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Happiness is a decision, not a destination. It's an attitude, not an event. That person decided to live in misery, then decided to deprive the world of them. So yes, I think suicide is selfish.
"in the support for your opinion you accept that everyone else's selfish desire for that person to live is what demands that person to live in misery."
and why do you assume we would want our loved ones to live in misery? maybe we see the GOOD in them and know they CAN get better if they get the needed treatment. we, the loved ones, the ones that will be left behind in misery of our own if these people we love killed themselves want them to LIVE and get better.
Suicide in the literal sense can be viewed as selfish. But one can also ask, is it selfish to ask a loved one to keep living when they live every day in misery?
It is hard not to see it as selfish in the day to day life after the one you love is gone. The worst are milestones - it is hard for those left behind to not feel angry. Over time I have decided that taking ones life as SENSELESS rather than selfish.
Some people who commit suicide do so precisely because they think it will benefit others. People who commit suicide often have very low self-esteem, which is accompanied by thoughts of being a burden to others. The solution, they think, is to remove themselves from the equation, thereby making life more bearable for those they leave behind.
Certainly those left behind may feel suicide is selfish, you're angry. It's obvious you've never suffered from depression, I have. I contemplated suicide several times in my life and fortunately I did not "complete" suicide. The pain and blackness of depression is unbearable. It affects your thoughts, your body and encompasses every part of your life. You hate yourself, you hate the way you feel and begin to feel like a burden to your loved ones. They worry and try to cheer you up and you know your sick. Mental illness is real. I've seen numerous doctors over numerous years, taken every anti-depressant, therapies, Psychologists, Psychiatrist you name it. Depression was not a choice. Suicide is a desperate act by sick people. You under mind and trivialize mental illness when you simply put it into a "selfish" category. Under this explanation death itself is selfish. I have recovered from my mental illness as of today and I'm diligent and mindful of my thoughts and actions. It's been six months for me. Last April I was planning my death today I am living my life. One day at a time I manage my depression. I am vegan, I don't drink, I don't eat sugar or allow myself to sit in certain places in my home. Is this the cure? Doubtful. The medications I was taken were making me more sick. I am medication free today. No, not selfish - Desperate! Stop today and find compassion for both sides. Those that leave and those that are left.
I think it's selfish to demand people to keep living. I mean, you all haven't seen the perspective of a suicidal person. Living can be a good and happy experience but it can be equally depressing and horrible. Some people get tired of living. Some people are in misery. Some people don't want to live on because they believe there's nothing but misfortune in their lives. Telling suicidal people that they should live on for other people's sake is just selfish in itself. And, suppose they do live on for said people. Chances are, the suicidal person would go get help and are finally embracing life. Or that said person doesn't mention their suicidal feelings, ignore it, and one day have a massive breakdown and they kill themselves anyway. Unless you're actually willing to help someone who's suicidal, don't just sit there and say "Committing suicide is selfish and they should live for their relatives"
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Happiness is a decision, not a destination. It's an attitude, not an event. That person decided to live in misery, then decided to deprive the world of them. So yes, I think suicide is selfish.
Melanie wrote: "Happiness is a decision, not a destination. It's an attitude, not an event. That person decided to live in misery, then decided to deprive the world of them. So yes, I think suicide is selfish."
More easily said than done. I would claim that it is both a destination reached by a decision. Anyway, you are demanding that all people make the decision to be happy in order for you and other living people to enjoy the benefits of their life. Like you said, it is a decision, so why is the decision to be miserable selfish and the one to be happy not? I see both decisions to be equally selfish therefore negating the decision's selfishness considering you must choose one or the other. (the relative selfishness of one decision to another is equal) How do you see the act of suicide or the decision to be miserable as more selfish? What makes it to be more selfish?
And you are ignoring conditions of depression as well as other situations where happiness is not a simple decision but more like a destination and an end which is arrived at by more complex means than a simple decision. What about people who have no option to live a life satisfactory to their happiness?
Also, if you accept the premise that there people have no existence after death, calling suicide selfish becomes impossible. For there is no agent left to be selfish, and a selfish act is done for the some agent's gain. Therefore, neither the agent nor the act can be considered selfish.
More easily said than done. I would claim that it is both a destination reached by a decision. Anyway, you are demanding that all people make the decision to be happy in order for you and other living people to enjoy the benefits of their life. Like you said, it is a decision, so why is the decision to be miserable selfish and the one to be happy not? I see both decisions to be equally selfish therefore negating the decision's selfishness considering you must choose one or the other. (the relative selfishness of one decision to another is equal) How do you see the act of suicide or the decision to be miserable as more selfish? What makes it to be more selfish?
And you are ignoring conditions of depression as well as other situations where happiness is not a simple decision but more like a destination and an end which is arrived at by more complex means than a simple decision. What about people who have no option to live a life satisfactory to their happiness?
Also, if you accept the premise that there people have no existence after death, calling suicide selfish becomes impossible. For there is no agent left to be selfish, and a selfish act is done for the some agent's gain. Therefore, neither the agent nor the act can be considered selfish.
"in the support for your opinion you accept that everyone else's selfish desire for that person to live is what demands that person to live in misery."and why do you assume we would want our loved ones to live in misery? maybe we see the GOOD in them and know they CAN get better if they get the needed treatment. we, the loved ones, the ones that will be left behind in misery of our own if these people we love killed themselves want them to LIVE and get better.
Suicide in the literal sense can be viewed as selfish. But one can also ask, is it selfish to ask a loved one to keep living when they live every day in misery?
It is hard not to see it as selfish in the day to day life after the one you love is gone. The worst are milestones - it is hard for those left behind to not feel angry. Over time I have decided that taking ones life as SENSELESS rather than selfish.
Some people who commit suicide do so precisely because they think it will benefit others. People who commit suicide often have very low self-esteem, which is accompanied by thoughts of being a burden to others. The solution, they think, is to remove themselves from the equation, thereby making life more bearable for those they leave behind.
Certainly those left behind may feel suicide is selfish, you're angry. It's obvious you've never suffered from depression, I have. I contemplated suicide several times in my life and fortunately I did not "complete" suicide. The pain and blackness of depression is unbearable. It affects your thoughts, your body and encompasses every part of your life. You hate yourself, you hate the way you feel and begin to feel like a burden to your loved ones. They worry and try to cheer you up and you know your sick. Mental illness is real. I've seen numerous doctors over numerous years, taken every anti-depressant, therapies, Psychologists, Psychiatrist you name it. Depression was not a choice. Suicide is a desperate act by sick people. You under mind and trivialize mental illness when you simply put it into a "selfish" category. Under this explanation death itself is selfish. I have recovered from my mental illness as of today and I'm diligent and mindful of my thoughts and actions. It's been six months for me. Last April I was planning my death today I am living my life. One day at a time I manage my depression. I am vegan, I don't drink, I don't eat sugar or allow myself to sit in certain places in my home. Is this the cure? Doubtful. The medications I was taken were making me more sick. I am medication free today. No, not selfish - Desperate! Stop today and find compassion for both sides. Those that leave and those that are left.
I think it's selfish to demand people to keep living. I mean, you all haven't seen the perspective of a suicidal person. Living can be a good and happy experience but it can be equally depressing and horrible. Some people get tired of living. Some people are in misery. Some people don't want to live on because they believe there's nothing but misfortune in their lives. Telling suicidal people that they should live on for other people's sake is just selfish in itself. And, suppose they do live on for said people. Chances are, the suicidal person would go get help and are finally embracing life. Or that said person doesn't mention their suicidal feelings, ignore it, and one day have a massive breakdown and they kill themselves anyway. Unless you're actually willing to help someone who's suicidal, don't just sit there and say "Committing suicide is selfish and they should live for their relatives"
By your reasoning, the duty to life is derived from everyone else's opinion that life is good. I would argue that this is not standard, and I would say that other people have no right to force their opinions onto others. Especially to someone who does not want to live. That is a complete violation of their human rights to force their every action to submit to your control.