Literary Fiction by People of Color discussion

The January 2019 discussion book will be Fruit of the Drunken Tree by Ingrid Rojas Contreras. If you would like to lead the discussion, please let me know. Thanks

I've had this one on hold for a while now. I hope it will come in soon!

Happy 2019!

Fruit Of The Drunken Tree by Ingrid Rojas Contreras is our first discussion book of the new year. Has anyone read it? Reading it?

If someone has a copy on hand and can tell me how the book is divided I’ll go ahead and make a discussion schedule. I’m still trying to obtain a copy from my library. So far no luck.

Columbus wrote: "Happy 2019!

Fruit Of The Drunken Tree by Ingrid Rojas Contreras is our first discussion book of the new year. Has anyone read it? Reading it?

If someone has a copy on hand and can tell me how the..."

There are 33 chapters
Chapt. 1-5 pages 1-44
Chapt. 6-10 pages 45-91
Chapt. 11-15 pages 92-136
Chapt. 16-20 pages 137-190
Chapt. 21-25 pages 191-226
Chapt. 26-33 pages 227-300
I don't know how you want to break this down but here it is.
The book is not broken down into parts only chapters.

Jean wrote: "Columbus wrote: "Happy 2019!

Fruit Of The Drunken Tree by Ingrid Rojas Contreras is our first discussion book of the new year. Has anyone read it? Reading it?

If someone has a copy on hand and ca..."

This is what I need. Thanks, Jean!

Discussion schedule for FOTDT:

Chap 1-10 Jan 4-11
Chap 11-20 Jan 12-22
Entire book open Jan 23rd

Ok, the discussion begins today. Has anyone started the book or read it previously? I’m assuming this is a debut from this author? Not familiar with her.

Finished it last week and liked it very much. I didn't think I was in the mood for a story seen through a child's eyes (although recounted by her as a teenager) but I bought into it right away. I think it was because the author did a great job of building all her characters by showing, not telling.

I just started it this morning and I'm loving it already.

Hello everyone and happy new year! Sorry I have been away but happy to be back now. Just hot the book today and I am very excited to start.

Great, everyone. If you have any particular thoughts on the first ten chapters, please share them with us. Would love to know what you think.

My copy just came through from the library (audio) so I'll be starting in the next day or two.

Here are a couple of articles/reviews regard the book and/or the author:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/25/bo...

https://www.bustle.com/p/the-fruit-of...

Ingrid Rojas Contreras on Not Writing for White People
http://www.pleiadesmag.com/ingrid-roj...

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/...

https://www.pastemagazine.com/article...

How ironic that Patrona got to witness the Santiago’s playing games with money when her family was so poor and hungry. They even handed Cassandra a few more dollars just so they could watch her eyes light up.

The contrast between the Santiago girls and Patrona keeps the story even more interesting to me. I've just started Chapter 7, so I'll be back when I finish through Chapter 11.

Beverly wrote: "Here are a couple of articles/reviews regard the book and/or the author:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/25/bo...

https://www.bustle.c..."

Thanks for sharing these! I will read once I'm done with the book. I'm only 4 chapters in. I was a bit wary at the beginning, but I'm gotten more comfortable with the writing style. Eager to see how it will unfold.

I enjoy seeing the contrast between the lives of the Santiagos and Patrona's. Bogata was in turmoil but the Santiagos were relatively insulated from it except when they choose to live their community. Whereas, Patrona was living right in the middle of it. Also interesting is the contrast between the lives of Chula and Cassandra who are raised as little princesses and Patrona's little sister who is about the same age but is expected to take care of the household.

Myron wrote: "I enjoy seeing the contrast between the lives of the Santiagos and Patrona's. Bogata was in turmoil but the Santiagos were relatively insulated from it except when they choose to live their communi..."

So far the contrasts between the two lifestyles are the most interesting factors of the story for me as well. I find it intriguing that sometimes the Santiago girls do some mean things but they aren't really "mean girls" in our current definition of the phrase. I'm listening to this one, and the narration is good. I just hate that once in a while my mind drifts and I miss something important and get confused.

I finished the book only moments ago, and I am elated that I read it.

Discussion open thru chap 20

I am currently nearly halfway through. I am enjoying the mother character the most. She keeps me laughing. So far so good.

I finished this recently, so was elated to discover it is this months read.

I'm currently puzzling over the meaning of the title, but more on that later after we've all finished.

I'm intrigued by the connection that develops between Chula & Petrona, and how clueless Chula & her sister are about Petrona's life. Also about how their mother, in spite of "marrying up" out of her village is perceived by her sister and (I think this is later in the book) people in Petrona's community

Myron, your mention of insulation brings up the issue of safety for me. Not just economical & physical safety, which the Santiago's appear to have, but emotional & intellectual safety as well. Petrona and her family don't seem to have this, though Petrona tries to hang on to it via remembering her origins and her father, but the Santiago's? Waiting for discussion after we've finished.

Ardene wrote: "Myron, your mention of insulation brings up the issue of safety for me. Not just economical & physical safety, which the Santiago's appear to have, but emotional & intellectual safety as well. Petr..."

I definitely want to have this discussion but yeah, I'm not far enough into the book to have it yet.

Bernie wrote: "I finished the book only moments ago, and I am elated that I read it."

Cool. I just picked up a copy this week and hope to start tomorrow.

A couple questions to hopefully get discussion going.

How do the dual perspectives this novel is told through affect your reading? What does Chula's perspective add? What does it leave out? What do you as a reader gain from Petrona's perspective? What does she miss seeing?

Which of the many characters in the novel did you empathize with the most? Which did you like the least? Talk about why you feel this way.

I am ready when the whole book opens for discussion. I was listening on audio and got pulled in and finished and am unsure what happened in the second section and what happened in the third.

I empathized primarily with the main characters, Chula and Petrona. If you asked me which one I'd rather be, I would choose Chula because she is mostly physically safe, while Petrona is not. But neither of them got a choice of when and where they were born.

Chula's perspective as a child brings us slowly to awareness of political and socio/economic conflicts in Columbia. Her youth and innocence bring some humor & irony to situations. I remember how I was enamored with certain babysitters my family had when I was a child, and understand Chula's connection to Petrona through that lens.

Petrona has had her innocence shattered, and has a completely different perspective because of her family's situation and her role as the breadwinner. She remains hopeful until she and her sister are hurt and she realizes the position she is in with Gorron. Even then, I think she makes the best choices she can, but the consequences for her are harsh. I am curious about whether she makes good on her promise to herself and her son to someday leave.

Gorron was my least favorite character. Of course, I don't know his backstory, but I don't understand the process that warps men's characters so they use rape and physical abuse as a means of controlling people.

I kind of loathed Gorrion. And wondered when and if Petrona would have left.

Random side note:
I walked into a burger joint in Queensland earlier this week & the 1st menu item I noticed was a "Pablo Escoburger" -- because making it spicy means it should be named after a Colombian drug lord??? At the time I was halfway through this book, so of course I ordered it.

I have since finished the book.
A general comment / without spoilers:
The slow build of surrounding events as seen from a child's perspective reminds me of Small Country by Gaël Faye.

Loved the book, and feel warmly towards all the characters, except Garron of course, since he causes so much harm. (I feel a twinge of guilt in hating a character I know so little about, but given that the story is seen through Chula's eyes, and he caused so much pain, I have no problem with him as villian.) I especially loved Chula's grandmother. She didn't play a big part, but she was such a deep and emotional character for me. Big sister Cassandra grew on me more and more - I loved that she wore pink glasses ;)

I also hated Gorron. But not only for his actions and how he was written. Since he had no background and he described as the " black man" or " afroed man" he felt like a trope.

Sicily wrote: "I also hated Gorron. But not only for his actions and how he was written. Since he had no background and he described as the " black man" or " afroed man" he felt like a trope."

True for me too.

Ardene wrote: "A couple questions to hopefully get discussion going.

How do the dual perspectives this novel is told through affect your reading? What does Chula's perspective add? What does it leave out? What d..."


The dual perspectives this novel is told in, gives the reader a complete picture of what is going on. When a storey is told from one point of view you are only getting one side of a storey, which is not always the truth. When you hear two sides of a storey, you know the truth is somewhere in the middle. Chula's perspective adds insight into the innocence of a family that was being targeted by the guerillas. Petrona's perspective tells us how someone who is poor and desperate enough, could bring themselves to a place where they could aid the guerilla's ( or do something else that is really wrong). Chula and Petrona's points of view each leave out the other persons perspective.

I found the mother to be one of the most interesting characters. I disliked her when I knew she was cheating. The more I read about her the more I liked her.

Bernie wrote: "I found the mother to be one of the most interesting characters. I disliked her when I knew she was cheating. The more I read about her the more I liked her."

That's fascinating. I never did like her much as a character. What made you begin to like her?

The mother wasn't my favorite character either - a bit too self-absorbed - but the author gave me enough of her background for me to 'get' her and I went along with it. But I was really surprised when she eased Chula's concerns and facilitated the paternity test.

I think the mother was a complex and contradictory character - on the one hand, she's a strong woman who isn't afraid to act when things get dangerous, even when her actions aren't very wise. On the other hand, in a machismo culture, her power comes from her beauty - it's what got her out of rural poverty and into the middle or upper middle class, and it's the source of her pride. Although come to think of it, beauty is power for women in the US too - where machismo is alive, but getting weakened, thanks to #metoo....

Entire book open for discussion

Hi,

I'm eager to talk about this book. If you haven't finished reading, I will avoid disclosing any spoilers. That said, I didn't like this book much. I found the voice of Chula to be too flowery and verbose, and wasn't convinced. I also did not care for the uneven alternating POVs. Although Petrona's chapters provided the reader with necessary backstory, I wished we stayed with her more, as opposed to what seemed like "check-in" chapters.

I agree with you, Ifeyinwa, on Petrona's chapters being weaker. Perhaps the author didn't want us to know more or as much about her than we did about Chula and her family, but I would have liked more information. I didn't have trouble with Chula's voice since she was writing as a teenager looking back and telling the story. There were many teens at the high school where I worked who were finding their "intellectual" voice that would have sounded much like Chula, so that voice felt real to me. I found the kidnapping scene particularly tense and realistic. I liked the mom as a character, but not necessarily as a mom.

Carmel wrote: "Bernie wrote: "I found the mother to be one of the most interesting characters. I disliked her when I knew she was cheating. The more I read about her the more I liked her."

That's fascinating. I ..."

I liked the way she did not forget where she came from, she did not have a problem with taking her daughters to the invasion that Petrona lived in. She was far from being a perfect parent, but she loved her girls. She even reached out to Petrona and extended kindnesses to her that were not required. I expected her to totally abandon her husband. She and the girls helped make those recordings. I found her character to be very amusing.

Ifeyinwa wrote: "Hi,

I'm eager to talk about this book. If you haven't finished reading, I will avoid disclosing any spoilers. That said, I didn't like this book much. I found the voice of Chula to be too flowery..."

You can discuss anything you like at this point. No restrictions.

Another interview by the author:

https://lithub.com/ingrid-rojas-contr...

Columbus wrote: "Ifeyinwa wrote: "Hi,

I'm eager to talk about this book. If you haven't finished reading, I will avoid disclosing any spoilers. That said, I didn't like this book much. I found the voice of Chula ..."

I did like that we could a glimpse of the girls as teens. The story was told by 15 year old Chula through her childhood eyes. It was a bit flowery but I did like the retroactive insight.