Poldark Saga - Winston Graham discussion

There was so much foreshadowing of Stephen Carrington's death that I expected him to die long before this. Or perhaps that was the point--he was like a cat with 9 lives-always one to somehow manage to escape death or serious trouble. He's found afloat and nearly dead by Jeremy and his friends, wiggles out of a battle with a naval press gang, gets away with robbery, nearly dies of typhus and then pneumonia, survives a battle at sea while privateering, and would have been shot in the face (and presumably killed) if not for damp conditions. I wanted to yell "just die already!" Then of course I felt badly because I knew that would make Clowance sad. Had there not been a much bigger tragedy in the same book, I might have been a bit more moved by Stephen's circumstances, but I wonder if I'm alone in being more concerned about what happened to the horse than whether Stephen would recover from his injuries.

I can't remember; was the horse's fate revealed, poor creature? I definitely cared more about the horse than I did about Stephen; but then, I never liked Stephen. I didn't like how he treated Clowance; and I found him a liar and an opportunist.

Pat wrote: "I can't remember; was the horse's fate revealed, poor creature? I definitely cared more about the horse than I did about Stephen; "

I kept asking that question too...what about the horse???? I don't think it was ever said and we should probably assume that it was put down if it initially survived.

Stephen rubbed me the wrong way from the very first sentence. I re-read the stranger from the sea and I still for the life of me can't figure out how or why Clowance fell in love with him. As I progressed to the next, nope nadda still couldn't understand. Same way I couldn't understand how he kept dodging bullets. Perhaps at an attempt to create suspense?

Sex appeal? Chemistry?

I found nothing sexually appeal in his character esp where he begged/bargained with Clowance to sleep with him or he would go elsewhere... Found him on the nose and kept getting smellier as time went on

I suspect part of Clowance's attraction to Stephan is his mystery. He's an older man, a stranger with an unknown past. He's led an exciting life while Clowance had been sheltered in Cornwall.

I'm reading the last book now, but are there any consequences for their marriage not being real because he was already married? Thank goodness she didn't have a child. I guess she couldn't reveal the truth to others because it would be humiliating, but I was so mad for her having to continue to use his name. But then again, like you all, I never liked Stephen.

I'm glad other readers hated him too. Lying right off the bat was wrong and if he had come clean he might have scored more points. I hated how he kept taking advantage of Clowance's body and pressuring her to have sex with him when she clearly stated her parents taught her to wait for marriage. He then proceeds to misjudge and hate her parents, trying to tear her away from her family. I, too, kept hoping he would die.

It didn't say what happened to the horse but I assume the horse was shot.

The arrival of Jason really sealed the deal with Stephen for me. Wow! What a jerk Stephen was.

I expected (view spoiler)[ Clowance to be more strong and carry on independently. I thought she should inherit Nampara. She knows the land, the people, the mines and cares. She helps Demelza care for Jud and Prudie! I didn't expect her to be so heartbroken and cynical, let alone marry again. (hide spoiler)]

I hated Stephen too. What he does to Clowance is nothing less than psychological abuse.

I believe it's several years after Stephen's death before she remarries. I'm not surprised that she's cynical. What Stephen pulled was the ultimate betrayal.

I don't think Stephen thought about anything he did. His thoughts reveal that he lives in the moment and always expects everything to work out. He wanted Clowance and nothing would stop him from achieving his goal. He probably wouldn't have married her if she had given in to desire. I'm glad she didn't but he destroyed her personality. I missed the barefoot girl, the rider, the friend to the miners. She was at her best when she went down the mine with Ben. Then Stephen ruined everything.

I liked Stephen best when he visited Violet's sickbed. They had such a nice relationship but I don't think he desired her as a woman. She was there and eager to make out with him in the church and he would have been willing to go farther because he's a horndog but he never would have married her.

I wondered whether I was reading Stephen through too modern a lens but since Ross and Demelza didn't like him much, I accepted that he was just not a likable person.

I agree that Stephen didn't think about anything he did. I didn't like his character at all but I kept on reading the books because the rest of the storytelling was so good!!!

Ross and Demelza could have prevented Clowance from marrying Stephen. All they had to do was delve a bit deeper into Stephen’s past. Ross had connections as an MP and should have made enquires in Bristol, just as George started doing later on in the story.
An older Clowance would probably not have fallen in love with Stephen, but he took advantage of her youthful vulnerability and she ended up paying dearly for her devotion to him.
For me Stephen has no redeeming features and is in my top three of Poldark villains throughout all the books.

Ross trusted his daughter to know her heart and wanted her to be happy. He didn't make inquiries because he didn't want to. The other alternative would be to have Clowance run away with Stephen and become estranged from her family. Sometimes you have to let adults make their own choices even if those choices are the wrong ones.

QNPoohBear wrote: "I'm glad other readers hated him too. Lying right off the bat was wrong and if he had come clean he might have scored more points. I hated how he kept taking advantage of Clowance's body and pressu..."

I hated the way the sexually experienced and much older Stephen seduced the 16-year-old Clowance, especially since he was indebted to Ross and Demelza for taking him in when he was shipwrecked. If Ross had known what Stephen was doing with Clowance, I think Ross would have killed Stephen or at least run him out of town.

Late to the party, but add me to the list of anti-Stephen people. I started out being as frustrated as everyone else re: the way Stephen was able to take in Jeremy and Clowance, and then realized -- Stephen is a sociopath. Contrary to popular belief, they're not killers, by and large, just completely and totally without any sort of care or concern for anyone but themselves and whatever amuses them at the moment. (If anyone's interested, I'd highly recommend Dr. Stout's The Sociopath Next Door.)

It's no wonder that Stephen was able to fool them so well; they're notoriously charming and neither of them were/are used to people who are that completely and totally amoral. That goes for a lot of people even *today*. Still, once I spotted him for what he was, I rolled my eyes every time he did it -- for example, generously offering to 'work' at the mine and pretending he didn't want to be paid, knowing all along that Jeremy would offer to pay him for piecemeal work, whereas he probably wouldn't have if Stephen had started out with, 'Hey, I'd like to work whenever I feel like it and get paid, how's that?'

Still, I really wish Ross had caught onto him and cut his lights and livers out and left him for the vultures, 'cause you know he would.