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The Conversations: Walter Murch and the Art of Editing Film
The Conversations is a treasure, essential for any lover or student of film, and a rare, intimate glimpse into the worlds of two accomplished artists who share a great passion for film and storytelling, and whose knowledge and love of the crafts of writing and film shine through.
It was on the set of the movie adaptation of his Booker Prize-winning novel, The English Patient, that Michael Ondaatje met the master film and sound editor Walter Murch, and the two began a remarkable personal conversation about the making of films and books in our time that continued over two years. From those conversations stemmed this enlightened, affectionate book -- a mine of wonderful, surprising observations and information about editing, writing and literature, music and sound, the I-Ching, dreams, art and history.
The Conversations is filled with stories about how some of the most important movies of the last thirty years were made and about the people who brought them to the screen. It traces the artistic growth of Murch, as well as his friends and contemporaries -- including directors such as Francis Ford Coppola, George Lucas, Fred Zinneman and Anthony Minghella -- from the creation of the independent, anti-Hollywood Zoetrope by a handful of brilliant, bearded young men to the recent triumph of Apocalypse Now Redux.
Among the films Murch has worked on are American Graffiti, The Conversation, the remake of A Touch of Evil, Julia, Apocalypse Now, The Godfather (all three), The Talented Mr. Ripley, and The English Patient.
"Walter Murch is a true oddity in Hollywood. A genuine intellectual and renaissance man who appears wise and private at the centre of various temporary storms to do with film making and his whole generation of filmmakers. He knows, probably, where a lot of the bodies are buried."
It was on the set of the movie adaptation of his Booker Prize-winning novel, The English Patient, that Michael Ondaatje met the master film and sound editor Walter Murch, and the two began a remarkable personal conversation about the making of films and books in our time that continued over two years. From those conversations stemmed this enlightened, affectionate book -- a mine of wonderful, surprising observations and information about editing, writing and literature, music and sound, the I-Ching, dreams, art and history.
The Conversations is filled with stories about how some of the most important movies of the last thirty years were made and about the people who brought them to the screen. It traces the artistic growth of Murch, as well as his friends and contemporaries -- including directors such as Francis Ford Coppola, George Lucas, Fred Zinneman and Anthony Minghella -- from the creation of the independent, anti-Hollywood Zoetrope by a handful of brilliant, bearded young men to the recent triumph of Apocalypse Now Redux.
Among the films Murch has worked on are American Graffiti, The Conversation, the remake of A Touch of Evil, Julia, Apocalypse Now, The Godfather (all three), The Talented Mr. Ripley, and The English Patient.
"Walter Murch is a true oddity in Hollywood. A genuine intellectual and renaissance man who appears wise and private at the centre of various temporary storms to do with film making and his whole generation of filmmakers. He knows, probably, where a lot of the bodies are buried."
368 pages, Paperback
First published January 1, 2002
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3461 people want to read
About the author
Michael Ondaatje
123 books4,215 followersPhilip Michael Ondaatje is a Sri Lankan-born Canadian poet, fiction writer, and essayist, renowned for his contributions to both poetry and prose. He was born in Colombo in 1943, to a family of Tamil and Burgher descent. Ondaatje emigrated to Canada in 1962, where he pursued his education, obtaining a Bachelor of Arts degree from the University of Toronto and a Master of Arts from Queen's University.
Ondaatje’s literary career began in 1967 with his poetry collection The Dainty Monsters, followed by his celebrated The Collected Works of Billy the Kid in 1970. His poetry earned him numerous accolades, including the Governor General’s Award for his collection There's a Trick with a Knife I'm Learning to Do: Poems 1973–1978 in 1979. He published 13 books of poetry, exploring diverse themes and poetic forms.
In 1992, Ondaatje gained international fame with the publication of his novel The English Patient, which won the Booker Prize and was later adapted into an Academy Award-winning film. His other notable works include In the Skin of a Lion (1987), Anil’s Ghost (2000), and Divisadero (2007), which won the Governor General’s Award. Ondaatje’s novel Warlight (2018) was longlisted for the Booker Prize.
Aside from his writing, Ondaatje has been influential in fostering Canadian literature. He served as an editor at Coach House Books, contributing to the promotion of new Canadian voices. He also co-edited Brick, A Literary Journal, and worked as a founding trustee of the Griffin Trust for Excellence in Poetry.
Ondaatje’s work spans various forms, including plays, documentaries, and essays. His 2002 book The Conversations: Walter Murch and the Art of Editing Film earned him critical acclaim and won several awards. His plays have been adapted from his novels, including The Collected Works of Billy the Kid and Coming Through Slaughter.
Over his career, Ondaatje has been honored with several prestigious awards. He was named an Officer of the Order of Canada in 1988, upgraded to Companion in 2016, and received the Sri Lanka Ratna in 2005. In 2016, a new species of spider, Brignolia ondaatjei, was named in his honor.
Ondaatje’s personal life is also intertwined with his literary pursuits. He has been married to novelist Linda Spalding, and the couple co-edits Brick. He has two children from his first marriage and is the brother of philanthropist Sir Christopher Ondaatje. He was also involved in a public stand against the PEN American Center's decision to honor Charlie Hebdo in 2015, citing concerns about the publication's anti-Islamic content.
Ondaatje’s enduring influence on literature and his ability to blend personal history with universal themes in his writing continue to shape Canadian and world literature.
Ondaatje’s literary career began in 1967 with his poetry collection The Dainty Monsters, followed by his celebrated The Collected Works of Billy the Kid in 1970. His poetry earned him numerous accolades, including the Governor General’s Award for his collection There's a Trick with a Knife I'm Learning to Do: Poems 1973–1978 in 1979. He published 13 books of poetry, exploring diverse themes and poetic forms.
In 1992, Ondaatje gained international fame with the publication of his novel The English Patient, which won the Booker Prize and was later adapted into an Academy Award-winning film. His other notable works include In the Skin of a Lion (1987), Anil’s Ghost (2000), and Divisadero (2007), which won the Governor General’s Award. Ondaatje’s novel Warlight (2018) was longlisted for the Booker Prize.
Aside from his writing, Ondaatje has been influential in fostering Canadian literature. He served as an editor at Coach House Books, contributing to the promotion of new Canadian voices. He also co-edited Brick, A Literary Journal, and worked as a founding trustee of the Griffin Trust for Excellence in Poetry.
Ondaatje’s work spans various forms, including plays, documentaries, and essays. His 2002 book The Conversations: Walter Murch and the Art of Editing Film earned him critical acclaim and won several awards. His plays have been adapted from his novels, including The Collected Works of Billy the Kid and Coming Through Slaughter.
Over his career, Ondaatje has been honored with several prestigious awards. He was named an Officer of the Order of Canada in 1988, upgraded to Companion in 2016, and received the Sri Lanka Ratna in 2005. In 2016, a new species of spider, Brignolia ondaatjei, was named in his honor.
Ondaatje’s personal life is also intertwined with his literary pursuits. He has been married to novelist Linda Spalding, and the couple co-edits Brick. He has two children from his first marriage and is the brother of philanthropist Sir Christopher Ondaatje. He was also involved in a public stand against the PEN American Center's decision to honor Charlie Hebdo in 2015, citing concerns about the publication's anti-Islamic content.
Ondaatje’s enduring influence on literature and his ability to blend personal history with universal themes in his writing continue to shape Canadian and world literature.
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 141 reviews
November 19, 2012
This is just a fantastic book about film editing from one of the professions masters. Murch is not only a great editor but he edited amazing films including The Conversation and Apocalypse Now (amazing, of course, in no small part, thanks to Murch's contributions.) Hearing the behind-the-scenes stories on these films and others is really fantastic but what makes this book so much more than the typical film history book is that Murch connects filmmaking to so many different disciplines--painting, literature, music, astronomy, to name a few. Murch is an intellectual but his observations are made from practical experience of the craft of filmmaking rather than a cinephile's theories based only on the finished product. Thus the grounded ideas that fill this book are fresh, elegant, and useful, the product of a lifetime of study and experience.
(Since I'm so steeped in film knowledge, it's hard for me to tell whether this is a book that can be enjoyed by the general public but I'm guessing that it can because the writing is in dialogue form and very straightforward.)
(Since I'm so steeped in film knowledge, it's hard for me to tell whether this is a book that can be enjoyed by the general public but I'm guessing that it can because the writing is in dialogue form and very straightforward.)
July 3, 2012
Two disclaimers: First, I'm recommending this book as a writer and not as a film editor or screenwriter. Second: I thoroughly resonated to this book because it mirrors the way I write and revise.
Having made these disclaimers, this is a book that I am recommeding to all my students. If you aren't a writer who works in a linear manner (and even if you are) this book, in which a film editor explains the way he works, is like listening in on the silent conversations writers often have with themselves when they work. The only thing that's different is that Murch is excited and exuberant. Many writers think they should have organized things from the beginning and berate themselves for having to wade through chaos.
Writers are a little like weavers, working on the wrong side of the cloth. They have to look on the other side to see what the reader will see. Walter Murch, a film editor, has the advantage of looking at the "other" side of the cloth for the first time. But at the stage he sees the film, the "other" side is chaotic without obvious highlights--full of jewels in the midst of a lot of detritus. As you read this, you realize that it's Murch who has created the final version because he assembles the jewels into a coherent necklace. He even makes things into jewels that aren't obvious and discards some that are. (Just as you discard the sentences you're in love with.)
He is generous when talking about his techniques and so is Ondaatje. Hence it really is an audible rendition of writers' silent conversations.
Without question this is a book that will be fascinating to many people--whether they are in the arts or not. It's really a visible discussion of a creative process that is usually hidden and silent, whether you compose, sculpt, paint, write, invent, or find a spin on Goeddel's theorem.
Without being a polemic, it debunks the notion that a creative work has to start as a coherent whole. (At times, of course, the whol does come all at one. But so much of the time the creative process is a switchback trail.)
Murch talks about many films, ranging from The English Patient to Rear Window to Apocalypse Now. It's fascinating to see the journey from the first shoot to the final film. Ondaatje often compares his own process to Murch's, weaving in a writer's perspective. Nonetheless, this should appeal to everyone interested in films, conversations, and the alchemy of the creative process.
Having made these disclaimers, this is a book that I am recommeding to all my students. If you aren't a writer who works in a linear manner (and even if you are) this book, in which a film editor explains the way he works, is like listening in on the silent conversations writers often have with themselves when they work. The only thing that's different is that Murch is excited and exuberant. Many writers think they should have organized things from the beginning and berate themselves for having to wade through chaos.
Writers are a little like weavers, working on the wrong side of the cloth. They have to look on the other side to see what the reader will see. Walter Murch, a film editor, has the advantage of looking at the "other" side of the cloth for the first time. But at the stage he sees the film, the "other" side is chaotic without obvious highlights--full of jewels in the midst of a lot of detritus. As you read this, you realize that it's Murch who has created the final version because he assembles the jewels into a coherent necklace. He even makes things into jewels that aren't obvious and discards some that are. (Just as you discard the sentences you're in love with.)
He is generous when talking about his techniques and so is Ondaatje. Hence it really is an audible rendition of writers' silent conversations.
Without question this is a book that will be fascinating to many people--whether they are in the arts or not. It's really a visible discussion of a creative process that is usually hidden and silent, whether you compose, sculpt, paint, write, invent, or find a spin on Goeddel's theorem.
Without being a polemic, it debunks the notion that a creative work has to start as a coherent whole. (At times, of course, the whol does come all at one. But so much of the time the creative process is a switchback trail.)
Murch talks about many films, ranging from The English Patient to Rear Window to Apocalypse Now. It's fascinating to see the journey from the first shoot to the final film. Ondaatje often compares his own process to Murch's, weaving in a writer's perspective. Nonetheless, this should appeal to everyone interested in films, conversations, and the alchemy of the creative process.
November 27, 2020
مایکل انداتجه(اونداتیه یا انداج) را خیلیها با رمان 《بیمار انگلیسی》میشناسن. در این کتاب انداتجه بخاطر علاقه خودش به سینما و برخلاف روال نویسندگیش میره و با یکی از بزرگترین تدوینگران و صداگذاران حال حاضر، یعنی والتر مرچ به گفتگو میشنیه.
کتاب شامل چهار جلسه مکالمه در زمانهای متفاوته به همراه تکگفتارهایی از افرادی که با مرچ کار کردن، مثل کاپولا.
کتاب رو نه فقط به علاقهمندان به تدوین و صداگذاری، که به عاشقان سینمایی که کرم دونستن درباره جزئیات تاریخ سینما دارن هم شدیدا پیشنهاد میکنم. مرچ در اینجا کلی اطلاعات جالب دربارهی مراحل ساخت 《پدرخوانده》،《مکالمه》،《سبکی تحملناپذیر هستی》و خیلی فیلمهای دیگه میده.
کتاب شامل چهار جلسه مکالمه در زمانهای متفاوته به همراه تکگفتارهایی از افرادی که با مرچ کار کردن، مثل کاپولا.
کتاب رو نه فقط به علاقهمندان به تدوین و صداگذاری، که به عاشقان سینمایی که کرم دونستن درباره جزئیات تاریخ سینما دارن هم شدیدا پیشنهاد میکنم. مرچ در اینجا کلی اطلاعات جالب دربارهی مراحل ساخت 《پدرخوانده》،《مکالمه》،《سبکی تحملناپذیر هستی》و خیلی فیلمهای دیگه میده.
July 27, 2020
این کتاب خوبیه مخصوصا اگر به تدوین علاقه داشته باشین یا نمیدونین اصن تدوین تو سینما چیه و چرا حتی به اندازه کارگردانی و فیلمنامه مهمه خوندش می تونه خیلی مفید باشه.
و خود والتر مرچ هم به شدت تدوین گر خیلی خوبیه مخصوصا خودم تدوین اینک آخرالزمان و جارهد رو خیلی دوست دارم.
درباره تدوین بیمار انگلیسی هم اوایل کتاب زیاد حرف زدن من خودم فیلمش رو هنوز ندیدم ولی گفتگوهاشون برام خیلی جذاب بود.
ایرادی که من به خود کتاب دارم تدوینشه :)))
آخراش دیگه به نظرم خیلی تکراری شده بود و همینطور خسته کننده و می تونست حذفیات زیادی داشته باشه.
به قول برسون با اضافه کردن نمی توان خلق کرد ولی با حذف چرا. :))
و خود والتر مرچ هم به شدت تدوین گر خیلی خوبیه مخصوصا خودم تدوین اینک آخرالزمان و جارهد رو خیلی دوست دارم.
درباره تدوین بیمار انگلیسی هم اوایل کتاب زیاد حرف زدن من خودم فیلمش رو هنوز ندیدم ولی گفتگوهاشون برام خیلی جذاب بود.
ایرادی که من به خود کتاب دارم تدوینشه :)))
آخراش دیگه به نظرم خیلی تکراری شده بود و همینطور خسته کننده و می تونست حذفیات زیادی داشته باشه.
به قول برسون با اضافه کردن نمی توان خلق کرد ولی با حذف چرا. :))
November 8, 2018
اغراق نکردهام اگر بگویم خواندن این کتاب در چهگونگی فهم یک فیلم و نیز در چهگونگی به کار بردن تمهیدات سینمایی برای انتقال مفاهیم، به من کمک کرد. از خواندنش خوشحالم و افسوس که در میان کتابهای سینمایی از این قبیل آثار را به ندرت میتوان یافت. شاید علتش همان باشد که خود والتر مرچ میگوید (نقل به مضمون): سینما هنر جوانیست و هنوز زبان آن به شکل مدون جمعآوری نشده است.
ترجمهی کتاب قابل قبول است اما شلخته و پر از اشتباهات سادهای که به نظر میرسد با یک بار خواندن دقیق قابل حل بوده است. این اشتباهات آدم را نسبت به صحت متن دچار شک میکند. نمونهی سادهاش این است که والتر مرچ و مایکل انداچ (مصاحبهشونده و مصاحبهکننده) یکی در میان همدیگر را تو و شما خطاب میکنند! این نمونه را ببینید
کی میتوانید بگویی قسمتهای اضافه شده با کلیت فیلم هماهنگ است یا نه؟
عجیب آن که کتاب نام دو مترجم را روی جلد دارد. یعنی ایندو کار همدیگر را نمیخواندهاند؟
نکتهی دیگر ترجمهی نامأنوس برخی اصطلاحات است. مثلاً کتاب و فیلم «سبکی تحمل ناپذیر هستی» که به فارسی «بار هستی» ترجمه شده است، در چند جای کتاب با هر دو عنوان ثبت شده است. یا اصطلاح
The Decisive Moment
که توسط هانری کارتیه برسون ابداع شده و بین عکاسان ایرانی به «لحظهی قطعی» شناخته میشود، در کتاب «لحظهی سرنوشتساز» ترجمه شده است. همچنین اصطلاح «اسمبل کردن» که بین تدوینگران به یک فرآیند مشخص فنی اشاره دارد، ردیف کردن ترجمه شده است که میتواند درست باشد اما گمراه کننده است چون اصطلاحی جا نیفتاده است و ممکن است خوانندهی کتاب منظور را درک نکند.
ترجمهی کتاب قابل قبول است اما شلخته و پر از اشتباهات سادهای که به نظر میرسد با یک بار خواندن دقیق قابل حل بوده است. این اشتباهات آدم را نسبت به صحت متن دچار شک میکند. نمونهی سادهاش این است که والتر مرچ و مایکل انداچ (مصاحبهشونده و مصاحبهکننده) یکی در میان همدیگر را تو و شما خطاب میکنند! این نمونه را ببینید
کی میتوانید بگویی قسمتهای اضافه شده با کلیت فیلم هماهنگ است یا نه؟
عجیب آن که کتاب نام دو مترجم را روی جلد دارد. یعنی ایندو کار همدیگر را نمیخواندهاند؟
نکتهی دیگر ترجمهی نامأنوس برخی اصطلاحات است. مثلاً کتاب و فیلم «سبکی تحمل ناپذیر هستی» که به فارسی «بار هستی» ترجمه شده است، در چند جای کتاب با هر دو عنوان ثبت شده است. یا اصطلاح
The Decisive Moment
که توسط هانری کارتیه برسون ابداع شده و بین عکاسان ایرانی به «لحظهی قطعی» شناخته میشود، در کتاب «لحظهی سرنوشتساز» ترجمه شده است. همچنین اصطلاح «اسمبل کردن» که بین تدوینگران به یک فرآیند مشخص فنی اشاره دارد، ردیف کردن ترجمه شده است که میتواند درست باشد اما گمراه کننده است چون اصطلاحی جا نیفتاده است و ممکن است خوانندهی کتاب منظور را درک نکند.
April 27, 2022
I loved this book so much! Exhilarating conversation between two great talents that I tried to enthusiastically describe to other people over dinner. It's an enormous treat to anyone interested in film. I ate it up like butter on toast but for some reason I abandoned the last 10 pages for 2 years, which is why it's languished on my reading shelf -- in this stop-motion time of latter pandemic/endless winter I finished it today.
May 7, 2020
This book is full of so much wisdom and information. I recommend watching, Godfather, The Conversation, Godfather II, Apocalypse Now, and The Talented Mr. Ripley then read this book to find out why they're as amazing as they are.
March 25, 2018
I spent a month savoring these discussions between Ondaatje and Murch. I don't think I've ever been so reluctant to return a book to the library.
Michael Ondaatje continues to amaze, and I have a new person to very much admire in Walter Murch. So many gems in here about the mysteries of creating art, of life in general, somehow put into words. Paradoxes, sound as light, ambiguity, editing. . . this book is a treasure trove of insights that have helped me with my own creative process, and understand why I love the films, books and poetry I do. (This book also added about 10 films to my must-watch list.)
Michael Ondaatje: "That's probably one reason I don't reread my books after they come out. So that my memory of Anil's Ghost or The English Patient or In the Skin of a Lion is of my emotional relationship to the book just before it came out. You are hanging fire. You don't know if it's going to work out or not, but this is the best you can do at this point. After that, as Wordsworth said, it may or may not be pudding . . . "
Walter Murch: "Yeah. It's important to hold fast in this hanging-fire state. That's the only thing, in the long run, that will allow the true lessons to emerge. It may take years for you to recognize them."
Michael Ondaatje continues to amaze, and I have a new person to very much admire in Walter Murch. So many gems in here about the mysteries of creating art, of life in general, somehow put into words. Paradoxes, sound as light, ambiguity, editing. . . this book is a treasure trove of insights that have helped me with my own creative process, and understand why I love the films, books and poetry I do. (This book also added about 10 films to my must-watch list.)
Michael Ondaatje: "That's probably one reason I don't reread my books after they come out. So that my memory of Anil's Ghost or The English Patient or In the Skin of a Lion is of my emotional relationship to the book just before it came out. You are hanging fire. You don't know if it's going to work out or not, but this is the best you can do at this point. After that, as Wordsworth said, it may or may not be pudding . . . "
Walter Murch: "Yeah. It's important to hold fast in this hanging-fire state. That's the only thing, in the long run, that will allow the true lessons to emerge. It may take years for you to recognize them."
May 23, 2020
Really enjoyed this visually as well as the interviews. What a collaborative process filmmaking is. There are so many analogies that give life to what happens before, during and after a production. This book associates the set of a film with a “beehive”. The role of the editor, often is quieter in all the buzz. But this book wants to acknowledge this “master lens”. Walter Murch happens to be an editor who has worked on projects that “have become central to the culture of our time.” He is described as a “true oddity in the world of film”...who also lives “outside the film world”.
This was another assigned MFA reading and our screenwriting cohort actually got to chat with Walter Murch on Zoom this week. With his editing career, my question for him was based on his color-coded system mentioned early on in the book. I wanted to know more about what that looks like for him and how it translates in his work. He graciously, meticulously and thoroughly shared his screen to show his process.
The book is also like that. Very candid and technical. If you are a visual artist or a writer, you can appreciate this gem and apply it to your own work to enhance your own craft. When done, it's also a nice coffee table book.
This was another assigned MFA reading and our screenwriting cohort actually got to chat with Walter Murch on Zoom this week. With his editing career, my question for him was based on his color-coded system mentioned early on in the book. I wanted to know more about what that looks like for him and how it translates in his work. He graciously, meticulously and thoroughly shared his screen to show his process.
The book is also like that. Very candid and technical. If you are a visual artist or a writer, you can appreciate this gem and apply it to your own work to enhance your own craft. When done, it's also a nice coffee table book.
April 8, 2020
درسته که تو عنوان کتاب از تدوین اسم برده شده اما تدوین تنها موضوع مصاحبه با والتر مرچ نیست. بیشتر حجم بحثهای فنی و زیباییشناسانهی کتاب اتفاقن به موضوع صدا در فیلم برمیگرده که البته چیزی جدا از تدوین نیست. درک والتر مرچ از جهان اطراف و شناختی که به واسطه تمرکز و مداقه روی انسانها و بطور کلی جهان بیرون موقع تدوین و صداگذاری به دست آورده خیلی راهگشا و خوندنی بود. مثلن ایدهای که در مورد پلک زدن آدمها و کارکرد ضمنیش داره یا ایدهی رادیکالی که در مورد ابداع یه روش شبه نتنویسی برای سینما مطرح میکنه. گذشته از اون نکات و توصیههای عملی که به درد کار روزانهی تدوین میخوره و نمیخوام به "ترفند" تقلیلش بدم هم میتونن به عنوان یه هندبوک تدوین خیلی به کار بیان. تنها نکته منفی بعضی اشکالات جزیی تو ترجمه عناوین فیلمها و اسم افراد و البته اسم مصاحبه کننده کتاب یعنی مایکل اونداتیه بود که به اشتباه مایکل اونداج نوشته شده بود
January 22, 2019
Interesting foray between a novelist and an editor but too much time is spent on gossip and irrelevant details and not enough on the craft! I'm being harsh because in comparison to the Fine Cuts European Editors book, there is little philosophy or heartfelt passion from these boomer millionaire artists.
November 17, 2017
One of the two best books on filmmaking - this and Sidney Lumet's Making Movies is all one needs to know.
March 16, 2018
I feel stingy for not giving The Conversations five stars, but it ends too soon, and I wanted these two brilliant artists to just keep exploring together.
February 3, 2020
Fascinating and so, so inspiring. Now I want to edit films and I’m in awe of all those silent, unthanked magicians who have made it look so effortless.
February 9, 2020
Such a fascinating read.
Read
June 3, 2024wonderful
February 10, 2018
Fantastic.
Read
November 30, 2023An odd book — a transcription of three or four conversations between a writer and a movie editor/sound mixer.
I didn't know most of the movies that they were talking about (Except for the Godfather trilogy) which made it hard to follow and stay engaged. But I did enjoy their discussions on editing and the creative process, as well as the effects of sound on the movie-going experience.
And then anytime they talked about the BTS of the Godfathers, I was all there for it.
I didn't know most of the movies that they were talking about (Except for the Godfather trilogy) which made it hard to follow and stay engaged. But I did enjoy their discussions on editing and the creative process, as well as the effects of sound on the movie-going experience.
And then anytime they talked about the BTS of the Godfathers, I was all there for it.
January 18, 2024
Walter Murch is a prophet of curiosity, of observation, and of truth.
January 4, 2025
Four conversations between novelist Michael Ondaatje and the great film editor Walter Murch---who had worked on the filmic adaptation of Ondaatje's The English Patient . Murch was also responsible for editing Coppola's Godfather trilogy, plus Apocalypse Now, and The Conversation among dozens of other stellar, stellar films, coming out of a sound mixing and editing background. If anybody remembers the thrilling opener of Apocalypse Now, the helicopter blades becoming the fan in Willard's room, back and forth, and the bleed of the sound... that was Murch's handiwork.
What was most interesting to me about the book was not only the insider's view of the making of these and other films--some of my favorites ever, the ones that lured me into film school for a brief moment--but also the lessons that film editing has for fiction-writing, something that struck Ondaatje as well. In that way, it was a great book about writing when it wasn't about writing at all, but about rhythm, framing, narrative juxtaposition, choice.
I have underlined so much of this book, it's an embarrassment of riches what to quote here.
"Don't get too smart too early. When you've finally gotten it all assembled, you can see how far the film has strayed from its intended trajectory."
"If you're too much on the nose, or you present too many ideas too quickly, either they are so obvious that they're uninteresting or there's so much confusion that you can't take it all in.
The editor works at both the macroscopic and the microscopic levels: ranging from deciding how long precisely each shot is held, to restructuring and repositioning scenes, and sometimes to eliminating entire subplots."
Cutting a linear story with a single pov like The Talented Mr. Ripley or The Conversation, as opposed to multi-pov stories like The English Patient or the Godfathers:
"Linearity does sometimes present its own problems... particularly regarding a film's length... Films with a single point of view are on borrowed time if they are more than two hours long. Since there's only one point of view, there's no relief if the audience is not one hundred percent with the film and it can subsequently seem too long even if it isn't objectively so.'
Ondaatje asks about Martin Sheen's intimate, inner voice as narrator of Apocalypse Now, where did that come from?
"There's a direct line from the narration in John Huston's Moby Dick through Zinnemann's Julia [which Murch also worked on] into Apocalypse Now.... a sonically intimate quality... Houston was dissatisfied with how it was sounding because he thought it had a defamatory quality... [during the recording, Basehart] leaned forward close to the microphone and asked 'John, what should I do next?" The microphone was right against his mouth. And Huston said, "That's it!... I want all the narration to sound just like that." "But I'm much too close." "No, you're not!"... If you position the microphone perfectly, you can get the intimacy without too many unwanted side effects... I asked Marty [Sheen} to imagine that the microphone was somebody's head on the pillow next to him, and that he was just talking to her with that kind of intimacy."
On editing actors:
he doesn't watch the shooting, he doesn't want to see any of that Sturm und Drang.
"The editor, who also has an influence on the way the film is construction, can (and should in my view) remain ignorant of all that stuff in order to find value where others might not see value, and on the other hand, to diminish the value of certain things that other people see as far too important. It's one of the crucial functions of the editor. To take, as far as it is possible to take, the view of the audience, who is seeing the film without any knowledge of all the things that went into its contrsuciton. You are studying them the way a sculptor studies a piece of marble tbefore decking to chisel it--here. So have to know al the hidden veins and strnetht and weaknesses of the rock that I'm working with, in order to know where best to put the chisel."
On ambiguity:
Ondaatje: "I've heard you talk before about the importance of ambiguity in film, and the need to save that ambiguous quality which exists in a book or painting and which you think a film does not often have. And at the same time in a mix you are trying to 'perfect' that ambiguity."
Murch: "It's a paradox. And one of the most fruitful paradoxes... even when the film is finished, there should be unsolved problems. Because there's another stage, beyond the finished film: when the audience views it. You want the audience to be co-conspirators in the creation of the work..." If you removed the ambiguity, you would "be doing the film a disservice. But the paradox is that uoui have to approach every problem as if it's desperately important to solve it. You can't say I don't want to slave this because it's got to be anbiguous if you do that, then there's a sort of haemorrhaging of the organism.
... As hard as you work, you must have this secret, unspoken hope that one very significant problem will remain unsolved. But you never know what it is until the film is one."
This kind of thinking goes so far beyond the average movie book--Murch is able to handle large ideas, his work comes out of those ideas. Just a few examples of where this book goes, plus real insider stuff on the making of some of the great films of our time.
Tiny example: I didn't know that Harry Caul--protagonist of The Conversation--was named for Harry Hall, protagonist of Hesse's Steppenwolf. Murch talking about Caul's transparent raincoat (his 'caul'): "It led from he costume to a way of acting, a way of being: Harry Caul is a man who has a membrane between himself and reality The film is about the shedding of that membrane, and how painful it is for this character."
"
What was most interesting to me about the book was not only the insider's view of the making of these and other films--some of my favorites ever, the ones that lured me into film school for a brief moment--but also the lessons that film editing has for fiction-writing, something that struck Ondaatje as well. In that way, it was a great book about writing when it wasn't about writing at all, but about rhythm, framing, narrative juxtaposition, choice.
I have underlined so much of this book, it's an embarrassment of riches what to quote here.
"Don't get too smart too early. When you've finally gotten it all assembled, you can see how far the film has strayed from its intended trajectory."
"If you're too much on the nose, or you present too many ideas too quickly, either they are so obvious that they're uninteresting or there's so much confusion that you can't take it all in.
The editor works at both the macroscopic and the microscopic levels: ranging from deciding how long precisely each shot is held, to restructuring and repositioning scenes, and sometimes to eliminating entire subplots."
Cutting a linear story with a single pov like The Talented Mr. Ripley or The Conversation, as opposed to multi-pov stories like The English Patient or the Godfathers:
"Linearity does sometimes present its own problems... particularly regarding a film's length... Films with a single point of view are on borrowed time if they are more than two hours long. Since there's only one point of view, there's no relief if the audience is not one hundred percent with the film and it can subsequently seem too long even if it isn't objectively so.'
Ondaatje asks about Martin Sheen's intimate, inner voice as narrator of Apocalypse Now, where did that come from?
"There's a direct line from the narration in John Huston's Moby Dick through Zinnemann's Julia [which Murch also worked on] into Apocalypse Now.... a sonically intimate quality... Houston was dissatisfied with how it was sounding because he thought it had a defamatory quality... [during the recording, Basehart] leaned forward close to the microphone and asked 'John, what should I do next?" The microphone was right against his mouth. And Huston said, "That's it!... I want all the narration to sound just like that." "But I'm much too close." "No, you're not!"... If you position the microphone perfectly, you can get the intimacy without too many unwanted side effects... I asked Marty [Sheen} to imagine that the microphone was somebody's head on the pillow next to him, and that he was just talking to her with that kind of intimacy."
On editing actors:
he doesn't watch the shooting, he doesn't want to see any of that Sturm und Drang.
"The editor, who also has an influence on the way the film is construction, can (and should in my view) remain ignorant of all that stuff in order to find value where others might not see value, and on the other hand, to diminish the value of certain things that other people see as far too important. It's one of the crucial functions of the editor. To take, as far as it is possible to take, the view of the audience, who is seeing the film without any knowledge of all the things that went into its contrsuciton. You are studying them the way a sculptor studies a piece of marble tbefore decking to chisel it--here. So have to know al the hidden veins and strnetht and weaknesses of the rock that I'm working with, in order to know where best to put the chisel."
On ambiguity:
Ondaatje: "I've heard you talk before about the importance of ambiguity in film, and the need to save that ambiguous quality which exists in a book or painting and which you think a film does not often have. And at the same time in a mix you are trying to 'perfect' that ambiguity."
Murch: "It's a paradox. And one of the most fruitful paradoxes... even when the film is finished, there should be unsolved problems. Because there's another stage, beyond the finished film: when the audience views it. You want the audience to be co-conspirators in the creation of the work..." If you removed the ambiguity, you would "be doing the film a disservice. But the paradox is that uoui have to approach every problem as if it's desperately important to solve it. You can't say I don't want to slave this because it's got to be anbiguous if you do that, then there's a sort of haemorrhaging of the organism.
... As hard as you work, you must have this secret, unspoken hope that one very significant problem will remain unsolved. But you never know what it is until the film is one."
This kind of thinking goes so far beyond the average movie book--Murch is able to handle large ideas, his work comes out of those ideas. Just a few examples of where this book goes, plus real insider stuff on the making of some of the great films of our time.
Tiny example: I didn't know that Harry Caul--protagonist of The Conversation--was named for Harry Hall, protagonist of Hesse's Steppenwolf. Murch talking about Caul's transparent raincoat (his 'caul'): "It led from he costume to a way of acting, a way of being: Harry Caul is a man who has a membrane between himself and reality The film is about the shedding of that membrane, and how painful it is for this character."
"
May 26, 2016
My co-worker (who majored in film) recommended Walter Murch's book In the Blink of an Eye to me, but while researching that book on here a lot of reviewers seemed to recommend this one instead, since it covers a lot of the same material plus a whole lot more. This book will leave you in awe of Walter Murch, not just as a genius of film and sound editing, but as a true Renaissance man with interests in science, music, poetry, etc. I especially recommend this book to my fellow cartoonist friends, since there's a surprising amount of crossover between editing film and writing and drawing comics. I also recommend reading it in small doses (I read it every day on my lunch break, usually 5-10 pages at a time), so you can soak it all in.
February 12, 2008
I don't usually like Q&A-style interviews, but this book is a notable exception because it's more like eavesdropping on a private conversation between two very savvy colleagues. Murch has some original and intriguing things to say about the ways he approaches his art (like theorizing that movie music reinforces an existing emotion--rather than inspiring one). Here's looking forward to his next book--the one in which he posits his notational scheme for cinema. It sounds like a crackpot idea, rather like that musical I wisely never wrote in which each instrument corresponded to a different bodily function. I suspect Murch can deliver on his dream, if anyone can.
January 12, 2019
A series of conversations with a true film genius. March's wisdom is not exclusive to cinema and as such, the connections he makes from science, art and history into his filmmaking are profound, revelatory and wholly unlike anything you've ever studied in relation to the art. The specific, behind the scenes anecdotes from films like the Godfather, Apocalypse Now and English Patient are in themselves, very interesting and full of great lessons to be learned. A must read for any filmmaker.
November 16, 2008
Great fun read between a now deceased author and the editor who cut some of the greatest movies made in the modern film era, including one of the author's own stories, The English Patient. I loved every page of it and never wanted it to end.
January 7, 2008
Fascinating, poetic, philosophical look at the Art of Film Editing.
June 4, 2019
This a non- fiction book interviews the movie editor Walter Murch, it talks about how important does editing means in a movie, and what kind of effects will shows by different editing. He talks about the experiences he been through his career and it gives the readers an idea of a revolution of editing. In a different era and time periods, editors invent different style and ways to edit video clips. It gives different effects to the audience, from a single cut and putting all the clips together, to putting sound effects, combine different clips. Walter Murch has been through a lot of big events for editing videos, and he demonstrates a positive and good attitude by sharing his experiences and encourage any editors to try new things. He gives an idea of the difference between director, mixer, editor, and screenwriter. They all have different jobs and difficult parts, and they are how a film begins. Reading the conversation with Walter Murch, the lovers of film and students who want to learn editing learns a lot of information on the timeline of how film forms and change.
July 7, 2020
Took my time learning about the editing techniques of one of Hollywood's unsung heros: Walter Murch. The conversations between Ondaatje and Murch are amazingly detailed and make you feel like you are sitting with them as you try to interrupt the conversation with your own brief and unspectacular (at least in my case) quips. I had to see these films again or for the first time after reading this book, including The English Patient, The Conversation, Rain People, Apocalypse Now, The Godfather, Touch of Evil (the remastered original by Welles).
If you enjoy reading about the artistry of film, you will enjoy it. Not to be read quickly, The Conversations should be taken in small bites. Because of the pandemic, I've held on to this library copy since March and it has been a pleasant friend all these months.
If you enjoy reading about the artistry of film, you will enjoy it. Not to be read quickly, The Conversations should be taken in small bites. Because of the pandemic, I've held on to this library copy since March and it has been a pleasant friend all these months.
April 4, 2023
“When you’re putting a scene together, the three key things you are deciding over and over again are: What shot shall I use? Where shall I begin it? Where shall I end it? An average film may have a thousand edits in it, so: three thousand decisions. But if you can answer those questions in the most interesting, complex, musical, dramatic way, then the film will be as alive as it can be.” (p. 267).
Title: The Conversations: Walter Murch and the Art of Editing Film
Author: Michael Ondaatje
Year: 2002
Genre: Nonfiction - Filmmaking
Page count: 368 pages
Date(s) read: 3/28/23 - 4/4/23
Reading journal entry # 83 in 2023
Ondaatje, M., & Murch, W. (2002). The conversations: Walter Murch and the art of editing film. Alfred A. Knopf.
August 31, 2023
i ran through this book so much faster than any other book in recent memory. it is exciting to read, for sure ! though a lot of the insights are more so recounts that you can only cherish if you yourself have edited. it is better positioned as something where you can share the perils of editing and a lot of choices i’ve made intuitively to edit are what Murch largely talks about, borne of his own, extensive experience. He is most insightful when talking about the use of sound; maybe because that’s something i know annoyingly little about.
As it goes on, however, it does talk about particular editing strategies—but they’re largely applicable for someone like me who knows very little about editing. The book is thoroughly engrossing and worthwhile because of Murch’s vast knowledge and insight into a very diverse range of topics.
Excited to read “In the blink of an eye” soon !!!
As it goes on, however, it does talk about particular editing strategies—but they’re largely applicable for someone like me who knows very little about editing. The book is thoroughly engrossing and worthwhile because of Murch’s vast knowledge and insight into a very diverse range of topics.
Excited to read “In the blink of an eye” soon !!!
December 20, 2023
Faccio la montatrice video da anni, ho letto il libro probabilmente importante di Murch, In un batter d'occhi, eppure queste conversazioni le ho trovate illuminanti. Il modo in cui ogni taglio di un'immagine assume un significato diverso, a seconda del respiro, della pausa o della virgola nel dialogo pronunciato, del battito della palpebre, ti fa riflettere su quanto ogni elemento di un film sia imprescindibile dal resto. Tutto si muove in sinergia, come in una perfetta sinfonia. E questo libro non è interessante solo per chi, come me, svolge questa professione ma soprattutto per chi ama il cinema e la sua filosofia. Un testo ricco di aneddoti, spunti, dietro le quinte dei film più importanti e famosi della storia del cinema.
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