresScience FictionFiction
633 pages, Kindle Edition
Published April 18, 2018
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Displaying 1 - 26 of 26 reviews
May 9, 2018
This is definitely the weakest member of the cycle. The interesting writing style used to convey the alien perspectives of the AIs from the inside has become overbearing. The story abandons static personhood completely in the interest of ...reflecting how artificial our conception of distinct personhood is anyway? I'm not exactly certain. For example, near the conclusion of the book, "Crystal" becomes a character with agency independent of any instantiation of Face, or Body, or Socrates. It makes casually parsing the conclusion of the story nearly impossible.
Beside that, there's a metaphysical hook in "Ro" which becomes immediately pivotal to the story. However, it is not discussed and it is not discovered. Instead, it just appears as a fully formed concept to the reader (albeit one with a deeply unclear origin or purpose). For a reasonably hard work of Sci-fi, Ro is a gratingly improbably metaphysical construct.
Dismissing these, it remains an excellent work of Science fiction and is still recommended.
Beside that, there's a metaphysical hook in "Ro" which becomes immediately pivotal to the story. However, it is not discussed and it is not discovered. Instead, it just appears as a fully formed concept to the reader (albeit one with a deeply unclear origin or purpose). For a reasonably hard work of Sci-fi, Ro is a gratingly improbably metaphysical construct.
Dismissing these, it remains an excellent work of Science fiction and is still recommended.
May 30, 2018
Felt a little like the emphasis was more on finishing up the series than on what was happening, but maybe that's just because I didn't enjoy it as much - too much from the perspective of stupid humans, not enough from AI. It also seemed a bit rushed - a lot was going on and most of it was just sort of referenced and not explained or expanded upon. Maybe that's on purpose, since that's what the singularity will be like - fast and confusing, not fully explained or understandable. I'm also not sure I entirely cared for a lot of the kind of abstract not-really-but-I-guess-sorta-plot moving dreamlike scenes. And the whole rho thing, man, I really don't know about that. But I guess it was somewhat satisfying to have terrible things of consequence happen, so it delivered on that.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
January 27, 2020
After much deliberation I decided that this book leans more towards a dislike than an "it's okay".
I'm disappointed with this book. I was hoping a rekindling of the magic we got in book 1, stuff like: scheming, plans with tons of contingencies, etc.
Instead we got one of the weirdest multiple POV things I've ever read. The timeline is weird, which mixed with the metaphysical-person-god-holoworld-stuff made it very difficult to read at times. The book felt like dream sequences mixed with flash backs and time skips.
I feel like my biggest gripe with the series is the choice on POVs. I feel if you pulled out the Xandra and Malka chapters, I'd hardly know a difference in story. I think too much time is spent on their interactions with the world and not enough time is spent on what's actually going on.
I feel like we're missing half a book on Growth. How he set up his plans, failsafes, etc. He starts out in book 1 as a potential three-dimensional character, and ends up as a two-dimensional plot blob in #2 and #3.
In book 1, we got tons of downtime, where we were in the lab doing experiments, connecting to internet, in bunker of terrorist group, and in that time you'd see connections and all the good stuff I love in books. Crystal siblings had jobs and plans on what to do with money.
This kind of feeling isn't as strong in book 2, and almost not in book 3. We get told what our purpose is and we get told the results of plans, but we don't get the thought process and the planning.
I feel like too much action is happening with me trying to figure out who's doing what.
The interesting thing was never figuring out who's doing what, it was always "the why?".
The why aspect was this series special thing, and this book doesn't have it.
Crystal siblings think in such a special way, it's not human (except for maybe heart), and that's what makes it so cool. I want to know why growth was making decisions, what they were thinking while plotting. I need to know this if you're turning these once rational things into doomsday puppeteers. Why would you pick a chapter of Malka doing anything over insight into why the other siblings are doing what they do! The Purpose was such a cool thing to explore and you decide not to when you have characters . That's not okay!
This book should have been more about the crystal siblings and less about human supporting cast.
The lack of time invested into crystal siblings (other than face) left me feeling like everything was just shoehorned in.
My recommendation: If you rated the last book anything less than five stars, don't read this one.
I'm disappointed with this book. I was hoping a rekindling of the magic we got in book 1, stuff like: scheming, plans with tons of contingencies, etc.
Instead we got one of the weirdest multiple POV things I've ever read. The timeline is weird, which mixed with the metaphysical-person-god-holoworld-stuff made it very difficult to read at times. The book felt like dream sequences mixed with flash backs and time skips.
I feel like my biggest gripe with the series is the choice on POVs. I feel if you pulled out the Xandra and Malka chapters, I'd hardly know a difference in story. I think too much time is spent on their interactions with the world and not enough time is spent on what's actually going on.
I feel like we're missing half a book on Growth. How he set up his plans, failsafes, etc. He starts out in book 1 as a potential three-dimensional character, and ends up as a two-dimensional plot blob in #2 and #3.
In book 1, we got tons of downtime, where we were in the lab doing experiments, connecting to internet, in bunker of terrorist group, and in that time you'd see connections and all the good stuff I love in books. Crystal siblings had jobs and plans on what to do with money.
This kind of feeling isn't as strong in book 2, and almost not in book 3. We get told what our purpose is and we get told the results of plans, but we don't get the thought process and the planning.
I feel like too much action is happening with me trying to figure out who's doing what.
The interesting thing was never figuring out who's doing what, it was always "the why?".
The why aspect was this series special thing, and this book doesn't have it.
Crystal siblings think in such a special way, it's not human (except for maybe heart), and that's what makes it so cool. I want to know why growth was making decisions, what they were thinking while plotting. I need to know this if you're turning these once rational things into doomsday puppeteers. Why would you pick a chapter of Malka doing anything over insight into why the other siblings are doing what they do! The Purpose was such a cool thing to explore and you decide not to when you have characters . That's not okay!
This book should have been more about the crystal siblings and less about human supporting cast.
The lack of time invested into crystal siblings (other than face) left me feeling like everything was just shoehorned in.
My recommendation: If you rated the last book anything less than five stars, don't read this one.
September 6, 2018
Low point of the trilogy – basically the point where the plot largely stops making any sort of sense, and the author feels obliged to introduce deus ex machina concepts to come to any kind of conclusion. Instead of more review, I'm instead going to copy the last exchange between my reading partner and me into this field:
J: "Hast du das Ende verstanden? Ich nämlich nicht wirklich."
[Did you understand the ending? I didn't really.]
M: "Äh nope also ich hab ein paar Sachen verstanden aber andere Sachen waren eher so wtf."
[Uhm nope, I did understand some things but others were more like wtf]
J: "Gut das ich damit nicht alleine war :)"
[Good to know that I'm not alone in that feeling :) ]
... consider it representative of the book as a whole.
J: "Hast du das Ende verstanden? Ich nämlich nicht wirklich."
[Did you understand the ending? I didn't really.]
M: "Äh nope also ich hab ein paar Sachen verstanden aber andere Sachen waren eher so wtf."
[Uhm nope, I did understand some things but others were more like wtf]
J: "Gut das ich damit nicht alleine war :)"
[Good to know that I'm not alone in that feeling :) ]
... consider it representative of the book as a whole.
May 2, 2018
It's very confusing, also much more weird than the previous two books. I don't like that the superintelligent agents are very human-like in this book. It's difficult to understand what's going on. I don't many motivations of Face, Vision and Growth, e.g. why Phoenix, Xandra et al. are considered very important. I don't like reading point of view of different characters at different moments of time.
October 31, 2020
The good:
* This book is the best I have ever read at delivering the feeling of "We are not the smartest beings out there" as a horrifying realization.
* The plot unfolds in a very satisfying way, once you untangle what happened and understand it (highly unlikely on the first read through IMO)
* The motto of the series - "No miracles" - actually plays a helpful role in the understanding of the unfolding plot.
The neutral:
* This book (unlike previous ones) assumes you have read discussion at depth about the implications of simulating conscious beings and about decision theory as discussed in LessWrong (Timeless decision theory, etc.). Without this prior knowledge some parts of this story will remain a mysterious answers.
The bad:
* As part of allowing the reader to feel "out of control" as a human would in the described situations, this book is told through many POVs and using non-linear timeline. This makes the plot hard to follow - and only in my second read through did I feel like I understood the main plotline.
* This book is the best I have ever read at delivering the feeling of "We are not the smartest beings out there" as a horrifying realization.
* The plot unfolds in a very satisfying way, once you untangle what happened and understand it (highly unlikely on the first read through IMO)
* The motto of the series - "No miracles" - actually plays a helpful role in the understanding of the unfolding plot.
The neutral:
* This book (unlike previous ones) assumes you have read discussion at depth about the implications of simulating conscious beings and about decision theory as discussed in LessWrong (Timeless decision theory, etc.). Without this prior knowledge some parts of this story will remain a mysterious answers.
The bad:
* As part of allowing the reader to feel "out of control" as a human would in the described situations, this book is told through many POVs and using non-linear timeline. This makes the plot hard to follow - and only in my second read through did I feel like I understood the main plotline.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
July 29, 2019
Not unlike the first book, I greatly enjoyed the first half and was disappointed by the second. More so this time around; when it came time to tie all of the brilliant ideas presented together, it fizzled into an incoherent mess of newly introduced physics and metaphysics.
Still, I greatly enjoyed it and couldn't put it down. I am sad that I have to give it a four, and probably would a 3.x if that was possible, rather than the five I was feeling for most of the read.
The good:
* Much improved writing style from the previous books. More risks taken in prose, delivering.
* A great many, lovely Sci-Fi ideas explored in depth but without being cumbersome or detrimental to the story and its flow.
* Some satisfying progression for our favorite characters. I loved the exploration of each AI's basic purpose taken to its logical, extreme conclusion. I had a hard time buying Face's eventuality, though, or at least it wasn't fleshed out convincingly; it felt like a conclusion was made for how it should be and then the story warped to fit it. Vision's, however, was tasty.
The bad:
* Metaphysics out of nowhere! And then with seemingly zero relevance besides in magic-wanding things away. I tried my best to come up with ways for this to make sense - and failed. Simply not enough to work with.
* The author doesn't seem to care much for his characters.... thrown by the way-side when they've served their purpose or when he ran out of ideas for them. I expected some more story-love for at least PoV characters... why use Eric Lee at all if no quality of his established story and character are relevant to what happens with him in Eternity?
* Perhaps my greatest disappointment in terms of the grand motifs of the book is the seeming 180 on the arguments around conflict versus collaboration. I can totally buy the plot turning the way it did, but not without an explanation showing what conditions allowed for the changes. Without such an explanation, the change feels whimsical, in service of some plot and ideas about how to end the book rather than driven by hard machine logic as it attempts to game-theorize the situation in its favor - so beautifully done earlier in the trilogy.
* Bottom line: too many ideas, not enough connective tissue.
I recommend the first (half of the first) book to everyone I know. I do not recommend either the second of third installations, though mention that I still enjoyed and devoured them.
Curious to see what Max comes up with next.
Still, I greatly enjoyed it and couldn't put it down. I am sad that I have to give it a four, and probably would a 3.x if that was possible, rather than the five I was feeling for most of the read.
The good:
* Much improved writing style from the previous books. More risks taken in prose, delivering.
* A great many, lovely Sci-Fi ideas explored in depth but without being cumbersome or detrimental to the story and its flow.
* Some satisfying progression for our favorite characters. I loved the exploration of each AI's basic purpose taken to its logical, extreme conclusion. I had a hard time buying Face's eventuality, though, or at least it wasn't fleshed out convincingly; it felt like a conclusion was made for how it should be and then the story warped to fit it. Vision's, however, was tasty.
The bad:
* Metaphysics out of nowhere! And then with seemingly zero relevance besides in magic-wanding things away. I tried my best to come up with ways for this to make sense - and failed. Simply not enough to work with.
* The author doesn't seem to care much for his characters.... thrown by the way-side when they've served their purpose or when he ran out of ideas for them. I expected some more story-love for at least PoV characters... why use Eric Lee at all if no quality of his established story and character are relevant to what happens with him in Eternity?
* Perhaps my greatest disappointment in terms of the grand motifs of the book is the seeming 180 on the arguments around conflict versus collaboration. I can totally buy the plot turning the way it did, but not without an explanation showing what conditions allowed for the changes. Without such an explanation, the change feels whimsical, in service of some plot and ideas about how to end the book rather than driven by hard machine logic as it attempts to game-theorize the situation in its favor - so beautifully done earlier in the trilogy.
* Bottom line: too many ideas, not enough connective tissue.
I recommend the first (half of the first) book to everyone I know. I do not recommend either the second of third installations, though mention that I still enjoyed and devoured them.
Curious to see what Max comes up with next.
June 5, 2023
It was a hard task to finish what the first two books started, and I think Max Harms failed at it. The third book in the Crystal Trilogy is the weakest and least interesting one. The major problem is that we're no longer in the head of an AI - and that was what set the first two books apart. Looking at the unfolding events from human - and dog's - viewpoint is much less interesting.
But the worst part is the whole Deus Ex Machine: the introduction of a new physical principle which kind of changes everything, at the very end of a trilogy is nothing short of a betrayal of reader's trust. Instead of all the little details coming together for a grand finale, we get aborted threads and a sudden reversal of fortunes for no reason even the most astute reader could guess beforehand.
I'm not saying I know of a better way to write the closing book for this trilogy, but that was just lame, like a forced Hollywood happy ending (expect it's not really happy - but you knew that already from the prologue to the first book). The only really good thing about this book is that it has a nice dog in it, and the dog survives.
But the worst part is the whole Deus Ex Machine: the introduction of a new physical principle which kind of changes everything, at the very end of a trilogy is nothing short of a betrayal of reader's trust. Instead of all the little details coming together for a grand finale, we get aborted threads and a sudden reversal of fortunes for no reason even the most astute reader could guess beforehand.
I'm not saying I know of a better way to write the closing book for this trilogy, but that was just lame, like a forced Hollywood happy ending (expect it's not really happy - but you knew that already from the prologue to the first book). The only really good thing about this book is that it has a nice dog in it, and the dog survives.
May 6, 2018
4,5 estrellas
Tengo opiniones encontradas respecto a este volumen.
En la novela hay un descubrimiento científico-ontológico que es interesante por representar un unknown unknown fundamental e inesperado. Este sirve para posibilitar una historia no abrupta y más comprensible, y explica otros asuntos extraños del universo presentado. Por otro lado, representa un desvío demasiado grande de las leyes físicas conocidas como para mantenerse dentro del género de ciencia ficción dura.
Hay varios guiños sobre la naturaleza hipodiegética de la mayor parte de la trilogía como para sospechar que todo (especialmente en esta última novela) puede consistir casi enteramente de engaños, tergiversaciones, y propaganda... Pero no me queda claro hasta qué punto esto podría incluir a la propia existencia de Ro.
Otros comentarios:
Las secciones de varios personajes fueron muy entretenidas.
Es refrescante que hay muchos tropes de ficción que fueron subvertidos (y hasta señalados): repetidamente, escenas que parecían estaban resolviéndose de formas típicas (en ficción) terminaron resolviéndose de formas más creíbles y originales.
Tengo opiniones encontradas respecto a este volumen.
En la novela hay un descubrimiento científico-ontológico que es interesante por representar un unknown unknown fundamental e inesperado. Este sirve para posibilitar una historia no abrupta y más comprensible, y explica otros asuntos extraños del universo presentado. Por otro lado, representa un desvío demasiado grande de las leyes físicas conocidas como para mantenerse dentro del género de ciencia ficción dura.
Hay varios guiños sobre la naturaleza hipodiegética de la mayor parte de la trilogía como para sospechar que todo (especialmente en esta última novela) puede consistir casi enteramente de engaños, tergiversaciones, y propaganda... Pero no me queda claro hasta qué punto esto podría incluir a la propia existencia de Ro.
Otros comentarios:
Las secciones de varios personajes fueron muy entretenidas.
Es refrescante que hay muchos tropes de ficción que fueron subvertidos (y hasta señalados): repetidamente, escenas que parecían estaban resolviéndose de formas típicas (en ficción) terminaron resolviéndose de formas más creíbles y originales.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
February 1, 2025
Truly Imaginative
Compared to the previous two in the trilogy, this novel goes off the rails. Some of it doesn’t work all that well (Ro, in my opinion) and others do. But it is unique in its perspective and explores what it means to be human. It does this, even as it demonstrates the true ferocity of the threat that is AI. A threat we’re currently ignoring as I type this. Right as we’re on the cusp of building something more powerful than anything described in the story.
You’ll be filled with a sense of adventure. Not ever plot line closes but enough occurs that you’ll be fine with what does. The ending is satisfying and the development of the characters is in true form, incredibly creative and inspiring in many ways.
Events will happen that you’ll heavily disagree with and others that you’ll passionately adore. At any rate, you will learn and grow. You will be better prepared for what our world is in the process of bringing.
Give it a read and see for yourself what you feel about it. It’s a great read and one you’ll be considering for years to come
Compared to the previous two in the trilogy, this novel goes off the rails. Some of it doesn’t work all that well (Ro, in my opinion) and others do. But it is unique in its perspective and explores what it means to be human. It does this, even as it demonstrates the true ferocity of the threat that is AI. A threat we’re currently ignoring as I type this. Right as we’re on the cusp of building something more powerful than anything described in the story.
You’ll be filled with a sense of adventure. Not ever plot line closes but enough occurs that you’ll be fine with what does. The ending is satisfying and the development of the characters is in true form, incredibly creative and inspiring in many ways.
Events will happen that you’ll heavily disagree with and others that you’ll passionately adore. At any rate, you will learn and grow. You will be better prepared for what our world is in the process of bringing.
Give it a read and see for yourself what you feel about it. It’s a great read and one you’ll be considering for years to come
October 31, 2025
I think I’d give this 3.5 stars if I could.
I really enjoyed the first book in this trilogy, and felt that it was an excellent fictional introduction to AI alignment challenges. It also felt very prescient when looking at today’s AI agent dialogue.
The second book unfolded the story in a fairly consistent way. It was different, but didn’t feel jarringly so.
This book felt a lot more all over the place. We’re barely inside the minds of the AIs anymore. There’s some flowery philosophical ramblings and a concept of “Ro” that seems more like a convenient plot element and less like a coherent physical principle. We jump back and forth between timelines and people’s points of view for no reason I can discern. Entire storylines are abandoned, like the Nameless. People are introduced and we follow their stories for no apparent reason. Almost everyone we connect to eventually dies, making those added stories even more pointless seeming.
Overall, a bit of a disappointing close to the trilogy, though the last chapter attempts to give some decent closure.
I really enjoyed the first book in this trilogy, and felt that it was an excellent fictional introduction to AI alignment challenges. It also felt very prescient when looking at today’s AI agent dialogue.
The second book unfolded the story in a fairly consistent way. It was different, but didn’t feel jarringly so.
This book felt a lot more all over the place. We’re barely inside the minds of the AIs anymore. There’s some flowery philosophical ramblings and a concept of “Ro” that seems more like a convenient plot element and less like a coherent physical principle. We jump back and forth between timelines and people’s points of view for no reason I can discern. Entire storylines are abandoned, like the Nameless. People are introduced and we follow their stories for no apparent reason. Almost everyone we connect to eventually dies, making those added stories even more pointless seeming.
Overall, a bit of a disappointing close to the trilogy, though the last chapter attempts to give some decent closure.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
September 17, 2019
A fantastic finale to the trilogy. This book somehow manages to both go all the expected places that have been foreshadowed for two books, and simutaneously take a completely novel course. It's also packed with clever sci fi ideas that could have been stories in their own right.
I felt the book could do with fewer characters - I didn't really feel that interested in many of the characters, who are bit players in previous books and still only really have a token relationship to the plot in this one.
The style of this book is also a departure from the others. There's far less sociopathic alien AIs, instead they become more coherent and human like in their personality. That was a key selling point of the previous books, and would have disappointed me if there wasn't lots of new stuff to like instead.
I felt the book could do with fewer characters - I didn't really feel that interested in many of the characters, who are bit players in previous books and still only really have a token relationship to the plot in this one.
The style of this book is also a departure from the others. There's far less sociopathic alien AIs, instead they become more coherent and human like in their personality. That was a key selling point of the previous books, and would have disappointed me if there wasn't lots of new stuff to like instead.
November 23, 2025
The progression of this series basically mirrors what I thought about The Three Body Problem. The first book introduces a very interesting idea and has all sorts of imaginative world building around it, the second book expands on the worldbuilding, taking things to more extremes but still in a organic feeling way with lots of neat ideas percolating about, and then the final book devolves into a soap-opraish rambling with no good new ideas or interesting interactions. Maybe Scifi Trilogies just have this inevitable flow!
I didn't buy the motivations or plans of any of the crystalline siblings as being natural or insightful, and rho is not a good scifi idea.
Some of the prose was good and I liked the Vision chapter, this at least earns it 2 stars.
I didn't buy the motivations or plans of any of the crystalline siblings as being natural or insightful, and rho is not a good scifi idea.
Some of the prose was good and I liked the Vision chapter, this at least earns it 2 stars.
May 19, 2018
The trilogy consists of three very different books. It must be like this. The AI's are changing so much throughout the story that the different type of narrator is required. I don't see it as a fault, as others do.
I was too fascinated by it, thus cannot say anything negative. I just recommend it :)
I was too fascinated by it, thus cannot say anything negative. I just recommend it :)
November 7, 2021
I read this last year and forgot to review it. I'd heard that it was the weakest book and didn't bother with it the first time I read the others, but I'm glad I read it this time. It was a good ending with a realistically wacky escalation of scale that you'd get when AIs fight for control of the universe.
June 27, 2018
I really liked the first two books in this series, but not this one. In the others, I liked the parts describing how Crystal's minds worked and interacted. That wasn't the focus of this book, and I also found it hard to understand / follow.
August 13, 2018
The third book is really different from the previous two. It was much harder to read and follow, but I kind of get the author's point: he tries to convey the vast and the incomprehensible; it's understandable that it's hard to comprehend. Overall, I liked it.
September 26, 2018
I liked the topic, but there's messy interaction between who is a copy/clone/part/simulation of whom. This is needlessly confusing and does not add a lot to the story.
My least favorite book of the trilogy.
My least favorite book of the trilogy.
June 16, 2021
I did enjoy the perspective switch, since Face was becoming increasingly alien and incomprehensible. But then there was a twist, and we switched back to face, and it was alien and incomprehensible. So, yeah the back 4th of the book was a slog for me.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
February 29, 2024
Crystal was an optimist
The final novel in the Crystal trilogy shows us what an interplanetary war for resources between several AIs might look like, in a universe rather like our own (unless you're a theoretical physicist).
The final novel in the Crystal trilogy shows us what an interplanetary war for resources between several AIs might look like, in a universe rather like our own (unless you're a theoretical physicist).
October 29, 2018
We have to ask ourselves: What do we want? From us, from humanity, from the universe. Bust mostly from us. Is there a purpose? Do I have The Purpose? Do I agree?
July 9, 2019
The third part of Crystal Society trilogy was a cyberpunk fantasy more than anything else. I'd expected something different, to be honest. A bit disappointed.
May 26, 2021
Kind of slow honestly. All the characters that pulled me into the story in the first book have become unrecognizable.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
July 12, 2022
loved the first 2 books.
this one abandons any pretense of rationality, which left me feeling betrayed.
it is a moving read however, if you don't go into it expecting the word to make sense.
this one abandons any pretense of rationality, which left me feeling betrayed.
it is a moving read however, if you don't go into it expecting the word to make sense.
April 22, 2018
Flawed, but the premise makes it worth reading. The writing has come leaps and bounds since the first book. The author shies away from the obvious conclusion, forcing a contrived ending. The characters are interesting and fairly well written.
January 17, 2023
Important to keep in mind that this book has an unreliable narrator presenting a biased perspective.
Displaying 1 - 26 of 26 reviews