Play Book Tag discussion

Winter's Tale by Mark Helprin - 3* - My Review

Sprawling epic fantasy set in New York in a world similar to ours but filled with mystical and fantastical elements. It is difficult to summarize since there is so much going on. It starts with Peter Lake being rescued from a gang by a magical white horse. It then goes back to provide Peter’s origin story and how he arrived at the scene that opens the novel. He is a mechanic and petty criminal who has made an enemy of the local leader of the Short Tails gang. While robbing a mansion, he meets a visionary young woman who is dying of consumption, and they fall in love. The storyline follows Peter Lake as he meets a variety of eccentric characters and crosses otherworldly barriers. There are characters who are not human, a bridge engineer, an industrial heir, a single mother, and too many others to describe in a short review.

It is like a parallel steampunk world of magical realism. There is a mysterious cloud wall surrounding the city. Winter plays a key role in the narrative, as the city goes through a series of winters, one following another. Time travel is involved. It is written in a lyrical style, which adds to the ethereal quality of this fantasy world. It contains many universal themes, such as justice, time, free will, love, mortality, and hope. There is also a good amount of symbolism and beautiful prose for those who enjoy literary writing. The main drawback is that it is very long (around 700 pages), and I eventually felt its length.

Interesting review. It is high on my TBR - actually as a sort-of reread.

This was a rare DNF for me way back when it was first published in mass market paperbacks or not long after, and everyone was reading it - at least in NYC. I did not get far before putting it aside - girl sleeping on roof townhouse rooftop, snow, and this mysterious guy Peter sitting in the cellestial ceiling of Grand Central Terminal - had no clue what I was reading and it was not showing itself to be the type of story I thought it was - HF. I did not read fantasy at all back then, did not care for it (or so I thought then). Had no clue tgere was anything like magical realism, and steampubk was not even coined as a genre yet. I also looked at original publication dates ... this had to be just after law school and my first year as an assocate. That did not help. Clearly a case of bad timing. I always thought I would go back to it and even have that now ancient MMP somewhere on my shelves still.

It was a dnf for me and also one in which I decided this author was just not my taste.

I enjoyed Helprin's historical fiction, A Soldier of the Great War much more than this fantasy book. I can see why it may have been a DNF for the two of you.

I got tired of it after a while, especially when the main characters disappear for a couple hundred pages. I liked the world-building aspect, but it was just too long for someone who doesn't care much for fantasy (like me). Perhaps I just haven't found the right type of fantasy, but I need to become immersed in it and really care what happens. Other than a few notable works such as Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter, and a few isolated others, I just haven't found it yet.

ETA - If anyone wants to recommend fantasy to me, I did not like Game of Thrones or Outlander. I enjoyed the first book of the Hunger Games, The Great Library, and the Golden Compass, but found the sequels lacking. I've enjoyed Piranesi, Babel, When Women Were Dragons (which is more historical fiction), and The Lathe of Heaven (which is more SciFi). I was lukewarm on the (many) Bujold books I read last year. I am still trying to enjoy more fantasy, but I just haven't found much that keeps my interest.

Theresa, since it was published in 1983, I don't think the term "steampunk" had been coined yet. It just seemed like what I know now to be steampunk.

Joy I think you may like:

The Black Tides of Heaven
Mary Stewart's version of Merlin-it starts with
The Crystal Cave
The Deep
Gods of Jade and Shadow
The Lions of Al-Rassan
Tigana
The Binding

These are all off of my Fantasy Read Shelf, and there are reviews I did that you can look at. Most of them could be classed HF and all of them were 4 or 5 stars for me. None are bogged done with magic and mayhem.

Back when I tried to read Winter's Tale, the only fantasy I had read and loved was Tolkein which read more like an adventure or quest story - on the road, surviving odds. I still am not overly fond of fantasy heavy on magic or world building.

But I have broadened my reading a lot since the 80s.

A Song for Arbonne by Guy Gavriel Kay - a stand-alone set in french courtly middle ages style world. My favorite by the author whose writing is very literary. I also love Tigana. This seems to me a good author for you as his writing isvery literary fiction.

The first fantasy that sucked me in and ulitimately led me to Tigana and then other more HF/adventure style fantasy works was Maia by Richard Adams published in 1984. You might try that.

Recently I and my Feminerdy Book Club read S.A. Chakraborty 's debut trilogy that starts with The City of Brass. We all really liked this series for very different reasons. World-building encompasses recognizable Egypt, middle east and primarily Northern India. Has adventure and potitical turmoil, some mythical beasts, magic and healing powers. Great characters and controversial ones. Astounding first work from a young author.

I have never heard of Maia, Theresa and that is a great hoaky" cover AND I love a great hoaky cover 😅 As a matter of fact, all the covers for it on the main page are hoaky!! I am adding this one to my TBR, it is a great fit for my "read older fantasy" personal challenge-And next time my Fantasy group has a "shows us a hoaky cover" thread-this is on my list.

@ Joy, Theresa's suggestion of A Song for Airborne is a great one too-I also have a review for that one. I love Guy K. G, and I love all his work. He is also Canadian-ATY has a challenge for that next year!

Joanne wrote: "I have never heard of Maia, Theresa and that is a great hoaky" cover AND I love a great hoaky cover 😅 As a matter of fact, all the covers for it on the main page are hoaky!! I am addin..."

Oh JoAnne - I think you will love it -- it's probably more like Tigana than most other older fantasy. Of course, Adams' other great fantasy was all about rabbits .... which basically banished Maia into the used book stores.

This is the cover of the MMP I read -- and probably still own buried on my shelves somewhere - the least hoaky of them all I think - looking at all those editions - what were they thinking?! I think I even re-read it once long ago. My friend Ellen and I read it about the same time - it made her a huge fantasy fan as it was really the first big fantasy she ever read as of then. We moaned for years about how hope sprang eternal that Richard Adams would publish another Maia ... then GGK published Tigana ....

@Joy - I recommended it to a friend who was not a heavy fantasy reader and she loved it. One of her favorite authors was Salman Rushdie. That was around the timeThe Satanic Verses was published.

A more traditional adventure fantasy is the series by Michael J. Sullivan that starts with Theft of Swords. The first book can stand alone and isn’t all that long. Some editions combine it with Book 2, but you could see if you get hooked after Book 1 or not.

I also love Guy Gavriel Kay, whose books are sort of alternate history based on real cultures but with just a bit of magic. I liked The Name of the Wind but the sequel wasn’t as good and then the author stopped writing in the middle of the saga. Same for The Lies of Locke Lamora the first 2 books were good f you like scams and heists, the 3rd one not as good and then the author stopped without finishing.

Thought I might through my two cents in since the door was opened on a fantasy book recommendation. It is Across the Nightingale Floor. This is the first in an excellent series.

Wow, thank you for all the recommendations! I will check all of them out. The only one mentioned that I have read is The City of Brass, which was a miss for me (too much sex if I remember), and I have The Name of the Wind on my TBR.

This is why I love this group! I am almost positive I could get into more fantasy if I just pick the right books.

Steven wrote: "Thought I might through my two cents in since the door was opened on a fantasy book recommendation. It is Across the Nightingale Floor. This is the first in an excellent series."

I have added it to my TBR - thanks, Steven!

Joy D wrote: "Wow, thank you for all the recommendations! I will check all of them out. The only one mentioned that I have read is The City of Brass, which was a miss for me (too much sex if I remember), and I h..."

I have no doubt you could too, Joy. I mean *I* found some!

I don't even remember there being any sex in The City of Brass, LOL. That series led to some really terrific discussions at the Feminerdy meetings.

The Name of the Wind read as very Dickensian to me - until the end. I've not yet read the 2nd in the series so can't opine on it - and though I own it, may not read it given how disappointed so many were and that I truly don't believe he will ever write the final book of the trilogy. My personal opinion is that he had this one book in him and somehow got talked into a trilogy which is when he strayed away from the Dickensian feel in the last part of The Name Of the Wind. He was a literature professor and it shows in the first 3/4 of the book, to my thinking.

Sounds like I'd probably like The Name of the Wind. I've had it on my TBR for a long time but never gotten around to reading it.

The City of Brass may have had some other reason I didn't care for it. I did not review it, and I usually don't review a book when my main objection is "too much sex" because I recognize that I have a personal issue with it that doesn't translate to others. I can also get turned off by "too much violence". I don't remember it well enough to know. I may have skimmed over a good bit of it (which is another reason I won't review a book since I didn't read the whole thing but I don't want to forget that I gave it a go).

I read a few years ago. I liked it a bit more than you did Joy, although I find that I haven't retained the details. I remember thinking that the book was drowning me in words. I liked the characters and there were so many quirky descriptions and interesting metaphors that made me smile. But the words buried me and I kept having to shovel myself out.

I did keep thinking back to Helprin's book when I read The City We Became. There's a good compare/contrast between those books.

I'll also add my vote directing you to Guy Gavriel Kay. My introduction to his writing was Under Heaven.
It's set in a pseudo-Tang Dynasty China. I'd actually say that it's closer to magical realism than fantasy. It reads like well researched historical fiction.

Jgrace wrote: "I'll also add my vote directing you to Guy Gavriel Kay. My introduction to his writing was Under Heaven.
It's set in a pseudo-Tang Dynasty China. I'd actually say that it's closer to..."
Thanks, that one does look interesting!

Jgrace wrote: "I read a few years ago. I liked it a bit more than you did Joy, although I find that I haven't retained the details. I remember thinking that the book was drowning m..."
I agree it is very wordy. I'm sure it could have easily been edited and not lost much.

Great review! I read it a good decade ago (at least) and remember enjoying it.

Thanks, Becky! Glad you enjoyed it too.