You'll love this one...!! A book club & more discussion

HISTORY HISTORY HISTORY
A STORY A STORY A STORY
REPEATED AND REPEATED
AGAIN AND AGAIN
CAN NEVER STOP IT CAN ONLY WATCH IT
HISTORY HISTORY HISTORY

Kairy Sauerwein

October Toppler
West Virginia celebrated it’s sesquicentennial this year, and so I’ve decided that this Toppler’s theme will be history.

We all know what a history book is – an allegedly true narration of the past, whether a specific event, the life of a group of people or an individual, or a description of a certain period of time.

Historical fiction, on the other hand, isn’t as clear. A simple definition states that HF comprises narratives that take place in the past and is characterized chiefly by an imaginative reconstruction of historical events and personages. A deeper look provides more detail.
- Historical fiction is divided into two broad categories. The first includes any work in which both the setting and the supporting characters have a historical basis in fact. The second includes work in which the setting alone is set in the historic past, while the characters and situations are otherwise fictitious.
- Specifics differ on how far in the past a given piece must be set in order to be considered historical fiction. The Historical Novel Society maintains that a work must be set at least 50 years in the past to be considered historical.
- Historical fiction does not include works written in the past which describe a setting contemporary to their time. For instance, while "Moby Dick" describes a past setting from our modern perspective, it was considered "modern" when it was first published.
- Historical fiction must devote itself to accuracy in its presentation of setting and events. Again, specifics vary depending on whom you ask, but in general terms, any element of fiction presented within the work must not contradict established historical fact. For example, while it is acceptable to create a fictitious British soldier who fought in the American Revolutionary War, it is not acceptable to have that soldier kill General Washington, which goes against historical fact. (Another sub-genre of fiction--alternate history--is used to explore such notions.)

Then we have my definition, which will be used for the Toppler.
- The two categories are still good. For our purposes, the book needs to give a good sense of setting, there must be some historical background. In other words, just because a book is set in the past doesn't make it historical fiction. It must have a historical theme; details of daily life and customs of that period, or the political climate, the feel of the period must be an integral part of the book.
- The setting must be at least 20 years in the past.
- That contemporary/historical distinction always throws me, so I’m throwing it out. For Toppler purposes, if it happened in the past, it doesn’t matter when it was written.
- I can’t decide how closely to follow the accuracy part. I’ll work on it and edit this soon.


This Toppler is one week long, and will start on October 12th at noon EST and end at noon EST on the 19th.

A few rules:
1. Books must be started and finished in this time period to qualify.
2. You may read any format - paperback, hardcover, ebook, or audiobook. For the last two use the page numbers on the first edition that comes up on the GR page.
3. Each book must be at least 150 pages.
4. Toppler books can count toward the monthly challenge, the group theme read, and the alphabet yearly challenge if they qualify.
5. You may plan ahead and chose books for the challenge, but you are not restricted to those books. You may swap them out at will.

There is no requirement to read a certain number of books, even if you only read one, you will receive a badge. WE WANT YOU TO PARTICIPATE AND HAVE FUN!

How exciting! I can't wait to see what you cook up for this J'mom!

Sounds interesting! :)

The toppler is when?

Snoozie Suzie wrote: "The toppler is when?"

"October, 2013
Monthly Challenge...
Monthly Group Themed Read
Yearly Challenge... Read the Alphabet
Toppler (week long)June 8th-15th"

☻☻☺☺☻☻

Ta

Have you got dates in mind, j'mom?

Almeta, is that from our group calendar? Yikes!

Janice wrote: "Have you got dates in mind, j'mom?

Almeta, is that from our group calendar? Yikes!"

lol Yes, I keep checking but it isn't changing!

My guess on the dates - February and June were 2nd Saturday thru 3rd Saturday, so I would say October 12-19. As for the substance, it might be a re-read, a classic, or a book made into a movie. I anxiously await Jaxnsmom's announcement so I can add to my large list of October TBRs!

I was thinking the 12th - 19th.

Start looking through your piles for history and historical fiction books. We won't be using the technical definition of historical fiction, but a modified one, which I'll post this week.

Almeta wrote: "Janice wrote: "Have you got dates in mind, j'mom?

Almeta, is that from our group calendar? Yikes!"

lol Yes, I keep checking but it isn't changing!"

I just wanted time to stand still awhile Almeta.....unfortunately time moved forward without me. Unbelievable I know. You should see some changes now and some to come :)

jaxnsmom wrote: "I was thinking the 12th - 19th.

Start looking through your piles for history and historical fiction books. We won't be using the technical definition of historical fiction, but a modified one, ..."

Good dates. It means a 3 day weekend for me as it is Thanksgiving here.

Should have known!! I have planned a FreeCycle event the weekend of the 18th. I think I did the same thing last year.

Well I have the week before, and maybe there will be lulls in the Free4All visits.

Looking forward to the challenge. Off to Gopher.☺

AmyK wrote: "I just wanted time to stand still awhile Almeta.....unfortunately time moved forward without me. Unbelievable I know. You should see some changes now and some to come :) ..."

Time does have a way of marching on. I'll keep checking. :D

Yay, I'll be HOME!!! (in Narita Airport waiting for the flight to Sydney... only 2 flights and 15 hours to go!)

Intrigued to see what emerges Jmom!

jaxnsmom wrote: "I was thinking the 12th - 19th.

Start looking through your piles for history and historical fiction books. We won't be using the technical definition of historical fiction, but a modified one, ..."

Super! I look forward to this one!

I'll be out of town from Friday through that whole weekend for a wedding. Won't be getting much done during this toppler, I'm afraid. :-(

Well, I teach on the 12th, but otherwise the weekend looks pretty open for me. And I'll have a longer drive on the 17th, so can listen to an audiobook on the way there and back.

I'll be at a family rebellion on the Thanksgiving weekend so won't be able to do much reading on the 12 & 13th. But I do have a long drive home on the 14th to indulge.

The theme sounds intriguing, especially the teaser about a modified historical fiction.

No no no! I'll be in China most of that week. :(

I'm around this week - hopefully I'll get more read this time as I won't be on holiday like the last week long toppler (unfortunately :-()

So sorry Pragya!!

A lot of us in the States will have the 14th off for Columbus Day, so a nice three day weekend. I'll be scurrying around cleaning because my dad's coming the 17th. We have the big library book sale Saturday morning, so my reading will be off and on.

Need more info...enquiring minds need (want) to know :-).

Janice, a family rebellion?

Snoozie Suzie wrote: "Janice, a family rebellion?"

Most families call them reunions. Someone in the family years ago called one of the reunions a rebellion and it's kind of stuck. In no way does the moniker describe the activities or incidents.

I like it! Enjoy your rebellion.

Thanks Suzie! I just hope they don't expect each family to perform on a "talent night" like the last time. We did a hula dance "Going to the Hukilau" (sp?) I think we damaged enough people with that one. If I have to perform, maybe I'll do an interpretive reading of whatever book I've chosen for the toppler.

Snoozie Suzie wrote: "Janice, a family rebellion?"

I found that very funny. I think I can relate, tho.

Janice, that sounds like so much fun!

I will try to join on 18-19 when I'm back, JMom.

I'm in! I will be in Hawaii that week and plan to spend most of the time looking at the water and reading! My kindle will be loaded and ready to read read read.

Looking forward to what I hope will be the first of many topplers!

Oh, Patty... and any other Toppler newbies, you must read this thread! http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/9...

On second thought, maybe you shouldn't read it. We don't want you scared off. Hehehe!

****IMPORTANT****

I've edited message one to give you most of the details about the Toppler.

Now get busy gophering, squirreling, spreadsheeting, or whatever method you use.

Yay!

Confirming: is it 24 hours or a week? Message one is unclear at this point in time.

Thanks Jmom!

Rusalka wrote: "Yay!

Confirming: is it 24 hours or a week? Message one is unclear at this point in time.

Thanks Jmom!"
it's a week long :)

I'm in! I've missed the topplers a lot.

Am I right in thinking that I can read a book set in the past and that will count? So I'm thinking The Shining - it's not historical fiction as we know it but it was written in 1977 so was set that decade (or possibly before) so is at least 20 years in the past?!?

Another question - are split timeframes ok? I have a couple books in mind which are based in present day, then flip back to the past for half of the chapters.

How about Fingersmith? I had a look and it doesn't have historical as a listed tag but I am fairly sure it is. Has anyone else read it?

Esta wrote: "How about Fingersmith? I had a look and it doesn't have historical as a listed tag but I am fairly sure it is. Has anyone else read it?"

I am reading Fingersmith at the moment. It is set in the Victorian period and I have put it on my historical fiction shelf on Goodreads. I think you should be able to count it for this toppler.

Btw, great theme jmom! I am really looking forward to it! :)

Lisa wrote: "Esta wrote: "How about Fingersmith? I had a look and it doesn't have historical as a listed tag but I am fairly sure it is. Has anyone else read it?"

I am reading Fingersmith at the moment. It is ..."

Thanks Lisa, I forgot you were reading it now. Are you enjoying it? Thanks for the info, that was just what I wanted to hear.

Jaxsnmom, if you're throwing out the contemporary qualification, would Crime and Punishment then fit? It was written in 1866 and the story takes place at that time, so it's generally classified as Classic Russian Literature, but not Historical Fiction. That's in my reading plan for mid-October.

I also have The Poisoned Pilgrim, Women in Love, Memoirs of a Geisha, and War Brides on my TBR October list, all of which should fit.

Janice wrote: "Oh, Patty... and any other Toppler newbies, you must read this thread! http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/9...

On second thought, maybe you shouldn't read it. We don't wa..."

Patty wrote: "Looking forward to what I hope will be the first of many topplers!"

Janice, I loved it! Lol there are a couple on there that I actually do at times now I have a good reason for the rest of them. ;-)

Esta wrote: "Lisa wrote: "Esta wrote: "How about Fingersmith? I had a look and it doesn't have historical as a listed tag but I am fairly sure it is. Has anyone else read it?"

I am reading Fingersmith at the m..."

You're welcome Esta. Yes, I am really enjoying it so far. It is really well written with plenty of twists and turns. Definitely worth a read in my opinion.

Kimberly wrote: "Rusalka wrote: "Yay!

Confirming: is it 24 hours or a week? Message one is unclear at this point in time.

Thanks Jmom!"
it's a week long :)"

Cheers Kimberly. I was double checking due to the following:
"This Toppler is 24 hours long, and will start on October 12th at noon EST and end at noon EST on the 19th."

It could just be the jetlag though.

Wish I had Janice's Crystal Ball.

I'm trying to read JMom's mind!

I wonder will these fit in with her demented thoughts?

Of Death and Black Rivers
One Corpse Too Many
Thirteenth Night
Wine of Violence
Remedy for Treason
Hangman Blind
The Queen's Gambit
The Hangman's Daughter
The Rival Queens

Ummmm.... j'mom, you might want to reword this sentence,

This Toppler is 24 hours long, and will start on October 12th at noon EST and end at noon EST on the 19th.

That has got to be the longest 24 hours I've ever encountered. You might be making history. LOL!

I'm firmly in the camp of the first broad definition, and negate the second. But then I'm anal, and I've been known to spout my prejudices about this genre loudly and often. (I hear a collective groan going up and can see the multitude of rolling eyes.)

But, since we're going by j'mom's personal definitions, I can temporarily give up my rigidity and start squirreling. Yippeeeee!

One book will be The Alienist because it fits and I'm reading it for the monthly challenge. Maybe The Orchardist too because that's on my ABC challenge... Hmmmmm!

Almeta wrote: "Wish I had Janice's Crystal Ball.

I'm trying to read JMom's mind!

I wonder will these fit in with her demented thoughts?

Of Death and Black Rivers
One Corpse Too Many
Thirteenth Night
Wine of ..."

My crystal ball says, "YES". There's enough dementia in those selections to fit any demented mind. Love those selections!

(Edit - Maybe one day I'll learn how to spell.)

Rusalka wrote: "Yay!

Confirming: is it 24 hours or a week? Message one is unclear at this point in time.

Thanks Jmom!"

OOPS! Edited to say one week.