Richard III discussion

Anyone hear any buzz about this one? Apparently its about Jane Shore and a younger sister. I just picked up via Amazon Vine so at least it's free :)

Pat read it and said that it seemed like it needed some editing...

How can I get hooked up on the Vine?!

I've got it. Haven't had a chance to do more than flip through it, but one review of it said that the author certainly researched the silk trade well! I think she has one coming out in the UK this year about Catherine of Valois.

Barb wrote: "How can I get hooked up on the Vine?!"

Sorry, invite only from Amazon. If I could put a good word in for you I would. Although I haven't had the best luck with the books I've received so far, and since I never bought electronics, etc. from Ammy those goodies don't show up on my targeted newsletter. I get the Blue Badge of the Vine voice on my profile page.

Tell you what, I owe you a book if I'm not mistaken so when I'm done we can work something out - although giving the Vine stuff away is a no-no.

Susan wrote: "I've got it. Haven't had a chance to do more than flip through it, but one review of it said that the author certainly researched the silk trade well! I think she has one coming out in the UK this ..."

I'm looking forward to that. I had a Rosalind Laker book out last year that went into the silk trade in great detail (although set in France and a few centuries later). It will be interesting to compare.

Barb, I've got the book and will mail it to you if you want. I won't be back home until March 5 though, so let me know.

What is the Amazon vine?

Pat, I've been wondering where you were - hadn't seen you around for a while.

MAP, Amazon has this "Vine Program" they cooked up a couple of years ago. Publishers or product manufacturers provide a certain quantity of a new product they want to have reviews out for the buying public to Amazon and us Vine members get to pick them and review them.

It's got it's ups and downs and there's quite a bit of misuse going on. There's been much talk of vine products going up for sale on Ebay within days of the latest newsletter - advertised as new. Since you can't get more stuff without writing a review, that's kind of a big indicator you didn't use the product. I've seen many reviews of books that are virtually nothing more than a rehash of the book jacket - and at least one case where a Vine reviewer copied Harriet's review from B&N and used it for his own and on another he copied the back jacket word for word. So much for highly respected Amazon reviewers......

There's something similar to that on Goodreads, isn't there? The chance to get books early if you agree to review?

Those make me nervous, because I don't feel I can be honest when I know the author is right there over my shoulder. I didn't post my scathing "King's Daughter" review on Amazon because I saw the author had some blog thingy she updated regularly over there and I had a feeling she checked her reviews.

...I have a little too much empathy; I'm always aware that the people out there are people, and I don't like tearing them down when I feel almost certain they'll see it.

I think I saw something on Goodreads but haven't paid much attention to it. I know Librarything has an early readers program and it's quite popular.

I don't feel bad with the ones I get on Amazon - those publishers are purposely giving them to Amazon and looking for opinions. I give 'em what they want. But then I'm never afraid to voice my opinion on a book, good or bad.

Do you have a link to that "bloggy thing"?

As for the review you didn't post on Amazon - * Misfit sits on hands to keep fingers off the keyboard*

I am suddenly having a strong urge to share my pain with the rest of the group.

"She nodded back. Avoided Jane's eye. 'My lord,' she answered, with all the poise she could manage; then, neutrally to Jane's shoulder, aware of Jane's hand settling on Will Hastings' arm on Jane's waist; of the moist, hungry look in her sister's eyes: ... " (I think this was the day after Edward died)

"When Hastings kept his temper, Dorset, unnervingly, began to stare at him. Jutting his jaw out. Leaning forward over clenched hands. Trying to stare Hastings down; the stare of a man with death in mind; holding the ey-lock for so long Hastings had thought he might pull out a sword then and there."

"But, quietly but firmly, he moved her back. Turned away. Reached for his buckler, with muscles taut as wire again."

The silk trade was interesting at first, but it's now lost as our intrepid heroine is too busy measuring the princess Elizabeth for dresses (in between making whoopee with Richard) as she comforts her (holds her hand even!), as Elizabeth bemoans "her Majesty my mother" and even makes a monkey face behind her mother's back in irritation.

Barb, you interested in my copy? Only 150 or so pages to go and the wall hasn't suffered damage - yet.

Oh, dear! Now I keep thinking of Julius Caesar saying of Brutus, "He has that moist and hungry look." The monkey face does make an interesting picture, though.

Susan, I can't wait for your review, as your perspective of the period is much more knowledgable than my limited one is.

I forgot, Elizabeth Woodville is a redhead (as is her daughter Elizabeth) and she's referred to constantly as "Queen Elizabeth Woodville". But then this ignorant reader might be missing the boat....

Oh man, that was basically incomprehensible.

Who's making whoopee with Richard? Princess Elizabeth or the intrepid heroin?

Speaking of, what's with all the new Richard fiction books having some sort of, at least one way, romance between Richard and Bess? I know there was that rumor at the time, but dang, even then it was rumored that he would marry her for political reasons, not because the two were desperately in love with each other or anything.

Speaking of, (and sorry to be off topic) -- is it true that someone found one of Bess's books with her name and Richard's motto (Loyalte me Lie or whatever) written on it? Which book was it? And was the motto in her hand or his?

MAP, so far it's our intrepid heroine making whoopee with Richard. They've been carrying on with a *any time I'm in London* affair for ten years now.

I'm still trying to figure out why publishers think we'll swallow this crap and keep publishing it no matter how bad it is or how much editing it needs.

Don't get me started on the Richard/Elizabeth bit. Although I'm terrified to see which direction this book is going to take that one.

Still impatiently waiting for Brian and Susan's books on Richard......

Has your version even been run BY an editor? About 8/10 of what you posted from the book doesn't even count as English.

Speaking of, what's with all the new Richard fiction books having some ..."


The book with Richard's motto, Loyalte me lye, and Elizabeth's signature, both in her hand, is a French translation of Boethius's De consolatione philosophiae. Because it's signed only "Elizabeth" instead of "Elizabeth the king's daughter" or "Elizabeth the queen," as she apparently signed herself on other occasions, it's thought that it might date from the period after she was bastardized and before she married Henry VII.

There's also a copy of Tristan and Isolde that was owned both by Richard (acquired when he was still duke) and by Elizabeth. It's been suggested that he might have given it to her.

I think the bit about Elizabeth being in love with Richard comes from the letter, now disappeared, that Buck says that he saw from her to the Duke of Norfolk. In it (as quoted by Buck) she calls Richard "her only joy and her maker in the world" and says that she fears the queen would never die. Some have suggested that this means she was in love with Richard and was eager to marry him; others have suggested that she was referring to the possibility of a Portuguese marriage. Since the letter is now lost or destroyed, and we have only Buck's word for its contents, we can only guess.

MAP wrote: "Has your version even been run BY an editor? About 8/10 of what you posted from the book doesn't even count as English."

I have no idea, but the book has already been published in the UK so one would think they were starting from that.....

At least twice now I've come across a repeated sentence. Exact same words one after the other. Bizarre.

I've had about five ARC's now and while they make it clear there might be typos I've not seen anything like this.

Thank God it's finally over and I can move on to something else.

Our own 15C Superwoman:

"The important thing now was to stay calm; avoid getting rattled; take one step at a time. She was managing it all so far. Having Alice and the Prattes see the Italian workers today, for instance. Tomorrow, visiting the princess and sewing in her new laces for the violet silk gown. After that, snatching another hour with Dickon on the way back. Then innocently chatting with Will Caxton at his gate about her time with the princess. It was all possible, if you kept your head. It could all work.

Whew, thank goodness there's no kids to take to soccer matches.

Here our silk merchant Isabel is having an intimate (!!) conversation with the Princess Elizabeth who has told her she's going to marry Henry Tudor:

"She shook herself. 'Well, so....what's he like, your future husband?' she said, trying to look and sound warmer without saying anything overtly treasonous"

Isabel having a conversation with R3 about the rebellion and looming battle:

"She said, doubtfully, thinking of all those armies blundering around different parts of the West Country, trying to meet up. 'Well, it seems...messy."

I feel better now for sharing my pain with the rest of you :)

And now, a message from Morbo:

SEMICOLONS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!

I must ask, who is Morbo? I'm sure I'm showing my age again but humor me.

It's a Futurama character. He's like an alien newscaster. In one episode, his newscaster partner says something like "Hopefully those windmills will keep them cool." To which Morbo replies "WINDMILLS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!"

It's become something of a meme in certain dark corners of the internet to point out flaws of movies/books/comic books/scientific articles/etc by yelling "_________ do not work that way!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQg8JK...

Thank you. I do agree, SEMICOLONS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!

I had hopes of this novel, as I quite enjoyed her Thomas More book. (For one thing it actually acknowledged More's dark side, while still keeping him likeable.) But the quotes given here put me off.

That's interesting. Could it really be just an editing issue that will be corrected prior to final publication? I thought this one had already been published in the UK.

The Book Depository has it for a tad over $19. No mention about the state of its editing.

I will part with my ARC for the price of shipping and/or book swap if you're dying to have a copy. I did dog ear some pages though where I wanted to go back and quote for this post :)

Seriously, since I don't know how the publishing industry works it does make me wonder if they started with a whole new draft of this. I've seen typos even in completed works, but never ever have I seen a duplicated sentence, let alone two of them.

The copy I have was not edited and became a real chore to plow through at times. Like Brian, I really enjoyed Portrait of an Unknown Woman and could hardly wait to get my hands on this one. I purchased it through an Amazon seller for 80 cents 2 or 3 months ago and would have been plenty p.o.ed had I paid full price.
As some of you know; as you get older, you seem to lose a little of your brain functions at times. I had almost convinced myself that I was becoming dyslexic after reading the first few chapters of this book. The second half got a little better, but I can't believe someone didn't clean up this book before it was released again.
She has another book coming out this spring and possibly a couple more within a years time, but I won't be seeking them out if this is the best she can do. Too bad, I really had high hopes for this author.

Pat, welcome back we've missed you. If I had paid even one penny for this I'd have been seriously PO'd. What I can't figure out is how a publisher can let typos like that slip by.

I think it comes down to money--copy editing and proofreading are farmed out to freelancers, and the end product is only as good as the freelancer. Also, I suspect that some of the more discerning eyes have retired from the business and are being replaced by people who don't have the grounding in grammar that earlier generations did.

Interesting. I just got a comment on my review of this book on Amazon. She said she picked up a copy in London last year and didn't notice any editing problems as this copy had. Now I'm really wondering if they started from scratch.

I wonder if they scanned the UK version for its US publication and didn't proofread it carefully afterward. I have a copy of the UK paperback version, but I haven't read it yet. (Though these days I tend to miss typos unless they're glaring--I think my eyes are taking a holiday.)

Did I tell you that I won a copy here on GoodReads?
I will take a look when I get it and let you know what kind of typos it has...

Barb wrote: "Did I tell you that I won a copy here on GoodReads?
I will take a look when I get it and let you know what kind of typos it has..."

Good for you Barb. I didn't even know they gave book copies away on GR. Learn something new every day.

It will be interesting to see the both of you read it and see if you have the same problem. My eyes are bad enough (like Susan's) to miss a few typos but my copy was way over the top.

I cannot comment on this book as I have not read it. But, I wonder - how can I become a freelance proofer? That would a great job for me - I can find other people's mistakes (just not my own). I'll have to look into that. P.S. It does not as if I am missing much with this book.

Some of the reviews on Amazon are coming in positive. A lot of times its just me. I'm waiting to see what Barb says.

I really hope that Barb's book is a corrected version. I don't want to give up on this author and hopefully she is aware of all the unedited versions circulating in the US.

I will try to read her other book based on everyone's recommendations, and hopefully the published edition is corrected. Repeated sentences were way over the top for me in the typo department.

I really liked 'Portrait of an Unknown Woman'.

I too hope that the typos were dealt with before this re-release.

Misfit, thanks for letting me be your guinea pig :0) I feel honored!