Laurie R. King Virtual Book Club discussion

What would you do if you were told that civilization as we know it was going to end in precisely one year? Sink into a pit of depression? Go "bucket list" and leave your current life behind to do those things you always wished to do?

This is the world we find ourselves in in our discussion book this month, The Last Policeman by Ben H. Winters. Astronomers have announced that a giant asteroid will be striking Earth in nine months and the world is going rather crazy in response. With people dropping their daily lives to either fall into an early oblivion or fly off to wherever to study art like they've been dreaming. Our protagonist, Detective Henry Palace, suddenly finds himself in his dream job...except it's not turning out the be what he dreamed, given the current social climate.

The plot is your basic kind of murder mystery, but the context of this story is wide open for much broader discussion!

So to get us started: what would you do if the world was going to end in less than a year? Keep to your current routine? Go "bucket list" and do things you've always wanted/been meaning to do? Or something else?

Loved the novel! I am happy to see the discussion - although there were times I wanted to strangle the main character. I am currently reading Countdown City.

Erin wrote: "What would you do if you were told that civilization as we know it was going to end in precisely one year? Sink into a pit of depression? Go "bucket list" and leave your current life behind to do t..."

I am afraid that I would turn totally inward, paralyzed and despondent. I can visualize my psyche becoming stuck in a feedback loop of wondering why this was happening during my lifetime. On the other hand, however, it could be possible that I would surprise myself with an unexpected fortitude.
I have to admit that I was quite impressed with our protagonist's resolve in carrying on with his chosen life's work regardless of the future. I imagine one would have to be hardwired in a special way to carry on as he did. A very interesting premise for an old science fiction trope.

People who liked this book -- myself, I really did -- would probably also enjoy Lucifer's Hammer, which has a little pre-strike but mostly explores post-strike. It poses a slightly different question: If you've survived the strike, what do you do now? How do you rebuild a society?

It's too early for spoilers, but once we're far enough along that no one is likely to be spoiled, will someone please explain to me what Nico actually did and why? I found the last scene in the book totally confusing. (And that didn't ruin the book for me at all, given that Nico isn't the focus of the book, just left me wanting a little explanation of Nico's behavior.)

John wrote: "Erin wrote: "I imagine one would have to be hardwired in a special way to carry on as he did. "

I think the MEs response just captures it so perfectly. Palace asks her why she didn't quit her job and go off to do something she loves, and she looks at him and says, "but this is what I love."

Lenore - Re Lucifer's Hammer, I loved it right up to the end. The ending seemed unfinished - like a cliff hanger. I probably need to re read it.

I remember reading "Lucifer's Hammer" many years ago, so long ago that I can't remember anything about it except that I liked it. "The Last Policeman" has been sitting on my Kindle forever, perhaps this discussion will finally motivate me to read it!
As for what I'd do if the world were going to end in nine months, I like to think I'd get working on my bucket list, but I probably wouldn't want to leave my cats that long!

I think I'd find out what my husband and children wanted to do, and if possible, just do stuff with them until the end. My own bucket list involves some places to see, but I'm not so pressed to see them that, if the choice were that vs. a bunch of good dinners with my family, I'd pass up time with my family. Also, if I figured out what might constitute a survival strategy, I would work on putting that into place with the family.

I think I'd probably spend the time doing stuff with my favorite people; friends and family equally. Outdoorsy stuff; enjoy a sunrise and hiking in the woods, etc. I'm lucky enough to have done a fair amount of travel already, and the thing that I enjoyed the most was the activities rather than the locations, for the most part.

Lenore wrote: "if I figured out what might constitute a survival strategy, I would work on putting that into place with the family. "

You totally touched on the thing that I was having a hard time suspending my disbelief with, Lenore! The fact that astronomers made this announcement and everyone just accepted the end of the world and reacted to a no-hope scenario. I kept wondering how no one was out trying to figure a way to either stop the asteroid (a la Bruce Willis in "Armageddon"), or devise a fall-out shelter kind of plan.

Though, I suppose your average Joe would probably not be in a position to try to stop an asteroid.

Erin wrote: "Lenore wrote: "if I figured out what might constitute a survival strategy, I would work on putting that into place with the family. "

You totally touched on the thing that I was having a hard time..."

Well, I think they explained the techological non-feasibility of stopping the asteroid in the scene (and I was really able to visualize this) where Scott Pelley asks the scientist, "So what are our options?" and the scientist has a breakdown.

That said, there exists science on what effects an asteroid strike would have, and it would not instantly obliterate the earth. There would be effects on sea levels, the dust would affect weather patterns for years to come, and it might trigger earthquakes; but once one knew where the strike would occur, the places least affected could be calculated, and preparations could be made for preserving power sources, growing food with artificial light, etc. From which, alas, not everyone could benefit, but some could.

Of course, something we really don't know about from the book was whether the U.S. and/or other governments were working on such plans, even if the individuals in Concord weren't.

Lenore wrote: "Erin wrote: "Lenore wrote: "if I figured out what might constitute a survival strategy, I would work on putting that into place with the family. "

You totally touched on the thing that I was havin..."

I guess it didn't work out so well for the dinosaurs, but I gather even that didn't happen overnight!

Lenore wrote: "Of course, something we really don't know about from the book was whether the U.S. and/or other governments were working on such plans, even if the individuals in Concord weren't. "

Right, exactly. We have a very limited view of what's going on globally. And Palace is oddly disinterested in any and all news. I can't get a handle on him; has he always been this disinterested in current events, or is no seeking out information his way of coping?

I'm pretty bad about staying up on current events generally speaking, but I'd like to think I'd be paying attention to at least some of what's happening.

So what happens if EVERYONE goes "bucket list" and NO ONE is around to run the art seminars and fly the airplanes to exotic destinations etc? The premise presupposes that some people will remain in their boring jobs so that others can enjoy their last moments...

MaryL wrote: "So what happens if EVERYONE goes "bucket list" and NO ONE is around to run the art seminars and fly the airplanes to exotic destinations etc? The premise presupposes that some people will remain in..."

Mary, we'll just have to count on the workaholics and the folks who can't imagine any life outside work. Poor things.

I am enjoying this and think things would be much like the author describes, many people would be glued to tv and computer screen as long as they lasted, others would be running about doing whatever they wanted and a few would just stumble along doing what ever they usually did. I think I would be a mix of these though I might get fixated on the news unfortunately.

MaryL wrote: "The premise presupposes that some people will remain in their boring jobs so that others can enjoy their last moments... "

Or at least presupposes that some people don't find their "boring" jobs boring (like Palace and the ME). Or don't have the money to talk the pilots into continuing the fly.

I haven't started this yet, but planning on it this week.

Hmm, what would I do if the world was going to end in a year? I imagine it would be complete chaos. So survival would probably be an issue, and trying not to die in some horrible way as opposed to a nice quick meteor smacking the earth. I'd probably go to a cabin somewhere with my family and enjoy nature. If that wasn't possible, I'd just be eager to get it over with. I hate waiting for bad things to happen.

I once had one of these what-if-the-world-were-ending conversations with someone -- I wish I could remember who -- and she said she'd rush to Cinnabon because she would no longer be worrying about the calories!

Lenore wrote: "I once had one of these what-if-the-world-were-ending conversations with someone -- I wish I could remember who -- and she said she'd rush to Cinnabon because she would no longer be worrying about ..."

Oh, good strategy, Lenore! I could embrace that!

Love the layering of a mystery over the sci-fi premise. I would like to think I was one of those like Palace, who kept on.

So I'm like two-thirds of the way through the book and had this realization this morning on the bus that I don't actually remember anyone taking finger prints on the "murder weapon" (belt). Would that have been like the first thing they should have done at a potential crime scene? Especially if the lead investigator was insisting on murder instead of suicide?

Because presumably, if it were a suicide, then the victims fingerprints should be in the belt, right? Since he wasn't wearing gloves. And a leather belt should pick up prints pretty well. If the belt had no prints or someone else's prints, they'd know pretty quick that the apparent suicide didn't actually kill himself?

Erin wrote: "So I'm like two-thirds of the way through the book and had this realization this morning on the bus that I don't actually remember anyone taking finger prints on the "murder weapon" (belt). Would t..."

Damn! You're right about that! For all the mysteries I read, why didn't I pick up on that? (And of course, why didn't the detectives?)

I'm ashamed to admit I didn't pick it up either.
I am looking forward to the discussion about Nico. I feel I've missed something.

Eleanor wrote: "I'm ashamed to admit I didn't pick it up either.
I am looking forward to the discussion about Nico. I feel I've missed something."

OK, Moderators: Is it too early to discuss Nico, or do we risk spoiling people? Because I, for one, am really confused about Nico.

Lenore wrote: "Eleanor wrote: "I'm ashamed to admit I didn't pick it up either.
I am looking forward to the discussion about Nico. I feel I've missed something."

OK, Moderators: Is it too early to discuss Nico,..."

Lenore, Erin is the official moderator for this discussion, so she has to rule, I guess, but I'd think it might be okay so long as you put a big Spoiler Warning at the beginning of your post, for those who haven't finished the book yet...

Haven't finished it yet. Please wait for the spoilers.

Please go ahead and discuss any facet of the book as you wish; anyone who is currently reading may just want to avoid the discussion until they have finished the book.

I have wondered exactly what I would do if I found out that I lived in the projected impact zone; do I stay or do I go? Would you try to get as far away from the impact, or roll the dice and hope that the impact could actually be just about anywhere else, or just give in to the "inevitable"?

Lenore wrote: "Eleanor wrote: "I'm ashamed to admit I didn't pick it up either.
I am looking forward to the discussion about Nico. I feel I've missed something."

OK, Moderators: Is it too early to discuss Nico,..."

Lenore, have consulted several folks and it's okay to discuss Spoilers now, we're far enough along in the month. So, do please through out what's bothering you about Nico. Speaking of soldiering on in the face of oblivion, has anyone here read "On the Beach" (which was made into a fine if depressing film with Gregory Peck and a host of other Big Name stars)? It's a great picture of the many and varied human reactions to impending disaster, from complete hedonism to adherence to Doing One's Duty.
And mentioning disaster and the human spirit, let us all pause here a moment to send our thoughts and prayers to the people of Paris. Like New York and London, Paris is a city that Belongs to Us All, and we're all grieving.

There was a story about a beloved saintly monastic who was visited in his little garden plot by seekers who asked, "What would you do if you knew the world was going to end tonight?"
His peaceful reply was, "I would finish hoeing my garden".

Margaret wrote: "There was a story about a beloved saintly monastic who was visited in his little garden plot by seekers who asked, "What would you do if you knew the world was going to end tonight?"
His peaceful r..."

Margaret, sort of reminiscent of Voltaire's "Cultivate your own garden," isn't it? That's a great story.

OK, here is my questions: What IS Nico up to? I re-read the conversation with her brother at the end of the book, and I am still just as confused as ever. It is clear to me that Nico believes the government is doing something, but (according to Henry) is too smart to believe that the government has bases on the dark side of the moon. It is also clear that she married her husband so she could use him -- get him to investigate dangerous places to see if there's really anything there.

But I do not understand if -- or why -- they tried to break Derek out of jail and what exactly happened there -- remember, the weird phone call to Henry with a lot of noise in the background? And I don't understand what Nico did. And most of all, I don't understand what she thinks she is going to accomplish once she learns what the government is allegedly doing -- is she going to demand to be taken in? And why would that work? Or is she going to destroy whatever the government is doing? What is her motivation?

Now I'm going to have to add On the Beach to my ever-growing TBR list.

Lenore wrote: "OK, here is my questions: What IS Nico up to? I re-read the conversation with her brother at the end of the book, and I am still just as confused as ever. It is clear to me that Nico believes the g..."

I wonder if Derek has actually been taken to the secret location where the government is, and is still collecting information in some way. And perhaps Nico's intention is simply to "blow the whistle" on what the government is up to? This begins to sound as if one will have to read the next two volumes in the trilogy in order to find out!
"On the Beach" was a big bestseller in its day and really reflects the Cold War paranoia and tension of the time. Having lived in Florida at the time of the Cuban Missile Crisis, I can truly testify to having believed that one was going to die in a nuclear attack, and soon!

Hmmm... I assumed Nico's motivation was just a fear of being alone at the end, as she tells Henry when she calls him to help her find Derek in the beginning. Not the most rational reasoning, but she did not strike me as a particularly rational person.

Erin wrote: "Hmmm... I assumed Nico's motivation was just a fear of being alone at the end, as she tells Henry when she calls him to help her find Derek in the beginning. Not the most rational reasoning, but sh..."

Erin, I gather from "reading ahead" a bit on Amazon (don't worry, no spoiles) that in the next two books we find out there is more than to Nico than we think ...

Merrily wrote: "I wonder if Derek has actually been taken to the secret location where the government is, and is still collecting information in some way. And perhaps Nico's intention is simply to "blow the whistle" on what the government is up to? ..."

Erin wrote: "Hmmm... I assumed Nico's motivation was just a fear of being alone at the end, as she tells Henry when she calls him to help her find Derek in the beginning. Not the most rational reasoning, but sh..."

No, I think Nico pretty clearly tells Henry at the end that she married him to use him, and that she did just that in whatever her plan is/was. And I don't think there's any evidence that he's smart enough to be doing any information collection. And Nico tells Henry at the end that she won't leave him (Henry) behind, which I interpret means more than blowing the whistle on whatever the government is doing.

Lenore wrote: "Merrily wrote: "I wonder if Derek has actually been taken to the secret location where the government is, and is still collecting information in some way. And perhaps Nico's intention is simply to ..."

Lenore, you got me, but since the author had planned a trilogy from the beginning, I suspect that this is one of these situations where his plan is to work out Nico's story in the next books.

Merrily, I think you must be right.

John wrote: "Please go ahead and discuss any facet of the book as you wish; anyone who is currently reading may just want to avoid the discussion until they have finished the book."

Finally finished it. Was pleasantly surprised to find I liked it.

Merrily wrote: "Erin wrote: "Hmmm... I assumed Nico's motivation was just a fear of being alone at the end, as she tells Henry when she calls him to help her find Derek in the beginning. Not the most rational reas..."

Now I'm tempted to read the last two in the trilogy.

Antoinette wrote: "Merrily wrote: "Erin wrote: "Hmmm... I assumed Nico's motivation was just a fear of being alone at the end, as she tells Henry when she calls him to help her find Derek in the beginning. Not the mo..."

Good, I'm sure that's what the author had in mine, Antoinette!

For some reason I was thinking of this book and Henry Palace last night, specifically Henry's determination to investigate the case even though everything seemed to indicate suicide. We've already discussed the question of what would make someone decide to keep "doing his job" even when it seemed the world was ending, but this led me to another question - what do you think motivates people who become detectives, that is, dedicated detectives? Is it truly a desire to seek justice, or is it simply a compulsion to solve the puzzle? Is Henry the sort of guy who can't quit, because detecting is his "drug" (one thinks of a certain Sherlock Holmes...)?

Henry's motivations were unclear to me at the end of the Last Policeman. Initially, he seemed admirable - great work ethic. By the end, he seemed pretty OCD - but kind of amusing too. One thing that I like about the sequel is Henry's motivations are clarified.

Kay

Kay wrote: "Henry's motivations were unclear to me at the end of the Last Policeman. Initially, he seemed admirable - great work ethic. By the end, he seemed pretty OCD - but kind of amusing too. One thing tha..."

Kay, detective work may be one of those fields where being a little bit OCD is actually useful. Certainly it requires an attention to detail and an ability to notice small things, that many of us lack! Glad to hear that the sequel clarifies some of Henry's choices...

Remember that Henry had always wanted to be a policeman. It was even a recurring dream. Remember that, as a child, his mother had been murdered and Detective Culverson helped him to understand what happened by going through the investigative file with him.

I imagine that what motivates people to become detectives in general is as varied as what motivates people to join any profession. For some, it may be a desire for justice or a desire to solve puzzles. For others, it may be the desire to restore "order"; they became policemen to maintain order and detective is the next progression up the ladder, restoring order when it's been disturbed. For some it may be just a socially sanctioned way of being nosy -- they're just curious about human nature. Compare a detective like Holmes with a detective like Sue Grafton's Kinsey Milhone.

Going back to Henry (you can see by the length of this post that I'm procrastinating on a boring task), I'd say it's really the need for order. Culverson helped him restore a sense of order to his world when he was a child, and now that everything is devolving into chaos, the need for order was never more intense.

Parenthetically, I disagree that detecting is a drug for Holmes. I think he has a passion for justice, and he turns to drugs to dull the frustration when he has no outlet for his passion.

Lenore wrote: "I'd say it's really the need for order. Culverson helped him restore a sense of order to his world when he was a child, and now that everything is devolving into chaos, the need for order was never more intense."

Totally agree. I got the sense that he was happy to have a case to solve; something to focus on. It actually struck me as interesting that he kept using his murder case as an excuse for not dealing with his sister, for not getting sucked into the obsession with the asteroid, etc, etc.

What did everyone think of Henry's not-so-appropriate relationship with Naomi? I'm pretty sure detectives aren't supposed to hook-up with the people they're interviewing for information about a crime. But that whole interaction struck me as a classic noir trope.

Lenore wrote: "Remember that Henry had always wanted to be a policeman. It was even a recurring dream. Remember that, as a child, his mother had been murdered and Detective Culverson helped him to understand what..."

All good points, Lenore. And I agree that Holmes has a passion for justice, but I still think that detecting/solving puzzles/using his brain is a major stimulant for him. Recall his famous speech about his brain stagnating without a puzzle to solve! I do agree that he turned to cocaine only when he was bored, however - I never have thought he was an addict in the real sense of the word, but now I'm getting off topic.
And Erin, indeed having an affair with one's client or a witness is a classic noir trope (and one that's still very much around!).

A classic noir trope, but somehow more understandable and forgivable in the context of the end of the world.