Phrodrick slowed his growing backlog’s Comments (group member since Dec 26, 2023)

Phrodrick slowed his growing backlog’s comments from the Espionage Aficionados group.

My copy was expensive and I suspect it to be out of print, but an interesting addition to ones thoughts about John Le Ce can be found in Conversations With John le Carré.
It is a verbatim collection of interviews given by the author across his career. It is necessarily repetitious. But I esp enjoyed his slow strip tease as he gave up more and more about his 16 yr active association with MI5 /6.

Not sure about all of them, The man in the white suit I remember as being about the suit,

Mostly Thanks, some name I can use to start my search.

I have been a consumer of espionage related novels and history for at least 45 years.
Reading
"But satire and spoof are surely, quite okay. We generally wish to encourage new authors in the genre."

It occurs to me that very little of my reading was intentionally funny. AS for that
Our man in Havanna is clearly designed to spoof spies among other things, but characters are hurt and put to torture. Hardly that funny.
There was a number of Our Man Flint, that count as satire, but the movies were heavy handed and I never took to the books. Speaking of which I literally cannot post my honest thoughts about anything Austin Powers, my words would scald XXX. FWIW Rowan Atkinson take was pure Mr. Bean and I think not based on a novel.

Ok too much about too little.
My question, read any good, and funny spy novels?

Very interesting.
Based on ;Empire of Tea: The Asian Leaf that Conquered the World
I think the first varieties of tea allowed for export to the Europeans was Puerh Tea. The versions I have had were pressed into cakes or tablets and most certainly black tea.

I think there was one other variety, Bohea<?>which I have had a modern version and was also black tea. Bohea may have come first.

The book, I think made it clear that green and silver variations are relatively new in my hemisphere.

I recently got KHS Organic Ripe Pu Erh Tea Brick, 4.5 Oz USDA Certified Organic Puerh Tea Cake, No Dust Production Workshop, Aged Fermented Pu erh Yunnan Ancient Tree Pu'erh Tea Cake, Woody, Deep Earthy Flavor and am saving it for something special.

Among the reasons why I , not just an American, but from New Orleans where coffee is more than just king, I prefer tea; is because there are so many varieties and each so unique to itself.

You may also want to consider
How the Irish Saved Civilization: The Untold Story of Ireland's Heroic Role from the Fall of Rome to the Rise of Medieval Europe 
Cahill has several similar titles. Most are worth you time

He was speaking-out-of-turn.
Sums things up nicely,
In fact I have no debate with any of your thoughts.
MYypoint is only that , to the degree they were his inventions, they lend his narrative depth. They feel at once very insider and very apt.
I am going to go a step beyond and suggest that the precise etymology of some of these terms is lost. Meaning some may predate Le Carre's fiction and some may have been adopted, lost and or retrieved, to the point that there is no absolute certainty.
It is unlikely that many (any) group/agency of whatever; closely tracks these kinds of expressions.

Again IMHO Le Carre allowed many of his characters very distinctive voices and where appropriate sets of languages within languages. To me , a non-British national at once authentic and realistic for that character. My personal take on all of his best, was that he made of me an insider to a world that by its nature was exclusive and unwelcoming.

From my Navy days I can remember dozens of in house names. I

For me the A10 was the original Warthog, and only much later did anyone refer to the much older F4 Phantom as the Warthog

For example when I sailed a gator freighter (amphibious helo carrier).

We referred to our typical helo complement as , Hueys,Snakes, Hogs and Frogs,
Hueys- Some version of the UH1, Huey type
Snakes- Cobra Attack Helo
Hogs- Then some version of the Sea Stallion, or Super Sea Stallion
Frogs - The Sea Knight

Rarely was anything known in the Fleet by entirely respectful names.

Feliks wrote: "'Control' was a real life character. If memory serves, he was Sir John Henry Godfrey.

'Center' was shorthand for 'Moscow Center' aka the Aquarium, the Fishbowl, the Fishtank. A specific glass buil..."

Among the aspects of J Le C's espionage books was the , for me, open question of the various terms and slang names he used. There seems to be no definitive answer to the question of how many he created, how many were in use and how many came into use.

For example, The Circus, was poetically adept, but prosaically based on the not entirely correct placement of the British Secert Service HQ in London on Piccadilly Circus.
The Company for the CIA feels right even if it is intended to be a tad pejorative.
As for specialties within the service
Lamplighters
Watchers
Baby Sitters among others, too many seemed too 'right' as in exactly the kinds of in house names people use over the more formal 'correct names'.

IMHO if there are all of John's invention I hope some were adopted within the service(s).

"He suspects that because it was critical of the British security services, which had been something he avoided doing while alive, his preferred not to be around to catch any unease form former colleagues."

It is hardly for me to question the son, but something about this sounds slightly off.

At least since J Le C very early The Spy he had been getting at least some negative feedback from his brothers in the MI s John was in both MI 5 and 6 at various times, over about 16 years.

Any of several of his earlier works were less than exactly honorific about what he called The Circus.

Based on my read of many things he wrote and said, he had a lot of respect for the people of MI, but as a fiction writer, and a man with a Lot of political opinion, he used the fictional service well or bad as per the needs of any given story. This is after all an advantage of writing fiction, none of it has to be taken as history. Unless it should be.

Please correct me if memory has (again) failed me, When Smiley , among others used the term, Center, it was most often Moscow Center and I think particularly Karla's Operation.

Your topic, you're monitor your rules.
Yes sir
and I am removing myself.

far from one of my firsts, wondering why no mentions any of the the
Night Soldiers?

A new quest for Karala, irresistable

I think I have hesitated to post in this thread, mostly because the question, is like asking a Texan what kind of meat was in his/her barbeque. Who cares to remember?

I know I read at least 40 Doc Savage books but never thought of them as espionage. Many years later I read all the Aubrey/Maturin books (maybe 3 times) and consider them less than 1/2 espionage.
I have read all of the Ian Flemming books at least 3 times,

The Soldiers of the Night series came in much later but deserve honorable mention.

None effected me as much as the John Le Carre books. Read them , listened to them saw most if not all televised and movie versions ,most more than one time. He is my touch stone, benchmark and holy grail of spy books. Yet I do not think he is really writing about espionage. He is way more interested in what kinds of people they are and what kinds of things drive their decisions making. Most happen to be spies, as was le Carre, but his characters could have been a lot of things, so long as the books could ask about love and or verses loyalty versus country and family/co workers.

So far I can find reference to 1 and reason to believe there were more

Feliks wrote: "Ian Flemings' "Thrilling Cities

full text available at Gutenberg free:

https://gutenberg.ca/ebooks/flemingi-..."

Look like fun, thanks for finding this.

Vannibaldassarre wrote: ""
Allow me to take advantage of you being Italian. This is not a title that speaks to spying, intel or esp great literature. But the author might surprise you and Only as a matter of history, all might want to give it a scan
The Cardinal's Mistress

Because most here revere Le Carre , I know I do, I want to mention:Conversations With John le Carré. It is out of print and can behard to find. also $$$
It is a re print of many years worth of interviews with him. So there is a lot of repetition, but also a very slow reveal of who he realy was and for how long.
Speaking of real and unbelievable, there is a small shelf on Sidney Reilly the "Ace of Spys". At hand I can recommend Adventures of a British Master Spy: The Memoirs of Sydney Reilly. written by himself, one of his wives (he tended to have more than 1 at a time) , and a British co worker, also a secret agent type.

I do not think I have here seen much reference to Night Soldiers a multi book series, I think I have read them all, but maybe the last one or two. Up for a buddy read if there are takers

Mentioned it before, the women spies in history have been taking off. Off those I can recommend:
Madame Fourcade's Secret War: The Daring Young Woman Who Led France's Largest Spy Network Against Hitler.

One of my suggestion for a real female spy who could become the women's answer to James Bond-
The Spy Who Loved: The Secrets and Lives of Christine Granville.
Escaping from the prison, naked is something James never did. And another time , she walked into Gestapo headquarters and negotiated the release of some of her compatriots. Also I think she is a model for one of Furst's, side characters, the Polish woman with the dogs...

Mus be that much of the action in this group is undercover.

So one newbie to another welcome.

Love to hear about what you are reading, or would like tobe reading

seems fair enoigh.
Again FWIW
the bulk of the espionage related reading I have done of late has been about the bios of women in the field. Not so much a matter of PC as because some reason the topic is new.

My one opinion on the subject tis in the face of pressure to have a female James Bond movie. I go on record as against it For the reason that females spies exist and do /did enough in the real world to not need to ride on the marketing of a fictional male spy.

Hi, I like an earlier poster on this page am originally from New Orleans and arrived here washed ashore by Katrina. I am about to retire from the local PD, ( Civilian). Actually I am a Sr. CIA, just not what you think that means.
FWIW I am also ex Navy, a ring knocker for those who know the term.

I have not gone for detail in your shelves but I noticed a specific reference to a male oriented discussion group. There has been a growing shelf of women in various front line roles esp WWII resistance and the like. Just a thought, prolly a few years too late.