All About Books discussion

This thread is for the discussion of Book 1, Swann's Way. The suggested dates to read and discuss this book are January 1st to February 15th, but people are welcome to go at their own pace. The thread will remain open after February 15th.

For the first two weeks, ie up until January 14th, please do not include spoilers in the discussion. Please use spoiler tags up until that date.

I'll start it not right the fist, but a couple of days later: I've managed to find an audiobook from RAI TRE (the Italian BBC!) but I want to finish Collins first: I'm listening to his Blind Love

Here's a paragraph from Sparknotes that gives a bit of context:

One of the major philosophical currents in Proust's day was the study of the nature of time. Albert Einstein's general theory of relativity inspired scientists and artists alike to reassess the meaning of time and the inherent subjectivity of existing interpretations of time. One of the most famous philosophers at the turn of the century was Henri Bergson, who believed in a more "natural" form of time called "duration," which "flowed" like music. Unlike the "homogenous" time measured by a clock, Bergson's duration had no pauses, but was instead an interconnected "interpenetration" of moments that were indistinguishable from each other. Proust adapted this idea to explain his theories about time and memory. He wrote that "we labor in vain" to try to recapture the past by means of the intellect; only the workings of chance will draw a person back in time to the moment he seeks. Proust compares his own theories about time and memory to the Celtic belief that the souls of deceased loved ones are held captive in objects; these lost loved ones are reincarnated only when a person brushes against or passes by these objects and recognizes the voices of these loved ones.

Proust also found inspiration for his work in the contemporary aesthetic philosophies of the visual arts. Despite the immense popularity of photography in his day, Proust considered painting a more "natural" expression of emotions. In addition to celebrating in Swann's Way the classical beauty of works by such Renaissance artists as Botticelli and Caravaggio, he attempted to capture the stylistic influences of one of the most revolutionary artistic achievements of the belle époque: Impressionism. He was fascinated by the works of Claude Monet and sought to emulate his form and subject matter; as a result, Swann's Way became a hallmark of French expression.

I've just had a look, and see that Swann's Way is divided into 4 sections, but not all the same length. I'm relieved it's in sections anyway. I was imagining it as a long, long passage.

Sections sounds good to me, I was also beginning to fear one long passage.

Thanks for posting the notes about time and art. Im beginning to get a grasp of who Proust was, from listening to the Alain de Botton book, as my knowledge of his life and work is very limited.

This I think is one of the most interesting philosophic issue of the late XIX Century, I loved Bergsons' theories when at school

My copy's open, and off I go!

I'm partway through Overture.

I really like the part about the Magic Lantern.

A comment that made me laugh out loud 'It's a funny thing now; I very often think of my poor wife, but I cannot think of her very much at any one time.'

I loved the nostalgic part where he waits in bed and anticipates his mother coming to kiss him goodnight.

I enjoyed both those mentions also. As well, I like the Grandmother figure, her walks around the garden and her concerns for the Grandfather and the Narrator.

Yes, I really like re Grandma (view spoiler)[ that she gives antique cultural presents e.g. chairs that collapse. (hide spoiler)]

All his relatives are a bit eccentric. The aunts try so hard to be clever and diplomatic that others don't even know what they are talking about. Some of this section is certainly autobiographical, especially the child's attachment to his mother and his high-strung nature. He seems to be the only child in the family.

I see I was wrong and there are some divisions. The first part ends with the madeleine episode. It sounds like that is the section you have as Overture. In my French version it is just called Part I.

This is certainly an eccentric family.

I am jealous you are reading Proust. I loved Swann's way, which I read in the French edition. I am too busy right now to reread this, however. I shall accompany you in spirit :)

I'm not quite ready to start, but I should pick it up by the end of this week :)

I've finished Overture. I really enjoy this family. The aunts are nutty (ie: how they thanked Swann for the wine), Grandma has her quirks (rickety furniture and strolling the garden). Mom & dad seem rather conventional and serene. The narrator is so sensitive and emotional. Put it all together and it makes for an entertaining story.... (view spoiler)[right down to getting "sensual pleasure" in the only room that can be locked. LOL! (hide spoiler)].

I'm about to finish Overture too. The level of intimacy given from the beginning of the book is incredible. I also noticed Freudian references in the book, which I had missed from my first reading.

Stuck a bit behind with King; I'll start this coming week end

Finished Overture. (view spoiler)[ It was such a nice feeling, reading the part about the Madeleines. I've seen it referenced so much and discussed so much over the years, and now I've read it. Lovely!

This was the main reason I wanted to read the book. Can I stop now?! (hide spoiler)]

Gill: (view spoiler)[No, we'd miss having you journey through this with us. :D (hide spoiler)]

Petra wrote: "Gill: [spoilers removed]"

Oh, OK then!

Just starting. Have just finished a murder mystery with lots of violence and thrills so I will have to adjust my mind set a bit:)

Almost finished with Overture, I enjoy this family as well. Extremely interesting.

Somewhere in the second part now, (view spoiler)[ Swann's in love, yippee!! (hide spoiler)] I'm delighted because this book isn't as hard as I had remembered it being two years ago, but I guess I'm two years wiser than when I first attempted it.

Found this to be more interesting than the ski trip my family dragged me into.

Phrynne wrote: "Just starting. Have just finished a murder mystery with lots of violence and thrills so I will have to adjust my mind set a bit:)"

Maybe the "looking for clues" mindset will be helpful? LOL!
Proust will be a calming influence after that mystery read.

Gill wrote: "Finished Overture. It was such a nice feeling, reading the part about the Madeleines. I've seen it referenced so much and discussed so much over the years, and now I've read it. Lovely!

This was ..."

Gill, I had the same feeling when I got to that passage. (view spoiler)[ I loved the line ...brought me of a sudden to a sort of puberty of sorrow, a manumission of tears. (hide spoiler)]

My copy of the graphic Swann's Way came today and I just love it. I'll read it along with regular copy I have, should be fun.

I posted this in the general Proust challenge thread, but realize now it properly belongs here.

I found this webpage (having read Proust's description of the kitchenmaid). It shows the paintings mentioned in Swann's Way along with the passages that mention them. I found it helpful to see the paintings, so I thought I'd share.

I like how his writing of the works of Bergotte could equally apply to this novel as well.

Diane S ☔ wrote: "I loved the nostalgic part where he waits in bed and anticipates his mother coming to kiss him goodnight."

This reminded me (for whatever reason) of the scene in A Christmas Story where Ralphie realizes he won't be punished for getting into a fight at school. An undeserved and totally unexpected benefit as when the narrator's father says that his mother could stay with him for the night.

P.S. I really understand the funny in the Monty Python "Summarize Proust Contest" sketch. The sketch is uncensored and NSFW.

That was marvellous Tom. I always loved Monty Python and had never seen that sketch. As you say, reading the books does make the sketch even more meaningful:)

Terri, I'm glad you like the Proust graphic novel. I really enjoyed it, too.

I'm looking forward to watching the Monty Python sketch.

Tom, thanks for posting the Monty Python link. Last night I was reading How Proust Can Change Your Life and I read about the sketch and cracked up just from that. I never would have thought to look for it on YouTube.

Big Monty Python fans here. My hubs and I watched this sketch last night. Thanks, Tom

Just watched the sketch. What fun! Thanks, Tom!

It's dangerous going to You tube to watch a sketch though. There's this little tempting column down the right hand side which led me off to watch a lot more! Half an hour later.......

I felt sorry for this little boy, All he wanted was a show of love, felt such yearning and sorrow.

I've just started and read for about an hour, though I don't think I've made much of a dent yet! I really like the writing and translation, it's so descriptive and long and winding it's almost funny. I can see why Monty Python did that sketch! I'll read all the spoiler comments above once I've finished Overture. Since I'm reading on the kindle app I really must remember to highlight passages that I've particularly enjoyed too.

I'm coming to the end of 'Combray'. There have been parts that I really liked, but other parts I have found boring.

I'll add a bit more when I've got my ideas together.

Finished Overture, I really liked the last part about the madeleines, so beautifully written. Gill and Petra, you made me laugh with your spoilers about this bit.

Finished Part I of Swann's Way just now. Reading it is kind of like being with a friend who tells some really great stories about his/her life, but who has a firm resolve to show you his/her entire slideshow/photo album and exhaustively describe each and every picture. And they're really into flowers and churches.

Yep, that's exactly what it's like! So far it's a story I want to hear more of...

Tom wrote: "Finished Part I of Swann's Way just now. Reading it is kind of like being with a friend who tells some really great stories about his/her life, but who has a firm resolve to show you his/her entire..."

Great description, Tom! In my case, I would add, that just when you think you can't stick any more of the boring minutiae, they come up with an excellent tale, and you forgive them everything. (Can I quote from your analogy when I write my review?!)

Tom, that's a lovely and perfect description!

Gill wrote: "Tom wrote: "Finished Part I of Swann's Way just now. Reading it is kind of like being with a friend who tells some really great stories about his/her life, but who has a firm resolve to show you hi..."

Sure. But I'm not ready to forgive just yet. I like it enough to continue though, so that says something.

Tom, I love your description It hits the nail on the head. I'm almost done with the first part, I'll probably pick it back up tomorrow.

I've decided to reserve this classic for later - right now I'm just too preoccupied with work projects to have the concentration needed for this book. Enjoy your discussion, guys!

Some thoughts on Part I.

(view spoiler)[It seems to me that knowing the true essence of a thing is one the themes in Part I. The narrator (in at least 4 different scenes with 4 different characters) is put in a position where he can observe but remain unobserved. He sees a rather different Francoise killing the chicken than the one to which he is accustomed to being around. He spies Mlle Vinteuil with her lover and embarks on an essay about sadism. He sees and overhears Leonie's muttering to herself about her ailments. He also sees M. Vinteuil's inner struggle about leaving one of his scores on the piano when the narrator's parents are coming to visit. I think these scenes suggest the question - can we really know another human being? Or, in a broader sense, do we know a thing as the object itself or the sum of its properties? I think early in the novel he says that we humans generally only know one thing about a person and are content with that. So, which is the "true" version of the characters mentioned?

It seems to me this notion of "knowing" ties into memory in that the narrator cannot remember Combray in its entirety, but rather in fits and spurts when occasioned with an object linked to the past, like the tea and madaleine. When I lose something, and on seeing it in an unaccustomed spot, my mind is (usually) able to reconstruct the events leading up to the object's being put there, whereas prior to seeing it, my mind's a blank slate. I also tried this with a song - Phil Collins' One More Night with which I associate a then good college friend. Hearing it does bring up images in my head I would not otherwise have access to (I think anyway.

The same is true of Proust's novel (moreso than most) - we can experience but a portion of it and remember even less, unless prompted by some suggestion, or phrase etc. This I think is what happens in life, and may be in part what Proust refers to as time lost. (hide spoiler)]

Another link that may be of interest - a reading journal about reading Proust's In Search of Lost Time.

Tom, that reading journal of Proust looks great, thanks so much for posting.

Ok I've finally started it.
But has not anyone - or it has skippe dmy attention? - not noticed the very first words of the book? I knew them alrteady before reading it for the first time, but they still impress me a lot: such a momentuous design, so big a story to tell, and you start telling it saying that lately you've gone to bed early????
I've loved it!

At the moment I'm only half way through the first chapter, and I feel the personality of the writer definitly too morbid, even for a sensitive child. His parent's attention should have been a bit keener!