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Grimms' Bad Girls and Bold Boys: The Moral and Social Vision of the Tales
The fairy tale collection of the brothers Grimm has been a central document in German social and literary history for generations, mined for various purposes by scholars of many persuasions. This book, the first in more than fifty years to examine the entire body of tales, provides a thorough content analysis, focusing in particular on the use of gender in the stories.
Ruth B. Bottigheimer’s close analysis of several major editions of Grimms’ Tales reveals coherent patterns of motif, plot, and image and also affords insight into the moral and social vision of the collection. Bottigheimer discusses, for example, the relationship between transgression and punishment, noting that gender distinctions rather than the severity of the sin determined the consequences of transgressing prohibitions. She finds that in the course of the Tales’ editorial history, speech was systematically taken away from women and given to men. She shows how common elements unite images and themes as disparate as abandonment in the forest, subliminal eroticism, violence, and Christianity in the Tales. And she treats their social and ethical bases, analyzing such aspects of the plots as the workings of the judicial process and the relation of anti-Semitism to the economics of work and money.
According to Bottigheimer, Freudians praise fairy tales as contributing to children’s moral education; although Jungians recognize the gender distinctions inherent in the tales, they treat the collection ahistorically, ignoring its nineteenth-century German origins. By combining a sociohistorical analysis of these stories with close scrutiny of the language in which they are told, Bottigheimer radically alters the uses to which Grimms’ Tales can be put in the future by historians, psychologists, feminists, and educators.
Ruth B. Bottigheimer’s close analysis of several major editions of Grimms’ Tales reveals coherent patterns of motif, plot, and image and also affords insight into the moral and social vision of the collection. Bottigheimer discusses, for example, the relationship between transgression and punishment, noting that gender distinctions rather than the severity of the sin determined the consequences of transgressing prohibitions. She finds that in the course of the Tales’ editorial history, speech was systematically taken away from women and given to men. She shows how common elements unite images and themes as disparate as abandonment in the forest, subliminal eroticism, violence, and Christianity in the Tales. And she treats their social and ethical bases, analyzing such aspects of the plots as the workings of the judicial process and the relation of anti-Semitism to the economics of work and money.
According to Bottigheimer, Freudians praise fairy tales as contributing to children’s moral education; although Jungians recognize the gender distinctions inherent in the tales, they treat the collection ahistorically, ignoring its nineteenth-century German origins. By combining a sociohistorical analysis of these stories with close scrutiny of the language in which they are told, Bottigheimer radically alters the uses to which Grimms’ Tales can be put in the future by historians, psychologists, feminists, and educators.
234 pages, Paperback
First published July 1, 1987
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About the author
Ruth B. Bottigheimer
22 books11 followersRuth B. Bottigheimer, is a Research Professor in the Department of Comparative Literary and Cultural Studies at Stony Brook University, State University of New York, is a leading historian of European fairy tales. Her conclusion that the most popular modern fairy tale plot originated in Renaissance Venice has been hotly contested and occasioned the October 2010 issue of the Journal of American Folklore. Her publications include Fairy Tales: A New History (2009), Gender and Story in South India, ed. with Lalita Handoo and Leela Prasad (2007), and Fairy Godfather: Straparola, Venice, and the Fairy Tale Tradition (2002). Past publications include The Bible for Children: From the Age of Gutenberg to the Present (1996), Grimm’s Bad Girls and Bold Boys: The Moral and Social Vision of the Tales (1987), and Fairy Tales and Society: Illusion, Allusion and Paradigm, ed. (1987), as well as articles on European fairy tales, the history of illustration, and the socialisation of children through Bible narratives. She also reviews widely, has contributed numerous encyclopaedia articles, and has translated many scholarly articles into English.
She is a Life Fellow of Clare Hall, Cambridge, held a seven-year visiting fellowship at Magdalen College Oxford 1997-2004), and has taught at Princeton University, Hollins University, and the Universities of Innsbruck, Göttingen, Siegen, and Vienna. An active member of professional organisations in the fields of folk narrative and children’s literature, she also serves on the editorial boards of scholarly journals in her fields and is continuing research in the history of early British children’s literature and the overall history of fairy tales in Europe and in nineteenth- and twentieth-century overseas colonies.
Ongoing research includes shifting relationships between magic and heroes and heroines in tales of the fantastic from ancient Egypt to the Renaissance, fairy tale authors’ prefaces to and comments on their own works (from the Renaissance to the nineteenth century), and the literary basis of fairy tales that have become so widely known that they are routinely used in film, commerce, and literature, as well as told by ordinary people.
She is a Life Fellow of Clare Hall, Cambridge, held a seven-year visiting fellowship at Magdalen College Oxford 1997-2004), and has taught at Princeton University, Hollins University, and the Universities of Innsbruck, Göttingen, Siegen, and Vienna. An active member of professional organisations in the fields of folk narrative and children’s literature, she also serves on the editorial boards of scholarly journals in her fields and is continuing research in the history of early British children’s literature and the overall history of fairy tales in Europe and in nineteenth- and twentieth-century overseas colonies.
Ongoing research includes shifting relationships between magic and heroes and heroines in tales of the fantastic from ancient Egypt to the Renaissance, fairy tale authors’ prefaces to and comments on their own works (from the Renaissance to the nineteenth century), and the literary basis of fairy tales that have become so widely known that they are routinely used in film, commerce, and literature, as well as told by ordinary people.
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Displaying 1 - 15 of 15 reviews
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April 24, 2017When I was young I imagined writing just such a book, but had no idea where to start--once I got to Europe, the archives at the university library and (I got one visit) the palace were so enormous, and there I was a dirt-poor student. (One without a head for the logic and rigor demanded of such a task.)
So I was thrilled to discover that someone had embarked on what I had wanted to do: tease out hints of social and cultural history from the Grimm Brothers' collections. Bottigheimer does what I think a superlative job--she quotes the relevant lines, she tracks down alternate version.
Her point that Germany suffered a type of group humiliation after Napoleon's depredations seems convincing; not just fairy tales but German poetry, plays, etc, reflected a hankering for their medieval past, and a taste for fantasy and other worlds all during the nineteenth century . . . all the while anti-Semitism was on the rise. She traces that, too, in these stories, showing how fertile a ground was prepared for Hitler's poison seed.
Grimm and grim.
So I was thrilled to discover that someone had embarked on what I had wanted to do: tease out hints of social and cultural history from the Grimm Brothers' collections. Bottigheimer does what I think a superlative job--she quotes the relevant lines, she tracks down alternate version.
Her point that Germany suffered a type of group humiliation after Napoleon's depredations seems convincing; not just fairy tales but German poetry, plays, etc, reflected a hankering for their medieval past, and a taste for fantasy and other worlds all during the nineteenth century . . . all the while anti-Semitism was on the rise. She traces that, too, in these stories, showing how fertile a ground was prepared for Hitler's poison seed.
Grimm and grim.
May 24, 2021
Wilhelm Grimm was a misogynist, racist, anti-semitic, disgusting little man and it reflects on every single tale he edited for their collections.
As someone who was raised on the watered down but still kind of questionable Disney versions of these tales, I can't help but feel very sorry for the great amount of children who were raised on the horrific original stories.
Overall, this book; although wordy, gives tons of insight into all of the recurring themes in the tales and offers direct evidence from different collection editions and shows comparisons and explanations on how they changed overtime. Good read if you're willing to get very angry at someone who died one hundred and a half years ago.
As someone who was raised on the watered down but still kind of questionable Disney versions of these tales, I can't help but feel very sorry for the great amount of children who were raised on the horrific original stories.
Overall, this book; although wordy, gives tons of insight into all of the recurring themes in the tales and offers direct evidence from different collection editions and shows comparisons and explanations on how they changed overtime. Good read if you're willing to get very angry at someone who died one hundred and a half years ago.
March 8, 2018
A good look at the social implications of the Grimm fairy tales. A bit outdated at this point, but still worth the read
December 11, 2020
I kind off expected a scathing take-down of the representation of gender in the Grimm’s Tales and their historical background. Didn’t get much of it. Seems more like someone got a school paper published.
The whole book consists of a rather lackluster literary analysis that just drones on and on without much meat on the bones.
There are some interesting points in between, but they don't really stand apart from the rest and it would be easy to miss them. Not all of the arguments are particularly convincing, though. Mostly just Bottingheimer rattling of lists and random examples presented as evidence for a point whether or not they thoroughly back up said point.
For every subject, chapter, and superficial analysis, it's always just 2-3 texts being compared to make wide sweeping statements about the entire collection of tales. Just a couple of texts that seems to be chosen really arbitrary and then forcing arguments and points from them.
The use of an overabundance of seemingly arbitrary examples, from both the presented stories and a bunch of random add-ons coming out of left field, often deter from or at times undermines the points being made. It also often leads to strange tangents, drawing connections out of nowhere without explaining why it was brought up.
The book would bennefit from being heavily edited, removing the rattling-on and focusing on making the points stand out clearer, more structured and substantiated.
The book doesn't deserve 3 stars, honestly, but some important points were made and I'd like to honor them, I guess.
The whole book consists of a rather lackluster literary analysis that just drones on and on without much meat on the bones.
There are some interesting points in between, but they don't really stand apart from the rest and it would be easy to miss them. Not all of the arguments are particularly convincing, though. Mostly just Bottingheimer rattling of lists and random examples presented as evidence for a point whether or not they thoroughly back up said point.
For every subject, chapter, and superficial analysis, it's always just 2-3 texts being compared to make wide sweeping statements about the entire collection of tales. Just a couple of texts that seems to be chosen really arbitrary and then forcing arguments and points from them.
The use of an overabundance of seemingly arbitrary examples, from both the presented stories and a bunch of random add-ons coming out of left field, often deter from or at times undermines the points being made. It also often leads to strange tangents, drawing connections out of nowhere without explaining why it was brought up.
The book would bennefit from being heavily edited, removing the rattling-on and focusing on making the points stand out clearer, more structured and substantiated.
The book doesn't deserve 3 stars, honestly, but some important points were made and I'd like to honor them, I guess.
November 26, 2013
Bottigheimer address many issues concerning fairy tales in this book from women's roles to trees to dialogue. Instead of narrowing her focus to one area, the author highlights many different subjects. This brings about many conclusions which leaves the reader feeling a bit confused. I am unsure of her overall message. However, this book is helpful if you want to look a brief overview of the social, gender, and spiritual themes in Grimm's fairy tales.
July 29, 2020
A very good book. I appreciated the thoroughness on topics and the author's approach to the Tales as a whole, especially looking at subsequent revisions. The pattern-tracking across the tales and through revisions was a really good tool to look at the social and moral context that they were collected and revised in. Honestly the patterns of punishing and silencing women were infuriating when it was all laid out like that, even though I already had negative reactions to some individual tales.
The first chapter is really dense academic writing (a function, I think, of situating the author's work in the context of existing research and history of the Tales), but the remaining chapters are much more accessible. Especially for academic writing! I found it easy enough to follow with my low-to-medium familiarity with the tales (knowing the popular ones and a few of the less common ones) and with basically no knowledge of German (the author translates basically anything you really need to know).
I'm really interested to go back and read the different revisions of the tales (translated to English of course) with this book in mind. And check out what the author has written since this book!
The first chapter is really dense academic writing (a function, I think, of situating the author's work in the context of existing research and history of the Tales), but the remaining chapters are much more accessible. Especially for academic writing! I found it easy enough to follow with my low-to-medium familiarity with the tales (knowing the popular ones and a few of the less common ones) and with basically no knowledge of German (the author translates basically anything you really need to know).
I'm really interested to go back and read the different revisions of the tales (translated to English of course) with this book in mind. And check out what the author has written since this book!
April 16, 2021
“The intelligence and sanity of [Bottigheimer’s] investigation and the thorough command of her subject that supports it are exemplary.”
This is one of the quotes on the back cover, and it is a perfect description of the book.
Unlike some social critiques stemming from (or masquerading as) hermeneutics, this book is not is not a cherry-picked collection of anecdotes to defend a preconceived thesis; it is a reasonable and thoughtful analysis with conclusions that follow where the data leads. It is not a poorly founded indictment of society as a whole via overly broad claims resting on overly limited evidence; its narrow, specific claims are restricted to what the evidence supports, and stronger for it. It, in other words, is not a politically motivated a polemic or manifesto; it is a literary analysis. And a highly competent one, extraordinarily well informed and insightfully carried out. It is, in short, both intelligent and sane. Which is always refreshing.
This is one of the quotes on the back cover, and it is a perfect description of the book.
Unlike some social critiques stemming from (or masquerading as) hermeneutics, this book is not is not a cherry-picked collection of anecdotes to defend a preconceived thesis; it is a reasonable and thoughtful analysis with conclusions that follow where the data leads. It is not a poorly founded indictment of society as a whole via overly broad claims resting on overly limited evidence; its narrow, specific claims are restricted to what the evidence supports, and stronger for it. It, in other words, is not a politically motivated a polemic or manifesto; it is a literary analysis. And a highly competent one, extraordinarily well informed and insightfully carried out. It is, in short, both intelligent and sane. Which is always refreshing.
December 5, 2019
Bottigheimer offers a very in-depth study of Grimm's Tales that shows incredible insights into the moral and social values Wilhelm Grimm specifically permeated his tales with. At times shocking to read how he reworked the fairy tales in order to make his female characters either silent and complacent or downright devious and cruel.
August 10, 2018
Ughhhhh. Too academic for me. I could have just read the dust jacket and saved myself four days.
August 29, 2025
This book was such an interesting read! Bottigheimer's attention to detail in breaking down the language of the Tales is very impressive and her arguments are convincing. While I'm entirely on board with her emphasis that the Tales reflect a time and place rather than a universal truth or unconsciousness, I wish there was slightly more emphasis on the Grimm's editorial hand. That being said, she is so acutely methodical in her investigation of symbolism, language and gender roles that it leaves little to be desired.
October 14, 2016
Personally, I think that if you're going to read the Brother Grimm's Fairy Tales in anyway seriously, this is a book to keep by your side. Its major fault is that it leans slightly toward the didactic, but hey, it's what we're here for, reading a university press book, right?
Hell, even just as someone who is thinking about going into writing, or just wants to delve into the history of Grimms can find a lot of it here. Bottigheimer is singularly skilled at getting her points across with as much detail and evidence as possible. The final result is a book that not only dissects the perspectives of the Grimms Brothers and their interpretation of stories, but also our perception of them (and consequently, ALL OTHER STORIES, from Grimm to all the way to modern writers of today). The Grimms' fairy tales, OF ALL media, tends to be overlooked in terms of how it was influenced. Its ubiquitous "original" quality gives it the impression that it sprung forth from the ground, untouched, like friggin' Athena from Zeus head. To say that it had no middle man from mouth to page is to underestimate the men who took it upon themselves to jot down the stories being heard around them, and the intensity of their need to impact society in a way that THEY deemed fit.
This all, in turn, gives a brand new way to look at modern literature. The speaking roles, the language used to describe characters, all of it. And when you see it that way, it's disheartening to see how little has changed since the Grimms bent the stories to their will.
Hell, even just as someone who is thinking about going into writing, or just wants to delve into the history of Grimms can find a lot of it here. Bottigheimer is singularly skilled at getting her points across with as much detail and evidence as possible. The final result is a book that not only dissects the perspectives of the Grimms Brothers and their interpretation of stories, but also our perception of them (and consequently, ALL OTHER STORIES, from Grimm to all the way to modern writers of today). The Grimms' fairy tales, OF ALL media, tends to be overlooked in terms of how it was influenced. Its ubiquitous "original" quality gives it the impression that it sprung forth from the ground, untouched, like friggin' Athena from Zeus head. To say that it had no middle man from mouth to page is to underestimate the men who took it upon themselves to jot down the stories being heard around them, and the intensity of their need to impact society in a way that THEY deemed fit.
This all, in turn, gives a brand new way to look at modern literature. The speaking roles, the language used to describe characters, all of it. And when you see it that way, it's disheartening to see how little has changed since the Grimms bent the stories to their will.
March 1, 2014
Pretty great, all in all. I would have liked to see examples and analysis in a more mixed format, but it was written so that several pages of examples were given followed by a short lumped analysis. I loved seeing Grimm's tales in a more complex light, and the sources, language and readability were wonderful.
April 5, 2016
Very interesting about the editing Wilhelm Grimm did on the tales, and how it mostly made the female characters less active and imposed more punishments on females than males. What I missed was wider explanations of the tales that the author handled the most, since most of them weren't familiar to me.
May 12, 2015
Scanned for the thesis. This wasn't nearly as useful as I had anticipated...or remembered. I used it once before for a Sleeping Beauty paper and it was more useful for that. Alas.
But that did mean I got through it really fast.
No rating, read for thesis.
But that did mean I got through it really fast.
No rating, read for thesis.
May 24, 2014
A very interesting insight into how the Grimm's viewed the tales, but also the world as a whole and how women played a role in it.
Displaying 1 - 15 of 15 reviews