The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral, by Robert Westall > Likes and Comments

Here's where we'll discuss all things connected to our annual group read for 2025, The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral by Robert Westall! This read discussion begins today, and will run through Oct. 31 (Halloween :-) ).

I'm enjoying my read so far. I really like the narrator's voice. He's a likeable, no-nonsense guy. And I'm learning lots of new stuff about steeplejacks and masons. A bonus!

I started on the book yesterday!

Cool. I'm interested in Joe's evolving perceptions of Reverend Morris from cliche to something else. Joe seems to represent the pragmatist perspective.

This short collection has been sitting on my to-be-read shelf for quite some time, so this common read affords me the perfect opportunity to polish it off. This will be (I think) the third Robert Westall book for me, the previous two being Antique Dust (1989) and Spectral Shadows (2016).

A couple of preliminary observations about Westall. During his lifetime at least, he was typically marketed as a writer of YA fiction. I’ve only ever read the author’s supernatural fiction, but those stories never struck me personally as particularly YA, but then again I’ve been informed that the line separating adult from YA literature has traditionally been more fluid in the U.K. than in the U.S.

Nearly everyone writing about Westall describes his work as Jamesian and Orrin Grey in his introduction to this collection is no exception, writing that “Westall follows in the footsteps laid down by the great M. R. James”. I’ve always thought that the link to James was rather tenuous, but maybe that’s just me. At least the title story takes place in a cathedral. Monty would probably have liked that.

I think the M.R. James influence shows, not only in the cathedral setting, but in the "antiquarian" aspect: we're dealing with a supernatural mystery that's rooted in events that happened centuries ago, and that has to be probed through reference to very old books, and old stained-glass art.

I personally think The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral is the most Jamesian of his books, (Werner has given examples and of course the fictitious "Muncaster Cathedral recollects the equally fictitious "Barchester Cathedral" of M.R. James).

However some of the stories in Antique Dust: Ghost Stories do also have that favour, as I remember.

Yes, he's thought of as YA here, but that doesn't preclude many adults from reading him, and the BBC radio dramatisation of this one was definitely geared to an adult audience.

Robert Westall has written a few novels around the Second World War, perhaps the best one being Blitzcat.

Canavan, if you are interested in authors who have written Jamesian stories - either as an homage or which just display his influence - try to get hold of Ghosts And Scholars: Ghost Stories In The Tradition Of M.R. James. It's excellent! (I name all the authors in my lengthy review.)

Werner said: ...a supernatural mystery that's rooted in events that happened centuries ago, and that has to be probed through reference to very old books, and old stained-glass art.

I agree that the stained glass window is a nice Jamesian touch (a bit reminiscent of “The Treasure of Abbot Thomas”), but the other aspects mentioned (old tomes, ancient mysteries) could apply to a vast number of stories. I’m really sorry if I’m coming off as churlish on this point. It’s a bit of a push-button issue for me; I often see blurbs describing this or that book as Jamesian that turn out to my eye to be anything but. (And some of those books are far less deserving of that adjective than The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral .) I probably shouldn’t get my feathers that ruffled about this stuff.

Bionic Jean said: ...try to get hold of Ghosts And Scholars: Ghost Stories In The Tradition Of M.R. James.

Excellent recommendation. This particular 1987 anthology has been on my partially-read shelf for an embarrassingly long time. I’ve read about three-quarters of the tales. Rosemary Pardoe, one of its co-editors, continues to put out the occasional collection aimed at James enthusiasts (most published by Sarob Press), for example, The Ghosts and Scholars Book of Shadows, Volume 3 (2016).

“The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral”

This may be my favorite of the Robert Westall stories I’ve thus far read.

(view spoiler)[Stuff I enjoyed: The narrtor is typical of Westall — a rather down-to-earth, blue collar type. I will note that I liked this guy (Clarke) a bit more than some of the author’s other protagonists (e.g., the dealer in Antique Dust). Westall did a good job supplying technical details about steeplejacking — enough to be interesting and make clear how Clarke and Billy were performing their job, but not so much as to overwhelm the reader and slow down the story.

I found interesting the progression of Clarke’s ideas about religion over the course of the novella and how that paralleled changes in his attitude toward Reverend Morris.

The story’s concluding confrontation was suitably gruesome. I especially enjoyed the passage involving Morris’ hand. (I’ve typically found Westall an effective writer in this regard.)

A few things about the novella I didn’t like: I tend not to care for stories that attempt to elicit reader emotion by putting kids in danger, but that’s a minor quibble.

Finally, I’ve criticized some of Westall’s other stories for dragging on too long. In contrast, I actually thought this tale might have benefited by being a bit longer. I found the concluding section a bit rushed and thought the story might have benefited from additional material about the relationship between the three final protagonists, particularly between Clarke and Morris. (hide spoiler)]

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Canavan wrote: "This particular 1987 anthology has been on my partially-read shelf for an embarrassingly long time ..."

Ah, I didn't check your shelves - sorry! I think in that case you're about the only GR member I know (apart from the one I'm married to) who knows if it! Since it was published, we've had the advent of e-books, which has probably saved some of the lesser-know authors from obscurity. (As an aside, it's just been announced that Mark Gatiss who has taken over the annual BBC "Christmas Ghost Story" slot, which first started as - now classic - annual dramatisations of M.R. James, has chosen one who is better known for the 2025 story, A.C. Benson.)

Anyway, I gave that book 5 stars - a rare accolade from me.

I'm not sure how accessible this is, but it is an excellent BBC radio dramatisation of The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral from 1996, for those interested https://archive.org/details/robert-we...

If you don't like blurbs, don't scroll down too far! As with M.R. James, it's all suggestion and the blurb can reveal too much.

(duplicated from another thread by request.)

I read this last night. What a great story! I agree with mostly everything Canavan said in their spoiler. I was surprised at Clarke's change of attitude towards his two new "mates," but it made a lot of sense.

I am woefully unaware of MR James, so I'll have to check him out.

So...the guy who built the tower on the deaths of the children, then had his guys wall him in alive...he must've been aiming for eternal life of some awful sort? Ick. I hope he got what he wanted. Very cool ending to the story!

Bionic Jean said: I'm not sure how accessible this is, but it is an excellent BBC radio dramatisation of The Stones of Muncaster Cathedral from 1996…

Thanks for the recommendation!

“Brangwyn Gardens”

(view spoiler)[It’s fair to say that this second story rather subverted my initial expectations. At first I was under the impression that Mr. Westall was setting the stage for one of those semi-sappy love-from-beyond-time tales that Jack Finney was so fond of. But that perception started to shift rather quickly; by the time we reach the denouement I would have been shocked had the story ended up any way other than the way it did.

I thought the novella was competently written (as I’ve come to expect from this author) and found both the ideas and characters kinda interesting. And yet I confess to having a rather “meh” reaction. This is a purely personal bias, but I’m not a huge fan of stories that in their final act pull back the curtain to reveal that a supposed supernatural phenomenon has, in fact, a rational explanation. What makes the explanation offered here doubly annoying is that (to my mind) it rather strains credulity to the breaking point.

I don’t require sympathetic characters to enjoy a story, but I will end by saying that both Harry and Catharine are fairly unlikeable people. Catharine comes off as cold, manipulative, and in dire need of professional counseling. Harry is a callow and creepy kid who sees women as collections of body parts. (hide spoiler)]

✭✭½

Bionic Jean wrote: "Canavan wrote: "This particular 1987 anthology has been on my partially-read shelf for an embarrassingly long time ..."

Ah, I didn't check your shelves - sorry! I think in that case you're about t..."

Ha! I read the comment about the Jamesian touch and was confused. I was thinking of the other James (Henry) and couldn't figure out the connection. Now I get it!

I finished my read of this book earlier today, though I don't expect to be able to write my review until this weekend. Right now, I'm leaning towards a four-star rating.

Deb wrote: "Ha! I read the comment about the Jamesian touch and was confused. I was thinking of the other James (Henry) and couldn't figure out the connection. Now I get it!..."

😂 Deb! I think that might have happened to me too, a while ago! Certainly on Goodreads "Jamesian" usually refers to Henry, doesn't it! 😄

Georgann wrote: "I read this last night. What a great story! I agree with mostly everything Canavan said in their spoiler. I was surprised at Clarke's change of attitude towards his two new "mates," but it made a l..."

The coming together of the three mates--I think of them as a sort of trinity trope--was probably my favorite part of the book.

I posted my review this afternoon, at this link: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show... .

I finished the second story in the book. I really liked the first novella, but the second story fell flat for me.

The elements I felt the author did well in The Stones such as characterization, plot development, and suspense were lacking in Brangwen Gardens (was my edition the only one that contained this other story?). I did appreciate one aspect of the setting in Brangwen Gardens--a mention of a clippie rug, which I'd never heard of. That set me off on a multi-hour adventure researching North England rag rugs, so a win. In case anyone else read Brangwen Gardens as well as The Stones, did you feel that the ending was forced?

Werner wrote: "I posted my review this afternoon, at this link: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show... ."

Nice review, Werner! I also felt this novella was very successful. I was particularly impressed with how the author layered the events and the eerie mood leading to the climax in a believable, unrushed way despite the short length of the novella.

I think I disagree with you on one point--you wanted more description at the end (if I understood you correctly). I would have liked less description of the evil entity. It almost seemed a little hokey to me. But everything else worked for me!

Deb said (in part): …was my edition the only one that contained this other story?

I believe most editions, dating back to the original Viking UK publication, have contained both stories. But it looks like Farrar, Straus and Giroux published just the “Stones” story alone (essentially as a chapbook). I read the more recent Valancourt edition which contains both novellas.

Deb also said: …mention of a clippie rug…

I had to look this one up as well. 🙂

Deb also said: …did you feel that the ending was forced?

I’m not sure I would use the word “forced”. In my brief review, I did mention that I found it unsatisfying.

Deb wrote: "Nice review, Werner! ...I think I disagree with you on one point--you wanted more description at the end (if I understood you correctly)."

Thanks, Deb! Actually, what I wanted wasn't necessarily more description (I felt that, as Goldilocks might have said, the author got that element just right), but more explanation. I have (sort of) a tentative theory of what was going on with the gargoyle. (view spoiler)[I'm thinking that Jacopo was a Satanist, and that he bargained with the devil for a perverted sort of extended life in which he could exist for centuries by drawing sustenance from the murdered children immured in the tower's stairwell. The unwholesome nature of the spiritual influence operating there corrupted and gradually destroyed the very stone around the gargoyle, so that it had to be replaced every 20 years; and Jacopo's own sustenance was somehow supplemented every 20 years by fresh child sacrifices, for which he was in some way able to possess the minds of certain victims. (hide spoiler)] But all of that is inference and guesswork, and the "how" of the working of these processes is very murky. So I'd have liked to have some of it made more explicit. But that's just a personal preference!

I read this in the Farrar, Straus and Giroux printing, which didn't include "Brangwen Gardens;" and I haven't encountered that story elsewhere, either. My guess is that the Viking and other printers included the bonus story in order to bulk up the book (and charge more money for it!), since the novella is quite short --97 pages in this printing.

I come from the north of England and we call them "rag rugs". There were plenty around in my childhood, when everyone (as they say, meaning all the females) made their own clothes and so there were lots of scraps of material, all of which were carefully saved and used. This explains the various dialect names for a rag rug https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rag_rug...).

Canavan wrote: "Deb said (in part):
…was my edition the only one that contained this other story?


I believe most editions, dating back to the original Viking UK publication, have contained both stories. But i..."

I guess what I meant by "forced" was that the story lacked enough foundation for what some people would consider a trick. I'm reminded of the trick ending in Presumed Innocent (though I didn't have a problem with that one).

Werner wrote: "Deb wrote: "Nice review, Werner! ...I think I disagree with you on one point--you wanted more description at the end (if I understood you correctly)."

Thanks, Deb! Actually, what I wanted wasn't n..."

That's funny re bulking up the book to charge more. You may be onto something there!

Bionic Jean wrote: "I come from the north of England and we call them "rag rugs". There were plenty around in my childhood, when everyone (as they say, meaning all the females) made their own clothes and so there were..."

I'm in California, and we use the term rag rugs as well. I make twined rugs and braided rugs. Soon I want to venture out into hooked rugs (also called proggies in the north of England?) I realize my mother made a couple of clippies though she didn't use that word.

At any rate, it was fun to spend a little time outside of the book going down the rug rabbit hole! I think I enjoyed that more than the story Brangwen Gardens.

Thanks to whoever helped choose last month’s common read and also to those who contributed to the discussion. I greatly enjoyed reading everyone’s comments.

Special shoutout to Bionic Jean for reminding me to finish reading Ghosts and Scholars: Ghost Stories in the Tradition of M.R. James . That was a collection that had been sitting on my TBR pile for far too long.

Deb said (in part): I guess what I meant by "forced" was that the story lacked enough foundation for what some people would consider a trick.

I think we are largely on the same page with respect to your point on this story.

Canavan wrote: "Thanks to whoever helped choose last month’s common read and also to those who contributed to the discussion. I greatly enjoyed reading everyone’s comments.

Special shoutout to Bionic Jean for rem..."

Yes, it was a good choice. I think we had a lively discussion of the common read.

It was me 🙂(forwarded from last year I think) I'm so pleased to have perhaps introduced a new author to some ...

Canavan, I'm delighted you will be returning to Ghosts And Scholars: Ghost Stories In The Tradition Of M.R. James. It's a great shame it was never republished, and remains a great source of "forgotten" authors in this tradition, I think.

Deb, I'm impressed by your knowledge and experience of rugmaking! I know from observation how long each of these take. (Yes, I've seen those terms too, but not known anyone who uses them, so I suspect they must be strictly regional.)

Bionic Jean said (in part): Canavan, I'm delighted you will be returning to Ghosts And Scholars: Ghost Stories In The Tradition Of M.R. James.

I have, in fact, now finished this one off. (Individual story ratings are here.) Kinda poking around now for something similar to read, but there are a number of choices to sift through.

Interesting to see how our ratings compare, thanks Canavan! I'm reading a story by Algernon Blackwood right now.

Bionic Jean said (in part): I'm reading a story by Algernon Blackwood right now.

I’ve read a fair number of Blackwood’s short stories over the years, but there’s a bunch I’ve never gotten around to. And, I am somewhat embarrassed to admit, I’ve never read any of his novels. One day… 🫤

He was incredibly prolific, wasn't he Canavan? They vary I think, but this is a good one: The Empty House. It's in the The Oxford Book of English Ghost Stories (among other collections) which I'm listening to on and off.

I read the Blackwood collection Tales of the Mysterious and Macabre back in the early 90s, and wasn't impressed by it; in fact, when I added it to my Goodreads shelves years later, I slapped a one-star rating on it. (The heavy-handed racism in some of the stories was very off-putting to me.) However, since then I've read and appreciated several of his stories in various anthologies (though his John Silence stories have been a mixed bag for me; I've only read two, but didn't like one, and wasn't bowled over by the other one). Some years ago, at the urging of another Goodreader (I forget who), I put the collection on my to-reread shelf, so one of these days I'll see if I appreciate it better from the vantage point of over 30 years more experience and knowledge.

Funnily enough Chris has said almost exactly the same thing to me, and has had that collection at least twice, passing it on each time. (The second time he couldn't remember why he got rid of it, but soon remembered!)

However there are some superb ones in anthologies, as you say.