Authors Helping Authors discussion

Let's face it, there are a lot of frustrations that come along with being a writer. They're a necessary evil, and sometimes you just have to express your frustrations to people who can understand and relate. Lucky for you, this is that place. As long as you are respectful of the other members (remember this if you're talking about a blogger!!) and as long as you use asterisks in place of the company names and such, this is a safe place to vent your frustrations and talk to others who may have had similar experiences.

So go on - tell me your horror stories and everything that pisses you off about the writing process.

spending days, weeks, months editing only to open your newly published novel and immediately see an obvious error. UGH.

Burnout.

After obsessing over this series for two years, planning the entire plot for all three books, then sitting down and writing for three straight months and producing 300 pages, I'm tired. (I've actually written more than 400 pages, but cut about 25% of that)

I'm doubting everything about this book. I'm finding myself rushing through scenes and trying to avoid writing others. (To the point where I'm actually bending the storyline to stay away from something that I'm not looking forward to writing.)

After sitting in front of the computer for three straight days and producing four pages of content that I can't stand, I decided to step away. I wanted to keep writing, though - maintain my discipline - and I decided to work on something else.

What began as a writing exercise has expanded into a pretty good story and I'm knocking out 10-14 pages easily. I think that it's because it's fresh. It's a lighter story. I'm very much enjoying this.

But now I'm stressed because I feel like I've abandoned my 'serious work' and pressured to get back to it.

Whatever. I don't know if I'm sabotaging myself in the long run, but I know that I can't give my best to the first story right now. At least I'm still producing something.

Thank you for letting me use the venting booth! lol!

My sales have stopped. Not slowed down, not seeing a slump - just stopped.

My passion is writing. I feel like I'm a great writer. I've produced one full-length novel, one book of essays on parenting (that originally came from a newspaper column I wrote), and one book of poetry this year. I'm gearing up to publish my second novel in the spring, and I have two more full length novels that are just waiting for me to edit. But I hate marketing, I'd rather spend my time and energy writing. Every dollar I've spent on advertising has been wasted, since it's literally given me no return at all. I feel like there's no place for me in indie publishing, which is unfortunate. I know how to format my books, I give them good covers, and I lay down serious money for editing. Each book costs me over $1000 to produce. I doubt I'll get reimbursed for my efforts any time soon through sales. The only reason I continue is because I love writing. But I'm so disappointed that I can't move a fricking book beyond my family and friends, and sometimes not even that far. It's only been a year since I started publishing, and I know I need to be patient. But honestly, what if my patience never pays off? I really wanted to do this all on my own without a traditional publisher, but I don't think I can afford to any more.

Thanks for the space to rant openly and honestly.

I hear you, Crissi. I have two novels out. The first I had a "real" (though local) publisher and worked my butt off to get promoted. Anything anyone said was a "good idea" I tried. I was pretty crushed when I realized, too, that it was mainly "F&F" (friends-and-family) sales. The publisher was so awful I ended up getting my rights back and self-publishing to keep a presence online. My second book I've hardly promoted, despite it being for a different audience. My new attitude is to build an audience slowly via social media and blogging, however modest (and hopeless) that seems. And continue to take my work seriously. I think part of our problem is that our art for some produces real money but for many nothing at all. I suspect fiction is drifting toward poetry in the sense that we will continue to write passionately but will less and less expect any "breakthroughs" or monetary success. Is that too negative? I wouldn't mind a surprise that knocked me off my feet, but I can't count on it.
I had a writing teacher once say "the honor of being involved in literature." Can't take that to the bank but it's not nothing.

Crissi,

I've also struggled with my own dark night of the soul regarding my dream of writing novels.

Please do not let your frustration cause you to miss the amazing opportunity we novelists now have.

For the first time in the history of language, writers control all facets of their work. Please see this as the big deal that it is. This is huge and can potentially earn you a lot of money.

But it will take time and loving patience on your part. Patience with yourself as well as your readers.

Your books will never go out of print, so you have time to figure this out. Every book you write will help sell every other book you write.

With the power of the internet you are free to build your readership, step by step and reader by reader.

Daphne Dangerlove has an excellent Author's Toolkit on Amazon. It costs about $5 and will tell you precisely what you need to do to build a readership.

I would also recommend the documentary "Samsara." It is available on Netflix to watch instantly. This film helped me put my life and dreams into perspective. It may help you as well.

Crissi, it took time for you to learn to write a novel. Allow yourself time to learn how to garner a readership.

I have always been a student of literature. Now, I am also a student of the internet. I'm determined to learn how to use the internet to promote my writing. I hope you will seize this opportunity too.

We are living our dream. In the course of human history, the opportunity to follow one's bliss is extremely rare, almost non-existent. That is why it can be so difficult but also rewarding on so many levels.

Finally, I would recommend the book "The Writer's Journey" by Christopher Vogler. In it, Vogler explores the Hero's Journey and shows how a writer is essentially a hero on a most extraordinary personal quest, complete with life threatening dangers and menacing gatekeepers. I hope you'll read it.

Stay the course.

Gary

Thank you C.B. and Gary. It is so hard to not get discouraged when the hoped-for results aren't happening, and, at times, seem to be going backwards despite my best efforts. I have to keep reminding myself that I only published my first book in March of 2013. Yet, because I've been a writer (both professionally and personally) for many years, I feel like the publishing road has been a lot longer than it has been. While the frustration remains, it's comforting to receive words of encouragement from other writers, as well as a few avenues to look at to help keep me motivated and give me an alternate direction in getting things moving. Thank you!

Realising that the active Goodreads community is mostly women - after having written a book suited to the male 25-45 demographic.

Despite the disclaimers and warnings that some of the story elements might offend, it is mostly women that add it to their 'to read' lists. Apart from fellow authors and friends, 16 people have my book on their various lists. 15 female, one male. That's not a huge number from which to draw any definitive conclusions but it does point to a trend.

My book is not anti-female, I just know who it was written for and that it refers to subject matter that will more likely offend women than men.

So then I get a Soccer Mom review that cites the very things I tried to warn people about. I know reviewers like to speak their mind about books and that their views might be well delivered and justified, but they have to consider whether or not they were the people the author was thinking of when the book was being written. Like all authors, I know that mediocrity is the art of trying to please everyone but reviewers should realise that selfishness is defined as believing that everything was created with their needs in mind. It might not be the book's fault that you didn't like it.

I'm not worried that my book won't be read by Goodreads users. I'm worried that it will be.

Yup, we're all in good company. I saw the post from the self-pubbed person and the disappointment with sales. Well, I was published for six years with one of the big 5 New York publishers, and I worked my butt off promoting, spending lots of dough to do so, and after six books and poor sales they dropped me. Which means I don't necessarily start from the beginning, but it does mean I can't count on going to another big New York house, because they all have access to the sales numbers. And the blame does fall on the publisher paradigm of *hoping* midlist author sales will zoom without actually doing anything about it. Even though they have all the resources, the connections, the abilities--they won't spend the time and money. Fortunately, I do have *some* following, so I plan on self-pubbing a prequel in that series this spring and I expect modest sales from that. In the meantime, I went in an entirely different direction with an urban fantasy, so my agent can go to those Big NY publishers again. But heck. It's not easy trying to make a living at writing. Editors, agents, they all make a living doing the job they love. Why can't the author???

Blair wrote: "Realising that the active Goodreads community is mostly women - after having written a book suited to the male 25-45 demographic.

Despite the disclaimers and warnings that some of the story elemen..."

I feel you. I set out to write a romance and it's not. The guys *love* this book. The women like it, but don't "feel* it. Too much mystery. Too much violence. (There's once scene where all my guys want more gore.) The guys are fed up with 'the emotional bs' and the women just want more physical descriptions of the men. So now I don't know what I've written. SMH (The one thing I thought would be an issue is that two of the characters are chain smokers - for good reason - and nobody cares.)

Care to point me to your book? Apparently, I think like a dude, so I'll probably love it.

Shay: Well mine starts off with the line "Pornography will be the last non-commercialised art form we have left." Try that for a polarising position - albeit from a character.

Since you asked:
The Day the Music Died

Message me with your email and I can flick you a copy if you want. That's possibly the subject of another post: the fact that I say on the book page that I will give free copies to anyone serious about reading it. But of all those who have added it to their 'to-read' lists, none have asked. Presumably they didn't read that far down into the description.

Rebecca wrote: "spending days, weeks, months editing only to open your newly published novel and immediately see an obvious error. UGH."
I had to laugh. Because, I sooo can relate.
How, you ask? Oh, let me show you the ways.
Edit for months. Have others double check.
Upload as ebook.
Introduce your amazing creation (exaggeration is mine) by offering it FREE for two days. Count the downloads. High five your supporting family members.
Only.to.discover...you spelled CHAPTER TWO without the 'P' in Chapter.
Yeah.
CHAPER TWO.
Deflation was likened to a balloon zipping around the room, hissing obscene noises. *hangs head*

LOL Karey.

Today, I received a distressing email from a reader. Amazon has three times denied her the right to review my second book. Why? Amazon says because she is my friend. Seriously.

I do know who she is, but only because we work for the same large, international corporation, but in different parts of the US. We ARE friendly, and share a passion for photography, but I couldn't pick her out of a crowd because we have never met. Not once.

The woman purchased her copy directly from me, but only because she preferred a signed copy. I can prove she paid for the book, and I'm thrilled she wants to review, but I did not guide her in any way.

So why is she denied her opinion? Doesn't Goodreads foster friendships like this? Doesn't the social networking model demand friendships like this? Will GoodReads also deny her her voice because we both like to take photos?

Does anyone have any suggestions to knock down this wall of ignorance?

Amazon?
Yeah, good luck with that.
They embrace the troll reviewer--to include no longer requiring 'spoiler alert' to be posted, but the HONEST reviewer...oh noz, noz, noz, can't have THAT--
I think Amazon wants their reviews to be the next Jerry Springer show--lots of hate, so they get tons of 'hits'.
Amazon, in some things, rocks. In other areas, they're a little TOO Big Brother--and ALWAYS on the wrong page--well, would you look at that, I made a writerly pun :P

I feel like I spend way too much time trying to promote my book when I could be writing something. By the time I'm done with marketing/blogging/stuff like that, I'm too sapped to write. I have no idea what the magic trick is to get people to notice me, and I hate that it takes so much time. I just want to write!

As for spotting typos and wanting to cringe, even super star authors aren't immune. I recently read A Dance with Dragons by George R.R. Martin, and there was a typo where he had written "alarum" instead of "alarm." I snapped a picture of it with my phone! **I love his work. I just found it funny there was a typo.

M.L. wrote: "I feel like I spend way too much time trying to promote my book when I could be writing something. By the time I'm done with marketing/blogging/stuff like that, I'm too sapped to write. I have no i..."
HEAR-HEAR!!
Marketing is exhausting. I've finally found a sorta-system, but it's not perfect. If my work schedule has me going in late-in-the-day, I market all morning, so that I can see results that evening by way of sales/rankings. Later that same night, I'll write. Some days I do the opposite--write BEFORE work, and market AFTER work. I think the marketing BEFORE work is better....writing at night, I don't have to turn off my muse & go get ready for work. But, yeah, I wholeheartedly agree, marketing is exhausting, but a necessary evil for we indie authors.
As for typos even from the professionals, some of Lynn Kurland's books, in eBook format are bloody awful!! When I grab the paperback version, there are a few of the same typos, but not as many. So, who's the hack uploading her books into eBook format and NOT checking and double-checking to make sure all is well?
I do the best I can...and then, I do it again, and again, trying to make it as perfect as possible.
But I've yet to part the Red Sea, so...*shrugs*

Typos. . . our gradeschool PTA always put together the Yearbook. One year, after not fewer than 4 of us had read and proofread, we got them back to discover that on one page--in giant type in the header--the name of the school had been misspelled. Yeah, no one was really looking at that, because, you know, a quick glance and you see it's the school...

I look at it this way. I run through a quarter million words per book. In the end, 90,000 end up in print. If 2-3 typos slip through, I'll survive. If a grammarian trashes me in reviews, that person is not interested in the story, only in proving how "smart" he/she is.
Shoot me. Then I dare you to do the same without an error creeping into the finished product.

Rebecca wrote: "I look at it this way. I run through a quarter million words per book. In the end, 90,000 end up in print. If 2-3 typos slip through, I'll survive. If a grammarian trashes me in reviews, that perso..."
You're my new beast best friend.
Excuse the typo :P

2-3 typos in a book is GOOD. Though I prefer to have none, and especially prefer to avoid having them in really embarrassingly obvious places like titles and headers :D

M.L. wrote: "I feel like I spend way too much time trying to promote my book when I could be writing something. By the time I'm done with marketing/blogging/stuff like that, I'm too sapped to write. I have no i..."

I don't want to be snooty, or seem to be snooty, but "alarum" is an archaic esp. British form of "alarm." It's all over Shakespeare.

@ Karey - I may have to try some sort of schedule of marketing/writing. What I'm doing now is not working as far as having creativity left over for writing goes!

@ Rebecca - I like your line of thinking! There will probably always be that one typo to escape us.

...I didn't notice "alarm" spelled "alarum" anywhere else in the book, but then again, I wasn't looking for it. It just popped out at me *shrugs* Interesting info!