That One Should Disdain Hardships: The Teachings of a Roman Stoic

by Musonius Rufus, Gretchen Reydams-Schils (Introduction), Cora E. Lutz (Editor)

Perennial wisdom from one of history’s most important but lesser-known Stoic teachers

“He knew that all a philosopher could do was respond well—bravely, boldly, patiently—to what life threw at us. That's what we should be doing now.”—Ryan Holiday, Reading List email

The Stoic philosopher Musonius Rufus was one of the most influential teachers of his era, imperial Rome, and his message still resonates with startling clarity today. Alongside Stoics like Seneca, Epictetus, and Marcus Aurelius, he emphasized ethics in action, displayed in all aspects of life. Merely learning philosophical doctrine and listening to lectures, they believed, will not do one any good unless one manages to interiorize the teachings and apply them to daily life.

In Musonius Rufus’s words, “Philosophy is nothing else than to search out by reason what is right and proper and by deeds to put it into practice.” At a time of renewed interest in Stoicism, this collection of Musonius Rufus’s lectures and sayings, beautifully translated by Cora E. Lutz with an introduction by Gretchen Reydams-Schils, offers readers access to the thought of one of history’s most influential and remarkable Stoic thinkers.

Genres: Philosophy, Nonfiction, Classics, History, Self Help, Psychology, Biography

160 pages, Paperback

First published January 1, 1947

About the author

Gaius Musonius Rufus, (c.20-30 - as late as 101), Roman Stoic philosopher. Born in Volsinii, Etruria (modern day Lazio, Italy).

Reviews

[Bob H · Rating 4 out of 5]

This is a pleasant read, in a clear translation. Musonius was an influence in his time on Roman philosophy, notably the Stoics -- Epictetus especially. Those today who have an interest in the Stoics and their work -- having discovered Marcus Aurelius or Epictetus, say -- will find this brief volume of interest. His views on marriage, women, family and education will perhaps seem curious to the modern reader, but seem thoughtful.

[Tg · Rating 4 out of 5]

I feel like people overlook Musonius too Much,
Common-sense Teachings from a very Wise Philosopher.
I feel people focus too much on the other Philosophers: Epictetus, Seneca, and Marcus Aurelius
This is Epictetus's Mentor and Teacher for 10 years.
4.75 out of 5
Wise speeches from an Ancient Sage

[Colin · Rating 5 out of 5]

An excellent compilation of the teachings of the Stoic philosopher Musonius Rufus in a nice little pocket-sized edition - my only complaint is that it is presented in translation without the original text!

[Rob · Rating 4 out of 5]

This small and interesting book seems more to me like a commonsense guide on how to be a good person than philosophical outpourings.
Again, with all these two-thousand-year-old stoics I've been reading lately, I find it amazing just how much like current people they were. The same hopes, fears and fundamental problems in life.
I'm not sure I can say I learned a lot from Musonius Rufus, but I do feel a lot of my thoughts and assumptions have been affirmed.

[Jonathan · Rating 4 out of 5]

Of course, some of the stuff in here is outdated, e.g. the views on sex and sexuality, and some perspectives on poverty and hard work. However, Mussonius simultaneously offers fascinating, and surprisingly progressive views on ancient gender roles. Combine that with the general wisdom of his Stoic teachings, and this book is highly insightful, albeit it's a shame that some of the less interesting lectures (e.g. on clothing) survive, while some of those that appear more insightful only remain as fragments. Nonetheless, I am glad to have read it, and I have learned many things.

[Matt Ely · Rating 2 out of 5]

I am no fan of Internet Stoicism. The brooptation of Marcus Aurelius turned him into less a philosopher and more a purveyor of Instagram captions. I picked this up hoping to find some contrast with a lesser-known figure of the same school.

And, well, I think my issues may just be with the school. I wonder whether the Stoics' popularity has something to do with their efficiency. You see it here as well as in the others: an insistence on the simple and singular pursuit of the key virtues. The wisdom here is bite-sized because it's less concerned with defining terms than insisting upon them. Rufus wants very much for his students be courageous, generous, healthy, and wise. But for the most part, those terms are left to the reader to interpret.

I think what bothers me about this is that it is often impossible to disagree with. For example, spouses should respect each other. People should eat healthy food. You shouldn't worry about dying. You shouldn't worry about how your hair looks too much. Okay, great. I was thinking of being sad, but you convinced me that being happy and courageous is more good. Looks like I'm fixed! This functions best as a collection of mantras than anything.

Contrast this with Socrates, a hero of Rufus'. In those Greek dialogues, the questions are just as simple, but there is no pretense at simple answers. Instead, the participants go to great lengths defining what they question is, convinced that they cannot know what words mean just by using them as they're traditionally used.

What those dialogues lack is efficiency. They aren't easy to excise and captionize. They are confusing and strange and hard. Oftentimes they don't even pretend to resolve the question they set out to answer. Rufus answers every question. He is always right and if you do what he does, you'll always be right too.

Bully for you, but that seems more like what I want my life to be like than what my life is actually like. We love the Stoics because they mirror our idealized self-perception. But we're just Socrates' dumb, confused friends if we're being honest with ourselves. Or, at least, I am.

[Rei Mariman · Rating 3 out of 5]

Meh. I disagreed with most of this and didn’t find it particularly well written or well argued.

[Alexander Olsson · Rating 4 out of 5]

"If one accomplishes some good though with toil, the toil passes, but the good remains; if one does something dishonorable with pleasure, the pleasure passes, but the dishonor remains."

En bra inspirerande sista bok för i år. Musonius Rufus var en Stoisk filosof som inspirerade många att också ta på sig uppdraget av att studera praktisk filosofi. Han levde för ca 2000 år sedan men kunde inte vara mer relevant idag. Med det sagt finns det fortfarande många idéer i hans texter som visar på tiden han levde i men bortsett från att han var ett barn av sin tid så var boken bra.

4/5.

[Javier Rivero · Rating 5 out of 5]

Interesting zoom in into the lessons from Masonious who appears to be a stoic which found the way to apply the main axis of the philosophy into more ordinary and banal activities such as food and grooming. Nonetheless his essay around hardships makes you think and reflect very deeply around one of the main components of Stoicisim: providence, and how it can be “manipulated” in our favor to grow our virtue as self-contained individuals

[شمس]

And moreover such practical exercise is the more important for the student of philosophy than for the student of medicine or any similar art, the more philosophy claims to be a greater and more difficult discipline than any other study. The reason for this is that men who enter the other professions have not had their souls corrupted beforehand and have not learned the opposite of what they are going to be taught, but the ones who start out to study philosophy have been born and reared in an environment filled with corruption and evil, and therefore turn to virtue in such a state that they need a longer and more thorough training. (6)
__________
Yet about things of which men have knowledge there is no difference of opinion, as, for examples about white and black, or hot and cold, or soft and hard, but all think the same about them and use the same words. In just the same way they would agree about justice if they knew what it was, but in. Their very lack of agreement they reveal their ignorance. (8)
__________
The first step toward making his home such a rampart is marriage. Thus whoever destroys human marriage destroys the home, the city, and the whole human race. For it would be no just and lawful procreation of children without marriage. (14)

__________
But those who require proofs at every point, even where the matter is perfectly clear, or demand to have demonstrated at length things which could be explained briefly are completely inept and dull-witted. (1)

How true this is we may readily recognise if we chance to know two lads or young men, of whom one has been reared in luxury, his body effeminate, his spirit weakened by soft living, and having besides a dull and torpid disposition; the other reared somewhat in the Spartan manner, unaccustomed to luxury, practiced in self-restraint, and ready to listen to sound reasoning. If then we place these two young men in the position of pupils of a philosopher arguing that death, toil, poverty, and the like, are not evils, or again that life, pleasure, wealth, and the like, are not goods, do you imagine that both will give heed to the argument in the same fashion, and that one will be persuaded by it in the same degree as the other?

For take the common man; when asked whether he its stupid or intelligent, not one will confess to being stupid; or again, when asked whether he is just or unjust, not one will say that he is unjust. In the same way, if one asks him whether he is temperate or intemperate, he replies at once that he is temperate; and finally, if one adds whether he is good or bad, he would say that he is good, even though he cn name no teacher of virtue or mention any study or practice of virtue he has ever made. Of what, then, is this evidence if not of the existence of an innate inclination of the human soul toward goodness and nobleness, and of the presence of the seeds of virtue . . . an inclination toward virtue is inborn in each one of us. (2)

For this reason it seems to me that Socrates too called philosophy the statesmanlike and royal discipline, because one who masters it immediately becomes a statesman. (8)

. . . but when the stopped living a life of luxury, he ceased to be ill. (9)

You name the plight of a slave, not to be able to say what one thinks. (Euripides, Jocasta to Polynices) (9)

Yet the occupations which require not too much physical exertion do not hinder the mind from reflecting on some of the higher things and by such reasoning from increasing its own wisdom—a goal toward which every philosopher earnestly strives. For this reasons I recommend particularly the life of a shepherd. But, speaking generally, if one devote himself to the life off philosophy and tills the land at the same time, I should not compare any other way of life to his nor prefer any other means of livelihood. For is it not “living more in accord with nature” to draw one’s sustenance directly from the earth, which is the nurse and mother of us all, rather than from some other source? (10)

From good men you will learn good, but if you mingle with the bad you will destroy even such soul as you had. (Theognis (?); 11)

Men who are not wantons or moral are bound to consider sexual intercourse justified only when it occurs in marriage and is indulged in for the purpose of begetting children, since that is lawful, but unjust and unlawful when it is mere pleasure-seeking, even in marriage. (12)

And yet what else is gluttony but intemperance in the matter of nourishment, cashing men to prefer what is pleasant in food to what is beneficial? And high living is nothing but excess in table luxury (18)

. . . people who eat the cheapest food are the strongest. (18)

Reflect on how many things have already happened to you in life in ways that you did not wish, and yet they have turned out for the best. (F27)

One who by living is of use to many has not the right to choose to die unless by dying he may be of use to more. (F29)

You will earn the respect of all men if you begin by earning the rest of yourself. (F30)

One man and one alone shall we consider rich, the man who has acquired the ability to want for nothing always and everywhere. (F34)

The greatest admiration yields silence rather than words. For that reason he said the wisest of poets does not have those who listened to Ulysses relating the wonderful tale of his hardships leap up and shout and cry out their approval when he finished speaking, but he says that all kept silent as if struck dumb and senseless because the pleasure they had in hearing him affected their power of speech.
“This he spoke; but they all were wished and silent
And were held spellbound throughout the shadowy halls.” (F49)

If one accomplishes some good though with toil, the toil passes, but the good remains; if one does something dishonourable with pleasure, the pleasure passes, but the dishonour remains. (F51)

To relax (remittere) the mind is to lose (amittere) it. (F52)

[Jerry Wall · Rating 3 out of 5]

Good advice from ancient philosopher. Terse and to the point of living a life of learning, teaching, debate, and forgiveness.
What sort of life is attractive, what sort of life is rewarding, what sort of life is best for each of us.
Many lessons relating to children, parents, friends, enemies, and descendants.
Stoic life has much to offer from Epictetus, Lycurgus, to Musonius.

[Enrique · Rating 4 out of 5]

Aunque discrepo con algunos pasajes, y considero algo obsoleto algún que otro pasaje suelto, creo que es un libro excelente. Cualquier persona se beneficiará de la sabiduría contenida en él.

[sanephele · Rating 3 out of 5]

another book about an adult man coming to the same conclusions that girls come to when they’re fifteen

[Joshua Best · Rating 2 out of 5]

“If anyone thinks that wealth is the greatest consolation of old age, and that to acquire it is to live without sorrow, he is quite mistaken; wealth is able to procure for man the pleasures of eating and drinking and other sensual pleasures, but he can never afford cheerfulness of spirit nor freedom from sorrow....” - Musonius Rufus, Lesson 17

Today’s review is on a classic text that’s hard to avoid when we talk about Stoicism. To be honest, Musonius isn’t on many people’s list of their top 3 Stoics. That’s an honor usually saved for Aurelius, Seneca and Epictetus. However, he was an incredibly influential teacher who unfortunately didn’t leave his own writing behind for us to explore. Instead, history has given us the chance to review a written piece by an unnamed student as well as several fragments attributed to Musonius.

I think it’s important to remember that Musonius didn’t write this collection. That means we lose the ability to discern how accurate these notes are to the teacher’s intent, but I do think they show us a fairly decent insight into how the Romans viewed the role of philosophy in the first century. Philosophy existed as system to reinforce order in Roman society. Purpose was derived from how your actions benefited the greater good—which really means the Empire. Keep this in mind as you read.

The author relies heavily on the use of logical proofs to demonstrate the validity of his viewpoint. That means that we see some errors as modern readers that may not have been so obvious 2000 years ago. Namely, today we can see the flaw in drawing conclusions based on how we feel the universe should operate. We are less likely—I hope—to justify our actions and beliefs by claiming we’re following the “will of the gods” or some humanized concept of Nature.

We look for truth and let facts challenge our understanding of how the world works. We recognize that our perspective and beliefs significantly influence our reasoning. We also acknowledge that historically we have attempted to create systems and cultures that reinforced our understanding of how we wanted the world to work. It is against those systems of ingrained thinking that we now fight to overcome ancestral bias. Patriarchal cultures tend to create systems that enforce male authority. Theocratic cultures tend to create systems that reinforce religious autonomy. If we’re not aware of our cultural influences, how can we ensure we are not unjustly influenced by them?

This collection responds to 21 practical questions from students on how we can live our best lives in ancient Rome. The goal of each lesson was not to present perfect and logical deconstructions of life, but to present a basic and very high level validation on why we should live our lives in the Stoic manner. In many ways, the ultimate justification relied on the presupposition that 1. the gods exist (a definite belief in the Roman era) and 2. that you can decipher their will by observing Nature.

Although there are some great lessons on the value of living in accord with Stoic principles in this text—many, many, many assumptions are flawed due to the historical beliefs of the period. Some very hot topics from millennia ago are bound to still wrinkle noses today. All I can say is that I clearly disagree with Musonius’ arguments on sexuality, vegetarianism, marriage and reproductive rights. I’m sure I’m forgetting a few more issues that didn’t get my support as well, but you get my point.

For Musonius, the aim of life is not only to live in accordance with Stoic virtues (principles) that were established by the gods but also to reproduce and continue the legacy of Rome. Both of those foundational tenants are inconsequential to me. I don’t need gods to define what principles I should value. I don’t need to have children to fulfill a responsibility to either the gods or the state.

At least I can take comfort in the fact that Musonius challenges his students to be on their guard against accepting false arguments. Maybe he knew he was limited by the willingness of his audience to hear his message. In the end, though I recommend any Stoic read this seminal work, I’m going to suggest everyone else pass on it.

[Alejandro Sanoja · Rating 5 out of 5]

Want to be wiser? Read this book.

Another great book that has passed the test of time (thousands of years since it was written).

It's great to see how he dissects and thinks through different topics related to day-to-day life.

If you are interested in philosophy, you won't regret picking up this book. Short and down-to-earth.

Flow: 5/5
Actionability: 5/5
Mindset: 5/5

Some of My Highlights:

"Merely learning philosophical doctrine and listening to lectures, they state, will not do us any good unless we manage to interiorize the teachings and apply them to daily life."

"....the aim of philosophy is for Musonius to lead a life of virtue."

"Most anecdotes about Socrates' marriage know to us from antiquity depict his marital relationship as turbulent and his spouse as a shrew who understood nothing of his aims."

"A king should not only study philosophy; he should also apply it by exerting self-control and serving the common good in his rule."

"For Musonius Rufus, as we have seen, to engage in philosophy means to apply its teaching in practice and in everyday life."

"Ant the pupil too, the quicker his intelligence, the fewer proofs he will require, and the sooner he will assent to the conclusion of the argument in question, provided it be sound."

"...the other reared somewhat in the Spartan manner, unaccustomed to luxury, practiced in self-restraint, and ready to listen to sound reasoning."

"But most of all his treatment should consist in showing himself not only as one who utters words which are most helpful, but as one who acts consistently with them."

"...for the only way to escape from wantonness is through self-control; there is no other."

"I only urge that they should acquire from philosophy goodness in conduct and nobility of character."

"In effectiveness, however, practice takes precedence over theory as being more influential in leading men to action."

"How, indeed, could a person immediately become temperate if he only knew that one must not be overcome by pleasures, but was quite unpracticed in withstanding pleasures?"

"Therefore upon the learning of the lessons appropriate to each and every excellence, practical training must follow invariably, if indeed from the lessons we have learned we hope to derive any benefit."

"For obviously the philosopher's body should be well prepared for physical activity, because often the virtues make use of this as a necessary instrument of the affairs of life."

"We use the training common to both when we discipline ourselves to cold, heat, thirst, hunger, meagre rations, hard beds, avoidance of pleasures, and patience under suffering."

"...to become good and just and self-controlled, a state which no man achieves without hardships."

"For the first duty of a king is to be able to protect and benefit his people..."

"In an ordinary man when these qualities are present they give him dignity and self-command, but if they be present in a king they make him preeminently godlike and worthy of reverence."

"For my part, I believe that the good king is straightway and of necessity a philosopher, and the philosopher a kingly person."

"In fact, there have been cases where exile was an absolute blessing, as it was to Diogenes, who by his exile was transformed from an ordinary citizen into a philosopher, and instead of sitting idly in Sinope, he busied himself in Greece, and in the pursuit of virtue came to surpass the philosophers."

[Greg Mcneilly · Rating 5 out of 5]

THAT THOU SHALL DISDAIN HARDSHIPS | Rufus, Musonius, Yale University Press, p124.

This is a handy reprint of the teachings of Gaius Musonius Rufus; a late period Stoic philosopher known mostly for being Epictetus’ teacher. His renown for right-action even drew accolades from early Christian writers like Origen.

Some of his appeals are easy to dismiss with our modern sensibilities as excessive Puritanism (not cutting beards, avoiding spices, preferring the hard bed to the soft); yet, in total, reading his defense of a more Spartan lifestyle is compelling for its assistance in leading a life free of wantonness.

Regardless of the practicality of his specifics, reading Musonius, it is difficult to see modern life without a better understanding of the corruption and decay wrought by our lavish decadence. This is not the theme nor aim of his teachings, just an all too obvious recognition. His lessons also taught the equality in spirit and purpose of both men and women, an uncommon outlook for his time.

Musonius preached the four cardinal Stoic virtues of wisdom, justice, courage, and temperance. He notes “philosophy is nothing else than to search out by reason what is right and proper and by deeds put them into action.”

He addressed marriage, family, and child-rearing in a fashion unique amongst his contemporaries. He did not find the necessity of such bonds in their utility to the common good, although he acknowledged this, Musonius found merit inherent in their purpose. He spoke against abortion, practiced as a luxury of convenience.

His writings conclude with two dozen “fragments” that read as maximums. Such as: “It is not possible to live well today unless one thinks of it as his last.” Or, “One begins to lose his hesitation to do unseemly things when one loses his hesitation to speak of them.”

Musonius asks, “shall we not be ready to endure hardship for the sake of complete happiness?” In his world - as in ours - hardship was the requisite sacrifice of good character.
wledged them but for their inherit luxuryconvenienceIn his world - as in ours - the hardship was the requisite sacrifices
#Books

[Lucy Faria · Rating 3 out of 5]

In order to support more easily and more cheerfully those hardships which we may expect to suffer in behalf of virtue and goodness, it is useful to recall what hardships people will endure for unworthy ends. Thus for example consider what intemperate lovers undergo for the sake of evil desires, and how much exertion others expend for the sake of making a profit, and how much suffering those who are pursuing fame endure, and bear in mind that all of these people submit to all kinds of toil and hardship voluntarily. Is it not then monstrous that they for no honorable reward endure such things, while we for the sake of the ideal good-that is, not only the avoidance of evil such as wrecks our lives, but also the acquisition of virtue, which we may call the provider of all goods— are not ready to bear every hardship? And yet would not anyone admit how much better it is, in place of exerting oneself to win someone else's wife, to exert oneself to discipline one's desires; in place of enduring hardships for the sake of money, to train oneself to want little; instead of giving oneself trouble about getting notoriety, to give oneself trouble how not to thirst

[Mary · Rating 4 out of 5]

Not as famous as the other Roman Stoics like that darling of modern stoics and ancient, Marcus Aurelius, but Musonius Rufus gets down to brass tacks: Should you get married? Cut your hair? What kind of cups should you buy? These are not trivial questions, but necessary application of stoic philosophy. Feminists get excited about his vehement support of teaching philosophy just as rigorously to women as to men, if some (like Martha Nassbaum) take issue with his sexual prudism. Still, there's a lot to be said for someone who says, "Hey, just because you have a female slave, it doesn't mean it's okay to sleep with her." There's a romantic description of marriage as "perfect companionship and mutual love" and a similarly domestic extrapolation in "That Kings Should Also Study Philosophy," where pretty much anywhere you see "king," you can read "parent," which Musonius himself approves: "Even if he does not have many subjects obedient to him, he is not for that reason less kingly, for it is enough to rule one's friends or one's... children or, for that matter, only oneself" (39).

[Jackson · Rating 3 out of 5]

Musonius Rufus gives some surprisingly progressive/inclusive writings on how women too should study philosophy and adhere to stoic principles, which was refreshing to read compared to some of the other stoic philosophers. Aside from that, there isn't too much to praise about this book. In my opinion, the core stoic ideas are far better described within Epictetus and Aurelius' writing, as much of "That One Should Disdain Hardship" is centered around social commentary rather than stoic principles. I simply don't care that Rufus thinks I should grow out my beard, become a farmer/shepherd, and wear certain clothes. The best section of the book was his "fragments" but it was only 14 pages. IMO skip this one and read Epictetus, Aurelius, and Seneca instead.

[Tony Senanayake · Rating 3 out of 5]

Rufus was one of the original Stoic philosophers and this compilation brings together much of his work. Much of his work no longer remains in writing, so it is intriguing to see these words laid out. Much of the thinking around temperance, virtue, control of oneself and the roles of genders has aged well, while other thoughts including gender-roles, sustenance and one may be considered the best career may not have aged as well into modern society.

For anyone interested in Stoic philosophy, I recommend giving this a read but not before some of the other great (Aurelius, Seneca and Epictetus in particular). The depth of thought is lacking and many of the ideas are shared in a declarative form which reduces its persuasiveness.

[Maughn Gregory · Rating 4 out of 5]

The great thing about Musonius Rufus is the way he applies fundamental principles of Stoicism to every-day questions about food, clothing, furniture, gender, marriage, and sex. It's great, not because he's obviously right (which he's not, IMHO), but because he reasons his way to his conclusions so clearly that he invites our own consideration of just where we might part company with him. Musonius takes Thoreau's caution to "Simplify!" to a level unreachable by most, but that very question of how and where to simplify, has never been more urgent or more relevant to the hope of living well and making a difference in the world.

[VII · Rating 3 out of 5]

Another book I wouldn't have picked up if I didn't have to. This version is has a helpful introduction and includes the ancient Greek text. The newer book by Cynthia King has an extra text but no introduction or the original text.

As for what Rufus has to say, it's hard to say it's worth reading. Standard stoic philosophy with an emphasis on everyday life (he even has a text on how long you should keep your hair). On the one hand too conservative (no sex even among married people except for childbearing, because in his mind it is animalistic and unhumanlike), on the other hand he says that women should study philosophy too and respects them somewhat more than what was usual.

[Jefferson Fortner · Rating 4 out of 5]

I have long been interested in the Stoic Philosophers, but I had never taken the time to read this very small book. I have read The Meditations of Marcus Aurelius, and I have read many of the writings of Seneca. I have also read extended excerpts from Epictetus, but I just have never approached this much shorter book. I found it very interesting. I like the way that Rufus grounds his ideas in the proper ways of developing Virtue in character and ignores other less tangible speculations that other philosophical schools indulge in. Basically, there is little in the way of imagination and cosmology and a complete focus on life conduct. I enjoyed that.

[Nicolas Carreño · Rating 4 out of 5]

A good book to know more about the thought of a not so popular Stoic and its subtleties. The fragments are concise, insightful and bring a wider scope to this philosophy. Nevertheless it is worth pointing out that to get the most out of this book you should have some prior knowledge of Stoicism in order to fully appreciate some of the brief comments made by Rufus.

[Zoe Honeycutt · Rating 2 out of 5]

There are some good Stoic reminders in here, but I couldn't get past the fact that the first essay is all about not giving more than 1 example to make your point, yet in every other essay he gives multiple examples to explain himself, even when you can grasp the concept after one. Makes the text dense and hard to read when really he's not saying that much. Epictetus remains my favorite Stoic.

[Ben · Rating 3 out of 5]

Great

This was a great book.

A very good stoicism read.

Now, stoicism is great and all for overcoming hardships, but no teaching in stoicism (or any other spirituality) is fully capable of overcoming hardship than the love of Jesus.
I recommend people having a hard time look towards this for everlasting life.

3.4/5

[John Matthew IV · Rating 5 out of 5]

This is a great book by an understudied Stoic.

He was Epictetus' teacher, so that proves his bona fides.

This book really made me think about marriage and having children but I really cannot change decisions I made on this.

He is against cutting hair and very much in favour of beards, so that's easy to do.

Read it slowly and savour what you read.

[Bodvar · Rating 2 out of 5]

I really tried with this book but could not finish it. Within the first chapter I felt bored and could not concentrate. I tried again and again and ended up reading half before deciding to leave it be. Probably the first book on stoicism and philosophy/history that I couldn’t get into.

[Blake · Rating 1 out of 5]

Outdated conservative thinking

Came looking to deepen my understanding of stoic philosophy, ended up reading the Jordan Peterson of ancient rome...at least i finished it i suppose

[Gina Gamba · Rating 5 out of 5]

Great read for people interested in Stoicism

This is not an easy read. Some of the topics covered are difficult like being excluded or banned from social groups. Take the bits you find helpful and leave the rest.