Catholic Thought discussion

I enjoyed this chapter. I think some of the comments that Nault made about acedia in the monastic and priestly life can also be applied to other vocations.

I agree that application can be made to other vocational states. But, I would have preferred if he had given more attention to the married and single life. I thought the section on the married life felt overly theoretical, almost sterile. I wanted a bit more passion in his writing. The section on the single life was nearly non-existent. For me, this was the chapter I liked the least.

Irene wrote: "I agree that application can be made to other vocational states. But, I would have preferred if he had given more attention to the married and single life. I thought the section on the married life..."

Irene, I'm with you there.

I think this is because acedia was first documented and reacted to within the monastic life. Nault is a monk himself, so he has much to say from that perspective. When we think about how different religious life is from everyone else's, it is only natural that over the millennia all sorts of coping mechanisms were developed, including battling acedia.

For married couples and singles we are not given detailed recorded observations on acedia beyond the basics. Maybe not much thought was given to it over the centuries. It is a bit of a let-down. I would have liked to see more as well.

Yes, I think that Nault's personal background influenced the direction and tone of this book. It appears that other monastics is his intended audience and that married and singles are an after thought.

I have just finished the book and have to say it started out very positive for me, but the further I read the less I liked it. Just when I thought I was beginning to grasp acedia and how it works in our lives, I felt the author lost his way (or lost me!) and that acedia can be just about anything! So how can I tell?

As a single, never married, no children person, I was/am pretty insulted by his narrow, demeaning view of single persons and our role in the Church. The idea that I am pining away or my life is less valued because I never married...infuriates me! I could cut him some slack for being a monk, but then he should have just left out the married/singles part...but he didn't...
While the author tries to veil these ideas with a little positive speak, he's not getting it past me!

Now...would you like to know how I really feel? ;)

Oh yeah...2 stars...mainly because he did cite some great sources and thinkers that warrant additional attention and learning about...

Susie wrote: "I have just finished the book and have to say it started out very positive for me, but the further I read the less I liked it. Just when I thought I was beginning to grasp acedia and how it works i..."

Susie,
you raise a good point. If he had left out the married/singles part the book would have been better.

Susie, I did feel frustrated by that part too, definitely a bit patronizing. And I agree with much of what everyone has said about this chapter.

Overall, I really liked the first two chapters but only portions of the other two. The first half of chapter 3 and the second half of chapter 4 felt very different, shallow and theoretical ... they lost the thoughtful depth of the first two chapters. The examples he uses show this difference right away. In the first two chapters, the examples are direct, touching, intimate, and everyday ... a mother lifting a baby she loves so that he can reach on object on a shelf. Later the examples turn theoretical & vague ... huge poorly defined social phenomena, like "nihilism."

I'd rate chapters 1 & 2 about 4 stars and chapters 3 & 4 on occasion 1 star, on occasion 2 stars, and on occasion 3 stars. It was really hard for me to figure out how to rate the book as a whole, but that's not the point really, the rating.

I got some good out of the book, definitely! Even in the fourth chapter, there were some insights that spoke to me. For example:

"God always asks of us something that we had not thought of, sometimes even apparently insignificant things of which we are quite incapable of letting go."

He was speaking of the monastic life, but that quote spoke to me and made me think of what I'm holding onto myself.

Regardless of the shortcomings, I'm still very glad I read the book. I've definitely struggled through periods of acedia and faint heartedness in my life, and this book gave me more clear-headedness about certain things. I think God led me to it. And now I can even recognize acedia in some of the books I've read recently that I've loved; I think I relate to that particular struggle strongly - for instance, the beautiful but disturbing literary science fiction book The Book of Strange New Things is basically all about a minister encountering acedia in his ministry, though I wouldn't have known how to describe it before.

Greg wrote: "Susie, I did feel frustrated by that part too, definitely a bit patronizing. And I agree with much of what everyone has said about this chapter.

Overall, I really liked the first two chapters but ..."

There were moments when I thought that for the monastic audience he was speaking of something they already knew, so the structure of the presentation didn't matter so much. For all of us new to the subject matter, all the differing manifestations of acedia are a little confusing and even overwhelming at times. One can get a little lost and not see the forest for the trees. A tighter structuring and reminders how all of this fits together would have helped immensely.

And just like you, I am glad I read it.

Kerstin wrote: " A tighter structuring and reminders how all of this fits together would have helped immensely...."

I can see that Kerstin!

I'm glad though that we were both able to get enough out of it to be glad to have read it. :)

I agree with what you are all saying. I think this began as a doctoral dissertation. The research was certainly in evidence. I loved the first half but thought the second half much weaker. He tried to make this accessible to a larger audience and was not able to pull it off. He should have kept it academic and it would have been a better book.

I came across some brilliant sections that spoke to me directly and clearly. One of my favorites is an original way of looking at God’s first commandment in Eden:

“’If you eat the fruit of that tree, you shall die’. (Gen 2:17) This is not about a jealous God who fears that man might become his equal. On the contrary, it is about an excellent father who says: ‘My child, do not eat that, or it will harm you.’ The day will come when the child understands that the prohibition was established for his own good.” (p. 77)

This book required more time of me than allowed in the schedule. It does require a somewhat closer reading. I humbly propose that people who vote for our readings perhaps give some information on how much time we should devote to the reading to better grasp its meaning.

I came to this group seeking advice on good Catholic readings that would broaden and deepen my spiritual life. (I don’t know if this is the right way of phrasing it.) I am puzzled somewhat by the fact that very few people who voted for this reading participated in the discussion. In checking closer after the third chapter these non-participating voters did not even show that they read, were reading or were planning to read this poll winner. I am puzzled by such recommendations. Our moderator Susan Margaret does remind the voters “If the book that you vote is selected, I hope you will join in on the discussion.” I thank all the commentators—a larger group than those voting for the poll winner-for some excellent and insightful notes that helped me in better understanding this work.

Galicius wrote: "I came across some brilliant sections that spoke to me directly and clearly. One of my favorites is an original way of looking at God’s first commandment in Eden:

“’If you eat the fruit of that tr..."

Galicius, I set the reading schedule and I admit that the pace was a bit too fast for me also. I too am disappointed when members nominate and/or vote for the winning book and then choose not to participate. However I do understand that life situations sometimes get in the way of reading.

I think this is a problem in most every group. I don't know if people are more ambitious in expectation than in reality or if something else is going on. I was in another group that asked that question, why did a particular book get so many votes and nearly no participation in the discussion. The answer many gave was that they had no intention of reading any book, but that they figured the voting was open to anyone without further expectation.

Susan, I thought the reading schedule was very reasonable. We only had approximately 50 pages a week.

Irene wrote: "I think this is a problem in most every group. I don't know if people are more ambitious in expectation than in reality or if something else is going on. I was in another group that asked that ques..."

Thank you for your thoughts Irene and Susan Margaret. It doesn’t seem there is a way to address the “silent majority” on the polls issue so it's best not to be too concerned about it.