The Debate Club discussion

Is body positivity a valid concept? Or is it an excuse to not make yourself better?

hi

Austin where are the capital letters and why is it under lgtbq+ 😭

It started out as a good thing but as always, became corrupted

What do you mean capitol letters?

Also, "fat pride" is not valid when you are actively saying you/people being morbidly obese is healthy.

It is not.

Austin wrote: "What do you mean capitol letters?"

"Body Positivity"

I keep seeing clara dao exploding on social media because of...what?

MidnightButterfly wrote: "Austin where are the capital letters and why is it under lgtbq+ 😭"

I'll fix that hang on

Is this folder better?

What is body neutrsilty?

Why doesnt body positivity belong under lgbt?

Austin wrote: "Why doesnt body positivity belong under lgbt?"

Because body positivity has nothing to do with being gay lol

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "When you’ve lived it, you know a bit more on how the body positivity movement is just as judgmental, telling you that it’s okay to eat something because they perceive you as fat and assume you’re s..."

I completely agree

Isnt it related to trans stuff?

Austin wrote: "Isnt it related to trans stuff?"

no 😭

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "What is body neutrsilty?"

It’s a more inclusive version of body positivity that basically emphasizes having a neutral take on your body’s presentation and the presentatio..."

That isnt a movement though, thsts just the "way its always been" right. I mean, its just saying nobody shoukd interefere but im assuming we try to encourage healthy eating not neccessarily to achive a "perfect body" but in order to be healthy

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "When you’ve lived it, you know a bit more on how the body positivity movement is just as judgmental, telling you that it’s okay to eat something because they perceive you as fat and assume you’re s..."

Agree with everything you said!

I mean i agree, but with the, for example, "fat pride/acceptance" movement they think what they are doing is healthy

Austin wrote: "Why doesnt body positivity belong under lgbt?"

Because it doesn't have anything to do with your sexuality or gender, it's just about your body type, self-confidence, and weight

Also I just renamed the topic to be a bit more specific about what we're discussing, hope this helps. Let me know if I should change the title or the folder.

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "Yeah, that’s something I always hated. Especially now that it’s been hijacked on social media by rage-baiters and people looking for brownie points by getting their fat friends to pretend like they..."

EXACTLY

Esp in america where 85% of people are obese, and the large majority of this is purely due to junk and not due their natural body type

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "Just a few months ago I came across a video essay where someone tied together social media and EDs but instead of just focusing on skinny influencers, they also addressed the western version of muk..."

True

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Esp in america where 85% of people are obese, and the large majority of this is purely due to junk and not due their natural body type"

THIS
We allow so many toxic chemic..."

Is this not what rfk jr is tackling?

I think it's okay to not like your body, and want to change some stuff about it (by dieting, exercising, etc). It can be very unhealthy to be overweight, so these changes can be really good. But you should definitely not hate your body, and NO ONE should make fun of you or tell you how to live your life involving your weight. The thing about comparing people on social media and talking about weight so much is, in my opinion, just harming people, because they might feel like they have to live up to social media's expectations of them, and they might also feel like being obese on an unhealthy level is OK (when in reality it can be life-threatening). I think everyone should just live their lives, no matter their body type/weight, and the only one who should be commenting on that is their doctor.

S0l4r_St4rz - beginning to be happy again wrote: "For those who don’t know abt Clara Dao:

She’s a ‘body positivity’ influencer who used to be a huge icon. She showed body positivity for skinny/ flat people rather than plus size people like lots o..."

SHe said that she starves hereelf, not others should

Austin wrote: "Isnt it related to trans stuff?"

How is weight and insecurities related to trans🤣😭😭

I think body positivity is a good thing. I think if you are obese or underweight body positivity should not be an excuse for you to get healthy, but body positivity is still a good thing.

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "S0l4r_St4rz - beginning to be happy again wrote: "she had a whole video essentially promoting Ed’s to little girls which is disgusting imo"

the only thing I could find is that she said she only ea..."

What does /genq mean

ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "YourLocalPoliticsPotato wrote: "ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (semi-hiatus till summer) wrote: "S0l4r_St4rz - beginning to be happy again wrote: "she had a whole video essentially promoting Ed’s to little girls which ..."

Oh thanks!

body positivity is good, but like many others have already said, only to a certain extent. if you're overweight, don't starve yourself, but don't go out of your way to eat unhealthy either. that's the only advice i have.

bc really being fat/skinny has almost nothing to do with how much you eat, compared to what you eat. i eat a lot, but since i literally never have fast food or soda, i don't gain much weight and am somewhat skinny and underweight (i was born underweight, that's how i naturally am). because things like burgers are genuinely really, really bad for you. the people who made them were hardly keeping your health in mind.

the goal of the body positivity movement was to stop toxic messaging. like there's this kid i know who keeps calling me weak and skinny, and refers to one of my friends as the "fat girl", which is like bro shut up that's just rude. but sometimes the movement goes too far and starts saying that things like burger king is ok. which it is not, at all. so we should just be aware of that. you don't need to starve yourself, but there are more options that just eating fast food or not eating at all.

I'd like to add onto the toxic messaging: when I was still identifying as a girl in elementary school, I had a pudgy stomach, but was actually underweight, and was fat shamed into an ED once I got to middle school. This shit actually effects people, and the people saying stuff like this don't really get why it's bad to shame people, and why positive messaging is so important.

(I did not back read bitcheagos)

So i think its always good to love yourself and others but you shouldn't be for obese or overweight people. and you shouldn't be mean either. instead you should be helpful ang give advice and push them towards a healthier lifestyle. I'm not going for people who are overweight im simply saying if your overweight or underweight it means your unhealthy (Unless there's smt else you cant change) and you should push to be healthier. you shouldn't be for obese people bcs thats unhealthy but you should help anyone that wants your help.

I think body positivity is very important because of how much bodies fluctuate throughout life. Also what might be healthy for one person, might not be for another so it's not an excuse to not improve yourself, it's to stop beauty standards from making people insecure and becoming unhealthy to adhere to them. While 120 pounds might be healthy for one person 160 might be for another and 220 might be for another, it all depends on what you do, what you eat, genetics, and even medical issues. What healthy is for people is between them, their doctor, and if they are a minor, their guardian(s).

I mean, it depends. sometimes people are healthy when theyre fat, some are not. it really just goes into your genetics.

lizzie ౨ৎ wrote: "I mean, it depends. sometimes people are healthy when theyre fat, some are not. it really just goes into your genetics."

This, lots of PLUS SIZE people are genetically the size they are, and still healthy, ex: my friend from summer camp, Disco! She's 5'5 and plus sized but has been told she "looks fat" by doctors, but is perfectly healthy.
A reminder that plus sized people exist, and get way too much shit when most of them are healthy.

I think to an extent it can help. if you're normalizing being healthy, say upper end of healthy weight even its okay, and it can help. for example, for me when recovering from an ed I've found it kinda helpful to watch some body positivity accounts (especially Spencer Barbosa). and ofc, no one should ever be shamed for their weight. when it gets to be a problem is when people are normalizing and encouraging being extremely overweight. it has nothing to do with looks, its because obesity can lead to severe health complications. so yeah, too an extent it is definitely good

and by normalizing, I mean saying that someone who is an unhealthy weight is ok because you want to be positive. I think no one should have a say in someone else's weight at all, only doctors should, but yeah it can sometimes be unhealthy

Someone who is an unhealthy weight should never be bullied or shamed for it but i don’t believe we should be glorifying/normalising being an unhealthy weight

Hazel wrote: "Someone who is an unhealthy weight should never be bullied or shamed for it but i don’t believe we should be glorifying/normalising being an unhealthy weight"

Agreed.

Normalize being overweight.
Being overweight is healthier than being underweight, the only problems scientists have found with it is possible joint issues.
Being underweight weakens your immune system, it effects your muscle mass, and a lot of other things.
For a man, a body fat percentage from 14%(bordering underweight) to 25% is healthy. 20%-25% can be considered overweight, however it is still healthy. Over 25% is considered obese.
For a woman, a body fat percentage from 21%-32% is healthy. Over 32% is considered obese. these are different because women need a larger internal fat layer to have children, so their body was evolved around needing to be this percentage.
But this doesn't mean these are your only rules! My mother is bout 33% but she is not obese, and she works out, she gardens, does pigs, etc..
Normalize having a belly pouch, thighs touching, having abs for most women is unhealthy!
Normalize men not having abs, men not having defined muscle, because that is okay!!
It only becomes a problem when people are comfortable in an unhealthy lifestyle. If you are living a healthy lifestyle, you wont be obese nor underweight.

Having fat is a good thing, and yes it should be normalized. Confidence is key and thats what body positivity shoudl focus on.

Tessie wrote: "Normalize being overweight.
Being overweight is healthier than being underweight, the only problems scientists have found with it is possible joint issues.
Being underweight weakens your immune sys..."

YES! 👏

Hazel wrote: "Someone who is an unhealthy weight should never be bullied or shamed for it but i don’t believe we should be glorifying/normalising being an unhealthy weight"

Yes!

Tessie wrote: "Normalize being overweight.
Being overweight is healthier than being underweight, the only problems scientists have found with it is possible joint issues.
Being underweight weakens your immune sys..."

YES EXACTLY

Tessie wrote: "Normalize being overweight.
Being overweight is healthier than being underweight, the only problems scientists have found with it is possible joint issues.
Being underweight weakens your immune sys..."

EXACLYYYY
don't promote unhealthiness, but we need to normalize so many things that people are just stupidly put down for!!! i want to add normalizing women having body hair to the list, like my bad if i don't want to shave every part of my body! so many people think that arm hair or leg hair or armpit hair is weird or gross but lowkey i think it's just based in consumerism, like since when was hair genuinely ugly? it's not. and if men can be hairy af, so can women.

Women never used to shave until razor companies wanted to expand their products, so they started marketing women with shaved legs and armpits, saying it was better hygiene and more youthful. It has nothing to do with hygiene and can actually cause problems like ingrown hairs. The hair was grown there to protect your skin, so its actually better for your skin to keep away bacteria and such.

i'm not a woman anymore, but when i was i didn't shave my legs. i just think it's so stupid to have to remove hair that isn't harming at all, just to fit into societal norms.

body positive should be about not hating your body, and promoting that health matters more than societal expectations and impressions

yes agreed!! i'll write more about this, but i will say a lot of stuff about body positivity is focused on weight. which is important because we do want people to be comfortable in their own skin. but weight can (usually) be helped. you know what can't be helped? height. shoe size. body proportions. facial proportions (usually). i feel like we should focus more on accepting those with traits that they can't help rather than just weight.

you can walk into a general store and find clothes from xxxs to xxxl. but they only carry shoes from 6-10 most of the time. their clothes are intent on fitting one body type. pants are a nightmare. why are we only focusing on weight???