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Dread Empire's Fall #2
The Sundering
“Space opera the way it ought to be [...] Bujold and Weber, bend the knee; interstellar adventure has a new king, and his name is Walter Jon Williams.” -- George R.R. Martin Following The Praxis, Walter Jon Williams’ critically-acclaimed mix of space opera and military science fiction, the conflict grows for the fate of humanity…and the universe. The Dread Empire of the Shaa is no more, following the death of the last oppressor. But freedom remains elusive for the myriad sentient races enslaved for ten centuries, as an even greater terror arises. The Naxids—a powerful insectoid species themselves subjugated until the recent Shaa demise—plan to fill the vacuum with their own bloody domination, and have already won a shattering victory with superior force and unimaginable cruelty. But two heroes survived the carnage at Lord Gareth Martinez and the fiery, mysterious gun pilot Lady Caroline Sula, whose courageous exploits are becoming legend in the new history of galactic civil war. Yet their cunning, skill, and bravery may be no match for the overwhelming enemy descending upon the loyalist stronghold of Zanshaa, as the horrific battle looms that will determine the structure of the universe—and who shall live to inhabit it—for millennia to come.
448 pages, Paperback
First published November 3, 2003
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About the author
Walter Jon Williams
238 books894 followersWalter Jon Williams has published twenty novels and short fiction collections. Most are science fiction or fantasy -Hardwired, Voice of the Whirlwind, Aristoi, Metropolitan, City on Fire to name just a few - a few are historical adventures, and the most recent, The Rift, is a disaster novel in which "I just basically pound a part of the planet down to bedrock." And that's just the opening chapters. Walter holds a fourth-degree black belt in Kenpo Karate, and also enjoys sailing and scuba diving. He lives in New Mexico with his wife, Kathy Hedges.
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Displaying 1 - 30 of 133 reviews
February 24, 2020
The second book in this space opera quadrology really takes off. The first has its fair share of space battles and idiotic commanders and a wealth of character building for our two main heroes, but the second book does them both real justice (thanks to the foundation of the first).
I honestly got rather excited that they might have gotten together. The team seemed rather unbeatable in the face of so much incompetence and tradition-hugging. But where the story went (to hell, basically,) was also pretty great.
There seems to be one enormous plotline that practically all these space operas follow. Idiocy, main characters who aren't idiots, a full crash-course featuring an invasion, and then a long space war that coincides with a lengthy ground siege. Some are written well, some aren't, but this one seems to have all its ducks in a row. I'm invested in both. :)
This series definitely has one of the biggest, most thoroughly thought-out, widest collection of worldbuilding I've seen in a mil-SF. It might not be as amusing as some, as flashy as others, or as deliciously character-oriented as, say, Bujold, but when all these different pieces (and more) come together in a single work, I can't help but be rather impressed.
And I am.
I've read MUCH worse. :)
I honestly got rather excited that they might have gotten together. The team seemed rather unbeatable in the face of so much incompetence and tradition-hugging. But where the story went (to hell, basically,) was also pretty great.
There seems to be one enormous plotline that practically all these space operas follow. Idiocy, main characters who aren't idiots, a full crash-course featuring an invasion, and then a long space war that coincides with a lengthy ground siege. Some are written well, some aren't, but this one seems to have all its ducks in a row. I'm invested in both. :)
This series definitely has one of the biggest, most thoroughly thought-out, widest collection of worldbuilding I've seen in a mil-SF. It might not be as amusing as some, as flashy as others, or as deliciously character-oriented as, say, Bujold, but when all these different pieces (and more) come together in a single work, I can't help but be rather impressed.
And I am.
I've read MUCH worse. :)
June 2, 2025
3.5 Stars
It was enjoyable to return to the world of this space opera series.
It was enjoyable to return to the world of this space opera series.
July 12, 2018
This book feels like a military space opera grafted on to a Regency Romance/Jane Austen style story.
A beautiful misunderstood woman! A brilliant but socially inept man! He is noble, but not the right kind of noble so he is an outsider! She is the right kind of noble, but her family is in ruins! They fall in love! Oh, but the woman messes it up! Wait the man takes her back! They ravage each other! it's perfect! Oh no the woman messes it up again, silly woman! He hates her! She hates him! No! She will throw herself on his mercies! OH NO HE AGREED TO MARRY SOMEONE ELSE IN THE SINGLE DAY THE WERE APART! WOE! And now everyone is getting married! But all the marriages are shams! She'll show him, she doesn't need a man! BUT SHE THINKS ABOUT HIM ALL THE TIME AND HATES HIM!
Also, the phase "seeing her was like being hit in the groin by a velvet hammer".
Please stop. just... stop... I ended up finishing this book by skimming large sections of it to focus on the military sci fi part, but even there it's frustrating. The main characters are SUPER BRILLIANT! Oh, but the leaders are traditionalists and stuck in their ways and won't listen! Even if the main character WON ALL THE FIGHTS! Damn his uppity provincial accent!
I kind of /want/ the damn empire to crash and burn if these idiots are the ones in charge...
i give this a 2, but it's more like a 1.5... the sci fi bits have some interesting ideas at least, but god the rest of the story... I don't understand the praise i saw for this book (and the series as a whole)
A beautiful misunderstood woman! A brilliant but socially inept man! He is noble, but not the right kind of noble so he is an outsider! She is the right kind of noble, but her family is in ruins! They fall in love! Oh, but the woman messes it up! Wait the man takes her back! They ravage each other! it's perfect! Oh no the woman messes it up again, silly woman! He hates her! She hates him! No! She will throw herself on his mercies! OH NO HE AGREED TO MARRY SOMEONE ELSE IN THE SINGLE DAY THE WERE APART! WOE! And now everyone is getting married! But all the marriages are shams! She'll show him, she doesn't need a man! BUT SHE THINKS ABOUT HIM ALL THE TIME AND HATES HIM!
Also, the phase "seeing her was like being hit in the groin by a velvet hammer".
Please stop. just... stop... I ended up finishing this book by skimming large sections of it to focus on the military sci fi part, but even there it's frustrating. The main characters are SUPER BRILLIANT! Oh, but the leaders are traditionalists and stuck in their ways and won't listen! Even if the main character WON ALL THE FIGHTS! Damn his uppity provincial accent!
I kind of /want/ the damn empire to crash and burn if these idiots are the ones in charge...
i give this a 2, but it's more like a 1.5... the sci fi bits have some interesting ideas at least, but god the rest of the story... I don't understand the praise i saw for this book (and the series as a whole)
June 3, 2021
This is the second volume of a long war&romance trilogy-that-became-a-series set in a very interesting interstellar empire during a rebellion. The action shifts back and forth from two star-crossed lovers who're doomed to not end up together, in the best Russian classic tradition. The evil alien rebel forces seem to have the upper hand on all counts, but luckily the loyalists have Caroline Sula and Gareth Martinez on their side, the lovelorn pair who for some reason have the ability to develop innovative tactics and strategies that haven't been discovered in the previous thousands of years of placid Praxis rule. The space battle sequences are quite suspenseful, as are Sula's adventures in establishing a guerrilla force when the Naxids occupy the capitol, but the examination of the characters of Sula and Martinez are the most appealing feature. It ends with a heap of cliffhangers, so I'm anxious to start the third book.
October 12, 2011
2nd book of the Praxis trilogy, true space opera/military scifi, a top-notch example of the genre. I really enjoy the writing and the character development - Caroline Sula is one of my favorite heroines. The space battle strategy and plotting (strictly no faster-than-light travel, although they do have wormholes) are interesting, but my favorite parts are everything from Caroline Sula's POV. (No, I lie; it was in vol3 that I couldn't tear myself away from her storyline, in vol2 it is fairly balanced and equally interesting.) It's a transitional volume, and mostly deals with the implications of events in volume 1, but compulsively readable with touches of humor. Caroline is a real person, yet brilliant but also dark and flawed.
September 15, 2018
Good book. This series is even better on a re-read.
November 29, 2022
A very good sequel to The Praxis. Recommended.
January 2, 2020
Things I didn't like:
- The universe was made to feel tiny as everywhere the protagonist, Martinez, went he ran into someone he met previously.
- Too much focus on his relationship.
- Martinez and Caroline doing exceptionally stupid things that were out of character so the author could write some inner city resistance story that was beyond his ability.
- Poor use of the word alien considering the setting. The book isn't old enough to get away with being so simplistic.
Small things, I know.
Things I did like:
- It finished. Eventually.
- The universe was made to feel tiny as everywhere the protagonist, Martinez, went he ran into someone he met previously.
- Too much focus on his relationship.
- Martinez and Caroline doing exceptionally stupid things that were out of character so the author could write some inner city resistance story that was beyond his ability.
- Poor use of the word alien considering the setting. The book isn't old enough to get away with being so simplistic.
Small things, I know.
Things I did like:
- It finished. Eventually.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
July 25, 2021
Wie Mittelteile von Triologien halt so oft sind: überschaubarer Spannungsbogen, aber für das Finale ist jetzt alles schön vorbereitet. Freue mich schon auf Band 3….
August 12, 2021
The Sundering is a decent continuation of the first volume, but it suffers from the same problem as many middle volumes - it starts where volume 1 left off, and it has to set up the resolution in the third volume. In this case, the civil war about control of the former Shaa and now leaderless empire continues, with more space battles, and with some initial partisan-style fighting on the ground.
The book is competently written, but seems a bit less whimsical and polished than The Praxis. There are some minor inconsistencies in the world building, but they match our expectations and so are easy to ignore.
Overall, I enjoyed it, and I'm looking forward to volume 3.
The book is competently written, but seems a bit less whimsical and polished than The Praxis. There are some minor inconsistencies in the world building, but they match our expectations and so are easy to ignore.
Overall, I enjoyed it, and I'm looking forward to volume 3.
June 28, 2024
The first 400 pages are horribly slow, focused on the heroes' thwarted loves, alcove secrets and struggles for influence. Setting up the action takes an infinite amount of time, with a multitude of uninteresting details. I perfectly understand the author's desire to detail the culture of his universe, but he could have gone to the essentials, not lost himself in the description of opera seats or wedding ceremonies. The world building has is limits, it's the reader's boredom.
The last 100 pages are worth reading. At last, some action! Ultimately, you should only read these, all of the above being just rubbish and all you have to know to read the last part of this first trilogy being there.
The last 100 pages are worth reading. At last, some action! Ultimately, you should only read these, all of the above being just rubbish and all you have to know to read the last part of this first trilogy being there.
July 21, 2012
This is a re-read for me. I read the Dread Empire trilogy years ago and rembered it as a rousin space opera. My memory was that it was an excellent epic with lots of space battles. Well, my memory was partially correct. There are some space battles, though nearly as many as I remembered, which are all brilliantly plotted and presented. There is also a substantial amount of politics, class warfare (particularly relevent with today's "1%" disputes), and interesting aliens, which I had forgotten nearly all about. I think Walter Jon Williams series is even more topical today than it was 10 years ago when he began it.
Other recent military sci fi, like Jack Campbell's Lost FleetConventions of War, so it is hard to know if there was actually any influence. Williams has far fewer actual battles, with political and class manuevering actually taking up more of the novels. This is what gives Williams opus more of a space opera feel than Campbell's straight ahead combat approach. Williams also invests much more effort into his key characters, imbuing them with real life problems and motivations. Both are excellent, however, so if you haven't picked up Campbell's work yet you may really like it.
Other recent military sci fi, like Jack Campbell's Lost FleetConventions of War, so it is hard to know if there was actually any influence. Williams has far fewer actual battles, with political and class manuevering actually taking up more of the novels. This is what gives Williams opus more of a space opera feel than Campbell's straight ahead combat approach. Williams also invests much more effort into his key characters, imbuing them with real life problems and motivations. Both are excellent, however, so if you haven't picked up Campbell's work yet you may really like it.
February 28, 2020
This is a reread, and it has held up well. Williams manages to mingle a baroque feudal society with space ships, reminding me some of Weber and Drake's work. The Shaa build a vast empire of five species, but when the last Shaa died, civil war emerged. One species made a power grab, and our two leads, both humans, are active in the resistance. One now serving as a tactile officer on the 'loyalist' fleet and the other part of the ground based rebels on the capitol planet.
While there is a lot of excellent action at times, most of the text concerns political intrigue among the lords, and great descriptions of the empire/world the Shaa created. Major cliff hanger at the end!
While there is a lot of excellent action at times, most of the text concerns political intrigue among the lords, and great descriptions of the empire/world the Shaa created. Major cliff hanger at the end!
March 2, 2021
Normalmente, os segundos livros de uma série - geralmente, trilogia, sofrem todos do mesmo mal. Não podem ser demasiado bons, avançando demasiado o arco narrativo, e com isso tornar desnecessário mais um volume. Mas também não podem ser desinteressantes, e com isso fazer perder o interesse dos leitores. Este segundo volume da série Dread Empire's Fall caminha nessa corda bamba. Arranca, e termina, de forma bombástica, mas entremeios somos brindados com uma série de linhas narrativas que, apesar de adensarem o mundo ficcional, servem mais para compor o texto.
O arco narrativo é vasto, e inicia e termina com operações militares em que um dos personagens se revela particularmente capaz. Por operações, leiam relatos de combates espaciais que se medem em horas e dias, em que a acção está na matemática dos vectores dos projéteis e nas estratégias de lançamento. Walter Jon Williams não se esquece dos limites relativísticos e isso torna o livro muito interessante. As batalhas no espaço, esse lado tão encantador da space opera, são aqui lentas e medidas, obedecendo às leis da mecânica orbital.
Pelo meio, adensa-se a história de amores entre os dois personagens principais, que terá um fim triste... ou nem por isso, que a série é longa e mais aventuras estão na calha. Todo o entretexto serve para Williams adensar o retrato do império - uma civilização milenar, estagnada, clientelista, profundamente elitista. E imersa numa guerra civil contra forças que são ainda mais conservadoras e arreigadas à tradição.
Uma das grandes fontes de tensão do livro está na forma como os seus principais personagens estão à margem deste sistema, mostrando capacidades de ação que não se coadunam com a sociedade estratificada onde o pedigree familiar é mais importante que o mérito. Isso é particularmente relevante numa frota espacial que, apesar do poderio do armamento, é largamente cerimonial e liderada por comandantes que seguem cegamente as doutrinas milenares, mesmo que ao fazê-lo, se condenem a pesadas derrotas.
Este segundo volume termina em alta rotação, com frotas imperiais a recuperar territórios, e os rebeldes atraídos à conquista da capital, o que se revelará uma armadilha. O oficial provinciano, mal visto pelos seus superiores especialmente por se estar a evidenciar pelas capacidades, continua a ser responsável por vitórias assentes em táticas inovadoras, sempre com o descrédito dos restantes oficiais. Irá casar-se para aceder a uma das mais poderosas famílias terrestres do império, essencialmente uma desculpa para Williams adensar a decadência moral das elites que dominam a política imperial, essencialmente uma enorme teia de interdependência clientelista. Já a mulher que realmente ama, opta por seguir o caminho da guerrilha contra os ocupantes do planeta-capital do império. E assim termina o segundo livro da série, que diga-se, mesmo que pelo meio se leia mais na diagonal do que com atenção total, é um daqueles livros que não se descansa até chegar ao fim, pela curiosidade que a historia desperta. E as cenas de combate espacial são magistrais.
O arco narrativo é vasto, e inicia e termina com operações militares em que um dos personagens se revela particularmente capaz. Por operações, leiam relatos de combates espaciais que se medem em horas e dias, em que a acção está na matemática dos vectores dos projéteis e nas estratégias de lançamento. Walter Jon Williams não se esquece dos limites relativísticos e isso torna o livro muito interessante. As batalhas no espaço, esse lado tão encantador da space opera, são aqui lentas e medidas, obedecendo às leis da mecânica orbital.
Pelo meio, adensa-se a história de amores entre os dois personagens principais, que terá um fim triste... ou nem por isso, que a série é longa e mais aventuras estão na calha. Todo o entretexto serve para Williams adensar o retrato do império - uma civilização milenar, estagnada, clientelista, profundamente elitista. E imersa numa guerra civil contra forças que são ainda mais conservadoras e arreigadas à tradição.
Uma das grandes fontes de tensão do livro está na forma como os seus principais personagens estão à margem deste sistema, mostrando capacidades de ação que não se coadunam com a sociedade estratificada onde o pedigree familiar é mais importante que o mérito. Isso é particularmente relevante numa frota espacial que, apesar do poderio do armamento, é largamente cerimonial e liderada por comandantes que seguem cegamente as doutrinas milenares, mesmo que ao fazê-lo, se condenem a pesadas derrotas.
Este segundo volume termina em alta rotação, com frotas imperiais a recuperar territórios, e os rebeldes atraídos à conquista da capital, o que se revelará uma armadilha. O oficial provinciano, mal visto pelos seus superiores especialmente por se estar a evidenciar pelas capacidades, continua a ser responsável por vitórias assentes em táticas inovadoras, sempre com o descrédito dos restantes oficiais. Irá casar-se para aceder a uma das mais poderosas famílias terrestres do império, essencialmente uma desculpa para Williams adensar a decadência moral das elites que dominam a política imperial, essencialmente uma enorme teia de interdependência clientelista. Já a mulher que realmente ama, opta por seguir o caminho da guerrilha contra os ocupantes do planeta-capital do império. E assim termina o segundo livro da série, que diga-se, mesmo que pelo meio se leia mais na diagonal do que com atenção total, é um daqueles livros que não se descansa até chegar ao fim, pela curiosidade que a historia desperta. E as cenas de combate espacial são magistrais.
March 8, 2023
In The Praxis, the first volume in the Dread Empire's Fall series, the Naxid had attempted to move into the gap left by the death of the last Shaa, who had ruled the empire for many centuries. Martinez, who figures out what the Naxid plan to do, manages to save his ship and flee the system -- a rare victory in the initial days of the rebellion.
That fight continues in The Sundering. Martinez, with help from Caroline Sulla's mathematical ability, devises a new fighting tactic that could help them win battles -- if the conservative captains in the fleet will accept a new way of doing things. But Martinez proves that his strategies work.
The Sundering is full of some very good action scenes, but it also explores the political and social manuevering that goes on in an old, very structured, very traditionalist society. The main characters are both interesting, and by book's end both are in situations that are well set up for them to take yet more major actions in the next book.
My only real complaint about the book was that I thought in a critical personal confrontation between the two characters, they could have solved everything by just talking, but instead took extreme actions a bit too quickly. Overall though this is just a minor flaw in an otherwise fine addition to the series.
That fight continues in The Sundering. Martinez, with help from Caroline Sulla's mathematical ability, devises a new fighting tactic that could help them win battles -- if the conservative captains in the fleet will accept a new way of doing things. But Martinez proves that his strategies work.
The Sundering is full of some very good action scenes, but it also explores the political and social manuevering that goes on in an old, very structured, very traditionalist society. The main characters are both interesting, and by book's end both are in situations that are well set up for them to take yet more major actions in the next book.
My only real complaint about the book was that I thought in a critical personal confrontation between the two characters, they could have solved everything by just talking, but instead took extreme actions a bit too quickly. Overall though this is just a minor flaw in an otherwise fine addition to the series.
March 4, 2020
This is the second book in what is proving to be a very enjoyable and creative Space Opera. I really liked the way the book ended and look forward to reading the next book.
June 14, 2021
Well, season two sucked.
I gave the first book of this series the benefit of the doubt by considering it the first season of a show trying to find its footing. Well, find its footing it did, and it consists of a dry aristocratic/royal family melodrama that happens to take place in space.
And it's very disappointing because this universe as a whole has some solid space action and concepts. But this book firmly established that the galactic war, the multiple alien species at play, even the base concept of the almighty Praxis itself, is all secondary to the human melodrama. The bulk of this book is dedicated to a series of high-class formal affairs, formal meetings, formal parties, and oh-so-many formal marriages. Even the action scenes themselves, of which there are proper only THREE, are fine as action scenes but, for the most part, are ALSO so formal as well that the characters take dinner breaks WHILE THEY ARE STILL HAPPENING. (But to be fair that's kind of the nature of the action when relativistic effects are considered.) What I failed to realize from the first book though, is that this painstaking formality permeates the entire series as an unbreakable law, much like the Praxis itself.
The first book was supposed to have set up the galactic war perfectly. But the war just barely happens. Again, it's just there, just like everything else that's not soap opera material.
So about that. The torrid romance between the two heroes from the first book carries on, but it falls apart, rom-com style. And yet, for all the character building that the first book spent so much time on, I now find these characters unlikable. Sula sets herself up for disaster simply because she didn't take one of the many chances to explain herself, and Martinez... well, Martinez is just kind of a womanizing asshole. Well, maybe even worse, because he's a womanizing asshole motivated by family pride? His actions outside of the war are appalling, and his lack of empathy for both his own family and civilian populations at large is kinda revolting.
And yes, this pseudo-oppressive attitude towards others is supposed to be a characteristic of the Praxis itself, and the leaders who uphold it, but... again, even the Praxis is second fiddle to all the melodrama, so the point doesn't even come across clearly, when it would have been very clever otherwise. Who's gonna notice the bigger picture when this whole universe revolves around business deals between aristocratic families and dry meetings between members of the high class? It might as well take place in 1860's England, for all the universe cares.
It saddens me to say that, despite its fantastic premise, I'm no longer interested in this series. This show spectacularly squandered its potential, and it's cancelled for me.
I gave the first book of this series the benefit of the doubt by considering it the first season of a show trying to find its footing. Well, find its footing it did, and it consists of a dry aristocratic/royal family melodrama that happens to take place in space.
And it's very disappointing because this universe as a whole has some solid space action and concepts. But this book firmly established that the galactic war, the multiple alien species at play, even the base concept of the almighty Praxis itself, is all secondary to the human melodrama. The bulk of this book is dedicated to a series of high-class formal affairs, formal meetings, formal parties, and oh-so-many formal marriages. Even the action scenes themselves, of which there are proper only THREE, are fine as action scenes but, for the most part, are ALSO so formal as well that the characters take dinner breaks WHILE THEY ARE STILL HAPPENING. (But to be fair that's kind of the nature of the action when relativistic effects are considered.) What I failed to realize from the first book though, is that this painstaking formality permeates the entire series as an unbreakable law, much like the Praxis itself.
The first book was supposed to have set up the galactic war perfectly. But the war just barely happens. Again, it's just there, just like everything else that's not soap opera material.
So about that. The torrid romance between the two heroes from the first book carries on, but it falls apart, rom-com style. And yet, for all the character building that the first book spent so much time on, I now find these characters unlikable. Sula sets herself up for disaster simply because she didn't take one of the many chances to explain herself, and Martinez... well, Martinez is just kind of a womanizing asshole. Well, maybe even worse, because he's a womanizing asshole motivated by family pride? His actions outside of the war are appalling, and his lack of empathy for both his own family and civilian populations at large is kinda revolting.
And yes, this pseudo-oppressive attitude towards others is supposed to be a characteristic of the Praxis itself, and the leaders who uphold it, but... again, even the Praxis is second fiddle to all the melodrama, so the point doesn't even come across clearly, when it would have been very clever otherwise. Who's gonna notice the bigger picture when this whole universe revolves around business deals between aristocratic families and dry meetings between members of the high class? It might as well take place in 1860's England, for all the universe cares.
It saddens me to say that, despite its fantastic premise, I'm no longer interested in this series. This show spectacularly squandered its potential, and it's cancelled for me.
December 27, 2023
Tome 2
Lu en anglais
Le contexte :
Les Shaa, une race immortelle d'extraterrestres, ont construit un vaste empire galactique, relié par des trous de vers. Mais ils ont dégénéré et le dernier Shaa s'est suicidé. Et les Naxids, une race insectoïde membre de l'empire, manigance pour prendre le contrôle de l'empire. Une formidable bataille spatiale s'ensuit; la plupart des vaisseaux sont détruits. Les loyalistes ne se font pas d'illusion; les Naxids ont maintenant plus de vaisseaux et ils vont sûrement attaquer la planète capitale de l'empire.
Mais il y a Martinez qui a conçu une nouvelle tactique de bataille avec l'aide des talents mathématiques de la pilote Sula.
La situation semble perdue, mais nos deux héros conçoivent un plan permettant aux loyalistes d'alimenter une résistance tout en faisant une guerre de guérilla.
Une fois encore, on a droit au jeu des politiques et des alliances entre familles. La grande bataille spatiale ayant eu lieu, on a plutôt droit à des escarmouches tout de même assez enlevées et un peu de guérilla urbaine. J'ai eu droit à mes scènes d'action avec des tactiques intéressantes, même si j'ai trouvé un peu long les discussions politiques et les affaires de familles. On croirait se retrouver dans l'empire romain où les familles nobles ont le dessus du panier alors que la majeure partie de la population ne compte pas.
J'ai malgré tout beaucoup aimé ce mélange de space opera et de science-fiction militaire.
Lu en anglais
Le contexte :
Les Shaa, une race immortelle d'extraterrestres, ont construit un vaste empire galactique, relié par des trous de vers. Mais ils ont dégénéré et le dernier Shaa s'est suicidé. Et les Naxids, une race insectoïde membre de l'empire, manigance pour prendre le contrôle de l'empire. Une formidable bataille spatiale s'ensuit; la plupart des vaisseaux sont détruits. Les loyalistes ne se font pas d'illusion; les Naxids ont maintenant plus de vaisseaux et ils vont sûrement attaquer la planète capitale de l'empire.
Mais il y a Martinez qui a conçu une nouvelle tactique de bataille avec l'aide des talents mathématiques de la pilote Sula.
La situation semble perdue, mais nos deux héros conçoivent un plan permettant aux loyalistes d'alimenter une résistance tout en faisant une guerre de guérilla.
Une fois encore, on a droit au jeu des politiques et des alliances entre familles. La grande bataille spatiale ayant eu lieu, on a plutôt droit à des escarmouches tout de même assez enlevées et un peu de guérilla urbaine. J'ai eu droit à mes scènes d'action avec des tactiques intéressantes, même si j'ai trouvé un peu long les discussions politiques et les affaires de familles. On croirait se retrouver dans l'empire romain où les familles nobles ont le dessus du panier alors que la majeure partie de la population ne compte pas.
J'ai malgré tout beaucoup aimé ce mélange de space opera et de science-fiction militaire.
October 25, 2022
A fun quick read, and due to my fond memories I still give it a high rating.
However, the writing could have used a better editor - there are just a few too many repetitive words and clunky phrases. The book also suffers a bit from being the middle of a trilogy and I wish the characters' interactions and their motivations - especially in the middle of the novel - were a bit better fleshed out. Things just happen, and I can definitely see why, but... some pivotal moments lack substance.
Other than that there is plenty of fun space opera and subversion going on; space battles, intrigue, scheming, etc!
However, the writing could have used a better editor - there are just a few too many repetitive words and clunky phrases. The book also suffers a bit from being the middle of a trilogy and I wish the characters' interactions and their motivations - especially in the middle of the novel - were a bit better fleshed out. Things just happen, and I can definitely see why, but... some pivotal moments lack substance.
Other than that there is plenty of fun space opera and subversion going on; space battles, intrigue, scheming, etc!
May 17, 2008
This is a great, action-packed space opera with some interesting characters and good battle scenes, in space and on the ground. I like his depiction of space travel, it seems reasonable and possible, although there is still a point where "magic happens" and then it carries on. Williams must have some time under high g-forces because his description is dead accurate. First two books in this series are well worth the price.
February 23, 2017
This book was like Santa Barbara just in space...it was too infuriating and at midway I just dropped it.
The two main characters in this book are just way too childish for my taste and it seems the author was too lazy to think of something interesting and choose the easy way to move the plot forward. I mean, how hard is to clear things up and talk to each other...
The two main characters in this book are just way too childish for my taste and it seems the author was too lazy to think of something interesting and choose the easy way to move the plot forward. I mean, how hard is to clear things up and talk to each other...
October 22, 2024
Welcome to the middle volume of the original Dread Empire's Fall trilogy. If you've already read The Praxis then you've likely already decided you enjoy the setting, Walter Jon Williams's writing, and the main characters Sula and Martinez. Maybe, like me, you were impressed by how Williams wove in themes of complacency and stagnation throughout the first volume in ways that made the first, meandering section of The Praxis make perfect sense in retrospect. Well, if you enjoyed all that, The Sundering is here to deliver even more of the same. More space battles in Williams's prose, even though the battles depicted herein are far less tense. More of Sula, even though she already completed her character arc in The Praxis. More about those themes of complacency and stagnation, but more explicit in case you somehow missed it the first go-around. But, you may ask, what new and interesting elements does The Sundering provide? Very little.
The exception to this is with regards to the relationship between Sula and Martinez in the first half of The Sundering, wherein Williams makes the surprising decision to Outside of this piece of The Sundering, most of the volumes feels like wheel-spinning. The volume ends with both of the book’s main characters taking paths that will keep them busy in the ongoing war, but that are both tangential to the final conflict that the series finale eventually reaches. It would be unfair to say that The Sundering ends in the same place that it begins, as that’s clearly not true, but it’s fair to say that it feels like not much of consequence happens in its 450 pages.
This isn’t an unheard-of problem, as many middle volumes in trilogies are the least memorable, even though some notable exceptions break this general rule. In such cases it’s up to the trilogy’s final volume to justify the weaker middle volume and make the whole journey worth it. Having finished Conventions of War, I don’t think Williams pulls it off.
The Sundering is where the wheels start to fall off the original Dread Empire's Fall trilogy, not because it messes up anything too badly, but because it fails to build on the strengths of the first volume. If you enjoyed The Praxis you’ll likely enjoy The Sundering too, albeit probably a bit less. Given the boilerplate nature of this sequel, the final volume of the trilogy was left with some heavy lifting to do if the completed work was to be something special, and I don’t think it ultimately comes together. This book is a 3/5, as is the trilogy as a whole.
The exception to this is with regards to the relationship between Sula and Martinez in the first half of The Sundering, wherein Williams makes the surprising decision to Outside of this piece of The Sundering, most of the volumes feels like wheel-spinning. The volume ends with both of the book’s main characters taking paths that will keep them busy in the ongoing war, but that are both tangential to the final conflict that the series finale eventually reaches. It would be unfair to say that The Sundering ends in the same place that it begins, as that’s clearly not true, but it’s fair to say that it feels like not much of consequence happens in its 450 pages.
This isn’t an unheard-of problem, as many middle volumes in trilogies are the least memorable, even though some notable exceptions break this general rule. In such cases it’s up to the trilogy’s final volume to justify the weaker middle volume and make the whole journey worth it. Having finished Conventions of War, I don’t think Williams pulls it off.
The Sundering is where the wheels start to fall off the original Dread Empire's Fall trilogy, not because it messes up anything too badly, but because it fails to build on the strengths of the first volume. If you enjoyed The Praxis you’ll likely enjoy The Sundering too, albeit probably a bit less. Given the boilerplate nature of this sequel, the final volume of the trilogy was left with some heavy lifting to do if the completed work was to be something special, and I don’t think it ultimately comes together. This book is a 3/5, as is the trilogy as a whole.
July 1, 2019
This book was a bit of a frustrating experience because I could see where things were going and I understood why they needed to go there; this is the second book in a trilogy, traditionally the "everything goes to hell" segment of the story.
But I'm a sucker for happy endings; if anyone's read my reviews of other books they know I very much dislike the 'grim/dark' tone pervasive in sci-fi and fantasy nowadays. I don't mind angst and issues, but I like there to be some hope of a positive resolution. Pyrrhic victories just annoy me. In that vein, I feel like a lot of the problems set up in this installment aren't solvable except by a sense of "well at least the good guys are the ones left." I read for escapism, so I don't really like it when authors tear down heroes in an effort to point out "look! Good people are just as horrible as evil people, everything is relative, and they're only heroes because they won." Not having Dudley Do-right be the star is fine; asking me to root for a miserable person is not something I want to indulge in.
This book dives sharper into the divide between military sci-fi and what I'm calling "Jane Austen in space". The importance of peerage, political maneuvering, and strategic marriages is much more center stage in this installment and I feel like it occupies more of the book. As I said, I understand why things played out the way they did, I just don't like the way the author did it.
The military sci-fi parts are just as engaging as they were in the other books. I'm hoping book three spends more time there.
But I'm a sucker for happy endings; if anyone's read my reviews of other books they know I very much dislike the 'grim/dark' tone pervasive in sci-fi and fantasy nowadays. I don't mind angst and issues, but I like there to be some hope of a positive resolution. Pyrrhic victories just annoy me. In that vein, I feel like a lot of the problems set up in this installment aren't solvable except by a sense of "well at least the good guys are the ones left." I read for escapism, so I don't really like it when authors tear down heroes in an effort to point out "look! Good people are just as horrible as evil people, everything is relative, and they're only heroes because they won." Not having Dudley Do-right be the star is fine; asking me to root for a miserable person is not something I want to indulge in.
This book dives sharper into the divide between military sci-fi and what I'm calling "Jane Austen in space". The importance of peerage, political maneuvering, and strategic marriages is much more center stage in this installment and I feel like it occupies more of the book. As I said, I understand why things played out the way they did, I just don't like the way the author did it.
The military sci-fi parts are just as engaging as they were in the other books. I'm hoping book three spends more time there.
July 3, 2019
Once again, the melodramatic description of the book used in its marketing is not entirely accurate.
This is an Age of Sail story set in the far future of space, although there is nothing particularly innovative about the science and weapons used by the various races. There is a great deal of social commentary and aristocratic politics in the book. Aristocratic patronage, arranged marriages, trading favors, etc. is all described.
There are two main characters, a junior lordling from a backwater planet (think province) and a young lady who is the sole remaining member of her disgraced family. Both have chosen to make their fortunes in the Empire's military. The Lady Sula goes from being a rich spoiled brat to a hardworking intelligent member of the military. Both of the main characters continue to be rewarded for their actions, and penalized because, since they are from less desirable elements of the aristocracy, it doesn't do for them to outshine their betters. Fortunately, in the wartime conditions the empire finds itself, there are leaders who value competence.
It is interesting that women hold positions of respect and power while at the same time in the same family the women my be used as trade goods to seal an alliance. I suppose this was still happening in our own age of sail. The two main characters are emotionally immature and seem spoiled. Professionally they behave mature, but in their personal relationships they are more like 13 year-olds.
All in all a pleasant easy diversion, but not something to go out of your way to read.
This is an Age of Sail story set in the far future of space, although there is nothing particularly innovative about the science and weapons used by the various races. There is a great deal of social commentary and aristocratic politics in the book. Aristocratic patronage, arranged marriages, trading favors, etc. is all described.
There are two main characters, a junior lordling from a backwater planet (think province) and a young lady who is the sole remaining member of her disgraced family. Both have chosen to make their fortunes in the Empire's military. The Lady Sula goes from being a rich spoiled brat to a hardworking intelligent member of the military. Both of the main characters continue to be rewarded for their actions, and penalized because, since they are from less desirable elements of the aristocracy, it doesn't do for them to outshine their betters. Fortunately, in the wartime conditions the empire finds itself, there are leaders who value competence.
It is interesting that women hold positions of respect and power while at the same time in the same family the women my be used as trade goods to seal an alliance. I suppose this was still happening in our own age of sail. The two main characters are emotionally immature and seem spoiled. Professionally they behave mature, but in their personal relationships they are more like 13 year-olds.
All in all a pleasant easy diversion, but not something to go out of your way to read.
July 8, 2023
The first book in this trilogy suffered from slow pacing during the the 1st 2/3 of the book due to all the setup required for the author's world building.
With that out of the way, book #2 got started much quicker and maintained much better pace throughout. Reading this depiction of a space going yet seemingly socially feudal stratified society was like watching something that one might expect to view on the PBS channel that was filmed in Britain.
Scientifically, there is much one could nitpick with in this universe. One example is the lack of some sort of a gravity counteract device in spaceships that must force the meat to endure excessively high acceleration forces that forces them into unconsciousness. Yet this is a universe where spaceships and missiles are powered by super science like antimatter and worlds that have huge commercial rings that circle planets attached to them by space elevators ("Skyhooks"). Another example is the lack of biometric and DNA technology that works to the benefit of Sula.
The main character arcs of Sula and Martinez converge but then are forced into divergence. Interestingly, Martinez, despite his "provincial accent" and an aesthetically unproportionate body seems to be a bit of ladies man who can rise to the occasion whenever necessary, despite drinking prodigious amounts of alcohol. Sula appears to be a highly intelligent math genius and keen observer of people.
I look forward to book #3. I hope there is less use of the word descriptor "viridian"!
With that out of the way, book #2 got started much quicker and maintained much better pace throughout. Reading this depiction of a space going yet seemingly socially feudal stratified society was like watching something that one might expect to view on the PBS channel that was filmed in Britain.
Scientifically, there is much one could nitpick with in this universe. One example is the lack of some sort of a gravity counteract device in spaceships that must force the meat to endure excessively high acceleration forces that forces them into unconsciousness. Yet this is a universe where spaceships and missiles are powered by super science like antimatter and worlds that have huge commercial rings that circle planets attached to them by space elevators ("Skyhooks"). Another example is the lack of biometric and DNA technology that works to the benefit of Sula.
The main character arcs of Sula and Martinez converge but then are forced into divergence. Interestingly, Martinez, despite his "provincial accent" and an aesthetically unproportionate body seems to be a bit of ladies man who can rise to the occasion whenever necessary, despite drinking prodigious amounts of alcohol. Sula appears to be a highly intelligent math genius and keen observer of people.
I look forward to book #3. I hope there is less use of the word descriptor "viridian"!
September 23, 2020
The Sundering Specific Review: This book did a great job expanding on the plot and world created in the first book. I felt that it did a better job of getting into the characters psychology and personalities even more than the first. While this book was slow on the action front I think it more than made up for it in its political gamesmanship.
Dread Empire's Fall Series Review: I loved the world that was built. I thought that their was a great blend of politics, action, personal relationships. I also thought the book did a very good job describing the different alien races, they felt fantastical but practical with very unique and interesting qualities. I also appreciate when a book introduces a new concept and how the book explains and illustrates space travel and combat was so unique and clearly thought out. Building on that, something not all science fiction books can do well, but I find this one successful at, is making scientific explanation and concepts comprehendible. I also appreciated how the world was supposed to be set in a more advanced future but how it was dominated by very antiquated traditions, political structures, etc. I know a book is good when it can make me root for even the richest onepercenters. A key theme of the entire series was economic inequality, but no matter how stark the author tried to make it, it was sad to know that our modern world is even worse off than this supposed world where wealth disparity is a crucial theme.
Dread Empire's Fall Series Review: I loved the world that was built. I thought that their was a great blend of politics, action, personal relationships. I also thought the book did a very good job describing the different alien races, they felt fantastical but practical with very unique and interesting qualities. I also appreciate when a book introduces a new concept and how the book explains and illustrates space travel and combat was so unique and clearly thought out. Building on that, something not all science fiction books can do well, but I find this one successful at, is making scientific explanation and concepts comprehendible. I also appreciated how the world was supposed to be set in a more advanced future but how it was dominated by very antiquated traditions, political structures, etc. I know a book is good when it can make me root for even the richest onepercenters. A key theme of the entire series was economic inequality, but no matter how stark the author tried to make it, it was sad to know that our modern world is even worse off than this supposed world where wealth disparity is a crucial theme.
September 24, 2020
Straight continuation of the first book, but what was missing or wrong in the first one wasn't fixed in this one.
The Sula origin plot is still as dumb as before and honestly I was actually hoping the book moved past that. As it is it's just an artificial issue for the romance between MC and Sula. It reminds me of the same stupidity in Honorverse with Hamish Alexander.
I also think it's a problem with some of the new POVs because the don't have a voice distinct enough.
This book also highlights a big plot hole: The Shaa are these masterful rules because they ruled a huge empire and had a military that was ceremonial. They didn't need the military to put revolts down because they had no revolts (or at least none in the near past). But they also allowed a corrupt organization like the Peers to not only exist but to essentially govern. To me it doesn't compute.
In terms of plot this book also presents little as most of the time is spent on the romantic aspirations of the MC and his sisters. After the previous book where we had the death of the last Shaa and the start of the civil war here we have only two small skirmishes and a failed terrorist attack. Overall not very much progress. Hopefully it picks up.
The Sula origin plot is still as dumb as before and honestly I was actually hoping the book moved past that. As it is it's just an artificial issue for the romance between MC and Sula. It reminds me of the same stupidity in Honorverse with Hamish Alexander.
I also think it's a problem with some of the new POVs because the don't have a voice distinct enough.
This book also highlights a big plot hole: The Shaa are these masterful rules because they ruled a huge empire and had a military that was ceremonial. They didn't need the military to put revolts down because they had no revolts (or at least none in the near past). But they also allowed a corrupt organization like the Peers to not only exist but to essentially govern. To me it doesn't compute.
In terms of plot this book also presents little as most of the time is spent on the romantic aspirations of the MC and his sisters. After the previous book where we had the death of the last Shaa and the start of the civil war here we have only two small skirmishes and a failed terrorist attack. Overall not very much progress. Hopefully it picks up.
April 4, 2021
The overarching storyline of these books is fascinating - the ending of a long established empire and its descent into war. The two central characters, Martinez and Sula have been well developed and both their stories allow us to see very different aspects of the war. I enjoy the detailed depiction of the ridiculous class structures of the society, and the way that impedes their ability to deal with a genuine rebellion.
So why only 3 stars? Mostly its the structure of the books. The first book spent a long time developing the central characters and the society they live in. The pace and the plot took a long time to get going but the scene had been set for book 2 to hit the ground running. But it doesn't. Instead there's a lot of faffing around as family alliances are detailed, and a terrible Mills and Boon style romance between Martinez and Sula plays out badly. It was excruciating to read. Sula became hopelessly insipid and lost all of the strong character traits that make her so interesting.
So by the time the war gets going again and the plot picks up, the book is ending again!
It's still good enough that I will move straight on to Book 3, and I really hope that finally delivers on the promise of the first two.
So why only 3 stars? Mostly its the structure of the books. The first book spent a long time developing the central characters and the society they live in. The pace and the plot took a long time to get going but the scene had been set for book 2 to hit the ground running. But it doesn't. Instead there's a lot of faffing around as family alliances are detailed, and a terrible Mills and Boon style romance between Martinez and Sula plays out badly. It was excruciating to read. Sula became hopelessly insipid and lost all of the strong character traits that make her so interesting.
So by the time the war gets going again and the plot picks up, the book is ending again!
It's still good enough that I will move straight on to Book 3, and I really hope that finally delivers on the promise of the first two.
May 28, 2025
Fresh from a famous victory over the centaur-shaped Naxid, newly-promoted Lieutenant Martinez and his paramour Lady Sula develop a new way of battling in fleets, after examining the last battle. Having their method adopted by higher-ups both Martinez and Caroline Sula grow ever closer until Martinez finally proposes marriage. Gladly accepting, it comes as a shock when Sula suddenly and decisively leaves without explanation. Lady Sula has a secret. She is not really Lady Sula and a blood test prior to marriage would show this. Both are now angry and feel betrayed. Martinez responds by becoming married to the Lady Terza Chen and Sula volunteers for a dangerous groundside insurrectionist group on the Praxis homeworld of Zanshaa. Martinez continues his golden boy run however and sells the plan he and Sula developed for defense of Zanshaa by separating and removing the ring habitats. Thus when the Naxid arrive they are forced to make a tedious ground invasion rather than bombardment from a prepared satellite mount. Sula’s cell are soon involved in a ground war while Martinez manages another spectacular victory over the Naxid, while acting as a Chen fire control officer. Walter Jon Williams continues his Dread Empires Fall series with a military SF-cum-romance vibe.
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