21st Century Literature discussion

This thread is for discussing Part Two of Fingersmith. Spoilers for Parts 1 and 2 are very much allowed but please do not post any spoilers for anything from Part 3.

In this section, we get Maud's perspective of events. We learn that much of what Sue discovered in Part One is partially true, while others are not. Maud is also scheming with the Gentleman and winds up getting duped herself.

I was again surprised by the twist at the very end of the section. I was prepared for the Gentleman to lead her astray and was not surprised when he and Mrs. Sucksby imprisoned her. However, I was not expecting Mrs. Sucksby's scheme to be so elaborate - to imagine planning something like this for 16+ years!

I loved the details in this section, as well as the parallels and contrasts between Sue's and Maud's versions. Initially, we are led to believe that Sue is the scoundrel who believes Maud to be "an innocent," with strange dreams and habits. Instead, we realize that Maud beats her maid, reads erotic literature to strange men in her uncle's library, and Maud realizes Sue is ignorant to much of the world outside of London (example: how they each tell the story of Sue being told the river nearby is the Thames). It was difficult to see Maud feeling hurt by Sue's rejection. We know Sue feels similarly towards her and that each was wondering how they might save the other.

I have not started Part Three yet and I'm incredibly curious to see what's going to happen next!

I've just finished Part Two. Poor Maud! She really is stuck. And that uncle - urgh! - what a creep.

I wasn't too surprised that Mrs Sucksby turned out to be her mother, otherwise it would be odd as to why she'd spent 16 years planning with Maud in mind as she doesn't seem to do things out of the kindness of her own heart!

What I'm hoping is that Part Three will see Maud & Sue getting together and defrauding Gentleman :-)

I'm thoroughly enjoying this book - it's so enthralling and entertaining, and Waters does such a good job of setting the atmosphere.

Just finished Part Two, and I am quite impressed so far - Waters is clearly a fine storyteller. I liked the way that Parts one and two are almost mirror images of each other, and the period details are fascinating. I also enjoyed the shifts in perspective, but wouldn't risk any prediction of what I would expect from Part Three!

I am really invested in these characters - Waters is a really good storyteller. I hate reading the same story told from different perspectives, but Maud's didn't at all feel repetitive to me and actually illuminated a lot of things that I was wondering about from the first part.

I agree that this section demonstrates Water's incredible storytelling capabilities. I was impressed with all the small details she focused on for both Sue's and Maud's sections.

Agree that Waters is an exceptional storyteller and this part is demonstrating that. It must be difficult to rehash the same story from another characters point of view and still make it fresh and interesting, and I think Waters succeeds. I like the aspect of getting each of the two main characters' heads as events unfold.

Viv wrote: " wasn't too surprised that Mrs Sucksby turned out to be her mother,..."

A nice touch by Waters, but not having yet finished the book, I won't take this at face value, least of all from Mrs. Sucksby. What a wonderful story. Wonder why I hadn't heard of it before?

Defrauded, yes, but Gentleman must also end up in a home for the insane or in prison framed for something he did not do, while Sue and Maud ride into the sunset all aglitter in diamonds and gold.

What I like is that it is how much Maud and Sue care for one another that keeps them to the script, sealing their fates. Each is afraid she will lose the other if the other finds out the truth, so each continues on, each betraying the other while both are being betrayed by others. Is there yet someone else out there playing them all?


What a wonderful name for him -- Gentleman. Getting even could take another book. In addition to Gentleman, there is Uncle -- the worst of the lot in my opinion -- Mrs. Stiles -- very much like the nurse we meet in part 3 -- Mrs' Sucksby -- who will kill you with kindness -- Mr. Hawtry -- who is a coward -- and then the Mrs' Stiles-like nurse. There is only one sadist in this story, and that is Uncle. So who has Sue or Maud met that isn't a liar and betrayer?

Xan, I do see some similarities to these characters' names and those of some Dickens type characters. Some oddity to these characters as well. I'm finding a lot of the minor characters somewhat repulsive.

Yes, like dickens there is the grotesque here. Unlike Dickens there is no Dickensian satire or exaggeration I've noticed. (Dickens could move from exaggeration to the grotesque and back again seamlessly.)

Then, as you point out, there are the names: Gentleman (NOT!!), Sucksby (I'll let that one speak for itself), Lilly (Uncle isn't a Liily), Dainty (she ain't), Mrs, Cream (reminds me of the game Clue), nurse Spiller (can't wait to find why she's named that) and nurse Bacon (and her piggy fingers). This book strikes me as very Victorian -- the plot twists, the erotica subculture, the sad state of mental hospitals, the plight of women, etc.

Xan Shadowflutter wrote: "Yes, like dickens there is the grotesque here. Unlike Dickens there is no Dickensian satire or exaggeration I've noticed. (Dickens could move from exaggeration to the grotesque and back again seaml..."

Yep, zero humor, all melodrama.

Franky wrote: "Xan Shadowflutter wrote: "Yes, like dickens there is the grotesque here. Unlike Dickens there is no Dickensian satire or exaggeration I've noticed. (Dickens could move from exaggeration to the grot..."
I would disagree with "zero humour" - maybe it is easier to see if you are British, but there is quite a lot of humour in the details, but maybe it was subtler than I thought...

I have to agree with Hugh, I am not British and I thought there was quite a lot of humor in the story - maybe it's just a different type of humor. And completely disagree that it was all melodrama. There was nothing melodramatic about the asylum part, for example.

I found the first half of this section to be a little slow and tedious, not connecting well with Maud's voice. I think partly because the plot just didn't make sense to me (doing it the way he planned with Sue, Richard got nearly the entire fortune, minus the $3k or so he'd promised to Sue. But with Maud, he only gets half. Why go that route? Why does that work out better? Or is it just a clever way of getting them BOTH out of the picture so he can have it all and no witnesses, by the end? Thankfully, that's answered not long later).

Boy, her uncle is something else. What a twisted, bizarre creature! It's a wonder Maud hasn't been physically sold to one of his friends for their pleasure before now... although I suppose he has sold her by making her read all of this aloud to them?

In some ways, I kind of imagine the author is giving us a more "real" picture of life in Dickens' world, insofar as the very base language of Sue and the others, using modern curses, etc. Maybe they're not as true of the time period, but Waters may be using language we're familiar with to give us the shock value of the language being used, to put us more into the real character of the shady happenings. I'm sure Dickens might have written them that way, if censorship wasn't involved at the time. But yes, he was very smooth in moving through the macabre, to dark (and light) humor, to drama, and all back again. I'm sure plenty of things went on that our Victorian authors would never have tried to write about, or maybe did, but had to give in to the censors.

Or maybe she just wants to write Victorian erotica, lol. It certainly delved more into that than I had expected, based on how the novel started.

The second half picked up the pace and got much more interesting. By the time they showed up at the house, before it was revealed where they were, I pretty much suspected that Mrs. Sucksby was in on all of this, maybe even the mastermind, because it just didn't line up otherwise. It didn't make sense for Richard to double-cross Sue unless there was something else entirely going on, because he made out with more money with that plan. I still don't think we've seen the last of Mrs. Sucksby's dealings though, somehow. I don't know why, but I have a feeling.

Poor Maud, she really is so naive about people. Her uncle really has her in a terrible fix, since she knows no one, none who can help her. I still don't feel as sorry for her as for Sue, since she had money and knew they were double crossing Sue, and she didn't seem to have as many qualms about the whole thing as Sue did, but she's certainly getting a rude shock now.

I have been most impressed with the two perspectives, as several of you mentioned. How many times have we read a novel where two characters gives their perspectives, and the conversations are nearly word-for-word, but with different nuances? Here, however, both characters give account of the same scenarios, but save for a few sentences here and there, they remember the events slightly differently, or remember different phrases or actions more keenly, depending on what they felt at the time. That is much more true to life. The voices are done differently enough that I feel them as different characters (I have lost count of the number of books where I can't keep track of which character is which because their "voice" is all exactly the same), even though I'm listening to the audio and I believe the same voice actor is reading both parts. It takes real talent to write different "voices" for characters within the same setting, especially when it's different perspectives on the exact same scene, and I think Waters has captured that remarkably well.

I've already started part 3, I can't wait to see how this all ends!