/r/Fantasy Discussion Group discussion

We're just under halfway through the month, so let's discuss the first half of the book! Share what you think of the characters, worldbuilding, and anything else that's going on. What's working, what's not working, what you hope will happen.

Feel free to discuss plot elements from the first half of the story (up to and including chapter 20), but please avoid any spoilers for the second half.

I found the first half of the book just wonderful as the second half, though the second half definitely speeds up the pace. I finished up the book this morning, and I absolutely loved it. I won't mention anything plot-related that I liked about the first half, though, because I don't want to accidently spoil anything.

I actually finished the book yesterday, loved it. I just looked up chapter 20 to avoid spoiling, and what a great halfway point, because this is where the book really shifts gears. The latter half is quite different from what has come before.

I really liked the character of Mykkael, especially in his interactions with the bigoted culture of Sessalie. Some nice comments on the nature of xenophobia and racism in here, even in subtle little details like the consistent mispronunciation of Myshkael. It doesn't fall into the trap of only having the "bad guys" be virulent racists either; we really see it as running through the whole society, and even otherwise well meaning and good people show prejudice against Mykkael. And for Mykkael's part, I at least felt we got a sense of the immigrant traveler, not quite belonging where he came from but certainly not belonging where he is. This loneliness on top of all the tragedy in his past- Wurts sure does love her tragic badasses ;)

I really enjoyed the mystery and intrigue of the first half. Almost felt like a noir thriller, with Mykkael playing the grizzled and bitter PI with his finger on the pulse that the authorities just won't give the time of day. Also noir-ish in that the setting of the city was the hub everything was turning on.

On the subject of prose, which saw quite a lot of discussion in the intro thread: how are people finding it now they are halfway through? Wurts' prose is often divisive- as a big fan of everything I've read of hers, I think it's sublime, but some people find it overly dense or complex. For me it reminds me a lot of Stephen Donaldson's prose, and it probably helps that I was a fan of his for years before picking up Wurts. They both employ a bit of psychodrama, taking pains to portray the conflicts going on in their characters' heads. They are both at times guilty of using a dozen words in a six word sentence, but it pays off in a wonderfully rich use of language that lends itself to imagery and metaphor.

Phew. Sorry for the wall. That's it from me, for now.

I'm really enjoying this book so far (I'm about 400 pages in). Wurts really nails the characters in my opinion. They are all interesting and the dialogue is dramatic without being melodramatic.

As for the prose I generally have a positive impression. It took around 30-40 pages to get used to but after that it's been relatively smooth sailing. I do feel that sometimes she can get a bit too wordy but that's a small nitpick really. Overall I think the writing is very compelling.

I'm loving this read so far and I can't wait to see where it goes.

I think so far my favorite character might be Taskin. It seems most people prefer Mykkael, and while I can understand why, I really enjoyed the no-nonsense competency Taskin displayed right from the start. He also strikes me as one of those "lawful good" characters, which I love because it can provide interesting internal conflict over what the correct course of action should be.

For instance, Taskin feels bound to obey the letter of the law, even if he knows that may not be a good path to follow. When do you all think the spirit of the law counts more than the letter of the law? Do you think Taskin had any other choice, at the crux at dawn on the tourney field?

I just passed the halfway mark as well, and I'm looking forward to seeing where the story goes from here. It feels like it's about to pick up in a pretty major way.

I'm about 47% done so it may be resolved in the next couple of percentages and then I'll feel silly, but what I want to know is, are the seneschal guy and the fiance prince Evil-with-a-capital-E or just obnoxious bureaucrats who unknowingly aid the bad guys by obstructing the heroes a la Cornelius Fudge?

I really like the character of Mykkael and feel bad for all the prejudice he has to endure in addition to his disability. The prejudiced nature of Sessalie's court seems a bit inconsistent, though. They're all "Nope, can't trust Mykkael, he's a foreigner! Never trust a foreigner!" yet they're perfectly willing to trust the foreign prince fiance and the foreign healer massage guy. I realize skin color may be a factor, but the massage dude is also pretty explicitly non-white and nobody seems to have a problem with him. It seems like maybe they're prejudiced against people from Mykkael's country specifically than xenophobic in general, but if that's the case, why? Guess I'll have to keep reading and find out :)

Margaret wrote: "It seems like maybe they're prejudiced against people from Mykkael's country specifically than xenophobic in general, but if that's the case, why?"

My understanding of this was the whole "desert bred" aspect to Mykkael's heritage. I don't think it's ever explicitly stated (at least not yet), but it seems like maybe the desert people of this world have stronger ties to magic and/or sorcery. It was mentioned that Mykkael is not really a part of this culture because we was left to die at an early age and raised by merchants instead. So it seems that the prejudice towards his skin color is more due to his association with these desert people and his widely-known fighting ability.

Jussoud, who is implied to be a non-white character, has the benefits of royalty, knowledge of healing, high education, and coming from a people with better foreign relations with Sessalie.

On the subject of foreigners and ethnicity: the English might diss the Americans, the Americans might diss the Spanish, but they all enslaved the Africans.

Currently at 56%.

I spent the first half of the book thinking of Mykkael as the loose cannon detective, who gets the job done by cutting corners and bucking authority. I kept expecting Taskin to yell at him that he was out of control, threaten to take his badge, and allow him to keep it on the condition that he takes on a by-the-books partner who's got three days until retirement.

Anyway.

I'm really liking the way we met Mykkael straight away, and we've been learning who he is by trickles, mostly from other people. It reminds me really strongly of *Master of Whitestorm*, one of Janny's other books. That one went from fairly straightforward sword-and-sorcery to really deep and startlingly moving in much the same way this one is going.

I've been enjoying the reveal of the mystery just as much. I'm really salivating to find out who's behind all this. Is the sorcerer someone we've met? I'm tending towards "no," but I'm really not certain.

Great book all around thus far.

Mike wrote: "Currently at 56%.

I spent the first half of the book thinking of Mykkael as the loose cannon detective, who gets the job done by cutting corners and bucking authority. I kept expecting Taskin to y..."

That's what I loved about this book too. Mykkael, is kinda like a bad@$$ version of the Dos Equis Most Interesting Man in the World.

I truly have a soft spot for Taskin. He's trying hard, but he's staying true to character, after all you can't simply turn a lifetime of beliefs and vows topsy-turvy in the twinkling of an eye.
That scene with him and Mykkael in the belfry gave me the goosebumps. I think both wanted to understand each other, but both were unable to yield their integrity, though Taskin relented. I liked that.

Wow this book just ramps up. I enjoy the tough decisions the main characters have to make; particularly when they have to decide which option is the least worst. I think that captures the situation really well. And interesting take on integrity - the spirit of the law versus the letter of the law. Does that make Mykkael unlawful good, neutral good or neutral neutral?

Hmm interesting question. I'd say if we consider the letter of the law, Mykkael would definitely be unlawful good. If we consider the spirit of the law, I'd say he's more "lawful" good, since he always adheres to his command to protect Anja and Sessalie.

Honestly, it's kind of hard to label Mykkael in one of these categories, which I think is largely because of the conflict between the letter and spirit of the law.

"How you hate to sully your immaculate resource with the wildcard tactic of chaos!"

Mykkael is truly a cipher (in Taskin's words), it's very intriguing to witness the culture clash considering they're all aiming at the same goal. I find myself thinking about the themes of racism and prejudice, sadly so contemporary...anyway amid the intrigue and the games afoot, I was really absorbed with Mykkael's tormented behaviour, his past is clearly playing a huge part in determining his actions, and I'm not only speaking about his skills.

"Does that make Mykkael unlawful good, neutral good or neutral neutral?"

if we want to fall back to some D&D alignments, i feel Mykkael is more chaotic good. he has his own strict moral code, and while he is an agent of the state expected to uphold the law, he certainly does not follow the rules placed before him.

Doing good, defeating the evil, saving the princess, is all more important than even the safety of his commander.

How is everyone pronouncing Mykkael's name? It kind of looks like it could be "Michael" but I pronounced it "Meh-KALE" in my head.

*grin* I probably pronounce it quite oddly, "meek-ka-el" (el like in "bell" and ka like "kaftan"), all hard sounds, despite the initial "meek". I don't know why, but I cannot associate him to the softer-sounding "Michael".

I wonder how "Myshkael" is supposed to sound, and Mykkael too.

"'Captain Myshkael?' His aristocratic lisp softened the name's uncivil consonants."

Alissa wrote: "*grin* I probably pronounce it quite oddly, "meek-ka-el" (el like in "bell" and ka like "kaftan"), all hard sounds, despite the initial "meek". I don't know why, but I cannot associate him to the s..."
That's more or less how I've been pronouncing it in my head, though I actually don't sound the first k. So it's just Mee-ka-el for me.

I've recently reached the 54% halfway point and despite the tough comprehension issues I had with the first couple of chapters, I'm really enjoying this. I think either the more convoluted introductory writing has eased down or I've gotten used to the author's writing. Either way, it's become much easier to read, which is also why I've been able to enjoy it a lot more.

Sure, I am mightily frustrated with some people's behaviours in this, including Mikkael's and Taskin's too, even though I understand why, and I am completely annoyed at the Crown Prince of Devall, whom I am wavering on being the famed enemy sorcerer or his pawn (which is actually the more expected path) or just someone whose fear and entitlement is just making that sorcerer's job easier. The scorn and discrimination and just plain distrust on the part of Sessalie's people for anyone not born in the northern states is also really frustrating and makes me wonder if the King everyone seems to claim is going half-witted is the only non-xenophobe in his own court. Sessalie does seem to be a very insulated country - they don't seem to have a great many deal of foreigners and apparently have very little knowledge of sorcery. Their more isolated location has probably made their ignorance easier to justify because of their being involved in any major conflicts, but even so, they're so ripe for the taking! At least there are some smarter people in their military forces, especially in the garrison.

I do have a criticism, though, because it's gone past mildly frustrating to full on annoying: why, why, why so much repetition of 'desert-bred', author? It's not only used as an insult (apparently the only known) in dialogue but also as part of the narration, either as description or as a substitute to just naming him. It's come to the point I get a little twitch every time I read it, many times over, in a single chapter. 'Eastern-bred' isn't at the same level of annoyance yet but maybe it'll get there too with the greater focus on Jussoud.

I think Jussoud's situation is a bit different, he's still regarded with suspicion but he's the palace guards healer and has Taskin's respect. Also, his demeanor and appearance are less forbidding than Mykkael's and his profession is less threatening. Even people who are hidebound and racist have become accustomed to him, and he's tolerated.
Mykkael instead stands totally out with his dark skin, he's been living in Sessalie for only a year, he's secretive and desert people have a reputation for dabbling with magic.

When ignorance faced with a mystery unleashed a witch-hunt, he was the perfect victim. I found all the slandering against him very appropriate considering the context; "desert-bred" is used many times, and that he's from a desert tribe is also very important to the story.

I also think Jussoud is the real reason Taskin gave Mykkael a chance in the first place, not simply because the healer spoke for him, but because having overcome his prejudice with Jussoud, and beyond, having forged a sort of friendship with him, it would have been unnatural if his perceptions had not shifted a little.