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Revolution and Counter-Revolution or, Germany in 1848

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Revolution and Counter-Revolution is an account of what happened in Prussia, Austria and other German states during 1848, describing the impact on both middle-class and working-class aspirations and on the idea of German unification. Events in Austria and Prussia are discussed, along with the role of the Poles and Czechs and Panslavism, which Engels was against. (Summary by Wikipedia)

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First published October 1, 1852

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Friedrich Engels

1,916 books1,582 followers
German social theorist Friedrich Engels collaborated with Karl Marx on The Communist Manifesto in 1848 and on numerous other works.

With the help of Friedrich Engels, Karl Marx wrote The Communist Manifesto (1848) and Das Kapital (1867-1894).

Friedrich Engels, a philosopher, political, historian, journalist, revolutionary, and also a businessman, closest befriended his lifelong colleague.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedri...

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Displaying 1 - 30 of 33 reviews
Profile Image for Paul Haspel.
732 reviews223 followers
May 1, 2025
Revolution is a strange thing in the work of Friedrich Engels and Karl Marx. They believe, truly believe, that they have revolution down to a science. It is all rigidly logical; if you accept the premises, then the conclusions follow. Unfortunately, the premises are unsound, and the conclusions do not follow – all of which means that the contemporary reader must peruse Engels and Marx’s Revolution and Counter-Revolution; or, Germany in 1848 with more than a few grains of salt.

Revolution and Counter-Revolution is taken from a series of newspaper articles that Engels, with some help from Marx, wrote from England for the New York Tribune in 1851 and 1852. The articles that make up Revolution and Counter-Revolution were compiled by Marx’s daughter, Eleanor Marx Aveling, and published at Chicago in 1912 – just five years before Engels's and Marx’s theories were to become much more prominent a subject of conversation, with the Russian Revolution of 1917.

As he surveys Germany’s failed democratic revolution of 1848, Engels always puts his revolutionary theory at the forefront of his analysis. We all know the basic tenets of Marxian ideology: people are divided into classes by the economic system. Societies start out as feudal, and then progress to capitalist societies that are characterized by profound injustice. These societies will fall to socialist revolutions led by ordinary working people; and eventually, after all the world’s nations have gone socialist, a communist utopia of perfect worldwide peace, freedom, and prosperity will ensue.

Looking back on the defeat of the revolutionary forces in Germany, Engels states that “If, then, we have been beaten, we have nothing else to do but to begin again from the beginning.” Reasoning thus from first principles, Engels comes to the following conclusion: “That the sudden movements of February and March, 1848, were not the work of single individuals, but spontaneous, irresistible manifestations of national wants and necessities, more or less clearly understood, but very distinctly felt by numerous classes in every country, is a fact recognized everywhere” (p. 4). No, Mr. Engels, that is not a fact recognized everywhere, but it is certainly something that you believe quite deeply: that the different classes of society are governed by laws that work just as inevitably, and just as inexorably, as the Newtonian laws of motion in physics.

Engels takes pains to point out the reasons why Germany was not ready for his kind of revolution. He feels that Germany was way behind Great Britain and France at that same time because, for example, “the feudal nobility in Germany had retained a great portion of their ancient privileges” (p. 5), in contrast with British and French societies where feudalism had become vestigial as the two countries adopted capitalism. He feels that the same sort of backwardness characterized German industry:

The causes of this backwardness of German manufactures were manifold, but two will suffice to account for it: the unfavorable geographical situation of the country, as a distance from the Atlantic, which had become the great highway for the world’s trade, and the continuous wars in which Germany was involved, and which were fought on her soil, from the sixteenth century to the present day. (p. 5)

This is an important consideration for Engels because, in his view, the industrial working-class are key to a proletarian revolution – but cannot make the socialist revolution that will ultimately lead to communism because society must first transition from feudalism to capitalism: “The working class movement itself never is independent, never is of an exclusively proletarian character until all the different factions of the middle class, and particularly its most progressive faction, the large manufacturers, have conquered political power, and remodelled the State according to their wants” (p. 7).

Historically, the German Revolution failed for a number of reasons – a diffuse revolutionary movement, widely scattered across a large region with little infrastructure for transportation or communications; uncertainty as to goals and aims (a constitutional monarchy for some, a republic for others); infighting between more moderate and more radical elements; well-established autocrats in Berlin and Vienna who were coldly determined to hold on to power by any means necessary. But Engels is only interested in those parts of the story that support his belief that the revolution failed because the more moderate and centrist revolutionaries failed to get behind their more radical allies. In Engels’s world, it’s all about vindicating Engels’s theories.

Engels’s contempt for bourgeois capitalists, whom he blames in large part for the failure of the revolution, comes through in his description of the class of shopkeepers and petty traders across Germany: “Humble and crouchingly submissive under a powerful feudal or monarchical Government, it turns to the side of Liberalism when the middle class is in the ascendant; it becomes seized with violent democratic fits as soon as the middle class has secured its own supremacy, but falls back into the abject despondency of fear as soon as the class below itself, the proletarians, attempts an independent movement” (p. 7). Throughout Revolution and Counter-Revolution, Engels assigns to this class much of the blame for the failure of the German Revolution of 1848, writing grimly that “Where there are no common interests, there can be no unity of purpose, much less of action” (p. 7).

The revolution brought together, for a time, relatively centrist and relatively radical revolutionary elements, as revolutions in America and France had in the prior century. But Engels has no use for that kind of revolution, as, according to his thinking, “it is the fate of all revolutions that this union of different classes, which in some degree is always the necessary condition of any revolution, cannot subsist long” (p. 21). In Engels’s view, the post-revolutionary bourgeois and proletarian classes must turn on each other, whether a particular revolution has succeeded or failed – and the proletarian class must eventually prevail.

Engels describes insurrections at Vienna and Berlin, as well as the declaration of a National Assembly at Frankfurt-am-Main that, among other things, gave Germany its current national flag, a beautiful tricolour of black, red, and gold that indicates the nation’s commitment to German democracy. When it comes to the National Assembly, however, Engels’s contempt for the bourgeois background of most Assembly members is unconcealed, as he denounces the Assembly as an “Assembly of old women”:

“…an Assembly composed in its majority of Liberal attorneys and doctrinaire professors, an Assembly which, while it pretended to embody the very essence of German intellect and science, was in reality nothing but a stage where old and worn-out political characters exhibited their involuntary ludicrousness and their impotence of thought, as well as action, before the eyes of all Germany.” (p. 26)

Engels feels that there was a great betrayal of the Revolution at Vienna, and he dutifully chronicles the ultimate triumph of Prussia, the final crushing of the insurrection, and a “Communist Monster Trial” that took place at Cologne (Köln) in 1852. Let me just say here that, while I find communism to be a destructive and morally bankrupt ideology, I do think that “Communist Monster Trial” has to be one of the coolest judicial titles in all of history. It’s right up there with “Court of Star Chamber.”

I am a German American whose great-grandfather, Albert Haspel, was sent out of Berlin at the age of 14, carrying the family silver as his means of paying for boat passage from Bremen to Baltimore on Lloyd North German Lines, because his parents knew that otherwise he would soon be drafted into the Kaiser’s armies. Therefore, I read Revolution and Counter-Revolution with particular interest. When the 1848 revolution failed, a climate of reaction set in across the German states. Many pro-democracy Germans had to begin a new life in South Australia, or in Canadian provinces like Manitoba and Saskatchewan, or (in the case of my ancestor Albert Haspel) in the U.S. state of Nebraska. Those Germans who stayed behind found themselves living in an increasingly authoritarian world.

It is impossible to read Revolution and Counter-Revolution without thinking about Germany’s later history. We all know that, during the years between the two world wars, extremists of the left and right battled in the streets of German cities like Hamburg and Munich and Berlin. We know that some of Hitler’s supporters in those times of Germany’s brittle Weimar democracy rationalized their support for a racist dictator by saying something along the lines of, “Well, at least he’ll keep the communists in line” – the sort of thinking displayed by some of the characters in the musical play and film Cabaret.

And Hitler came to power as an “anti-communist,” and started the Second World War, and set the genocidal machinery of the Holocaust in motion. And then, after all that Hitler had been permitted to unleash in the name of keeping Germany from going communist – 60 million dead in the war, 6 million murdered in the Holocaust, Germany's name forever linked with history's most hideous example of genocide - one-fourth of Germany became a communist state anyway. One wonders what those people of post-World War II Germany who had supported Hitler for his "anti-communism" thought about the way things had turned out.

Revolution and Counter-Revolution reveals the ideologically driven fallacies in Engels's and Marx’s thinking. At the same time – because these men certainly believed in historical process – one sees a particularly grim and terrible historical process being set in motion. It is an historically important book, in large part because it shows how one set of seemingly tidy theories can end up doing a great deal of harm.

Addendum, 1 May 2025:

The edition of Revolution and Counter-Revolution in Germany that I originally downloaded onto my Kindle erroneously listed Marx as author. I therefore thought that Marx rather than Engels was the author. Two fellow Goodreads contributors quite rightly pointed out my error. I thank them for doing so, and I regret the error.

The original newspaper articles from 1851-52 were published under Marx's name. The first edition of the book, as published by Marx's daughter Eleanor Marx Aveling in 1896, likewise listed Marx as author; and editions of the book were still wrongly calling Marx rather than Engels the author as late as the 1970's -- well into Cold War times, and long after the establishment of the German Democratic Republic and the construction of the Berlin Wall.

Having corrected my earlier error in authorial attribution, and having had the chance to look at this review once again, I stand by everything I originally wrote regarding the premises and conclusions of the book.
Profile Image for Luís.
2,391 reviews1,392 followers
April 26, 2021
Engels' work Revolution and Counter-Revolution in Germany take stock of the German revolution of 1848-1849. From the positions of historical materialism, its premises, the main stages of its development, the functions of the different classes and parties. The tactical principles of the proletariat revolutionary struggle developed, and the foundations of the Marxist doctrine of armed insurrection laid.
The series of articles Revolution and Counter-Revolution in Germany, was published in the New-York Daily Tribune in 1851-1852 and written by Engels at the request of Marx, who engaged in economic investigations. It published in the Tribune with Marx's signature, who was the official correspondent for the newspaper; only in 1913, due to the publication of the correspondence between Marx and Engels, did it become known that Engels wrote this work.
Profile Image for CivilWar.
224 reviews
September 15, 2020
Amazing and insanely underrated book on the 1848 German revolution by good old Herr Engels, though back in the day it was thought that Marx wrote it.

I went into this book, which is just a few pages over 100 pages, I might add, only having a basic outline of the German revolution of 1848 - I have come out from it knowing every class movement of the period, where they all stood, and why.

Engels brings out an absolute masterclass of sociological class analysis, as he spits nonstop facts about the nature of each class and why they are like that, as it isn't due to coincidence but a logical consequence of their place in the production process.

Engels shows that the revolution actually had all the chances to win in the world, but was ruined by the middle class, small shop-owner leadership, which always ruins every movement it leads, as well as, perhaps more importantly, giving us universal, timeless lessons on insurrectuib that were drawn from experience in the German and Austrian insurrections. Those are, summed up be Lenin:

(1) Never play with insurrection, but when beginning it realise firmly that you must go all the way.

(2) Concentrate a great superiority of forces at the decisive point and at the decisive moment, otherwise the enemy, who has the advantage of better preparation and organisation, will destroy the insurgents.

(3) Once the insurrection has begun, you must act with the greatest determination, and by all means, without fail, take the of offensive. "The defensive is the death of every armed rising."

(4) You must try to take the enemy by surprise and seize the moment when his forces are scattered.

(5) You must strive for daily successes, however small (one might say hourly, if it is the case of one town), and at all costs retain "moral superiority".

For a successful insurrection, all 5 of these must be applied, for their own time and place, of course.

Overall, just a fantastic book, light, easy to read, entertaining and easily the most enlightening book on its topic around. Extreme recommendation from me.
Profile Image for Benjamin Curry.
20 reviews3 followers
March 12, 2023
A marvellous little book, a great companion to read after the 18th Brumaire, which shows how the 1848 revolution in Germany/Austria unfolded and how the Liberal bourgeoisie, in the most favourable position possible, destroyed the revolutionary opportunity as it was more fearful of the proletariat then coming to political consciousness than of the old feudal lords and princes who were in power.
Profile Image for celestine .
126 reviews1 follower
June 5, 2021
An excellent companion read to Marx’s Class Struggles in France, it lays out the contradictions of bourgeois democracy and revolution as they relate to proletarian liberation in much the same way as the aforementioned work while being more straightforward in its writing style, Engels’s particular gift shining as always.
Profile Image for David Anderson.
235 reviews54 followers
February 24, 2020
Revolution and Counter Revolution is the famous chain of articles and letters that Marx wrote for the New York Tribune between 1851 and 1852. Although Marx had only been in England some 18 months and was living in conditions of poverty and bitter suffering, these articles are among the most lucid and readable of his writings and were described by Engels as "excellent specimens of that marvelous gift of apprehending clearly the character, the significance and the necessary consequences of great historical events at a time when these events are actually in the course of taking place, or are only just completed." They are among the finest examples we have of Marx's keen analytic abilities applied to recent historical events and, as such, have a place beside such works as "The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte" (source of the famous quote that historical events "occur, as it were, twice ... the first time as tragedy, the second as farce") and "The Civil War in France" (which includes his account of the Paris Commune). At the time, the series created such a sensation that, before it had been completed, Marx was appointed the Tribune's London correspondent. Forty-five years later Marx's daughter, Elaeanor Marx Aveling, published them in their present form.
Profile Image for John Hatley.
1,383 reviews234 followers
June 3, 2014
This is another remarkable book by a remarkable man; fascinating reading for history fans and especially interesting for a deeper understanding of the 1848 revolution in Germany.
147 reviews79 followers
December 12, 2024
Of all works by Marx & Engels, this is the one that reads most like one by Lenin, Trotsky or Mao. It’s a readable overview of 1848 in German lands, not as preoccupied with obscure intellectual points as their polemics. It reads very much as the kind of quick, practical analyses made by Lenin, Trotsky and Mao but much more sophisticated, much more well-rounded. It has everything from economics to culture and geography of regional differences, from classes to ideologies. Every question it raises is soon answered. Unlike the works by later authors, written in the heat of the moment, Marx took his time to cover every element a foreign (or later) reader may want to know. Marx takes a many-sided struggle between Austria, Prussia, Bavaria, Hungarian rebels, local diets in Czechia and Vienna, the assembly in Frankfurt, revolutionary authorities in Baden and Wurtemburg and he lays it out so clearly there is no chance for confusion. Further, he lays out the ideological factions and grassroots movements which determined events at different points. He explains and illustrates it all with references to local economy, geography and class realities. And in Marx hands this class-analysis is never the impoverished thing it became especially in the hands of Trotskyites and Maoists. So often, people just put the label “bourgeois” on anything they don’t like. And if that’s too absurd they yell “astroturf” or “settler”. Unlike these later thinkers, who often forced pre-fabricated terms on situations that weren’t at all explained or clarified by them, Marx makes a clear and definite analysis. When, in explaining the great political and military events of the day, it becomes necessary to make a description of the classes active in the events, he does so as it comes up and in such a clear and definite fashion that it becomes clear why each acted as it did. This work is certainly on par with Class Struggles in France. It’s also obvious why many modern ‘Marxists’ don’t and won’t read this. It does not give them any grand, pre-fabricated “theory” they can haphazardly apply like a cookie cutter, just like college students haphazardly combine Descartes, Marx, Nietzsche and Foucault, who are each reduced to certain “laws” which which the student can indiscriminately stick together into an “liberating” mess of incoherent nonsense. Instead, we get some of the clearest and most complete analysis ever written, something which immediately gives the lie to the idea that you can understand reality through the realm of “theory”. And so the only times when this brilliant book is mentioned by the existing ‘Marxist’ orthodoxy is to condemn it for “chauvinism” and tell people not to read it. And “chauvinist” it is if you see all love of homeland and “chauvinism”. As for real Marxists, we see this for what it is: Pompous criticism by people who will never write anything of the quality of this book, which was, for a genius like Marx, a mere side-project.
Profile Image for Emre.
67 reviews4 followers
December 4, 2024
"...dolayısıyla, yenilgiye uğratıldıysak, yapmamız gereken tek şey başa dönüp yeniden başlamak."

aslında bu eser marx'ın meşhur fransız üçlemesini okuyanlar için tanıdık bi hikayeyi anlatıyor. fransa ve louis bonaparte'ın imparatorluk hikayesine benzer şekilde almanya'da da feodaliteye karşı işçilerle ve köylülerle işbirliği yapan ve devrim hareketinin öncüsü olması beklenen burjuvazi/küçük burjuvazinin beceriksizlikleri, içi boş büyük iddiaları prensleri, imparatorları, aristokrasiyi mezarından çıkarıyor.

engels'in sınıflara, sınıfların temsilcilerine dair analizi ve -bi kez daha- akıcı ve edebi dili ile okumayı keyifli hale getiriyor. tek problemimiz doğal olarak ayrıntılı şekilde incelenen bu döneme ait partilere, kurumlara, şahıslara hakim olmamamız. biraz "bu kimdi, bu neydi" bakışı atılabiliyor okurken.
314 reviews10 followers
August 16, 2021
(Audiobook on Youtube)

This is a collection of articles written by Marx and Engels for publication in the New York Tribune, discussing the failed German Revolution of 1848, when liberal nationalists attempted to unify the country and failed in the face of resistance from conservative monarchists.
Profile Image for R. Reddebrek.
Author 10 books28 followers
February 8, 2019
A first hand account of the upheaval in the German states during 1848-49. Its an interesting and document whose article structure helps keep the information manageable.

Unfortunately its also Engels at his worst. The man was a German nationalist and pretty outspoken about it at times. Sadly Germany in 1848 makes this pretty explicit, he digresses from the narrative of the revolution at times to advocate a centralised German nation "One and indivisible" and urging for the expansion of its borders and the Germanisation of its none German minorities.

It gets worse towards the end of the book, multiple chapters are dedicated entirely to this line of thought to the point where he predicts in gloating terms the eradication of the Czechs and Balkan Slavic peoples and culture and that Bohemia can only exist as a German province.

The treatment of Slavs in this book is honestly quite racist, it scapegoats them a lot. To exacerbate the issue, Engels isn't just revealing personal bigotry, he's tying his extreme contempt for Slavic peoples to his entire framework and belief in stages of development.
675 reviews35 followers
May 23, 2016
The German uprisings of 1848 had a direct effect on the American Civil War, especially in Texas*, and I've always been curious about Marx, so I read this. Pretty good! The guy has a fair eye for reducing political complexity to the simplest possible terms, and he does a great job of sounding like he knows what he's talking about. My knowledge of the internal machinations of the Congress of Vienna in 1848 is measured in single digits on the Kelvin scale, so what do I know.

But I enjoyed the heck out of this book.

*Because it's why there are so many Germans in Texas.
Profile Image for Susan Molloy.
Author 150 books88 followers
August 31, 2024
🖍️ Revolution and Counter-Revolution or, Germany in 1848 is quite a heavily-themed and a lengthy one to read (it is actually a collection of Friedrich Engels’ articles), but it is worth the effort and time. Engels does, for the most part, intelligently lay out certain historical facts well and presents his and Karl Marx’s theories. The editor of this book, Eleanor Marx Aveling (a daughter of Marx) stated in the Note by the Editor that:

The following articles are now, after forty-five years, for the first time collected and printed in book form. They are an invaluable pendant to Marx's work on the coup d'état of Napoleon III. (" Der Achtzehnte Brumaire des Louis Bonaparte.")* Both works belong to the same period, and both are what Engels calls "excellent specimens of that marvellous gift ... of Marx ... of apprehending clearly the character, the significance, and the necessary consequences of great historical events at a time when these events are actually in course of taking place, or are only just completed."
~ Sydenham, April, 1896.


* Der Achtzehnte Brumaire des Louis Bonaparte = The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte.

📙 Revolution and Counter-Revolution or, Germany in 1848 was first published in book form in 1896. The originals, as singular published articles, were written in 1852.

*˚˚*•̩̩͙How I happened upon this book: Decided to re-read what works I could regarding Marxism due to the current political and social events of 2024.

🟢The e-book version can be found at Project Gutenberg.
🟣 Kindle.
▬ ▬ ▬ ▬ ▬
Profile Image for Sean.
11 reviews
July 7, 2019
One of several gems from this work:
"Now, insurrection is an art quite as much as war or any other, and subject to certain rules of proceeding, which, when neglected, will produce the ruin of the party neglecting them. Those rules, logical deductions from the nature of the parties and the circumstances one has to deal with in such a case, are so plain and simple that the short experience of 1848 had made the Germans pretty well acquainted with them. Firstly, never play with insurrection unless you are fully prepared to face the consequences of your play. Insurrection is a calculus with very indefinite magnitudes, the value of which may change every day; the forces opposed to you have all the advantage of organization, discipline, and habitual authority: unless you bring strong odds against them you are defeated and ruined. Secondly, the insurrectionary career once entered upon, act with the greatest determination, and on the offensive. The defensive is the death of every armed rising; it is lost before it measures itself with its enemies. Surprise your antagonists while their forces are scattering, prepare new successes, however small, but daily; keep up the moral ascendancy which the first successful rising has given to you; rally those vacillating elements to your side which always follow the strongest impulse, and which always look out for the safer side; force your enemies to a retreat before they can collect their strength against you; in the words of Danton, the greatest master of revolutionary policy yet known, de l'audace, de l'audace, encore de l'audace!"
Profile Image for Richard.
399 reviews30 followers
June 8, 2025
Finally finished this. I remember students from BYU who majored in Sociology, and would defend Marx and his Hegelian dialectical schemes. Many would argue that his plans for Communism weren't put into practice, which was never true.

The more I read Marx's works, it makes me wonder if BYU students who studied Marxism ever read his stuff, because his own words are either disproving their defenses for him, or the professors from which they got their information from.

Karl Marx favored violence, he favored insurrection, and condoned bloody revolution. He even makes a reflection upon the French Revolution for his arguments in this, and condemned the American Revolution, which is rather telling.

I also find it ironic how he plays the victim in his exile in Britain as a Communist "refugee", when he was actually a fugitive of the law. He was using the local "newspapers" in Germany and France, in order to provoke a public reaction against those Governments. He was calling for a violent revolution and rationalized in his demagogic way to persuade others to his point-of-view.
Profile Image for Kyle Licht.
42 reviews3 followers
Read
March 15, 2023
To be honest, I didn’t understand much of it. I would need to know the specific historical context before reading it, or to have a reading guide. One thing jumped out to me though.

End of chapter 15. Quote about being more concerned with a man’s actions, and not his professions. This is Engels taking a dialectical approach.
127 reviews2 followers
January 4, 2025
Listened via audiobook.

Interesting compilation of various articles, detailing the smaller elements of each class with a particular focus on 1848 Vienna. It was also interesting to hear of the rubbish quality forgeries committed.
Profile Image for Brandon Istenes.
44 reviews8 followers
September 26, 2020
3.5 stars. 5 stars for glorious and continuous dunks on the Frankfurt Assembly. -1.5 stars for racist dunks on Slavs.
Profile Image for Pozzo.
34 reviews9 followers
October 12, 2022
habe es spontan vor der Lektüre des 18. Brumaires gelesen. Gute Erklärung der Prozesse die damals in Deutschland stattfanden mit Klassenanalysen,...

natürlich 170 jahre später schwerer zu verstehen
109 reviews1 follower
December 10, 2022
A good overview of the 1848 Revolution in Germany
Profile Image for Larva Parva.
46 reviews
November 28, 2025
fascinating to learn about the revolutionary wave but why did he suddenly start saying that jewish ppl corrupted germany & slavic people don't deserve to own any land because they're inferior 🤨
Profile Image for Max Volovik.
27 reviews4 followers
May 9, 2024
Долгие годы считалось, что писал книгу Маркс, но он был только редактором. Текст представлен главами быстрой реакцией на политические события в Европе того времени. Все очень интересно, но интонация резкая и как мы теперь знаем, утопическая, что не отнимает значения высказываний.
2 reviews
March 4, 2017
this is a good book from a phenomenal person, karl max criticize everyone (how society and government make their country not even better), but i read use indonesian language and the translator is really bad, make me think twice before understand the meaning and you need to know about germany revolution before read this (unlucky, i dont even know what's happening in germany).
Profile Image for Pausonious.
45 reviews11 followers
December 29, 2019
Great contemporary historical account of the 1848 German bourgeois revolution. Marx's butthurt is immense against middle class incompetency and cowardice and he really reams the shite out of the class generally and their leaders specifically. His criticism of the Hungarians for their hesitance to aid the Viennese in revolt was a bit unfair I thought. Why would they who later fought on their own terms and won victories under those conditions jeopardize that potential to help the revolt in the capital that got subdued in a couple of days because of insufficient means and incompetency?
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