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Are We Really Better Together? Revised Edition: An Evangelical Perspective on the Division in The UMC
The authors set out to address the division within The United Methodist Church and contend that remaining united is hurting the church and the proclamation of the gospel. Recognizing that conservative and progressive Methodists are sincere in their beliefs, the authors doubt that one side will convince the other to change their minds. They therefore suggest that a fair and amicable separation is the best course of action.
The United Methodist Church is at a crossroads. We are a divided church and the truth is we are a hurting church.
Some of us believe that our differences are so great and the ongoing battle so destructive that it's time to part ways. For over four decades conservative and progressive United Methodists have expended enormous emotional, financial and spiritual resources to gain the upper hand in a denomination that has declined every year since its founding in 1968. Surely our efforts and our finances would be better devoted to evangelism, discipleship and missions. For the sake of the lost and the poor, shouldn't we set each other free to pursue what we believe to be God's calling upon our lives and our ministries? (From the Introduction)
The United Methodist Church is at a crossroads. We are a divided church and the truth is we are a hurting church.
Some of us believe that our differences are so great and the ongoing battle so destructive that it's time to part ways. For over four decades conservative and progressive United Methodists have expended enormous emotional, financial and spiritual resources to gain the upper hand in a denomination that has declined every year since its founding in 1968. Surely our efforts and our finances would be better devoted to evangelism, discipleship and missions. For the sake of the lost and the poor, shouldn't we set each other free to pursue what we believe to be God's calling upon our lives and our ministries? (From the Introduction)
- GenresReligion
114 pages, Kindle Edition
Published February 4, 2020
32 people are currently reading
15 people want to read
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Displaying 1 - 11 of 11 reviews
January 14, 2019
A quick review of a disappointing book. The bibliography was interesting so I thought it would be interesting. It was not, fueled by cliché and anecdote more than argument.
The first chapter is basically an introduction so I am going to skip the summary. Some people have said there is a schism in the UMC.
Chapter Two offers a summary of John Wesley’s view of Scripture that is brief, and then goes into a declension narrative about the historical-critical method leading up to the postmodern readings, the Jesus Seminar, and Adam Hamilton. Conservatives are the only people who talk about postmodernity and the Jesus Seminar.
In chapter three, the author’s say that traditionalists affirm the current teaching on sexuality because it is “biblical, balanced, and compassionate.
As well, the authors criticize Hamilton’s three buckets method and then use it on page 53 with regards to the Old Testament and which laws to follow.
Chapter four claims that we are divided on mission but gets to the fact that there are legitimate criticisms of the Publishing House and the General Board of Global Missions. They then claim the key to declining growth in the Episcopal Church and the PCUSA is “having liberalized their sexual ethics.” As well, the Cal-PAC conferences decline since 1970 is because of being progressive, yet the Growth of CHurch of of the Resurrection, already mentioned as the largest UMC church in the country, is not.
The final chapter looks at the way forward, but the book was written at the same time as the way forward was taking place and published before the full plans were released, so the chapter is based on speculation.
There are three main issues masquerading as one. Scriptural authority is important and unity around the Bible would be great, but the declension narrative described is trash and hypocritical at times. Views on sexuality in the Bible are nowhere near as clear as they are made out here and so confidence about it come more from cultural inheritance than scriptural exegesis. And finally, how churches view the connection and the episcopacy is fraught and challenging. I think this is the biggest issue for large churches but it was not even well argued. I mean, GBGM has responded and changed, church and society has responded to criticism, Abingdon published this book.
But these are not the same things and to pretend they are equal is disingenuous and it makes the whole endeavor rather unhelpful and disappointing.
The first chapter is basically an introduction so I am going to skip the summary. Some people have said there is a schism in the UMC.
Chapter Two offers a summary of John Wesley’s view of Scripture that is brief, and then goes into a declension narrative about the historical-critical method leading up to the postmodern readings, the Jesus Seminar, and Adam Hamilton. Conservatives are the only people who talk about postmodernity and the Jesus Seminar.
In chapter three, the author’s say that traditionalists affirm the current teaching on sexuality because it is “biblical, balanced, and compassionate.
As well, the authors criticize Hamilton’s three buckets method and then use it on page 53 with regards to the Old Testament and which laws to follow.
Chapter four claims that we are divided on mission but gets to the fact that there are legitimate criticisms of the Publishing House and the General Board of Global Missions. They then claim the key to declining growth in the Episcopal Church and the PCUSA is “having liberalized their sexual ethics.” As well, the Cal-PAC conferences decline since 1970 is because of being progressive, yet the Growth of CHurch of of the Resurrection, already mentioned as the largest UMC church in the country, is not.
The final chapter looks at the way forward, but the book was written at the same time as the way forward was taking place and published before the full plans were released, so the chapter is based on speculation.
There are three main issues masquerading as one. Scriptural authority is important and unity around the Bible would be great, but the declension narrative described is trash and hypocritical at times. Views on sexuality in the Bible are nowhere near as clear as they are made out here and so confidence about it come more from cultural inheritance than scriptural exegesis. And finally, how churches view the connection and the episcopacy is fraught and challenging. I think this is the biggest issue for large churches but it was not even well argued. I mean, GBGM has responded and changed, church and society has responded to criticism, Abingdon published this book.
But these are not the same things and to pretend they are equal is disingenuous and it makes the whole endeavor rather unhelpful and disappointing.
July 14, 2018
Everybody has an opinion about the state of the UM Church. Renfroe makes his case for an amicable separation. Fenton contributes a realistic assessment of the challenges of any way forward. We need this kind of frank discussion in the UMC right now, and this contribution should be appreciated. However, I felt that the capitulation to dissolution may inhibit the end toward which these two strive, exposing our denomination to further decay and undermining the work of those who have served faithfully for decades and didn’t see the possibilities for renewal that we see today. If we hold fast, we may discover that the Holy Spirit isn’t done with the UMC yet!
February 22, 2019
Neither insightful nor hopeful. A fatalistic, conservative, approach. The authors treat Adam Hamilton’s interpretative framework very unfairly, comparing him to Marcion and Thomas Jefferson, in addition to the Jesus Seminar progressive scholars. This is not at all an accurate portrayal of Adam Hamilton. They also fail to display affirming arguments fairly, often resulting to straw men in my opinion. However, even excusing these problems, the fatalism is unacceptable. “Eh, let’s just break it up.” It shows little respect for Methodism and Wesley’s desire. A split like this, even if amicable, is heartbreaking and should not be endorsed.
July 21, 2022
Very Informative
I belive Refroe and Fenton do a great job of informing the two primary sides of the UMC ethical debate. There is, of course, a rhetoric for the conservative position, as this is what the book is meant to do, but it is gracious and understanding to the contrary rhetoric. I read this book in 2022, well after the 2019 called General Conference, and found it valid and meaningful. Regardless of the side an individual finds themselves on in this arena, I recommend that they read this book. It does justice to inform all sides of the issues as best as I have seen thus far.
I belive Refroe and Fenton do a great job of informing the two primary sides of the UMC ethical debate. There is, of course, a rhetoric for the conservative position, as this is what the book is meant to do, but it is gracious and understanding to the contrary rhetoric. I read this book in 2022, well after the 2019 called General Conference, and found it valid and meaningful. Regardless of the side an individual finds themselves on in this arena, I recommend that they read this book. It does justice to inform all sides of the issues as best as I have seen thus far.
May 7, 2019
I don't agree with Renfroe's position in the arguments in the UMC, but he clearly states the conservative stand. I do agree with him that schism has occurred. The actions at the February 2019 General Conference confirm his predictions. Not sure where progressive Methodists go from here, but it should not be in a church with Renfroe.
May 3, 2018
A concise overview of the Evangelical perspective of the crisis in the United Methodist Church. Worth reading for those interested or concerned about this issue.
September 5, 2022
Excellent reading of the state of the Methodist Church.
February 18, 2021
UMC vs UMC: A good decsription of the internal battle
This book decsribes the internal conflict in the United Methodist Church. It is written by Rob Renfroe who is a traditionalist. Rob does a good job describing the differences between the progressives, centralist, and traditionalist. Rob favors and concludes as a tradionalist but his writing has helped me better understand the internal conflict and arguments of the progressives and centralist. I am now going to look for more information that supports the progressives and centralist factions to better understand their position before I advocate one above the others.
This book decsribes the internal conflict in the United Methodist Church. It is written by Rob Renfroe who is a traditionalist. Rob does a good job describing the differences between the progressives, centralist, and traditionalist. Rob favors and concludes as a tradionalist but his writing has helped me better understand the internal conflict and arguments of the progressives and centralist. I am now going to look for more information that supports the progressives and centralist factions to better understand their position before I advocate one above the others.
December 1, 2021
Excellent presentation of the rift in the United Methodist Church from the Evangelical point of view. I feel so much better aware now of the issues that is being debated in our church. I appreciate the fair
explanation of the three decade old crisis that has damaged the UMC. I would recommend this book to anyone who is concerned about the upcoming general conferences where this issue will once again take center stage.
explanation of the three decade old crisis that has damaged the UMC. I would recommend this book to anyone who is concerned about the upcoming general conferences where this issue will once again take center stage.
July 4, 2018
Worth the Read
Rob Renfroe is an excellent writer and most of what he has written here is on target and helps us face the reality of where our denomination is, and how we can, with the most love possible, move forward.
Rob Renfroe is an excellent writer and most of what he has written here is on target and helps us face the reality of where our denomination is, and how we can, with the most love possible, move forward.
August 24, 2018
Now I understand. I am not confused or disillusioned anymore.
Displaying 1 - 11 of 11 reviews