C. S. Lewis discussion

Lewis was influenced by many sources...but mostly by classical writers and myths. Lewis himself often talked about how Norse mythology combined with classical Christian writers (such as Milton and Bunyan) influenced his mythology and his writing heavily.

However, as a literature professor, I'm sure these were the very tip of a very deep iceberg. I'm sure his true influences are as numerous as the stars in the sky.

I definitely agree with Bob. If you read Lewis' "Surprised by Joy" you see a beautiful picture of imagination awakened. Lewis is so humble and endearing in his account, but as I found myself enchanted by even his life.

Definitely the classics, as others have stated, but he also sites some more contemporary influences such as George MacDonald whom he considered a spiritual father of sorts. I believe G. K. Chesterton and Lewis' colleague J. R. R. Tolkien also had noticeable influence on his thinking and writing.

I recently purchased all of George MacDonald's books and stories that are available and have been reading through them one by one. It is pretty clear that George MacDonald had a pretty significant influence on C.S. Lewis, particularly as to the basic literary approach that Lewis adopted of writing fiction that combined Christian symbolism and fantasy/faerie tales.

The Great Divorce has a wonderful depiction of an imaginary interation between C.S. Lewis and George MacDonald that is worth checking out if you haven't read it. About halfway through the book, MacDonald appears to C.S. Lewis as his spiritual guide to the lower reaches of Heaven. Then he and Lewis muse together about the reasons that so many of the spirits refuse to move forward and progress from the frozen/backwards state in which they find themselves.

Early on in studying Lewis it was easy to see how much of an impact MacDonald had on him. So, like any curious Lewis reader, I went out and picked up MacDonald's most noted book (and the one that Lewis says changed his worldview), Phantastes.

I have to say, I was bored to death by it. I didn't find it inspiring or, frankly, even decent writing. Lewis was obviously inspired by a connection between that book and his own life, not the writing itself.

I also picked up Lewis' George Macdonald compilation and wasn't all that excited by that one either. So, it just left me wondering, what did he see in those writings? I have to guess, again, it was something that struck his heart in relation to his experience and not any writing that was particularly inspiring.

My 2 cents....

Wow! Sad to hear what you wrote about MacDonald. maybe you should check out more of his stuff! He is amazing, he was not only a great writer but a pastor as well. There is a lot of symbolism in his writing, and sometimes it helps to discuss it with other people. I think the way MacDonald writes, is a challenge to us to see beyond the surface and dig deeper... One of my favorite things about Lewis and MacDonald is they allow us the joy of discovery - so many authors these days rob their readers of that.

Esther....Well, I'm glad to hear that there's more to MacDonald than I found. It's quite possible that when I read some of his stuff, I had a skewed expectation of what I'd find. Afterall, we are all so spoiled by Lewis that most other theological writers disappoint. Maybe I'll have to give it another crack.

But, I do agree with you that this stuff takes some digging (or maybe, more accurately "exploring") to get to the meat of it.

Thanks for the encouragement. Any MacDonald you (or anyone else) would recommend in particular?

Hey Bob-

Its funny I have enjoyed quite a few of MacDonalds books.. But its challenging which one to recommend - what is your favorite CS Lewis book? That might help me point you to a G MacDonald book that you would like.

I really enjoyed "At the Back of the North Wind" and "The Light Princess" but several of my friends really like "Princess and Curdie"

Ginnie wrote: "I just purchased a book that explores how wartime radio broadcasts by Lewis turned into Mere Christianity and set his face toward popular apologetics as his calling.
http://www.goodreads.com/book/s..."


It's on my list already but likely from your info, Ginnie!

I am new here and I see that the last comment was four years ago, but you can forget about Owen Barfield's "Poetic Diction". My copy says "The seminal text that inspired Tolkien and C.S. Lewis"

Sorry! I meant to say, "you can't forget about Owen Barfield's..." Not can forget.

Lewis was heavily influenced by G.K. Chesterton, as his own comments in "Surprised By Joy" attest to. He also considered GKC's "The Everlasting Man" to be the best popular book of apologetics.

He also thought Arthur Balfour's "Theism and Humanism" to be an important book.

The top ten books that Lewis said influenced his life, and presumably his writings, were as follows...

1. Phantastes by George MacDonald.
2. The Everlasting Man by G. K. Chesterton.
3. The Aeneid by Virgil.
4. The Temple by George Herbert.
5. The Prelude by William Wordsworth.
6. The Idea of the Holy by Rudolf Otto.
7. The Consolation of Philosophy by Boethius.
8. Life of Samuel Johnson by James Boswell.
9. Descent into Hell by Charles Williams.
10. Theism and Humanism by Arthur James Balfour.

Regarding MacDonald, he was a great writer of romances. We, here in the west, are realist. Even when we read what we regard as "fantasy", it must be recognizable to us in some way for us to digest it. But writers of older fantasy made no effort to do this. Whatever their imaginations could contrive, no matter how fantastic and unrealistic, went onto the paper. Our minds are not primed to comprehend the metaphysical. 100 years ago or more, we likely would have read MacDonald and thought it an interesting look into the metaphysical. Today, it is just too "unreal" for our locked-out, rational minds to comprehend.

The same holds true for when we read biblical books with odd imagery contained in the heavens. But did you ever stop and ask yourself, what did you expect the inhabitants of metaphysical realms to look like?

A psychologist once told me that when a child is born and develops, the development moves the intellect of that child from the romantic to the realistic. That is why a child so readily accepts ideas like Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy, where an adult would require some type of empirical proof to accept the existence of such entities.

Makes me wonder what Christ meant when he said we must come to him as a child. Could an adult retention of whatever psychological attribute children have that makes them believe in the "fantastic" so quickly, and so completely, be considered a virtue by God?

I mean, let's face it. In order to believe in the Bible, you have to believe in parted seas, floating ax heads, talking donkeys, and fire from Heaven. That's difficult for the completely rational "realist". And true belief, like a child eagerly awaiting the arrival of Santa Claus on Christmas Eve, will produce a noticeable amount of anticipatory "giddy-ness".

Wm. Scott wrote: "Regarding MacDonald, he was a great writer of romances. We, here in the west, are realist. Even when we read what we regard as "fantasy", it must be recognizable to us in some way for us to digest ..."

Wow, what an interesting comment! Very helpful.

Wm. Scott wrote: "Regarding MacDonald, he was a great writer of romances. We, here in the west, are realist. Even when we read what we regard as "fantasy", it must be recognizable to us in some way for us to digest ..."

I agree that fantasy worlds must be real and recognizable in order to work in literature, but there are other realities besides the world of our senses. For MacDonald, Lewis, and Tolkien it was the spiritual reality. If the spiritual struggles of the character, and the spiritual symbolism of the environment ring true, we can easily suspend disbelief, or as Tolkien preferred, experience secondary belief--a belief in a world created by the author that derives from God's creative powers.

There's also the psychological reality that is powerfully captured in traditional fairy tales. We can accept impossible events in stories if they mirror psychological truths, even if those truths are unconscious. Many people believe that one of the purposes of fairy tales is to help people learn to manage psychological conflicts that are too frightening to be addressed directly.

A completely made-up fantasy world, no matter how cool, is ultimately going to be boring. There has to be something more driving it.

Alana wrote: "Definitely the classics, as others have stated, but he also sites some more contemporary influences such as George MacDonald whom he considered a spiritual father of sorts. I believe G. K. Chester..."

He says that that MacDonald baptized his imagination. I loved that idea.

It's helpful, I think, to distinguish between books/authors that Lewis read and people who Lewis interacted with. Both are very influential, but the kind of influence is a little different.

Lewis read Norse mythology, George Macdonald, Dante, Boethius, and Virgil. Their work influenced his understanding and informed the work that he did.

Lewis knew Tolkien, Barfield, and Dorothy L. Sayers. Their friendship encouraged, challenged, and sustained the work that he did.