The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion

We finally come to the "mystery" in The Mystery of Edwin Drood.

Where has Edwin gone? Is he dead? If so, was he murdered? If he was murdered, who murdered him? Was it Neville? Was it Jasper? Another person hitherto unmentioned?

Let the speculations begin...

For the record, I was thinking that Jasper was going to do away with Edwin because he was in love with Rosa and wanted her for himself, and was going to blame it all on Neville. But, he seems genuinely upset, and now looking for revenge on Neville, hanging around in the house opposite Mr. Grewgious. But that could be Dickens trying to throw us off. Jasper was hanging out in the crypt - which made for a creepy part of our chapters - and he was also upset when he found out that Rosa and Edwin broke it off. And I don't think that Neville did it.

Also:

One, were you surprised that Rosa took the lead in breaking it off with Edwin?

Two, I just love Mr. Crisparkle even more now. The way he believes in Neville, and stood up for him with that idiot Mr. Honeythunder.

Three, speaking of Mr. Honeythunder, Dickens obviously doesn't like philanthropists (who I have always thought of as good types of people - must have been different in Dickens' time).

Four, I feel sorry for Neville, imprisoned in his tower, unable to go out during the day. Will he be vindicated?

Five, Mr. Grewgious doesn't seem to trust Jasper, particularly Jasper's response to the news about Edwin's and Rosa's breakup.

Lastly, I'm curious as to the person who came in and out the window and talked to Neville. Who is he? Will he be important to the story?

Re: philanthropists in Dickens.
Mr. Pecksmith in Martin Chuzzlewit is one, and is portrayed as the most hypocritical character in the book. Also exremely well nourished.
I think Dickens distinguishes between those who do good and help others in a quiet way,and those blowhard philanthropists like Mr. Honeythunder.

There was another philanthropist in Bleak House. I'm sorry, I've forgotten the characters' names, but Esther had a friend who came from a large family, and the mother of the family was a philanthropist, and portrayed very negatively - of course, Dickens had his own ideas about women and portrayed her as neglectful of her family. I laughed out loud on the bus the first time I read the name "Honeythunder," by the way!

I also saw some parallels between Mr. Sapsea and Mr. Podsnap! Both arrogant and disdainful of anything un-English.

Jasper is a very suspicious character. Remember how he reacted when Durdles told him about the cry he'd heard last Christmas Eve, and the dog who howled as if its owner had died? Did Jack kill someone? If so, who, and why? It couldn't have been someone local, or it would have been connected with the scream heard by Durdles (I forget who he told). I wonder if it's connected with the "needle in a haystack" the opium lady is looking for. Did someone she knew disappear in that area? If so, why? Jasper is also irrationally angry about Deputy having seen him with Durdles. He's hiding something, and I think a lot of us suspect what it is.

I think Deputy and Grewgious will be key in solving the mystery, although I'm sure the others will be involved as well, including Dick Datchery.

Something happened two Christmas Eves in a row. I think the mystery will be finally solved next Christmas Eve.

After reading Our Mutual Friend, I doubt Edwin is actually dead, though Jasper seems to think he finished him off.

It's possible that Jasper's concern for his missing nephew is as false as we suspect his affection may have been. That he's simply crying up feeling against Neville. But I also suspect that the news of the breakup did actually take him by surprise.... Perhaps giving him reason to believe that he has acted against Edwin for no reason.

Mrs. Jellybee was the misguided philanthrope in Bleak House. I agree that Dickens categorizes genuine philanthropy differently from those who do damage by their deeds, however intended.

Crisparkle is quite a wonderful character. He and Grewgious give me reason to suspect that things would have come to light in the end

Renee wrote: "It's possible that Jasper's concern for his missing nephew is as false as we suspect his affection may have been. That he's simply crying up feeling against Neville. But I also suspect that the new..."

I think that Jasper is an unfortunate, adddicted man. Even though he may have killed Edwin, I consider him a tragic figure. I noticed that he is very manipulative and skillful in influencing others by his subtle insinuations. I think that Mr. Crisparkle and Mr. Grewgious will solve the mystery--and without a body we don't know if Edwin is really dead.

Mr. Grewgious is remarkably silent and thoughtful as Jasper recites his thought and suspicions about Neville and Edwin. It is remarkable that he did not search that section of the weir where the watch was found. This is truly a mystery. I am glad that Septimus still believes in Neville's innocence.
As for the question about Rosa, I think she realized how important marriage was and that she wasn't ready to marry anyone yet, because for all those years she thought she was going to marry Edwin. I think they both breathed a sigh of relief when they realized that they didn't have to get married-- that it was just a wish of their parents, not a command.

The encounter between Mr. Honeythunder and Septimus was entertaining. Honeythunder reminds me of some politicians. Unfortunately, I doubt whether Mr. H listened to anything Septimus said because it made sense.

I am glad that Neville is staying with Mr. Grewgious, and that his sister will be coming to London. The mysterious plant man is going to play some role in the book, if only to be a friend for Neville.

Rosemarie, I think you were right in your earlier conjectures. Jasper may have done something to Edwin under the influence of opium and really doesn't remember it, or maybe he did deliberately harm Edwin so that he could have Rosa. Maybe he's a good actor most of the time, seeming like he knows nothing about it. He reacts very dramatically when he finds out Rosa and Edwin had broken off the engagement.

If Edwin isn't dead, has he been shipped off somewhere? Or conveniently suffering from amnesia? Or set up his own disappearance for some reason? He doesn't seem like the devious type who would plot something like that. I wonder if we will find out the answer since the book is unfinished.

Dickens seems to be throwing all suspicion on Jasper, which tells me he didn't do it... though whether he remembers what actually transpired, who knows?

They've found Edwin's watch and the tie pin. Where is the ring? That should have some key role in the revelation.

Like Deputy, Durdles, too, should play a part in uncovering the truth. Something's going on in all those crypts, but I'm not sure just what it is yet. Jasper certainly seems interested, though. We can assume he drugged Durdles so that he'd sleep, took the key and ... what? Durdles seems to have been in that half hazy state, not knowing what was real and what he was dreaming. Will he remember something?

Tope seems to be a minor character, but I found his exchange with Crisparkle about making new arrangements for Neville quite interesting. He was able to turn it around to make it sound like Crisparkle's idea, when Crisparkle would have been happy to have Neville stay. Despite all that, it sounds like the new digs in London are less oppressive to him.

I quite liked the neighbor, Tartar, and hope he'll continue to be a benevolent character.

I tend to think that Edwin is still alive. I so wish Dickens had left an outline to help us put the pieces together!

I agree, Mary Lou. The ring was not found. Maybe Edwin decided to disappear for awhile. But we will never know, alas.

Mary Lou wrote: "Dickens seems to be throwing all suspicion on Jasper, which tells me he didn't do it... though whether he remembers what actually transpired, who knows?

They've found Edwin's watch and the tie pi..."

I was wondering about the key too. Did he make a copy? Was it possible to copy a key so quickly in those days? Would Jasper have known how to do it (otherwise who else could have done it in the middle of the night)?
He was pretty interested in that quicklime.

Lori, I noticed that about the crypt and the quicklime too. I also noticed that Rosa really does not like Jasper.

Rosemarie wrote: "Re: philanthropists in Dickens.
Mr. Pecksmith in Martin Chuzzlewit is one, and is portrayed as the most hypocritical character in the book. Also exremely well nourished.
I think Dickens distinguish..."

Yes, there were other philanthropists in Dickens, and they are not portrayed well in those novels as well. Also, activists for certain causes. Can't remember which book, but the female activist for various world causes was not depicted in a good light.

Rosemarie - I'm not sure I could argue that Jasper is a tragic figure. He'd have to have a backstory, something powerful that has made him such a creepy, suspicious character. And so far, there is no backstory that would make him tragic. He doesn't like his job. He likes Rosebud. That's about it so far.

Robin - I wonder as well whether or not we'll have an answer. No spoilers because I haven't gotten there yet, but since we do that there have been many speculations regarding the end of the book, it makes me think that there won't be an answer.

But given all the attention to the crypt in the book, I wonder if poor Edwin is in there. :-(

And yes, no ring. That's the first thing that I thought of. Of course, the only one other than Edwin who knows about the ring is Mr. Grewgious. So, if Edwin was murdered, the murderer wouldn't know about the ring.

Lynnm, good point about the ring.

Lynnm wrote: "Rosemarie - I'm not sure I could argue that Jasper is a tragic figure. He'd have to have a backstory, something powerful that has made him such a creepy, suspicious character. And so far, there is ..."

But then in Our Mutual Friend, we never really found out what made Bradley Headstone so evil. He apparently just had an evil streak, became obsessed with Lizzie (I won't say "loved;" what he felt was more selfish), and went completely bats.

There are some short books that used Dickens' notes and correspondence to reconstruct the end of the story - at least provide one or two hypotheses about how each character should have ended up, although of course most of the details are missing. I read one of these books awhile back after I read ED the first time. I can post some of these hypotheses in the final thread if you want.

That would be great, Lori.

What do you do with quicklime?

You dissolve bodies in mass graves(or individual graves also).

Well, that's creepifyingly ominous.

Renee wrote: "Well, that's creepifyingly ominous."

Indeed it is. :-)

Lori - that would be great! I figured that Dickens had to have some notes. Most writers sketch out the story before writing.