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In the Dark Places of Wisdom
A set of ancient inscriptions on marble found forty years ago in southern Italy, recording details so bewildering that scholars have kept silent about them ...
Strange evidence about a tradition of people who were mystics but who were so intensely practical that, two and a half thousand years ago, they shaped our existence and the world we live in. And yet they did this with a purpose we've completely forgotten...
These are just two ingredients of this extraordinary book, which uncovers an astonishing reality that lies unsuspected right at the origins of the western world. Our dramatic failure to acknowledge or come to grips with that reality is what has been responsible for so much of the emptiness -- of the sense of something missing -- in our modern lives.
In the Dark Places of Wisdom is no work of fiction. The documents, the discoveries, the people that it describes are all as real as we are. But the story it has to tell is far stranger than any fiction, because this is the story of ourselves.
Strange evidence about a tradition of people who were mystics but who were so intensely practical that, two and a half thousand years ago, they shaped our existence and the world we live in. And yet they did this with a purpose we've completely forgotten...
These are just two ingredients of this extraordinary book, which uncovers an astonishing reality that lies unsuspected right at the origins of the western world. Our dramatic failure to acknowledge or come to grips with that reality is what has been responsible for so much of the emptiness -- of the sense of something missing -- in our modern lives.
In the Dark Places of Wisdom is no work of fiction. The documents, the discoveries, the people that it describes are all as real as we are. But the story it has to tell is far stranger than any fiction, because this is the story of ourselves.
255 pages, Paperback
First published January 1, 1999
52 people are currently reading
1907 people want to read
About the author
Peter Kingsley
11 books336 followersClassical scholar and spiritual teacher Peter Kingsley was born in the UK. He received his BA from the University of Lancaster, his Master of Letters from King's College, Cambridge University, and his PhD from the University of London. He is a former Fellow of the Warburg Institute in London and has held honorary professorships or fellowships at universities in Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States.
Kingsley's early writings are traditionally academic, and culminate in the 1995 Ancient Philosophy, Mystery, and Magic: Empedocles and Pythagorean Tradition. His more recent works emphasize the lived experience and daily application of the ancient mystical tradition that helped give rise to the western world.
He continues to write and teach, working to make the spirituality and meditative disciplines of Empedocles, Parmenides, and those like them available to people today. His most recent book, Catafalque: Carl Jung and the End of Humanity, is due to be published in November 2018 and for the first time it shifts the focus of his work directly onto our modern world.
Kingsley's early writings are traditionally academic, and culminate in the 1995 Ancient Philosophy, Mystery, and Magic: Empedocles and Pythagorean Tradition. His more recent works emphasize the lived experience and daily application of the ancient mystical tradition that helped give rise to the western world.
He continues to write and teach, working to make the spirituality and meditative disciplines of Empedocles, Parmenides, and those like them available to people today. His most recent book, Catafalque: Carl Jung and the End of Humanity, is due to be published in November 2018 and for the first time it shifts the focus of his work directly onto our modern world.
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 97 reviews
March 23, 2009
In this book, Peter Kingsley covers the roots of the Western civil system as revealed through the lives of Plato, Pythagoras and Parmenides. Essentially, the Phoenicians brought eastern spiritual traditions with them when they fled the Persians and settled in Italy. Through the methods of 'incubation', simply sitting quietly, the most revelatory discoveries that we accredit to the Greeks were developed.
In our current rational systems we would instantly discredit anyone bringing 'laws from the gods delivered by dreams' but not so in Greek society. The rational faculties we have celebrated in those we attributed early rationality to are heavily misplaced, shaking the foundations of our own systems.
Perhaps the most significant failure of current humanity is the inability to experience incubation in our daily lives due to strict schedules. This quiet meditation of the heart is a core aspect of all mystical schools and a severe afterthought in the blueprint for modern existence.
In our current rational systems we would instantly discredit anyone bringing 'laws from the gods delivered by dreams' but not so in Greek society. The rational faculties we have celebrated in those we attributed early rationality to are heavily misplaced, shaking the foundations of our own systems.
Perhaps the most significant failure of current humanity is the inability to experience incubation in our daily lives due to strict schedules. This quiet meditation of the heart is a core aspect of all mystical schools and a severe afterthought in the blueprint for modern existence.
January 22, 2021
What we have here is an academic paper puffed into a book, written by one who does not respect his reader.
If one has the patience to wade through his tedious repetitions, condescensions, ax grinding, and self-congratulations, one is rewarded with the glimmer of a new idea. But that idea, recedes mirage-like, ever into the horizon. I don't know how I ever made it through.
The essence, however, is that the early Greek teachers found enlightenment, not through intellectual discourse, as did the later philosophers, but rather by retreating far into a dark cave, for a long time, to await critical insight--certainly a practice not limited to the ancient Greeks. That's pretty much it.
It's disappointing that Kingsley fails to locate his thesis within the context of other indigenous spiritual practice or even of Ganzfeld parapsychology, but I was amused to find that despite what he believes to be his breakthrough insights, he is ignored by other scholars.
Nice try, Peter, but you owe us much better. Next time, at the very least, give us a useful table of contents, a readable list of references, and an index.
If one has the patience to wade through his tedious repetitions, condescensions, ax grinding, and self-congratulations, one is rewarded with the glimmer of a new idea. But that idea, recedes mirage-like, ever into the horizon. I don't know how I ever made it through.
The essence, however, is that the early Greek teachers found enlightenment, not through intellectual discourse, as did the later philosophers, but rather by retreating far into a dark cave, for a long time, to await critical insight--certainly a practice not limited to the ancient Greeks. That's pretty much it.
It's disappointing that Kingsley fails to locate his thesis within the context of other indigenous spiritual practice or even of Ganzfeld parapsychology, but I was amused to find that despite what he believes to be his breakthrough insights, he is ignored by other scholars.
Nice try, Peter, but you owe us much better. Next time, at the very least, give us a useful table of contents, a readable list of references, and an index.
May 22, 2018
This is an extraordinary book in which Peter Kingsley takes us on a journey through the roots of our esoteric traditions as Westerners. It's a simple book, written with a clear style, deeply appreciative of our mystical traditions without falling prey to silly eurocentric ideas. It is a book that helps placing us within a time and place, and shows the roots of the beliefs that we have come to destroy and pervert during the last couple of millennia. It's a book to read with the heart, to stimulate our imagination and to bring us into our first steps in a road that leads into the mysteries of the underworld, and the goddesses and gods that live therein.
February 6, 2018
This book is written like a mystery or suspense pulp novel. While some may be critical of this, I found the topic framed very well leaving ample space for thought. This is also a very quick read. So it's hard to complain too much. I read it in two sittings. Anyway, onto the ideas.
What Peter Kingsley has hit on here is truly paradigm-shattering, the implications of which are enough to upend the history of philosophy. Kingsley reveals that Apollo, rather than being associated purely with light and reason, is instead of the darkness and is arational (or beyond the rational/irrational dichotomy). But of course... the sun (Apollo) sets at night and goes to sleep. Kingsley says the kouros -- Apollonian seers -- would "incubate" by laying down in a cave. This facilitated entering into an ecstatic trance-like state or waking dream. The dreamtime was very important because it was the thread of consciousness carried through the dark of night until the light of day again. Then the kouros would emerge back into town in the daylight and share his visions.
There's a lot more packed in here. Kingsley implicates Plato as someone like a "liar" who distorted the traditions of pre-Socratics like Parmenides. Whether Plato did this in a willful and calculated way or whether he simply acted out of ignorance... Kingsley doesn't spell out. But the implications are profound.,For instance, many modern philosophers have operated on an inverted-Platonism, having found the Greek Platonic ideals disagreeable. What happens to Nietzsche, for example, when it turns out that his inverted Platonism is actually something more like an undoing of Plato's mistake, revealing an unlikely harmony between Nietzsche and the pre-Platonians?
Beyond these merely intellectual ponderings, there's a vitality and substance here. Kingsley is a practicing Sufi, and though I do not subscribe to any particular system, I found lots here to digest in a form suitable for carrying with me.
What Peter Kingsley has hit on here is truly paradigm-shattering, the implications of which are enough to upend the history of philosophy. Kingsley reveals that Apollo, rather than being associated purely with light and reason, is instead of the darkness and is arational (or beyond the rational/irrational dichotomy). But of course... the sun (Apollo) sets at night and goes to sleep. Kingsley says the kouros -- Apollonian seers -- would "incubate" by laying down in a cave. This facilitated entering into an ecstatic trance-like state or waking dream. The dreamtime was very important because it was the thread of consciousness carried through the dark of night until the light of day again. Then the kouros would emerge back into town in the daylight and share his visions.
There's a lot more packed in here. Kingsley implicates Plato as someone like a "liar" who distorted the traditions of pre-Socratics like Parmenides. Whether Plato did this in a willful and calculated way or whether he simply acted out of ignorance... Kingsley doesn't spell out. But the implications are profound.,For instance, many modern philosophers have operated on an inverted-Platonism, having found the Greek Platonic ideals disagreeable. What happens to Nietzsche, for example, when it turns out that his inverted Platonism is actually something more like an undoing of Plato's mistake, revealing an unlikely harmony between Nietzsche and the pre-Platonians?
Beyond these merely intellectual ponderings, there's a vitality and substance here. Kingsley is a practicing Sufi, and though I do not subscribe to any particular system, I found lots here to digest in a form suitable for carrying with me.
March 18, 2012
Engaging, compelling and very persuasive,
this book looks at the origins of Western philosophy
and turns them
and our current perspectives on their head.
It was easy to follow and yet very deep in it's scope.
Highly recommended.
this book looks at the origins of Western philosophy
and turns them
and our current perspectives on their head.
It was easy to follow and yet very deep in it's scope.
Highly recommended.
January 18, 2017
Something about this book excited me unbearably, beyond the facts and research and scholarship. I think Kingsley taps into his Goddess on a level few achieve, and manages to share some of the holy awe. I love this book.
October 26, 2012
Fantastic, enlightening...dare I say life-changing? :)
September 30, 2008
Parmenides as the inheritor of a lengthy tradition. Thoroughly researched, splendidly written alternative history of religion/philosophy/medicine.
January 10, 2010
Fasinating book. Interesting take for Western mind on a spiritual course.
January 28, 2016
Interesante perspectiva la del autor interpretando la visión sesgada de Parménides presentada por Platón en sus diálogos. Mucho más profunda su propuesta interpretativa del poema de Parménides apoyada por diversos restos arqueológicos y textuales.
Sin embargo, sus afirmaciones son en ocasiones completamente arbitrarias, argumentadas en generalidades y forzando la credulidad del lector con el único fin de consolidar sus tesis iniciales. Así, afirma que “el resto de la Italia meridional, eran la tierra de Heracles. Aquel era el territorio por donde había viajado, donde había vivido sus míticas aventuras y realizado sus trabajos.” (pág. 35), cuando más allá de de lo relativas que puedan ser las distintas localizaciones del mito heracliano sus trabajos se desarrollaron en el Mediterráneo oriental (península griega y Macedonia, Tracia y Asia Menor), dos de ellos pasadas las columnas de su nombre y otro en un lugar tan poco, o diversamente, localizable como las puertas del Hades. O asegurar que “Especialmente en Italia y Sicilia,… Allí la filosofía se había desarrollado como una actividad generalista, intensamente práctica.” (pág. 134) cuando otros filósofos (Tales , Solón, Epiménides,Anaximandro, Anaxímenes, Demócrito, Anaxágoras,...) desarrollaron una actividad filosófica igualmente práctica en otros lugares del mundo helénico (Mileto, Salamina, Creta, Abdera, Clazomene,...) sin obviar que eso sucedió también en la Magna Grecia y admitiendo las intensas relaciones que hubo desde la antigüedad entre la costa anatolia y el sur de Italia como con otros lugares del mundo heleno. Al final alude a una conspiración milenaria y a un abuso y tergiversación de las enseñanzas de Parménides. Es probable, e incluso seguro, que se hayan distorsionado los conceptos parmenídeos pero otros conceptos como “amor platónico”, “epicúreo”, “cínico”, “hedonismo”, “aristocrático”, “átomo”, “Diógenes”, “socrático” son entendidos coloquialmente en un sentido diferente, y en ocasiones opuesto, al que tenían en la Grecia clásica.
La invitación final no sólo a leer y discutir sobre filosofía sino a intentar entender los conceptos y que las conclusiones sirvan de fuerza motriz en la vida cierra el círculo que delinearía cualquier filósofo clásico.
En definitiva, un interesante libro, una interpretación de Parménides caleidoscópica y alejada del monolitismo tradicional digna de tener en cuenta y un acercamiento a algunos hallazgos arqueológicos realmente reveladores. Si hubiese aportado, sea brevemente y en lo esencial, los textos, mencionados en una extensísima bibliografía, en los que se basa su argumentación en lugar de aludir a “tradiciones antiguas”, “numerosos textos”, “testimonios diversos” y no hubiese forzado algunas relaciones difícilmente comprobables hubiese sido una obra excelente. Aconsejable para todo aquel que esté interesado en el mundo antiguo y la filosofía clásica.
Sin embargo, sus afirmaciones son en ocasiones completamente arbitrarias, argumentadas en generalidades y forzando la credulidad del lector con el único fin de consolidar sus tesis iniciales. Así, afirma que “el resto de la Italia meridional, eran la tierra de Heracles. Aquel era el territorio por donde había viajado, donde había vivido sus míticas aventuras y realizado sus trabajos.” (pág. 35), cuando más allá de de lo relativas que puedan ser las distintas localizaciones del mito heracliano sus trabajos se desarrollaron en el Mediterráneo oriental (península griega y Macedonia, Tracia y Asia Menor), dos de ellos pasadas las columnas de su nombre y otro en un lugar tan poco, o diversamente, localizable como las puertas del Hades. O asegurar que “Especialmente en Italia y Sicilia,… Allí la filosofía se había desarrollado como una actividad generalista, intensamente práctica.” (pág. 134) cuando otros filósofos (Tales , Solón, Epiménides,Anaximandro, Anaxímenes, Demócrito, Anaxágoras,...) desarrollaron una actividad filosófica igualmente práctica en otros lugares del mundo helénico (Mileto, Salamina, Creta, Abdera, Clazomene,...) sin obviar que eso sucedió también en la Magna Grecia y admitiendo las intensas relaciones que hubo desde la antigüedad entre la costa anatolia y el sur de Italia como con otros lugares del mundo heleno. Al final alude a una conspiración milenaria y a un abuso y tergiversación de las enseñanzas de Parménides. Es probable, e incluso seguro, que se hayan distorsionado los conceptos parmenídeos pero otros conceptos como “amor platónico”, “epicúreo”, “cínico”, “hedonismo”, “aristocrático”, “átomo”, “Diógenes”, “socrático” son entendidos coloquialmente en un sentido diferente, y en ocasiones opuesto, al que tenían en la Grecia clásica.
La invitación final no sólo a leer y discutir sobre filosofía sino a intentar entender los conceptos y que las conclusiones sirvan de fuerza motriz en la vida cierra el círculo que delinearía cualquier filósofo clásico.
En definitiva, un interesante libro, una interpretación de Parménides caleidoscópica y alejada del monolitismo tradicional digna de tener en cuenta y un acercamiento a algunos hallazgos arqueológicos realmente reveladores. Si hubiese aportado, sea brevemente y en lo esencial, los textos, mencionados en una extensísima bibliografía, en los que se basa su argumentación en lugar de aludir a “tradiciones antiguas”, “numerosos textos”, “testimonios diversos” y no hubiese forzado algunas relaciones difícilmente comprobables hubiese sido una obra excelente. Aconsejable para todo aquel que esté interesado en el mundo antiguo y la filosofía clásica.
May 25, 2018
Peter Kingsley leads the seeker gently by the hand, explaining historical migrations, revealing and righting inexact translation of Parmenides' poem and relevant ancient writings, uncovering the life and times of pre-Platonic Greece and connecting overlooked evidence for the historical role of shamanism in the West. The style is simple and straightforward, the pace careful, measured. I was struck by the many similarities between 'incubation' - the act of lying down in perfect stillness in a dark place without food in order to receive healing or messages from the gods and goddesses - and deep meditation, astral travel; even the strength of vibrations that often precede OOB experiences and raising Kundalini were mentioned, and 'neither sleep nor waking' seems an exact description of Robert Monroe's 'body asleep, mind awake', or Focus 10, that prepares the astral body to slip out from the physical body.
There are no footnotes for sources in the body of the text, they are all grouped at the end of the book, neither is there an index, which I'd have found useful when writing this review, but having read (and more particularly, watched) interviews with Peter Kingsley I was prepared to take his findings and conclusions on trust, and it has to be said that a text without the distraction of footnotes is infinitely more compelling than one with reference numbers and blocks of small print at the bottom of the page or the end of the book.
In conclusion this is definitely a book to keep and enjoy again, although my eyes would really appreciate an audio version read by the author.
There are no footnotes for sources in the body of the text, they are all grouped at the end of the book, neither is there an index, which I'd have found useful when writing this review, but having read (and more particularly, watched) interviews with Peter Kingsley I was prepared to take his findings and conclusions on trust, and it has to be said that a text without the distraction of footnotes is infinitely more compelling than one with reference numbers and blocks of small print at the bottom of the page or the end of the book.
In conclusion this is definitely a book to keep and enjoy again, although my eyes would really appreciate an audio version read by the author.
June 24, 2018
در ادامهی خواندنیهای سنتگرایی، اینبار در باب فلاسفه و عرفای یونانی ماقبل ارسطو. دربارهی اینکه در یونان هم حکمت همان عقل استدلالی نبوده و این پدرکشی افلاطون بوده که عرفان و «زوایای تاریک حکمت» را از فلسفهی یونان جدا کرده.
فکر میکنم برای فهم بهترش خیلی خوب باشه که با خدایان یونان و فلاسفهی ماقبل ارسطو آشناییای جزئی داشته باشید. من نداشتم و در اسامی کمی گم شدم. پارمنیدس و زنو و آپولو و اورفئوس و ... ولی بهنظرم برای فهم کتاب بیش از این باید با سنتگرایی آشنا باشید.
در خواندن این کتاب مرتب یاد رنه گنون و سیطرهی کمیت میافتادم.
خیلی از قسمتهای کتاب استعداد تبدیلشدن به کلمهی قصار را دارد. و این از همان جملهی اول شروع میشود: «اگر بخت یارت باشد، در بعضی از مراحل زندگی به بنبست کامل خواهی رسید.»
ترجمه چنگی به دل نمیزنه. بهنظرم کار ترجمه را خانم شراره معصومی انجام داده، چون در سه مقدمهای که بر کتاب نوشته شده، مقدمهی دکتر نصر و خانم سیدجوادی و مقدمهی مترجم، خانم دلآرا قهرمان، هیچ اسمی از ایشون آورده نشده. حداقلش این بود که خانم قهرمان باید از مترجم دیگر کتاب، خانم معصومی، اسم میآورد. (این همه تاکیدی که روی ترجمهی کتابها میکنم خودم را هم داره اذیت میکنه. محتوا را بچسب داداش.) اینکه کلمهی
incubation
را هم به همین صورت انگلیسی در متن آوردهاند جالب نیست. یکجور راحتکردن کار خود است. بههرحال، کتاب نیاز به ویراستاری هم دارد.
فکر میکنم برای فهم بهترش خیلی خوب باشه که با خدایان یونان و فلاسفهی ماقبل ارسطو آشناییای جزئی داشته باشید. من نداشتم و در اسامی کمی گم شدم. پارمنیدس و زنو و آپولو و اورفئوس و ... ولی بهنظرم برای فهم کتاب بیش از این باید با سنتگرایی آشنا باشید.
در خواندن این کتاب مرتب یاد رنه گنون و سیطرهی کمیت میافتادم.
خیلی از قسمتهای کتاب استعداد تبدیلشدن به کلمهی قصار را دارد. و این از همان جملهی اول شروع میشود: «اگر بخت یارت باشد، در بعضی از مراحل زندگی به بنبست کامل خواهی رسید.»
ترجمه چنگی به دل نمیزنه. بهنظرم کار ترجمه را خانم شراره معصومی انجام داده، چون در سه مقدمهای که بر کتاب نوشته شده، مقدمهی دکتر نصر و خانم سیدجوادی و مقدمهی مترجم، خانم دلآرا قهرمان، هیچ اسمی از ایشون آورده نشده. حداقلش این بود که خانم قهرمان باید از مترجم دیگر کتاب، خانم معصومی، اسم میآورد. (این همه تاکیدی که روی ترجمهی کتابها میکنم خودم را هم داره اذیت میکنه. محتوا را بچسب داداش.) اینکه کلمهی
incubation
را هم به همین صورت انگلیسی در متن آوردهاند جالب نیست. یکجور راحتکردن کار خود است. بههرحال، کتاب نیاز به ویراستاری هم دارد.
April 22, 2014
Thoroughly unimpressed. The writing style was atrocious and not suitable at all for the material being presented, it was written too much like a mystery novel. A bad mystery novel.
The author's tone felt melodramatic, especially since most of the ideas he was presenting did not seem too "revolutionary" to me. I've given it two stars, as some information was redeeming and informative, so it has some merit. It just wasn't that great.
The author's tone felt melodramatic, especially since most of the ideas he was presenting did not seem too "revolutionary" to me. I've given it two stars, as some information was redeeming and informative, so it has some merit. It just wasn't that great.
January 2, 2013
This is the second time I have read this book, and I learned a lot more this time. Incubation as healing and prophecy is at the center of the book. This book explores how philosophy was rooted in the mystical as taught by Parmeneides, but was changed into Plato into the sciences and logic as the western world now recognizes. A very good read, I am glad I took the time to re-read this book.
January 30, 2013
Fantastic hardcover edition by Ediciones Atalanta. Loved the book! a must read to understand truths of our civilization.
August 12, 2015
This book is a dramatic re-appraisal of Parmenides, the Ancient Greek philosopher who is commonly considered to be the founding father of logic. Far from being a pedantic academic, however, the Parmenides presented here is far more of a magus figure, a seer who went into a trance and descended into the underworld to talk personally to The Goddess herself, Persephone the Maiden, and came back to write his great poem as an account of this experience. Professor Kingsley is at times too full of himself, and he makes over-the-top claims about the importance of all this to our sense of ourselves that he does not really substantiate, but nevertheless this is an amazing book. Five stars!
July 28, 2008
don't know if any of its true
but medaitive for the lonely soul
but medaitive for the lonely soul
January 16, 2016
Esta obra tiene que ser leida con el corazón desbocado y los ojos como platos. Ya estáis tardando.
Imprescindible.
Imprescindible.
June 10, 2019
Breathtaking.
June 16, 2019
Excellent book, well written and full of intriguing and unusual viewpoints that provide answers to some of the most complex questions of life and history of thought. Highly recommended.
September 1, 2019
Perfect warm-up to the more expansive book Reality
January 7, 2025
Un ensayo construido como un cuento que se narra en la noche, a la luz de una fogata… alrededor del poema de Parménides sobre su viaje al inframundo, su encuentro con la divinidad femenina, su aprendizaje místico, su recorrido hacia la quietud sanadora.
May 10, 2020
EN LOS OSCUROS LUGARES DEL SABER: UN FASCINANTE ENSAYO CON RITMO, FORMAS Y HASTA FINAL DE NOVELA.. MÁS QUE UN LIBRO, UNA REVELACIÓN (literalmente)
Hay libros para los que las 5 estrellas se quedan cortas. “En los oscuros lugares del saber” es uno de ellos.
“Tiene mérito: hemos conseguido crear la ilusión de que somos más sabios que las gentes de tiempos anteriores. En cuanto a las figuras de los filósofos que se alzan en un pasado lejano, en los albores de la cultura occidental, hemos aprendido a disculparlos, a justificar que no supieran llegar a las conclusiones a las que, en nuestra opinión, deberían haber llegado. Y, sin embargo, somos nosotros quienes necesitamos disculpa. No estamos en posición de juzgar a esos filósofos: son nuestros jueces. Cuando les cerramos la puerta, nos la cerramos a nosotros mismos”. Peter Kingsley.
Peter Kingsley trata en este libro la figura de Parménides, filósofo pre-socrático que ejerció una influencia decisiva en Platón. Dicho así, tal cual, 9 de cada 10 lectores se mantendrán a una prudente distancia de varios kilómetros de este libro. Y estarán cometiendo un terrible error.
EL LIBRO EN SÍ (la edición de Atalanta).
Primera pista: EDICIONES ATALANTA NO PUBLICA NADA MALO. Gracias, Jacobo Siruela, por haber fundado Atalanta y, particularmente, gracias por la COLECCIÓN MEMORIA MUNDI. Ya de partida, EL LIBRO ES MARAVILLOSO EN LO FORMAL, CON UN DISEÑO SÍMPLEMENTE EXQUISITO. Paleta de colores, imágenes en cubierta y guardas, maquetación, gramaje… ¡hasta los márgenes! ¡gracias por esos amplios márgenes! ¡había tanto que anotar! No hay detalle que no esté cuidado con el mayor mimo.
Y es que, si en lo formal el libro es una delicia, EL TEXTO DE KINGSLEY SIN DUDA MERECÍA ESTA EDICIÓN.
EL AUTOR
Kingsley es un intelectual solvente, con un bagaje académico, literario y vital que habla por sí mismo (recomiendo su conversación con el doctor Murray Stein sobre ‘El Libro Rojo’ de Jung, disponible en YouTube). La detallada bibliografía adjunta parece tener la intención de silenciar las muy probables críticas. Kingsley -con aplomo, estilo y pruebas- desmonta buena parte de lo que hasta ahora sabíamos o entendíamos por filosofía occidental y sobre el concepto mismo de Occidente.
¿UN ENSAYO? ¿UNA NOVELA? EL ESTILO COMO VIRTUD.
Es un ensayo en toda regla. Y aún así… sabe a novela. De entre los méritos que cabe reconocerle al autor, el estilo literario es definitivamente uno de los más importantes. Este ensayo tiene mucho de narrativa. Kingsley tiene un estilo propio con el que te familiarizas a poco de empezar a leer. Un capítulo nos puede trasladar a una excavación arqueológica en los años 60 y Kingsley dedicará el resto del capítulo a insuflar vida en esas ruinas o esos hallazgos. Otro capítulo puede comenzar con una afirmación controvertida o chocante y el autor se dedicará entonces a contextualizar y demostrar dicha afirmación al hilo de lo que está contando.
Hasta los títulos de los capítulos tienen algo de evocador. No son simplemente descriptivos sino que preparan emocionalmente al lector para lo que va a leer-aprender. Hay están “Un cuento de hadas”, “Lo que falta”, “El hombre con toga”, “Amos de los sueños”, “El sonido de las flautas”, “Como el viento en la noche”, “Un rayo invisible”…
PERO ¿DE QUÉ VA EL LIBRO? (LA TRAMA Y SUS PROTAGONISTAS)
“Los malos”
Atenas y Platón son claramente “los malos de la novela”. La ciudad de Atenas y la figura de Platón se han tenido desde siempre como elementos fundacionales de esta nuestra “civilización occidental”. Y es que, como dice el autor, “una de las desventajas de crear héroes es la sombra que proyectan”.
“Los buenos”
Parménides y de los pitagóricos son los protagonistas y héroes de este ensayo novelesco (y no por ello menos veraz). El autor expone cómo Platón y sus seguidores se apropiaron de la figura y obra de Parménides. De cómo estas quedaron desvirtuadas y manipuladas desde entonces hasta hoy. De cómo la arqueología, la filología y la antropología pueden demostrar que nuestros libros de texto de filosofía de COU mantienen esas mismas mentiras.
“En los oscuros lugares…” trata de la intencionada incomprensión y caricaturización de los pitagóricos. De cómo estos se sentían pertenecientes a un mundo que no entendía de dualismo Oriente-Occidente, sino que se sentían parte de un solo mundo que iba desde Emporion hasta India (hasta Siberia, si apuramos).
“En los oscuros lugares…” cumple de lejos como ensayo: después de leerlo hemos aprendido mucho. Y hemos disfrutado haciéndolo. Nos sentimos ya familiarizados con personajes como Parménides, Zenón, Empédocles, Epiménides, Jenófanes, Hipócrates, Diógenes Laercio o Pitágoras (y los pitagóricos); con ciudades como Elea, Posidonia, Focea, Caria, Mileto o Hierápolis; con divinidades como Apolo Oulios / Phôleutêrios / Physicos, Perséfone, Asclepios u Orfeo (y los órficos); con conceptos como kouros, hêsychia, incubación o iatromantis…
“En los oscuros lugares…” es un fascinante viaje al pasado. Un viaje al nacimiento de la filosofía, al auténtico “amor por la sabiduría”. Un momento y un lugar gobernado por filósofos que entendían que las ciudades puede ser curadas mediante buenas leyes y que para defenderlas no dudaban en inventar las catapultas (aplicación práctica de principios de armonía y equilibrio).
CUANDO EL FACTOR ESPIRITUAL IMPORTA: MÁS RAZONES POR LAS QUE ESTE LIBRO ES MÁS QUE UN ENSAYO
“De lo sublime a lo ridículo solo hay un paso” dijo (supuestamente) Napoleón. Este libro, a mi juicio sublime, podría haber caído en lo ridículo, pero Kingsley ha sabido jugar sus cartas. Cuando uno propone teorías nuevas y desafiantes a lo aceptado por el ámbito académico se puede caer muy fácilmente en el “cantamañanismo”. Si además, en un ensayo de historia de la filosofía, entras a hacer observaciones personales de índole espiritual (por llamarlas de alguna manera) y te alineas con los tan denostados y ridiculizados pitagóricos, estás a un paso de convertirte en un Paulo Coelho de saldo. Pero Peter Kingsley sale bien parado del desafío. Peter Kingsley no un cualquiera. Insisto, echen un vistazo a su CV.
“En los oscuros lugares…” es un libro lleno de sabiduría y de Verdad. Cerraré esta reseña con algunos fragmentos del libro y que el lector juzgue por sí mismo.
Dulces sueños.
“Confundimos sofisticación y madurez y casi no nos damos cuenta de que no hay nada más repetitivo que el deseo de variedad. (…) lo más importante que necesitamos para ser libres ya está dentro de nosotros: nuestro anhelo. Y la voz de nuestro anhelo es la repetición. (…) Cuando uno empieza a ser arrastrado más allá de las apariencias empieza a tocar la esencia de la existencia(…) Y no puede seguir juzgando las cosas por su aspecto”.
“No hace falta demasiada familiaridad con los hechos cuando el objetivo es recrear una historia que encaje con unos objetivos personales concretos”.
“Por ese motivo, aprendamos lo que aprendamos, nunca nos afecta en lo profundo, nunca llega a satisfacernos. Y cuanto más conscientes somos de ello, más nos apresuramos para intentar encontrar otros sustitutos y llenar el vació que seguimos sintiendo en nuestro interior. Todo nos empuja fuera de nosotros mismos, lejos de la absoluta sencillez de nuestra propia humanidad”.
“El MEJOR MAESTRO no es necesariamente el que nos muestra o transmite algo. El MEJOR MAESTRO nos enseña lo que YA TENEMOS EN NUESTRO INTERIOR, LO QUE SIEMPRE ESTUVO AHÍ; “tenemos ya todo lo que necesitamos. Sólo necesitamos que se nos enseñe lo que tenemos. (…) Por este motivo con frecuencia el mejor maestro es un don nadie; “Los verdaderos maestros (…) cambian por completo al discípulo sin por ello alterar nada, ni siquiera sus mayores debilidades”.
“Nada podría parecernos más absurdo y menos práctico que la idea de crear nuevas leyes a base de yacer en silencio e inmovilidad totales. Pero desde el punto de vista de la gente que lo hacía, lo que parece poco práctico son nuestras numerosas ideas sobre ‘lo práctico’ . Creemos que ser ‘práctico’ significa estar ocupado siguiendo adelante con nuestra vida, corriendo de una distracción a otra, encontrando más y más sustitutos de lo que percibimos débilmente pero no sabemos cómo asumir o descubrir. Ahí surgen los problemas en comprender tanto el pasado como a nosotros”.
“La tabla de Cebes”: la suprema sabiduría de intentar “tanto de palabra como de obra, vivir una vida pitagórica y parmenidiana”, (…) no existe mayor peligro o riesgo concebible que no poder resolver el acertijo de nuestra vida a lo largo de esta”.
Hay libros para los que las 5 estrellas se quedan cortas. “En los oscuros lugares del saber” es uno de ellos.
“Tiene mérito: hemos conseguido crear la ilusión de que somos más sabios que las gentes de tiempos anteriores. En cuanto a las figuras de los filósofos que se alzan en un pasado lejano, en los albores de la cultura occidental, hemos aprendido a disculparlos, a justificar que no supieran llegar a las conclusiones a las que, en nuestra opinión, deberían haber llegado. Y, sin embargo, somos nosotros quienes necesitamos disculpa. No estamos en posición de juzgar a esos filósofos: son nuestros jueces. Cuando les cerramos la puerta, nos la cerramos a nosotros mismos”. Peter Kingsley.
Peter Kingsley trata en este libro la figura de Parménides, filósofo pre-socrático que ejerció una influencia decisiva en Platón. Dicho así, tal cual, 9 de cada 10 lectores se mantendrán a una prudente distancia de varios kilómetros de este libro. Y estarán cometiendo un terrible error.
EL LIBRO EN SÍ (la edición de Atalanta).
Primera pista: EDICIONES ATALANTA NO PUBLICA NADA MALO. Gracias, Jacobo Siruela, por haber fundado Atalanta y, particularmente, gracias por la COLECCIÓN MEMORIA MUNDI. Ya de partida, EL LIBRO ES MARAVILLOSO EN LO FORMAL, CON UN DISEÑO SÍMPLEMENTE EXQUISITO. Paleta de colores, imágenes en cubierta y guardas, maquetación, gramaje… ¡hasta los márgenes! ¡gracias por esos amplios márgenes! ¡había tanto que anotar! No hay detalle que no esté cuidado con el mayor mimo.
Y es que, si en lo formal el libro es una delicia, EL TEXTO DE KINGSLEY SIN DUDA MERECÍA ESTA EDICIÓN.
EL AUTOR
Kingsley es un intelectual solvente, con un bagaje académico, literario y vital que habla por sí mismo (recomiendo su conversación con el doctor Murray Stein sobre ‘El Libro Rojo’ de Jung, disponible en YouTube). La detallada bibliografía adjunta parece tener la intención de silenciar las muy probables críticas. Kingsley -con aplomo, estilo y pruebas- desmonta buena parte de lo que hasta ahora sabíamos o entendíamos por filosofía occidental y sobre el concepto mismo de Occidente.
¿UN ENSAYO? ¿UNA NOVELA? EL ESTILO COMO VIRTUD.
Es un ensayo en toda regla. Y aún así… sabe a novela. De entre los méritos que cabe reconocerle al autor, el estilo literario es definitivamente uno de los más importantes. Este ensayo tiene mucho de narrativa. Kingsley tiene un estilo propio con el que te familiarizas a poco de empezar a leer. Un capítulo nos puede trasladar a una excavación arqueológica en los años 60 y Kingsley dedicará el resto del capítulo a insuflar vida en esas ruinas o esos hallazgos. Otro capítulo puede comenzar con una afirmación controvertida o chocante y el autor se dedicará entonces a contextualizar y demostrar dicha afirmación al hilo de lo que está contando.
Hasta los títulos de los capítulos tienen algo de evocador. No son simplemente descriptivos sino que preparan emocionalmente al lector para lo que va a leer-aprender. Hay están “Un cuento de hadas”, “Lo que falta”, “El hombre con toga”, “Amos de los sueños”, “El sonido de las flautas”, “Como el viento en la noche”, “Un rayo invisible”…
PERO ¿DE QUÉ VA EL LIBRO? (LA TRAMA Y SUS PROTAGONISTAS)
“Los malos”
Atenas y Platón son claramente “los malos de la novela”. La ciudad de Atenas y la figura de Platón se han tenido desde siempre como elementos fundacionales de esta nuestra “civilización occidental”. Y es que, como dice el autor, “una de las desventajas de crear héroes es la sombra que proyectan”.
“Los buenos”
Parménides y de los pitagóricos son los protagonistas y héroes de este ensayo novelesco (y no por ello menos veraz). El autor expone cómo Platón y sus seguidores se apropiaron de la figura y obra de Parménides. De cómo estas quedaron desvirtuadas y manipuladas desde entonces hasta hoy. De cómo la arqueología, la filología y la antropología pueden demostrar que nuestros libros de texto de filosofía de COU mantienen esas mismas mentiras.
“En los oscuros lugares…” trata de la intencionada incomprensión y caricaturización de los pitagóricos. De cómo estos se sentían pertenecientes a un mundo que no entendía de dualismo Oriente-Occidente, sino que se sentían parte de un solo mundo que iba desde Emporion hasta India (hasta Siberia, si apuramos).
“En los oscuros lugares…” cumple de lejos como ensayo: después de leerlo hemos aprendido mucho. Y hemos disfrutado haciéndolo. Nos sentimos ya familiarizados con personajes como Parménides, Zenón, Empédocles, Epiménides, Jenófanes, Hipócrates, Diógenes Laercio o Pitágoras (y los pitagóricos); con ciudades como Elea, Posidonia, Focea, Caria, Mileto o Hierápolis; con divinidades como Apolo Oulios / Phôleutêrios / Physicos, Perséfone, Asclepios u Orfeo (y los órficos); con conceptos como kouros, hêsychia, incubación o iatromantis…
“En los oscuros lugares…” es un fascinante viaje al pasado. Un viaje al nacimiento de la filosofía, al auténtico “amor por la sabiduría”. Un momento y un lugar gobernado por filósofos que entendían que las ciudades puede ser curadas mediante buenas leyes y que para defenderlas no dudaban en inventar las catapultas (aplicación práctica de principios de armonía y equilibrio).
CUANDO EL FACTOR ESPIRITUAL IMPORTA: MÁS RAZONES POR LAS QUE ESTE LIBRO ES MÁS QUE UN ENSAYO
“De lo sublime a lo ridículo solo hay un paso” dijo (supuestamente) Napoleón. Este libro, a mi juicio sublime, podría haber caído en lo ridículo, pero Kingsley ha sabido jugar sus cartas. Cuando uno propone teorías nuevas y desafiantes a lo aceptado por el ámbito académico se puede caer muy fácilmente en el “cantamañanismo”. Si además, en un ensayo de historia de la filosofía, entras a hacer observaciones personales de índole espiritual (por llamarlas de alguna manera) y te alineas con los tan denostados y ridiculizados pitagóricos, estás a un paso de convertirte en un Paulo Coelho de saldo. Pero Peter Kingsley sale bien parado del desafío. Peter Kingsley no un cualquiera. Insisto, echen un vistazo a su CV.
“En los oscuros lugares…” es un libro lleno de sabiduría y de Verdad. Cerraré esta reseña con algunos fragmentos del libro y que el lector juzgue por sí mismo.
Dulces sueños.
“Confundimos sofisticación y madurez y casi no nos damos cuenta de que no hay nada más repetitivo que el deseo de variedad. (…) lo más importante que necesitamos para ser libres ya está dentro de nosotros: nuestro anhelo. Y la voz de nuestro anhelo es la repetición. (…) Cuando uno empieza a ser arrastrado más allá de las apariencias empieza a tocar la esencia de la existencia(…) Y no puede seguir juzgando las cosas por su aspecto”.
“No hace falta demasiada familiaridad con los hechos cuando el objetivo es recrear una historia que encaje con unos objetivos personales concretos”.
“Por ese motivo, aprendamos lo que aprendamos, nunca nos afecta en lo profundo, nunca llega a satisfacernos. Y cuanto más conscientes somos de ello, más nos apresuramos para intentar encontrar otros sustitutos y llenar el vació que seguimos sintiendo en nuestro interior. Todo nos empuja fuera de nosotros mismos, lejos de la absoluta sencillez de nuestra propia humanidad”.
“El MEJOR MAESTRO no es necesariamente el que nos muestra o transmite algo. El MEJOR MAESTRO nos enseña lo que YA TENEMOS EN NUESTRO INTERIOR, LO QUE SIEMPRE ESTUVO AHÍ; “tenemos ya todo lo que necesitamos. Sólo necesitamos que se nos enseñe lo que tenemos. (…) Por este motivo con frecuencia el mejor maestro es un don nadie; “Los verdaderos maestros (…) cambian por completo al discípulo sin por ello alterar nada, ni siquiera sus mayores debilidades”.
“Nada podría parecernos más absurdo y menos práctico que la idea de crear nuevas leyes a base de yacer en silencio e inmovilidad totales. Pero desde el punto de vista de la gente que lo hacía, lo que parece poco práctico son nuestras numerosas ideas sobre ‘lo práctico’ . Creemos que ser ‘práctico’ significa estar ocupado siguiendo adelante con nuestra vida, corriendo de una distracción a otra, encontrando más y más sustitutos de lo que percibimos débilmente pero no sabemos cómo asumir o descubrir. Ahí surgen los problemas en comprender tanto el pasado como a nosotros”.
“La tabla de Cebes”: la suprema sabiduría de intentar “tanto de palabra como de obra, vivir una vida pitagórica y parmenidiana”, (…) no existe mayor peligro o riesgo concebible que no poder resolver el acertijo de nuestra vida a lo largo de esta”.
March 29, 2023
En este ensayo se propone una reinterpretación de la figura de Parménides (a la luz de los hallazgos arqueológicos de Elea-Velia y textos antiguos), que el autor considera prominente fundador de la filosofía. En esta reinterpretación, Parménides no es tanto el padre de la lógica occidental en el sentido racional-intelectual en que ahora la entendemos, sino un legislador-profeta-místico-sanador vinculado a las tradiciones de ouliades y iatromantis adoradores de Apolo Oulios provenientes de las costas del este (Focea, Mileto, Creta) y al pitagorismo. Su poema se relee entonces como fruto de las visiones producidas por la práctica de la incubación (central en las mencionadas tradiciones) y sus referentes no son abstracciones filosóficas sino elementos de las mitologías heroicas y órficas.
Todo ello es muy interesante y merece mucho la pena aproximarse a este texto, que además es breve y ligero. Si se le puede poner una pega, es que su formato ensayístico puede no ser de gusto de todos, ya que el autor sobrepasa lo académico e introduce sistemáticamente su lectura personal sobre los hechos, con una retórica que puede llegar a redundar y, en mi opinión, con algunas contradicciones en los estándares que aplica a unas y otras fuentes y figuras (con una clara admiración por Parménides y denostación por Platón). Leyendo el texto echaba en falta referencias bibliográficas concretas, pero al llegar al final me di cuenta de que estaban recopiladas ahí por capítulos y temas.
Me habría gustado que profundizase en una explicación sobre la brecha entre Parménides y Platón, figura esta última en la que a veces enfatiza la distancia respecto al paradigma de Parménides y en la que a veces señala continuidades, de manera dispersa. ¿Cuáles habrían sido exactamente las modificaciones o innovaciones introducidas por Platón? ¿Y por qué se habrían producido?
En conclusión, me parece una lectura interesante para todo interesado en filosofía y cultura de la Grecia antigua.
Todo ello es muy interesante y merece mucho la pena aproximarse a este texto, que además es breve y ligero. Si se le puede poner una pega, es que su formato ensayístico puede no ser de gusto de todos, ya que el autor sobrepasa lo académico e introduce sistemáticamente su lectura personal sobre los hechos, con una retórica que puede llegar a redundar y, en mi opinión, con algunas contradicciones en los estándares que aplica a unas y otras fuentes y figuras (con una clara admiración por Parménides y denostación por Platón). Leyendo el texto echaba en falta referencias bibliográficas concretas, pero al llegar al final me di cuenta de que estaban recopiladas ahí por capítulos y temas.
Me habría gustado que profundizase en una explicación sobre la brecha entre Parménides y Platón, figura esta última en la que a veces enfatiza la distancia respecto al paradigma de Parménides y en la que a veces señala continuidades, de manera dispersa. ¿Cuáles habrían sido exactamente las modificaciones o innovaciones introducidas por Platón? ¿Y por qué se habrían producido?
En conclusión, me parece una lectura interesante para todo interesado en filosofía y cultura de la Grecia antigua.
December 14, 2021
Això és un gran llibre: No només per com està escrit, a mode d'assaig lleugeret (de lectura de tarda de diumenge anodina) amb una manera d'escriure que molesta (com pot ser que l'assagista ens digui el que diu, si ho escriu en forma de novel·leta plena d'aforismes que semblen extrets d'un volum de parapsicologia), sinó pel que arriba a plantejar. L'autor ens provoca constantment, vol irritar els lectors occidentalitzats defensant una tesi és molt polèmica, i que no per això deixa de ser verdadera: El fonament de la nostra cultura és la irracionalitat. A partir del poema de Parmènides, l'autor desenvolupa els rituals místics i sanatius d'una cultura - la Grècia antiga - que creiem com el cim d'allò racional, de l'ordre i de la intel·ligència. Bé, amb aquestes paraules concretament ja sé que només ho pensen uns quants il·luminats, però nogensmenys el viatge que proposa Kingsley és enlluernador: Per què tendim a aquest orgull occidental quan resulta que els contactes amb allò que prové d'Orient eren constants? I això ja és collita pròpia: Quantes vegades ens hem cregut erròniament relats històrics? Per exemple: Avui ja sabem que Pitàgores no va descobrir el teorema que porta el seu nom, sinó que a l'antiga Babilònia 1000 anys abans ja ja es feien aquesta mena de càlculs. Per què no assumim que els Pitagòrics no demostraven teoremes, sinó que no eren altra cosa que xamans, com defensa Kingsley?
March 22, 2018
So here's the thing. The book is about 57 thousand words long, so barely even a book to begin with. But what Kingsley has to say of substance can be said comfortably in maybe fifteen or twenty thousand words. So around two thirds of the work is filler. Some of it is just extremely slow-paced, like the many times he declines to move on from one piece of evidence to another without first having spent a transitional paragraph to say that it would be easy to dismiss the point he's just made, were it not for the presence of this next point he's about to tell us about; or when he takes an entire paragraph to explain that, in ancient Greek, it's easy to confuse the prepositions "on" and "for". But a lot of it is ... much more questionable.
Kingsley might have a defensible thesis here: that the Greek philosopher Parmenides, father of metaphysics (and who has been called grandfather of philosophy because of his influence on Plato), came from and participated in a far more mystical tradition than scholarship's consensus understanding of him allows. Certainly one of his central points, that our understanding of historical figures (specifically in this case, pre-Socratic philosophers) should take them on their own terms rather than be coloured by what we know comes later (Plato's depiction of them), is one that's dear to my heart when it comes to historiography. That's why I've opted to give the book two stars when I'd much rather go with 1.5.
But I can tell that Kingsley doesn't think he has a defensible thesis, because of how often he takes time out to attack evidence-based scholarship or science in general: "Underneath the surface of the rhetoric and persuasion there's not much to choose between modern science and ancient magic." Or when he tells us it's perfectly possible that future generations will think we were just as foolish for thinking the earth revolves around the sun as we think of past generations for believing the sun revolved around the earth. It's ridiculous on the face of it, and its sole purpose is to delegitimise the scientific method to preemptively discredit any counterargument based on evidence.
Kingsley also likes to tell us how we're reacting to a particular piece of evidence, so he can tell us that we're wrong. Or he tells us that while something might not seem significant to the modern mind, it was very significant in ancient times: "To most people nowadays a dream is nothing. It's just a dream and that's that. And yet for people in the ancient world there were dreams and there were dreams. Some were meaningful, others weren't; and some could take you into another kind of reality altogether." My favourite of these was "On the middle of a piece of marble you could just about make out the remains of three words. Nowadays three words are nothing. On an inscription like this they meant as much as a whole book."
And then there are his flights of flat-out supernatural fancy. "We honestly believe we're in control, that it's we who search and look and make all the important discoveries in life and know what's important. Occasionally, very occasionally, we may happen to sense something entirely different: that it isn't we who make discoveries at all because really the discoveries draw us to them at the right time and make us find them. It's the discoveries that want to be found and understood. Just as we like to believe it's we who 'make' discoveries, we also think we 'have' dreams. But what we don't understand is that sometimes beings communicate to us through our dreams, in the same way that they try to communicate through outer events. It can be so difficult for them to draw the attention of the living, to struggle through from their world to this: unimaginably difficult."
The first half of the book in particular had some good bits, with its account of the Phocaeans' flight from their home island ahead of the Persian invasion and ultimately founding Elea (which Kingsley refers to as Velia throughout) in southern Italy, or with the description of the Charonium in Hierapolis. But in the end, it just can't be taken seriously.
Kingsley might have a defensible thesis here: that the Greek philosopher Parmenides, father of metaphysics (and who has been called grandfather of philosophy because of his influence on Plato), came from and participated in a far more mystical tradition than scholarship's consensus understanding of him allows. Certainly one of his central points, that our understanding of historical figures (specifically in this case, pre-Socratic philosophers) should take them on their own terms rather than be coloured by what we know comes later (Plato's depiction of them), is one that's dear to my heart when it comes to historiography. That's why I've opted to give the book two stars when I'd much rather go with 1.5.
But I can tell that Kingsley doesn't think he has a defensible thesis, because of how often he takes time out to attack evidence-based scholarship or science in general: "Underneath the surface of the rhetoric and persuasion there's not much to choose between modern science and ancient magic." Or when he tells us it's perfectly possible that future generations will think we were just as foolish for thinking the earth revolves around the sun as we think of past generations for believing the sun revolved around the earth. It's ridiculous on the face of it, and its sole purpose is to delegitimise the scientific method to preemptively discredit any counterargument based on evidence.
Kingsley also likes to tell us how we're reacting to a particular piece of evidence, so he can tell us that we're wrong. Or he tells us that while something might not seem significant to the modern mind, it was very significant in ancient times: "To most people nowadays a dream is nothing. It's just a dream and that's that. And yet for people in the ancient world there were dreams and there were dreams. Some were meaningful, others weren't; and some could take you into another kind of reality altogether." My favourite of these was "On the middle of a piece of marble you could just about make out the remains of three words. Nowadays three words are nothing. On an inscription like this they meant as much as a whole book."
And then there are his flights of flat-out supernatural fancy. "We honestly believe we're in control, that it's we who search and look and make all the important discoveries in life and know what's important. Occasionally, very occasionally, we may happen to sense something entirely different: that it isn't we who make discoveries at all because really the discoveries draw us to them at the right time and make us find them. It's the discoveries that want to be found and understood. Just as we like to believe it's we who 'make' discoveries, we also think we 'have' dreams. But what we don't understand is that sometimes beings communicate to us through our dreams, in the same way that they try to communicate through outer events. It can be so difficult for them to draw the attention of the living, to struggle through from their world to this: unimaginably difficult."
The first half of the book in particular had some good bits, with its account of the Phocaeans' flight from their home island ahead of the Persian invasion and ultimately founding Elea (which Kingsley refers to as Velia throughout) in southern Italy, or with the description of the Charonium in Hierapolis. But in the end, it just can't be taken seriously.
October 23, 2020
Not a great book. While fine for what it is, there are some definite drawbacks.
1) Peter Kingsley writes this book as though he were talking to a 6-year-old. I just ignored it, and focussed on his message. While this is a good message, there is no need to speak to the reader as though they are a child. What Kingsley loses through doing this is the chance to take us to some truly brilliant heights in the spell he is trying to weave. He talks down to us, rather than taking us with him. I think he thinks that makes his work accessible. I don't think it does.
2) For all the fact that he spends time knocking "scholars", at the end of the day, this is a book for rather bookish people. He spends a long time discussing obscure Greek etymologies. No matter how he attempts to package this as self-help, these are a series of linguistic arguments. He has real wisdom and a deep message to impart here too, but I think it would be more dignified if he owned up to the fact that he himself is one of the scholars he is throwing shade at.
3) It reads like self-help by a patronizing person. No matter how much he tries to write a book like this as self-help, ultimately it is still scholarly work which evolves naturally out of his other book, Ancient Philosophy Mystery and Magic. I think this is interesting, because to me it shows the limit of packaging. I may be wrong, but I don't think many people who are not already interested in these questions of antiquity are just going to pick this up at a New Age bookstore.
My favorite part of this book is how he discusses the practice of incubation, and the way he evokes the world of the philosophers before Plato. It is transformative, and very effective. This is why I gave it three stars rather than a lower rating. I would still recommend you read this book if you are interested in the subject matter. However, I would advise you to ignore his arguments and his patronizing tone.
Ironically, I am someone who needs no convincing of his central message. I would entirely agree with him. But he alienates me because his tone is so patronizing it spoils the opportunity to truly explore what he is trying to say.
1) Peter Kingsley writes this book as though he were talking to a 6-year-old. I just ignored it, and focussed on his message. While this is a good message, there is no need to speak to the reader as though they are a child. What Kingsley loses through doing this is the chance to take us to some truly brilliant heights in the spell he is trying to weave. He talks down to us, rather than taking us with him. I think he thinks that makes his work accessible. I don't think it does.
2) For all the fact that he spends time knocking "scholars", at the end of the day, this is a book for rather bookish people. He spends a long time discussing obscure Greek etymologies. No matter how he attempts to package this as self-help, these are a series of linguistic arguments. He has real wisdom and a deep message to impart here too, but I think it would be more dignified if he owned up to the fact that he himself is one of the scholars he is throwing shade at.
3) It reads like self-help by a patronizing person. No matter how much he tries to write a book like this as self-help, ultimately it is still scholarly work which evolves naturally out of his other book, Ancient Philosophy Mystery and Magic. I think this is interesting, because to me it shows the limit of packaging. I may be wrong, but I don't think many people who are not already interested in these questions of antiquity are just going to pick this up at a New Age bookstore.
My favorite part of this book is how he discusses the practice of incubation, and the way he evokes the world of the philosophers before Plato. It is transformative, and very effective. This is why I gave it three stars rather than a lower rating. I would still recommend you read this book if you are interested in the subject matter. However, I would advise you to ignore his arguments and his patronizing tone.
Ironically, I am someone who needs no convincing of his central message. I would entirely agree with him. But he alienates me because his tone is so patronizing it spoils the opportunity to truly explore what he is trying to say.
December 14, 2020
Foundational reading. A phenomenal introduction to the Western Mystery tradition for those who are completely unfamiliar with the concept. Taking a look at other reviews, I've seen some people complain that Kingsley's tone is patronizing, the book is slow-paced, goes nowhere, etc.
A response:
1) As an esoteric practitioner, it's quite evident to me that the book is literally a spell - it is meant to induce a particular state of consciousness in the reader. In the Dark Places of Wisdom deals with philosophy, mythology, ancient history, geography, archaeology, etymology, and poetry, but it is not academic at all. Though such subject matter is often perceived to be dry, boring, or daunting (because it usually indeed is), Kingsley's text is written in an engaging, easy to follow, conversational manner. If read without expectations or preconceived notions, it can take you on a vivid, powerful journey.
2) The book's last line is: "But the story is far from finished and this book that you've come to the end of is only the beginning: the first chapter". Having started REALITY , I can verify how literal that quote is. In the Dark Places of Wisdom is merely a prequel - if you've enjoyed what you've read here, there's a 600 page tome waiting for you to dig deeper.
A response:
1) As an esoteric practitioner, it's quite evident to me that the book is literally a spell - it is meant to induce a particular state of consciousness in the reader. In the Dark Places of Wisdom deals with philosophy, mythology, ancient history, geography, archaeology, etymology, and poetry, but it is not academic at all. Though such subject matter is often perceived to be dry, boring, or daunting (because it usually indeed is), Kingsley's text is written in an engaging, easy to follow, conversational manner. If read without expectations or preconceived notions, it can take you on a vivid, powerful journey.
2) The book's last line is: "But the story is far from finished and this book that you've come to the end of is only the beginning: the first chapter". Having started REALITY , I can verify how literal that quote is. In the Dark Places of Wisdom is merely a prequel - if you've enjoyed what you've read here, there's a 600 page tome waiting for you to dig deeper.
August 16, 2015
i may read through this again because of the recommendation of another reader, but i found it to be unimpressive. the author seemed incapable of making any straightforward points. it almost felt like he was being purposefully obscure in order to make the book longer and to make it sound "deeper".
May 30, 2021
In this relatively short, easy-to-read book, Peter Kingsley sets forth findings from archeology and classical tests that paint a very different portrait of one of the founders of Western metaphysical thinking, Parmenides. Kingsley's tale of discoveries and insights supports his contention that Parmenides and those around him were profoundly concerned with healing and a deeper form of knowledge than simply rational thought. "Dying before you die" is the title of one of the chapters, and it's a familiar refrain to me, having recently read Brian Muraresku's The Immortality Code, in which "dying before you die" was the dominant motif throughout his account of his search through ancient sources. (In fact, I'd taken a stab at Kingsley's book many years ago, but it didn't stick, but Muraresku's praise for Kingsley's work brought me back to it.)
I'm not a classicist and I'm not in any way qualified to shift through the evidence that might counter Kingsley's contention that Parmenides was first and foremost a healer. I get the impression that such a contention is outside the mainstream of thinking in the classics, at least when Kingsley first promoted this thesis. But having read a bit in this area, including Pierre Hadot's Philosophy as a Way of Life and The Present Alone is Our Happiness, Thomas McEvilley's The Shape of Ancient Thought, and Muraresku's recent book, I'm not surprised that the roots of classical philosophy are found in mysticism, that is religious, spiritual, and healing practices that arise from deep within the cultural tradition. In short, I suspect that Kingsley is on the right track.
I noted in perusing some other reviews, I find that some reviewers noted the very simple style in which this book is written. This is true, it is an easy read, especially given the subject matter. But while Kingsley writes simply, he thinks deeply. I found myself racing through the book while noting many gems of insight and argument as I went, so don't let the simplicity of the prose deceive you. Also, he doesn't use footnotes, but he has a section of references at the end of the book for each chapter for those who want to take a deeper look. It's especially useful if you read French, German, and Italian in addition to English and have access to an academic library!
Kingsley has made a fascinating argument here, and I'm looking forward to reading his Reality, which appears to be a sequel of sorts (originally published in 2004 with a revised and updated version published in 2020). I also look forward to reading the "prequel," Ancient Philosophy, Mystery and Magic: Empedocles and Pythagorean Tradition (1995), which may not prove such an easy read given that it's published by OUP.
Kingsley is onto something here, and I look forward to continuing the journey with him.
I'm not a classicist and I'm not in any way qualified to shift through the evidence that might counter Kingsley's contention that Parmenides was first and foremost a healer. I get the impression that such a contention is outside the mainstream of thinking in the classics, at least when Kingsley first promoted this thesis. But having read a bit in this area, including Pierre Hadot's Philosophy as a Way of Life and The Present Alone is Our Happiness, Thomas McEvilley's The Shape of Ancient Thought, and Muraresku's recent book, I'm not surprised that the roots of classical philosophy are found in mysticism, that is religious, spiritual, and healing practices that arise from deep within the cultural tradition. In short, I suspect that Kingsley is on the right track.
I noted in perusing some other reviews, I find that some reviewers noted the very simple style in which this book is written. This is true, it is an easy read, especially given the subject matter. But while Kingsley writes simply, he thinks deeply. I found myself racing through the book while noting many gems of insight and argument as I went, so don't let the simplicity of the prose deceive you. Also, he doesn't use footnotes, but he has a section of references at the end of the book for each chapter for those who want to take a deeper look. It's especially useful if you read French, German, and Italian in addition to English and have access to an academic library!
Kingsley has made a fascinating argument here, and I'm looking forward to reading his Reality, which appears to be a sequel of sorts (originally published in 2004 with a revised and updated version published in 2020). I also look forward to reading the "prequel," Ancient Philosophy, Mystery and Magic: Empedocles and Pythagorean Tradition (1995), which may not prove such an easy read given that it's published by OUP.
Kingsley is onto something here, and I look forward to continuing the journey with him.
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