UB Libraries Book Group discussion

We will start our discussion of the Orphan Train on Monday, February 22nd. Happy reading!

What did you think of Orphan Train? I liked it, since it had a couple things that I always like: historical fiction and a story told through different voices (added to by the different time periods).

Did you know anything about this historical event of the orphan trains? I had no clue about them. It was an innovative idea. But I think the hard times during which it was implemented almost made it impossible to result in more happy than sad stories.

I haven't finished this book yet but am enjoying it very much. I like the contrast and similarities between the young girl and the old lady. I had not head of orphan trains, but they must have been heartbreaking for the children involved. I will try to finish it tonight!

I had never heard of these orphan trains and found this story very interesting but definitely filled with sad stories as Ellen said. Seemed like these poor children moved from one tragedy to the next. Vivian somehow was strong enough to endure it all but I think it permanently scarred her; she seemed to have made just a few deep connections with people throughout her long life.

I felt more connected to Vivian's story, maybe because it felt more fleshed out. Molly's story was certainly sad but some of it seemed a little too cliche or something. Her foster mother was certainly a composite of stereotypes.

When Niamh/Dorothy/Vivian went to that family in the woods, I couldn't help but think, OMG, how many horrific things can happen to this one girl? But I think given the hard times, it was probably totally possible to go from one bad experience to a worse one, as an orphan during the depression. I think her scarring is what allowed her to survive.

I was amazed that the supposedly good intentions of the orphan train resulted in a sort of auction, where the children were inspected for their physical attributes. And the thing with just changing their names was so shocking to me. These kids had literally nothing of their own, not even their names. I can't imagine it. And the fact that the kids that weren't chosen, got back on the train and went through it all again in the next town -- so sad!

I really liked this book, too. It makes me want to read more about the orphan trains. I knew early on that there was going to be a connection between Vivian and Molly, and I was hoping it wasn't going to turn into a cheesy story, and it didn't! I liked the significance of the boxes in the attic and not being able to throw things away. I also liked the relationship that develops between Molly and Vivian.

I also really liked the book. Although I had heard of the orphan train before (probably through another book) I really don't know a lot about it. I liked the parallels in the story between the two women's lives. I agree with Kath that Vivian's story was more compelling because of all she went through. Once her life is finally going right Dutchy dies and she feels she has to give up the baby. It's just one tragedy after another. Molly's story may be cliched but I loved the way Vivian related to her and how they finally formed a friendship. Stories like this always makes me think how history repeats itself and people never learn. In Vivian's time people took on orphans for what they could get out of it and in Molly's time they do it for the money. It's a great feeling that no matter what time period you live in there are some good people who just want to help

I did like the relationship between Molly and Vivian -- similar to Vivian and Dutchy, it seemed they related to each other as outsiders who understood bad situations that most people have never had to deal with.

Ellen, I found those auction type scenes difficult to read about -- seemed like animal auctions, or worse, slave auctions. And these kids were so young! I can't imagine dealing with that.

I was poking around the web on this topic and found a couple of interesting links if you are interested:
Natl Orphan Train Complex: http://orphantraindepot.org/orphan-tr...
CBS News photo stream: http://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/the-o...

Thank you for those links, Kathy! My book had a short history at the back with some of the same and some different photos of the orphan train. It says that many of the 200,000 orphans were first-generation Irish Catholic immigrants, like Niamh. I guess they were one of the groups highly discriminated against during those years, so they endured some of the hardest times.

Here's a question from the back of the book: In the prologue, Vivian mentions that her "true love" died when she was twenty-three, but she doesn't mention the other big secret in the book. Why not?

My knee jerk reaction would be to say regret. However, I wonder if it was more of just how she was able to survive terrible events. Once she has lived through these events (deaths, abuse, cold/hunger etc) she just has to put it behind her to survive and move forward. With all she lived through though, her decision to part with her child made the least sense to me; she had strength to get through so much bad stuff but maybe that was the final straw that broke her. I don't know, what do others think?

As you point out, Kathy, the more interesting question is why did Vivian give her baby up? Maybe she was afraid to love, since whenever she had in the past, she also lost the person/people she loved.

Perhaps she didn't share the secret of her baby because she felt guilty about potentially subjecting her baby to the same harsh life she had endured.

Here are a couple more questions:

Why does Vivian seem unable to get rid of the boxes in her attic?

What does Vivian mean when she says "I believe in ghosts"?

I like this quote from Kathleen Kent from the back of the book:

"... a poignant and memorable story of two steadfast, courageous women. It is a revelation of the universal yearning for belonging, for family, for acceptance, and, ultimately, the journeys we must all make to find them."

Any other thoughts on Orphan Train?

The ghosts line stuck with me; I found the quote from the book online: "I believe in ghosts. They're the ones who haunt us, the ones who have left us behind." She has been "left behind" so much by the people she loved; ghosts are the way she keeps those people with her.

This other quote I really liked, in a similar vein is: "I've come to think that's what heaven is- a place in the memory of others where our best selves live on.”

I imagine the boxes were her physical ghosts; memories of the good (and lots of bad) that happened in her life. She's lost the people and this is all that remains.

This book was interesting since I knew very little about the topic I enjoyed Vivian's story the most though I didn't understand her decision to not keep her baby. It certainly did not have a positive view of the foster care system

Thanks to Ellen for leading our discussion this month!

Next up in March: Marlies will lead our conversation on Secret Daughter by Shilpi Somaya Gowda.
Happy Leap Day!

I know that I'm 2 weeks late but I just finished this book and found it very moving. I was afraid to follow these messages because I didn't want any spoilers. When I read that Vivian had a baby that was given up for adoption, I thought that the baby might have been some relation to Molly. I wished that they had gone into more depth about why Vivian gave up the baby because the author glossed over that in a couple of paragraphs. At times I thought the writing was simplistic, but it must have been powerful in its own way because I felt so attached to both Molly and Vivian. All in all, a great read!