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Here's the problem. With the system of justice in place in the Bible, it doesn't matter what you do, it matters what you believe. In other words, you could be a murderer, a rapist, the worst of the worst, BUT if you accept Jesus as lord before you die, you get into heaven. On the other hand, someone who is kind, works for charity, helps his friends and loved ones and even strangers, this person could go to hell for eternity just because they believe in a different god, or they don't believe in any god. This is NOT fair "punishment and reward" system.
Yes, nothing you said contradicts what I said. By the way, according to the Bible, God already knows where you are going before you were even born, so not much of a choice if God already knows the outcome.
Also, if I held a gun to your head, and said to worship me and love me, OR ELSE, is that really a choice? This is exactly what god does. He blackmails us into worshiping him by punishing for eternity if we do not. This is tyranny, not love.
That is probably the biggest obstacle for people to accept. God's total and complete Sovereignty.
When you get right down to it, God knows all and 'planned' all. Nothing happens without his say so, in a sense.
In our understanding, we see it as if a person ends up in Hell, that means God created them knowing, and indeed planning the outcome.
It's too much to handle for humans. Although we must understand that people who have not heard the word at all, are not automatically condemned. Just as the Bible says Jesus went into Hades and preached to those who hadn't heard Him, so will those who have never heard Him have a chance to repent.
It's easy to refer to this as a sort of spoilt kid scenario, with God creating toys just for the sake of burning them.
I honestly don't have the words to convince or even to provide a rational argument that I think will satisfy you otherwise. Perhaps it is because I myself need to walk close and have a stronger deeper relationship with God. Either way, I pray God reveals Himself to you someday.
We of course could argue that 'praying' is useless, because God's already decided your fate, but we don't live outside time, we live Now in the present. This means no matter what lies ahead of us, we do not possess foreknowledge of what will happen. So I don't know if you will end up knowing God or not. However, we are called to speak to those who don't know God. So that is what I will do. Even you yourself do not know what will definitely happen. And the ascribing power of God is that, should He will it, even a man like Richard Dawkins will accept it. In the Bible it talks about every knee bowing, and every tongue confessing that Jesus is Lord. This doesn't mean everyone will be saved, but rather, that everyone will acknowledge the truth in the end.
There are tons of more arguments here to go on, such as 'well then if they will believe then that's ok, right' and 'what's the point of creating anything like this? why not just create perfect harmony for humans and create it so it will always be that way?'
Tons more.
Humans have a lot to learn. Realistically, I don't know squat.
God knows.
I say take the questions up with Him. He's got plenty of time to answer any queries. In fact he planned it so we would ask Him......ah here we go again!!!!
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Will
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Oct 28, 2012 12:37PM
Here's the problem. With the system of justice in place in the Bible, it doesn't matter what you do, it matters what you believe. In other words, you could be a murderer, a rapist, the worst of the worst, BUT if you accept Jesus as lord before you die, you get into heaven. On the other hand, someone who is kind, works for charity, helps his friends and loved ones and even strangers, this person could go to hell for eternity just because they believe in a different god, or they don't believe in any god. This is NOT fair "punishment and reward" system.
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God does give us a choice. Even in the Garden of Eden God gave Adam and Eve a choice even though Satan tempted them. Humans have always had a choice whether they want to sin or not. And if you choose to sin while not being a Christian you will go to Hell. The only way you can go to Heaven is if you believe in Jesus Christ and ask him to forgive your sins and come into your life.
Yes, nothing you said contradicts what I said. By the way, according to the Bible, God already knows where you are going before you were even born, so not much of a choice if God already knows the outcome.
Also, if I held a gun to your head, and said to worship me and love me, OR ELSE, is that really a choice? This is exactly what god does. He blackmails us into worshiping him by punishing for eternity if we do not. This is tyranny, not love.
But I know that in my entire life God has never put a gun to my head. I will have more to say tomorrow
That is probably the biggest obstacle for people to accept. God's total and complete Sovereignty. When you get right down to it, God knows all and 'planned' all. Nothing happens without his say so, in a sense.
In our understanding, we see it as if a person ends up in Hell, that means God created them knowing, and indeed planning the outcome.
It's too much to handle for humans. Although we must understand that people who have not heard the word at all, are not automatically condemned. Just as the Bible says Jesus went into Hades and preached to those who hadn't heard Him, so will those who have never heard Him have a chance to repent.
It's easy to refer to this as a sort of spoilt kid scenario, with God creating toys just for the sake of burning them.
I honestly don't have the words to convince or even to provide a rational argument that I think will satisfy you otherwise. Perhaps it is because I myself need to walk close and have a stronger deeper relationship with God. Either way, I pray God reveals Himself to you someday.
We of course could argue that 'praying' is useless, because God's already decided your fate, but we don't live outside time, we live Now in the present. This means no matter what lies ahead of us, we do not possess foreknowledge of what will happen. So I don't know if you will end up knowing God or not. However, we are called to speak to those who don't know God. So that is what I will do. Even you yourself do not know what will definitely happen. And the ascribing power of God is that, should He will it, even a man like Richard Dawkins will accept it. In the Bible it talks about every knee bowing, and every tongue confessing that Jesus is Lord. This doesn't mean everyone will be saved, but rather, that everyone will acknowledge the truth in the end.
There are tons of more arguments here to go on, such as 'well then if they will believe then that's ok, right' and 'what's the point of creating anything like this? why not just create perfect harmony for humans and create it so it will always be that way?'
Tons more.
Humans have a lot to learn. Realistically, I don't know squat.
God knows.
I say take the questions up with Him. He's got plenty of time to answer any queries. In fact he planned it so we would ask Him......ah here we go again!!!!
