The Seventh Letter

by Plato

"The Seventh Letter is a literary and philosophical text of the mid-fourth century BC (ca. 360 BC), the authorship of which has long been disputed by classical scholars. Much contemporary scholarly opinion favors the authenticity of the text-i.e. that it was written by Plato himself, or by a student of Plato who possessed direct and intimate knowledge of the events and circumstances involved.

For readers and students of Plato and Greek philosophy, interest in the Seventh Letter lies in the text's account of Plato's involvement with Dionysius II (Dionysius the Younger), tyrant of Syracuse. The philosopher Dion, the tyrant's uncle, convinced his nephew to invite Plato to Syracuse to serve as a tutor to the young Dionysius in philosophy and political ethics (much as Aristotle would later serve as tutor to Alexander the Great). Plato made three journeys to Syracuse, but became victimized by court intrigues, especially involving the exile of Dion. Dionysius was at times so enthusiastic about Plato that he kept the philosopher a virtual prisoner; at other times Plato feared he might be murdered by the tyrant's fractious court. Plato even had difficulties escaping from Syracuse back to Athens.

Plato's involvement with Dionysius II of Syracuse has attracted attention as the philosopher's attempt, apparently his sole attempt, to apply his idealistic political philosophy to real-world politics; and its general failure has struck some critics as a negative commentary on the practical applicability of a Platonic system.

The Seventh Letter also has a detailed exposition of Plato's doctrine of the Forms. Toward the end of the letter is an explanation about the perfect circle as an existing, unchanging, and eternal Form, and how any reproduction of a circle is not the perfect circle. The Form of a perfect circle cannot even be talked about, because language and definitions are not the perfect circle either.

Genres: Philosophy, Nonfiction, Ancient, Classics, Metaphysics

52 pages, Paperback

First published January 1, 354

About the author

Plato (Greek: Πλάτων), born Aristocles (c. 427 – 348 BC), was an ancient Greek philosopher of the Classical period who is considered a foundational thinker in Western philosophy and an innovator of the written dialogue and dialectic forms. He raised problems for what became all the major areas of both theoretical philosophy and practical philosophy, and was the founder of the Platonic Academy, a philosophical school in Athens where Plato taught the doctrines that would later become known as Platonism.
Plato's most famous contribution is the theory of forms (or ideas), which has been interpreted as advancing a solution to what is now known as the problem of universals. He was decisively influenced by the pre-Socratic thinkers Pythagoras, Heraclitus, and Parmenides, although much of what is known about them is derived from Plato himself.
Along with his teacher Socrates, and Aristotle, his student, Plato is a central figure in the history of philosophy. Plato's entire body of work is believed to have survived intact for over 2,400 years—unlike that of nearly all of his contemporaries. Although their popularity has fluctuated, they have consistently been read and studied through the ages. Through Neoplatonism, he also greatly influenced both Christian and Islamic philosophy. In modern times, Alfred North Whitehead famously said: "the safest general characterization of the European philosophical tradition is that it consists of a series of footnotes to Plato."

Reviews

[Owlseyes]

"I fancied that if, early in life, I became my own master, I should at once embark on a political career."

"...I began to be moved by the desire to take part in public and political affairs."


"I, an Athenian and friend of Dion, came as his ally to the court of Dionysios, in order that I might create good will in place of a state war;..."


(Plato talks to Dionysios)


"On my arrival, I thought that first I must put to the test the question whether Dionysios had really been kindled with the fire of philosophy, or whether all the reports which had come to Athens were empty rumours."


"...of general wickedness and greed they had reached. This was the cause of his downfall, which has involved Sicily in countless sorrows."



I wonder if you can really mix Philosophy with Politics. Plato's experience with the Syracuse leaders wasn't that good.


https://aeon.co/essays/when-philosoph...

[Buck Wilde · Rating 3 out of 5]

Everyone's favorite jacked, optimistic philosopher/potential satirist gets hired by one of his philosopher friends to tutor said philosopher friend's batshit crazy nephew. Plato rolls up and is immediately taken prisoner by the li'l tyrant, who becomes obsessed with him. Plato essentially calls him a poser since he doesn't want real philosophy, but can't really leave, so hangs around until he becomes embroiled in court politics. He tries to apply his optimistic ideals of virtue and the Forms to political philosophy. It fails miserably, Ned Stark and Petyr Baelish style. Plato shuffles out of Syracuse, barely scraping by with his life.

tl;dr: Plato gets kidnapped and learns that idealism doesn't work in politics.

[Truls Ljungström · Rating 3 out of 5]

Jag läste om denna, separat från de andra breven, eftersom boken om medeltida filosofi påstår att den ger vid handen att tillgången till filosofi är en mystisk upplevelse; jag ser inget i boken som tydligt påstår detta, om inte dialogen om hur Dionysius av Syrakusa lärde sig filosofi och publicerade den är vad som avses. I någon mån förstår jag om detta användes som ett skäl till idén om tyst kunskap - det var vad jag förstod det som vid första läsningen, men jag är osäker på om det verkligen kan hävdas innebära att plötslig klarhet - plötslig insikt - en en nödvändigt föregående fas för filosofisk förståelse.

[sofía malfoy · Rating 5 out of 5]

Platón le daba princess treatment a Dión

[Ray LaManna · Rating 4 out of 5]

A really good example of how difficult it is even for Plato to reconcile philosophy with the realities of political life and governance

[Reinout · Rating 4 out of 5]

Plato gets into an awkward hostage situation while in Syracuse as the man who invited him is banished and his nephew in law, a petty tyrant called Dionysius, forces him to teach him about philosophy. After his eventual escape, Plato claps back with this epic philosophical epistle in which he reveals the nature of 'true knowledge' only to roast Dionysius for not having any and yapping to much.

Plato shows himself much more nuanced than the neo-platonist Plotinus interprets him to be. Plotinus reads his letter as claiming that in the final stage of knowledge, epistomological knowledge becomes ontological knowledge: the soul meets with the platonic Idea of the object of inquiry. Very gnostic and cool. Plato however doesnt make this jump explicit and may just as well mean that the knower receives a copy or vision of the ideal. It is made transcendant by Plato by stating that once this knowledge is let into the soul ('the narrowest place') it can never be lost...

Plato 1 - Dionysius 0

[Arianna · Rating 4 out of 5]

Da molti considerata un’opera spuria, la Settima Lettera mi ha permesso di comprendere meglio non soltanto la biografia del grande Platone e in particolar modo i suoi tre viaggi presso la corte del tiranno siracusano Dionisio, ma è anche un’opera che permette di chiarire l’excursus filosofico dell’ultimo Platone. A parer mio la lettera è autentica, se non lo fosse, il falsario doveva essere un grandissimo conoscitore della filosofia platonica ma anche uno scrittore geniale.

[Leopold Benedict · Rating 4 out of 5]

I needed a break from Plato's confusing and contradictory epistemology and found this letter fresh and interesting. One can get an insight into Plato's more practical reasoning and his involvement into politics in Syrakus.

[Philemon - · Rating 4 out of 5]

Authenticity of this letter has been disputed (see Wikipedia).

Martin Buber praised this letter in The Eclipse of God for its poetic approach to philosophy. This paragraph from the letter expresses the view that true philosophical wisdom should be dynamically held in the mind rather than written down!

The same applies to straight as well as to circular form, to colours, to the good, the, beautiful, the just, to all bodies whether manufactured or coming into being in the course of nature, to fire, water, and all such things, to every living being, to character in souls, and to all things done and suffered. For in the case of all these, no one, if he has not some how or other got hold of the four things first mentioned, can ever be completely a partaker of knowledge of the fifth. Further, on account of the weakness of language, these (i.e., the four) attempt to show what each thing is like, not less than what each thing is. For this reason no man of intelligence will venture to express his philosophical views in language, especially not in language that is unchangeable, which is true of that which is set down in written characters.

[Ricardo Salinas · Rating 3 out of 5]

Uma historinha da vida do Platão que ele meio que usa pra relatar como o ensino tem que ser dado a pessoas que já são propícias ao conhecimento, justamente pela educação e criação favorável ou desfavorável do corpo em que está a alma. Mostra o quanto Platão se importa com a educação desde pequeno como sendo importante para o processo do conhecimento posterior. O conhecimento posterior por sua vez se dá justamente assim, em um *processo*, que nunca pode vir da fixidez dos discursos preparados ou de fonte escrita, mas sempre do diálogo, que busca elucidar suas próprias bases múltiplas como insuficientes para chegar às Ideias unas, em si mesmas, somente acessíveis à memória da alma. O Platão fala mal dos italianos também muito engraçado.

[Luotenrati · Rating 5 out of 5]

Plato talks about his experiences of trying to persuade a young tyrant to virtue in this letter. He gives us a chronological account of his adventures and his motivations as well as of the situation in Syracuse. It is a very entertaining story over all but it is more than just that. In the beginning Plato actually introduces his views on the topic of law and why a philosopher should be king. Later, in a small interlude between parts of the history, he sets forth a significant aspect of his philosophy and how it should be interpreted, talking about how things come to be known and about the insignificance of the written word for displaying true knowledge. This gives us deeper insight into how we should actually read and interpret Plato.
It's also quite funny how to him a democracy is at the same level as a tyranny or an oligarchy. Oh no! Everything but democracy! Everything but that!

[Aaron Schuschu · Rating 4 out of 5]

A stand- in for both Cleitophon and the Seventh Letter because Cleitophon is not by itself on Goodreads and is usually published with Platonic dialogues I’ve already read. But anyway, in Cleitophon, Cleitophon calls out Socrates for being a troll and the Seventh Letter is about Plato himself writing to Dion’s family because Dion got killed in a shady property deal with Dionysius at some point around Socrates’ death.

[Blaze-Pascal · Rating 5 out of 5]

This is a story about a man who got lost in his own thoughts, was up high on a philosopher's mountain, and basically made fences.

If you live a life for a war, and don't come down from the mountain as Nietzsche talked about in Zarathustra, then, you'll be in wars.

The real difficult work is to create peace.

[Santiago González · Rating 3 out of 5]

De las pocas cartas (junto con la VIII, quizá) que parecen reales y además tienen algo de interés.

Si fue escrita por Platón, es crucial estudiarla si queremos profundizar en su pensamiento, sobretodo de los últimos dialogos y también si se quiere teorizar sobre las doctrinas no escritas.

[Jairo Fraga · Rating 3 out of 5]

Uma pequena carta de Platão a Dion, mostra um pouco do envolvimento do filósofo com Siracusa. Platão se acha o esperto e virtuoso, mas percebe que o mundo não é bem do jeito que ele gostaria.

[Maja · Rating 3 out of 5]

Plato is much more concise and sharp when voicing his thoughts through Socrates in the dialogues. This still seems as a work of justification of his actions and/or lack of them.

[JOE · Rating 5 out of 5]

Its just plato simping for some dictator (the other one). Cool history and philosophy in the background however

[Piper Rutchik · Rating 4 out of 5]

Just one tiny step closer to reading all of Plato’s work…I actually really enjoyed reading this, first time!!

[rachel care · Rating 5 out of 5]

Underrated. Perhaps the most metaphorically powerful work by Plato. One of my favourites.

[Zachary Scipioni · Rating 2 out of 5]

Plato’s misadventures on Sicily. Dudes named Dionysus just want to party not ask questions.

[Jessica Berlus · Rating 3 out of 5]

Plato, writes “if the pupil be truly philosophic, in sympathy with the subject and worthy of it, upon being divinely gifted, he believes that he has been shown a wonderful pathway and that he must brace himself at once to follow it, and that life will not be worth living if he does otherwise”, depicting how the idea of a singular purpose can be impactful, but also it takes a true depth and understanding of all other aspects of the person to be a whole philosopher. I resonated with how he touches on how his writing is a sense of “birth in the soul”, too many who are caught in their realities, and how a lot of people blame their inward thinking and their “Why”, on the nature around them and the fear within them. To be flexible and question the very purpose of who you are makes many people feel uncomfortable, which forces people into the box of habitual mindsets and ideals of how to identify themselves. Since I was little, I always found deep solace and expression through writing, which gave me the habit of reflection and interpretation, which I think in itself is a skill that Plato touches on in this book as well.

[Bread · Rating 4 out of 5]

putting aside issues of authenticity, plato gives an account of his adventures in sicily & his failed attempts to reform the tyrant dionysus, pointing to a constant problematic for the philosopher attempting to navigate the realities of politics. he also goes into a short digression where he discusses how to acquire knowledge, which can only be achieved through dialectic, & gestures to secret doctrines that cant be written down. one wonders what these doctrines were, but the letter was quite interesting and pedagogic

[Daria · Rating 4 out of 5]

And this is the reason why every serious man in dealing with really serious subjects carefully avoids writing, lest thereby he may possibly cast them as a prey to the envy and stupidity of the public. In one word, then, our conclusion must be that whenever one sees a man's written compositions —whether they be the laws of a legislator or anything else in any other form,— these are not his most serious works, if so be that the writer himself is serious: rather those works abide in the fairest region he possesses.

[Rob Roy · Rating 3 out of 5]

Not a dialog but rather a letter from Plato. Another view on Socrates execution, and an insight into politics in Syracuse.