Mrs. Jernigan's Class discussion

I'm going to read this book..

I am reading Divergent by Veronica Roth. The beginning of the book introduces the characters and explains how the plot will be written out. The protagonist, Beatrice "Tris" is a 16 year old year that lives with her mom, dad, and brother. This book is a futuristic dystopia and the country is divided into 5 factions: Abnegation (selfless), Dauntless (brave), Erudite (intelligent), Amity (peaceful), and Candor (honest). Tris and her family are in Abnegation. She was taught growing up to never look in a mirror because it is selfish, and to not talk at the dinner table because it was selfish, and many other things. When it comes to initiation day, all the 16 year olds (ish) get to chose whether to stay in their faction or chose another faction.

In Divergent, each teenager has to take a mind test to see what faction the government thinks they should be in to help in their decision making process. When Tris takes the test, Tori, the instructor tells her that her test results were inconclusive. The test didn't work on Tris, meaning one thing, Tris was "Divergent." Divergent is a rare thing that only few people have. What makes it special is that those who are Divergent can break the system. They know how to pass the tests in exceptional time and differently than normal people. Tori made it very very clear to Tris not to tell anyone... Not even her family. If the government found out she was Divergent, they would try to get rid of her. This made Tris very confused and she had no idea why it was special. You don't find out until the end why it's a big deal.

It's normal and obedient to just stay in the same faction that you grew up in. Usually, when someone switched (which was rare), it is looked down upon and your families may not talk to you anymore. At initiations day, Tris and her bother both leave Abnegation, but they go to separate factions. Tris chooses Dauntless.

She chose it in the moment and couldn't change her decision after that. After the ceremony, her parents didn't really talk to her and they just walked away. Immediately, everyone went to their same or new factions and began initiation process to see if they can make it into the faction.

I really enjoyed reading this book and I can't wait to see the movie when it comes out either! One of my favorite things about this was the fact the Tris was different, and it follows her as she struggles with this difference. I think it employs many good life lessons that can be very applicable to teens in todays world. Throughout the book Tris knew she was different, and hid it from almost everyone, but when she finally came forward with the truth, was when she made a difference. She fully embraced her role of being Divergent and led a group to do something unthinkable and nearly impossible. This can be related to today's society because when people are different they are often mocked and ridiculed, I am no exception, But when these people decide to embrace their difference that is when they become brave, strong, and powerful behind measure just like Tris did in this book.

While reading Divergent, one thing I noticed was the similarity between this book and The Hunger Games. During both of these stories, a girl is followed as the main character (Katniss and Tris), both girls are different (Katniss Volunteered and Tris is Divergent), society is set up in divisions (Districts and Factions), and a rebellion is led against the central government (The Capital and Abnegation Leaders), and the hero must overcome multiple challenges along the way in order to be victorious (The Games and Mind Control). Did anyone else notice this or have any other observations?

This book has what every reader wants in a book: thrill, love story, action, pain, and a little but of redemption. The thrill is all of the fear-facing actions that everyone does in Dauntless. Tris, the protagonist that switched into Dauntless, began to fall in love with the 18 year old instructor, Four. They ran into a couple obstacles, trying to hide their love for each other so that they wouldn't get in trouble by the officials. Tris also experiences a lot of pain in trainging to be Dauntless; she is so tough and keeps pushing through, which I would never be able to do as well as her. Redemption is seen with her family. As Tris left her faction for another faction, her father was very disappointed in her. At the end of the book, when lives are on the line, the family comes together and the mother and father both die to (in a way) save Tris's life. Sacrifice amongst the family was very prominent.

Sam wrote: "While reading Divergent, one thing I noticed was the similarity between this book and The Hunger Games. During both of these stories, a girl is followed as the main character (Katniss and Tris), bo..."

I completely agree with Sam. I was thinking from the beginning that I see similarities between those two stories. Both stories are futuristic dystopias, so a lot of common things fell into place. Both Katniss and Tris stand out in their own ways. The stories are so different, yet have so much in common. Both books have governments that are unfair and making dumb decisions that the people want to overthrow in a sense. Both Katniss and Tris met their lovers by doing what they had to do, also.

I read this book in 24 hours because I literally could not put it down. I was blown away by all of the genius details of this book. The breakdown of human nature into 5 simple factions and the way the characters correlate as the story unfolds. Everything about Tris and her evolution through the book makes it so captivating. Obviously I loved reading about Tris and Four's relationship, but mainly because it was so different. Affection is so foreign to Tris that she doesn't recognize it when it begins to consume her. The way that Roth analyzes family and loyalty is a scary but almost refreshing new outlook. I feel like this book does an amazing job at balancing affection and maturity and seriousness and scare. It has it all.

One thing that stands out to me in this book is the strong focus in on one faction (Dauntless). Why do you think Roth made Tris choose Dauntless and focused in on it instead of any of the other factions? After reading it my initial response would be to say that is naturally more interesting and captivating, but really I just think that because I experienced just this side of it. Tris's journey in dauntless is mind-boggling. I feel as though I went through every little pain and growth experience with her. I feel like as she goes through her simulations with her fears I not only fear with her but I evaluate my own fears. I wonder what my fear landscape would be like. Would I have four fears or would I have 24? Would I be able to calm myself or would I panic tot he point of breaking under pressure? Every bit of this initiation process I would try to put myself in their shoes as they experienced it too. I think it changes the way you read and emotionally respond to it as well.

Here is a thought... Why do you think we find about the mom so late in the book? Also why does Roth have her die right after the reader finds out about everything going on?

Better yet, why do you think the mom chose to keep information about her past life, her present life, and divergence away from Beatrice? Do you think she adds or takes away from the experience of the story? Do you think Roth intended for her to add or subtract so much from the story?

A huge part of Tris's life and growth in this book is about the transformation and combining (in her case) the qualities of dauntless and abnegation. How did you feel about the correlation between the two? Bravery and selflessness begin to blend together in my mind and when I kept the reading the more I realized how truly close the two characteristics are. I think the analysis of courage in the dauntless is taxing to the body and mind in many ways, but it leaves you stronger in reference to your own well being. Abnegation prepares you for the preservation and defense of everyone around you. With both in mind, how could anything go wrong? Roth makes a genius connection between the two.

Do you think the connection and story would have been as strong or as moving if she attempted to use the other characteristics or factions?

I feel like I most reflate and naturally analyze the character of Tris, but a huge question I have is the analyzation on Four. I feel like his character has SO many layers that I got confused about him. I actually wasn't surprised when I found out he was Tobias, but I was shocked to enter in to his world as much as we do as readers. I was shocked, but found myself wanting to hear more of his thoughts and feel what he feels for tris. I think one of the most powerful scenes in the book is when she wakes him from the war simulation tracker towards the end right before he kills her. What do you think Roth's message is with the history of that relationship and the way that affects the way they act then? Why do you think Tobias/Four shows vulnerability and strength yet we don't get the full grasp on him yet? Or is that just me?

Kenzie wrote: "One thing that stands out to me in this book is the strong focus in on one faction (Dauntless). Why do you think Roth made Tris choose Dauntless and focused in on it instead of any of the other fac..."
To answer the first part on this, I think Roth chose Dauntless because it was described as "Brave" in the book and that is what it seems everyone in society is seeking. The book started with her just following standards and codes, like we do now, but she eventually became brave enough to break away on her own and be independent. I think this relates directly to the readers and what we want to feel, brave. We all long to be strong, independent, and brave and following Tris on her journey allows us readers to feel empowered and really connect with someone being brave. Roth shows us an example of bravery in hopes of actually changing a reader.

Kenzie wrote: "One thing that stands out to me in this book is the strong focus in on one faction (Dauntless). Why do you think Roth made Tris choose Dauntless and focused in on it instead of any of the other fac..."
One thing I tried to do while reading was put myself in the situation and think about my reactions and thoughts just like you discussed. I don't think I would have handled myself as maturely as Tris and Four did and that really intrigued me. Roth gave the kids the adult-like personas and attributes and reversed the roles, especially towards the end. Another thing I liked that you mentioned was the fear landscapes. I thought that this were something unique that I hadn't really thought about before. I know for a fact that I would have way more fears than either of them, and facing them would be an impossible task for me. One of the scarier things than that would be having to stay calm while other people just watched me and my reactions.

Kenzie wrote: "One thing that stands out to me in this book is the strong focus in on one faction (Dauntless). Why do you think Roth made Tris choose Dauntless and focused in on it instead of any of the other fac..."

I think Roth focused on the Dauntless faction because they were such a mystery. From the beginning they are a interesting bunch jumping off trains and are really free. Tris frees so trapped and alone in abginagtion that this wild and free life style appeals to her but also she doesn't know enough about it to see the flaws in their system. Tris is torn between who she is and who she feels like she is supposed to be. Abgination representing who she is supposed to be and Dauntless symbolizing who she feels like she is. Also I think Roth put her in dauntless for the aspect of the story and plot development.


Do you think if Tris had known what it would take to get initiated that she still would of chosen dauntless?

I really enjoyed reading this book. Here are a few things that I enjoyed. I loved how multi demential Tris is. I think this is what sets her apart from everyone else around her. She uses the fact that she is divergent to her advantage but also works hard for everything that is given to her. I also really enjoyed the character of Four. At the beginning he had this mask up to the world of a tough guy with ton of walls. However, Roth takes us behind those walls and show the readers what made him this way and whats going on in his head. I also thought this book had the perfect balance of romance and excitement and fighting unlike alot of the books in this day and age.

Kenzie wrote: "Here is a thought... Why do you think we find about the mom so late in the book? Also why does Roth have her die right after the reader finds out about everything going on?

Better yet, why do you..."

I think the mom story comes in later to help give background to the story. Roth has a pattern of presenting characters as private and secretive people in order to provide depth into the characters as he did with Four. The mom at first comes off as a rule follower who loves her children like all moms but that being the extent of who she is. But in reality she was divergent and is so much more than she ever seemed. This adds suspense and character development to the story

A question I had during the story was why is being divergent such a huge deal? If they don't respond to the serum then why not just let them into the inside and have them be part the guarding, managing, or technology teams, instead of killing them? If janice had just adopted the divergent to be leaders and team members then all this strive could of been avoided

How do you think each of Tris's divergent characteristics (smart, selflessness, and brave) contribute to her success in the later part of the book?

I think that Tris's intelligence helps her handle sudden situations in the best way and deal with everything that is going on around her. Instead of freaking out when the serum kicks in she follows others and plays along. She is intelligent enough to not ask questions which is a major flaw in lots of intelligent people. She is selfless in the way that she risks everything to save her old community and the people in it and is brave to stand up to her new strong function. She shows her bravery throughout the initiation process. She shows her intelligence again in the final stage of initiation when she figures out how to handle her fears without showing that she is divergent. She also shows her intelligence when she has a conversation with janise and knows all the right things to say.

I agree. I think that Tris is strong, and intelligent. Because she can acknowledge her selfishness, it makes her brave because she can accept the truth about herself and not deny it out of pride.

Sarah wrote: "A question I had during the story was why is being divergent such a huge deal? If they don't respond to the serum then why not just let them into the inside and have them be part the guarding, mana..."

I think they kill the divergent because being divergent is a dangerous thing. When one is divergent, it means that they cannot be influenced under the serum which means that if there are enough of them, they could potentially overthrow the government, and the government wouldn't be able to stop them using the simulations because they are immune to them.

Sam wrote: "Kenzie wrote: "One thing that stands out to me in this book is the strong focus in on one faction (Dauntless). Why do you think Roth made Tris choose Dauntless and focused in on it instead of any o..."

I agree with Kenzie. The Dauntless are described as the "Brave" ones. but their definition of being bravery is a whole other thing entirely. They describe bravery as being able to be physically strong and being powerful over the weak. It is about being cruel and not having any fears. But what Tris learns in Dauntless, is that the true definition of being brave is being selfless, and kind and to stand up for those that can't stand up for themselves. It's having fears, but being able to overcome them. It's being able to rise up even when they're scared. That's what Tobias fought for all along, which is probably the reason Tris is so drawn to him; because he is the definition of bravery and truth.

Kenzie wrote: "A huge part of Tris's life and growth in this book is about the transformation and combining (in her case) the qualities of dauntless and abnegation. How did you feel about the correlation between ..."

I think bravery works closely with selflessness. Most of the time standing up for those who cannot stand up for themselves is the hardest and most impressive kind of bravery. Tris and Four prove there bravery and selflessness when they stand up for abgination, who do not have the skill set to fight an army such as dauntless so they prove to be the most impressive kind of people ever.

One thing that stood out to me was the death of Tris' parents. She is merely a teenage and witnessed both of her die right before her eyes. That is something I don't know if I would be able to overcome yet I think she continued on her mission because she knew their deaths we're for the greater good. Tris refused to allow their deaths to be for nothing and that is very powerful. They were almost sacrificial deaths and that made me think about sacrifices in the recent Batman movies we watched and the first thing I thought of was Alfred. I thought about how Alfred sacrificed his relationship with Bruce Wayne for the greater good. It was in Bruce's best interest and he finally realized that and ended up saving his own life. Although minimal time has passed since her parents death, I want to read the second book and see how their deaths impact her and play a role in her decisions and thoughts. I'm interested to see if she will continue to be able to get over them.