Cyberpunk discussion

Enjoyed reading your thoughts here. Recently had a conversation regarding the same topic after a viewing of Kathryn Bigelow's Strange Days, a film tapping into some of the classic notions of Burning Chrome cyberpunk, without embracing the full aesthetic of the genre. Somewhere in that film there is a Gibson story at the heart. I wish they took it further. The question of conversation then, was what necessarily IS that "further."

It's late, and I'd love to expand on my thoughts, but it will have to wait for another day. Thanks for the great topic for discussion. This group could use the activity.

Interesting stuff here. While I agree with your viewpoint that cyberpunk is actually a dead genre, only used as "seasoning", your reasonning for the missing "punk" in Snow Crash and the GitS is wrong, as both of them are cyberpunk, where the main characters usually work FOR the government. One example of subverting the trope of the classic cyberpunk outlaw is the beginning of The Diamond Age. It opens with some punk who gets a skull rifle implanted, proceeds to try to rob a rich family and is then captured and swiftly sentenced to death.
And I don't get people's problem with the game being named Cyberpunk. I mean, what do they expect, that's the name of the pen'n'paper game. Like if Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines got Vampire: The Masquerade cut out of the title.

Oops, i meant to say both GitS and Snow Crash are post-cyberpunk

"Robocop" takes place in a Futuristic Detroit with a majority white population. Now, ignoring the fact that you couldn't call something like "Robocop" 'cyberpunk', you can see how the fantasies envisioned 20+ years ago have failed to realistically predict the modernizing urban future. Will expand further if anybody tackles it.

Cyberpunk isn't dead. It just evolves with our times and knowledge, similar to the rest of science fiction. Sure, if you believe cyberpunk is contained in its own retro-future, like a museum wing at the Epcott Center, you might see it that way, but that's an unusual thing for any sub-genre of fiction.

Instead, it has grown up and there are certainly stories to be told that suit our current world view and relationships with technology. With social networks, personal devices, bot engines,dashboard overlays, social divides, and the Anonymous movement, you might even argue we are on the cusp of cyberpunk 2.0--with many stories yet to be told.

The difference, of course, is how we see the environments and style of the 20-teens. That is a changing variable, as is the way we integrate our lives with technology. Maybe a self driving bus isn't cyberpunk, but certainly, overriding that programming and driving it from your basement is a classic extrapolation of the attitude.

While cyberpunk evolves,I'd argue that there are narrative elements which are the more important aspects defining the genre that must remain, at which point we digress into elements of noir. That is exactly what you have with most of the old Gibson stories, and you can see it in Strange Days all the same, though if that film embraced itself at cyberpunk, you might see Lenny living in those memory tapes, and likely confusing his reality. Instead of corrupt law enforcement officers, the entire system would have been rigged, pervasive, obstructing. Lastly, the memory decks would not have been an isolated technology; it would have been one of many devices changing the lives of the characters.

The noir though, the seedy bars and back alley deals, the loser in love with the singer, it's all there.

*More later.

I appreciate your take on this subject, but I cannot wholly agree that this is a "dead genre." I have always viewed "Cyberpunk" a little differently.
You have stated that cyberpunk can be reduced to one phrase: “high tech, low life”. Here is where I disagree.
"Punk" is more a philosophy. Anarchy. Anti-establishment. Our protagonists rail against the boundaries imposed upon them by social norms/mores.
On the next level we might incorporate the Marxist Notion of "infiltratism." In this, our protagonists appear outwardly to be a part of the establishment only to move in and break it down.
Add to this the technology that gives us the flavor and backdrop we love in this genre and we open the playing field.
Here, Stephenson succeeds marvelously as many of his protagonists begin this way and he usually likes to look at various class levels.
Max Barry might also join the fray with his novels "Jennifer Government" and "Machine Man." (On a side note his other two novels, "Company" and "Syrup" are superb)
Herein, for me, beats the heart of cyberpunk.
If we reduce the genre to the literal translation solely predicated upon the facade worn by the main characters then, for me, the substance is lacking.
Cyberpunk beats in the hearts of many by my estimation, but it is the rare author who can make it work.

Definitely not dead. It was at one-time, let's say, devalued? Or, in my opinion defaced. But, not, nor ever dead. I'd agree with evolved too. I also think the controversial history of the subject is interesting when it is correlated with the genre itself. If anyone is interested in the subject and has not read REWIRED... It is highly recommended.

Thank you for the thoughtful and well written piece on our favorite genre.

Here is my theory.
The Cyberpunk became Reality. Nowdays everyone is connected to the matrix, which is portrayed by facebook, google, ebay and etc. Punks and model citzens... we are all part of it.

I think this is where a lot of my own nit pick of using dystopia as a catch all phrase comes from. Although I've been told cyberpunk doesnt have to be dystopic.

I have nothing against cross genre work.

Jon wrote: "Definitely not dead. It was at one-time, let's say, devalued? Or, in my opinion defaced. But, not, nor ever dead. I'd agree with evolved too. I also think the controversial history of the subject i..."

What is the controversial about the history of the subject?

Very interesting, Silvio. Thanks for posting. I'd love to see the punk put back into cyberpunk.

You certainly have the skills and the knowledge to make that novel good. Let me know when it's done.