Kyle’s Comments (group member since Apr 18, 2013)

Kyle’s comments from the The Great Gormenghast Read group.

Sumant wrote: "Here is my review of 1st book of gormenghast trilogy.I really liked the book, and writing an review of the book was sort of challenge."

That was a great review, Sumant! I agree though that trying to review a book like that is definitely a challenge though.

midnightfaerie wrote: "Just want to say I really enjoyed these books! Thanks so much for inviting me to this group! Without it, I might never have heard of Peake!"

It was a pleasure to have you in the group Midnightfaire! I loved reading about your first experiences/impressions with the strange world of Titus Groan.

B. wrote: "Kyle wrote: "...he realizes his Gormenghast has always been with him and always will be."

That's a more sensible summary of the book than I came up with. So, he leaves Gormenghast to be free, real..."

Haha, yeah that's kinda what I took away; I'll try to be more specific in my conclusions. I seem to have misplaced my copy, so I can't reference the exact parts. But from memory,(view spoiler)[ at the end of the book (I think the last little chapter/scene) where Titus is at the rock and deciding whether to continue on to Gormenghast, Peake writes something like 'He no longer needs home, for he realized he carries his Gormenghast within him.' The second book ends with Titus leaving Gormenghast because he has an identity crisis, and wants to know who he truly is, sans Gormenghast. I feel like Peake's point is that Titus (or anyone, for that matter) cannot separate who he is from where he comes from. One quote I remember is, "What a boy set out to seek a man had found, found by the act of living." I see it as Titus setting out to seek himself; he as a man found that Gormenghast is not a place (even if it actually is). It doesn't matter if Gormenghast is a real place or not, because its meaning to Titus remains the same. (hide spoiler)]

As a parallel, I grew up in a very small town and I always wanted to move out and see what else was out there. I wasn't a small town-boy, I told myself; I was being held back by my surroundings and my home. The true me was out there somewhere, in the wider world. However, now that I am a little older I realize now that I will (on some level) always be a small-town boy. I cannot escape or deny my upbringing nor should I, as it is an integral part of who I am. Trying to escape my childhood would leave me lost, without direction; I wouldn't be 'myself,' until I found some marker or anchor to keep me linked to who I truly am (like a big rock).

As the Countess said, "All roads lead back to Gormenghast." And so too, do all my actions and morals lead back to my upbringing and personal identity. I can't know where I am, or where I'm going, without embracing where I've been.


Ugh, sorry... that was all a bit tangential, and definitely beyond the scope of this particular section of the book. But, I can't seem to talk about one particular section of the book without talking about others in relation.

B. wrote: "Is that a demonstration that away from his castle home (or perhaps without his knuckle of flint), he's less capable?"

That observation is close to how I see the whole book. Ultimately Titus Alone is about identity, and when Titus tries to shake off his identity (i.e. Gormenghast) he becomes lost, confused, and weak. And so he is throughout the book, until the end where he realizes his Gormenghast has always been with him and always will be.

Lora wrote: "My name is Lora, and I read the trilogy several years ago. I just started a reread and wandered into your group.
My first introduction to Gormenghast (as well as Peake) was during a meeting of my C..."

It seems pretty obscure here in the U.S.. I hadn't even heard of it until I learned about it here on goodreads. Welcome to the group, Lora! It seems a lot of people often like to talk about Peake in the same circle as CS Lewis or Tolkien; however, the comparisons confuse me since they don't seem to have too much in common.

I would push it back one chapter and include ch 48. Honestly, the under-river was the most thought provoking section for me, and the one that convinced me Peake retained more of his mind then is given credit. Once Titus goes underground, and is once again surrounded by dank and crumbly stone, Peakes writing style changes to something more familiar to us. The pace slows a bit, more emphasis is on description, and context of people; away from the hustle and rapid intensity of the city the writing becomes more Gormenghastian, more ponderous. Titus feels more "aware" of himself, and less like he's in the stupor of the beginning of the book. His fight with Veil is reminiscent of his fight with Steerpike; there is a particular primal quality to it.

I feel like Peake was trying to toss around the ideas of place and identity. The "real" feeling world portrays a more "fake" feeling Titus. A less genuine Titus. The less real feeling worlds, like under river and before that Gormenghast itself, show me a more "real"feeling Titus. It's as though one can only be who they really are in a world remove from time or space. Out in the "real" world, we fight to maintain who we actually are and act as in a depressed stupor, while all the while secretly hoping to find our way back home to where we are our true selves.

I like what you did there, B. Sorry for the lack of presence lately.
I initially wasn't going to break it into sections, because this book actually feels more like a "theme" book to me and I played down the sectioning.

But, I'm glad you took the initiative and split it into the pieces you thought appropriate. I'll have to look through it with new eyes, and see how the sections relate. :)

midnightfaerie wrote: "It's just so different. But it's starting to grow on me."

It's like a fungus!

B. wrote: "It's hard to think that what Peake intended was this result. It's just too sewn-together. He makes a masterful effort to give it all meaning near the end, but he doesn't really pull it off, in my v..."

Interesting thoughts! However, for me, this volume seemed much more... driving. Actually more purpose-driven than the previous two books. Part of that is probably just the fast pacing, but from early on in the beginning of this book I feel like there is a particular point to which the story is trying to converge.

It is interesting that you mention the end, and I would agree with your assessment. It seems as though Peake was getting ready to address the point of "so what was the point of the book?" I have to wonder how much of that question was meant to be answered in a fourth book.

midnightfaerie wrote: "good question...i might be able to answer it better once i finish..."

Yeah, I'm not sure there's a knowable answer to it, but I think having the questions in the back of one's mind helps while reading through the book.

Titus Alone is striking in its contrast to the previous two books, as anyone who has started it has found out. It's pace is driving compared to the ponderous and methodical pace of Gormenghast, its chapter's short. People and place flash by in a quick moment, where before we had a chance to familiarize ourselves with every nook, cranny, and eyebrow.

In his personal life, Peake was quickly spiraling out of control both mentally and physically; he was literally losing his mind. Does this book reflect his drastic deviation from reality, or is there more going on here? Is this book instead a more logical continuation of Titus's journey beyond the dream-like and enclosing arms of Gormenghast?

How much of this book "makes sense" to you, and how much of this book is simply craziness?

midnightfaerie wrote: "He already did! Everyone said this one was different, and I knew it would be, but I had no idea how different! I'm having a really hard time with it, and I'm only about 20 pages in. It's almost ..."

I think Cecily gave some good advice! When I first read this third book, I was warned that it might be a shock to my system, so I think I was more prepared than most. One thing I think is worth asking, is "why?" Why is it so different than the first two? Is it because Peake was mentally on a rapid decline (which he obviously was), or is there more to it than that? Did Peake have a system/reason for the drastic shift?

I think it's both of those reasons, but I also think the real interesting question is how much of each is actually playing a role. I tend to lean towards the idea that the latter is wielding more influence than might be readily apparent.

Almost upon us is the last, and possibly most problematic, Gormenghast/Titus novel! For those who have read it already, some pre-read musings would be welcome. What did you expect going into the read? Did you walk away satisfied, troubled, disappointed, yes to all and more?

For those who have yet to read the book, where do you think Peake is leading this story of Titus Groan? Is there anything that Peake could do to completely pull the rug out from under you? Would you resent him if he did?

Almost upon us is the last, and possibly most problematic, Gormenghast/Titus novel! For those who have read it already, some pre-read musings would be welcome. What did you expect going into the read? Did you walk away satisfied, troubled, disappointed, yes to all and more?

For those who have yet to read the book, where do you think Peake is leading this story of Titus Groan? Is there anything that Peake could do to completely pull the rug out from under you? Would you resent him if he did?

Adam wrote: "Peake is a powerfully word painter; his language creates strong visual impressions and ambiance. His writing is however so concentrated in voice and description that, however much I appreciate his..."

That's an interesting point, Adam. The first time I was reading Gormenghast I was also writing a number of papers for school, and I admit there were a few times where I stopped and asked myself, "how would Peake describe this?" I suppose on the one hand I should be appreciative that I felt like my writing had improved for a little while, yet on the other hand I also felt like I was masking my own personal voice. I realized that I write in a very particular style/voice, and that no matter how hard I tried, it always seemed to be present in whatever I was writing (whether a scientific paper, or something more narrative).

I guess what I mean is that at first I felt ashamed of my own style of writing, but as I went along I learned that the best results come from embracing one's own style and simply tweaking it to make it work for what I wanted to accomplish (in whatever type of thing I was writing).

But yeah, I definitely know what you mean about how a writer's voice can kind of overwhelm and extend out into other things.

Ah, yes Cecily. I had forgotten how enjoyable I found chapter 14 to be. Such a vivid painting of words!

"Nine hundred seconds! Oh, marvellous! marvellous! Seconds are so small. One-two-three-four- seconds are so huge."

Jonathan wrote: "I definitely agree about the humour which stems from Irma and her brother. Particularly regarding the story about the knife.

I did find the beginning of this novel fascinating and poingnant. The i..."

Good stuff Jonathan! I really like what you say about what makes a man a man (or woman a woman). To me, this seems to be Peake's greatest objective in what he does. Peel back the layers of culture on all of us, pry up our shared and learned behavior (like ritual) and what lies beneath? A primal animal? Am emotional romantic? etc:

It seems like in Gormenghast Peake is able to dive a little deeper into those questions, since he's working with a lot of things he already set up with Titus Groan. Ghosts and ancestors. Isaac Newton said we are all standing on the shoulders of the giants that came before us; does that mean we can't stand alone, or are we forever bound to the model of the previous generation?

Cecily wrote: "I do like the brazen way this book starts with a catalogue of the dead, and then of the living (and the one who is sort of in both). Mind you, it omits a couple of the dead (Rantel and Braigon). TV..."

midnightfaerie wrote: "Almost finished! Loving it! Wasn't expecting some of the twists that came along, which made it all the better. I'm really starting to like Titus. I can't wait to see he develops in the third book."

There are definitely plot twists in this one that I think are more defined than the previous ones in TG. The comedy surrounding the schoolmasters and Irma is an interesting factor. In my mind I categorize Gormenghast as a "darker" book than TG, yet at the same time there, like you said Cecily, more overt comedy. I tend to think of Mervyn Peake as a writer who likes to push his characters to extremes in order to reveal the more extreme aspects of our every day human existence. I wonder if the schoolmaster comedy is just a larger scale version of what Peake does to his characters? As he pushes his characters to different ends of the spectrum, so too does he seem to push his very plot to opposite extremes. If this is true, I wonder what is his intention in doing so.

I'm definitely keeping an eye out for it myself. :)

Ah, if only the wealth of nobility was at my disposal for such things.

Cecily wrote: "Kyle wrote: "...I think this is one aspect of Fuchsia that allows us to sympathize with, and relate to her, more than we might otherwise (given her...unsteady nature). "

Her unsteadiness might be ..."

Hah! I suppose so; I never thought of it that way before.