Richard III discussion

Am I the only one who feels that this is a very passive group? Several months without a discussion!

Daisy wrote: "Am I the only one who feels that this is a very passive group? Several months without a discussion!"

I can't open your post on the email from Goodreads. It seems there is something wrong with their email.

Clare

I suspect all forums go through more and less active periods. But to get the conversation going, I read a post elsewhere that referenced Edward IV's military brilliance. While it's true he won several major battles, does anyone have specific knowledge of why he was considered so competent? Certainly, in Edward's declining years, he relied on Richard. But I'd be interested in knowing what prompts Edward's reputation.

I presume you mean Edward IV?

dislexic

I'm a habitual transposer of letters myself (and make a lot of typos).

I think there are a few major areas in which he excelled as a military leader: a bit prodigy (being only 18 when he won his first major battles); he was terrific at rallying support under difficult circumstances and raising an army when he needed one; he was inspiring as a leader from the front and could put a positive spin on a bad situation (the parhelia at Mortimer's Cross might have frightened his troops, but he convincingly labeled it a show of divine favor); he made a habit of winning! It's hard to break down his specific talents and tactics as a military commander because of lack of information, but one has to assume he made use of an aptitude in the field, because we cannot attribute his wins time after time to simply dumb luck, any more than we can say that his father or Richard Neville were consistently unlucky--they seemed to lack the knack he had as a field commander.

Later he had other concerns--economic and political (he made and spent a lot of money). But he saw capacity in young Richard of Gloucester and used his brother well in a military capacity throughout his reign, which in and of itself shows good judgment.

Good points, Oshun. I've been studying Edward III's military exploits in greater detail lately. His military genius seems to have been derived from knowing how to manipulate his enemies into attacking him when he was in a strong defensive position and capitalizing on his artillery (longbow arrows). I think you're right, Edward's talents lay in recruiting and inspiring his troops, and a brother who had his back!

Daisy I received an email concerning this thread for the first time after several months. I had assumed it had terminated. I was surprised to receive an email about this thread. I found changes having to log in.

What I meant was to open a new thread because I was concerned about this group being so passive. In my other groups there is always something new--actually new members too--and I think this group must be more active,because this is much more interesting than sci-fi and detective stories which people discuss in other groups. Right now I'm reading a little Agatha Christie,but I don't think there's much to discuss about it.Here we can focus on important questions
RJay's concerns about Edward may also have an answer in the books of authors who researched this period. I don't know any such book,but someone may know some

Has anyone visited this site and paged through his book? Comments to share?

http://leicestercathedral.org/about-u...

I downloaded it this morning. I absolutely love it. Strange thing,Richard naturally belonged to the Church of Rome,but Leicester Cathedral and the dean we could see in many interviews and videos last year,played a very impressive and positive role ,though they are Anglican ,They seemed to me much nicer than the University of Leicester,both at the time of the reburial and since. It is a wonderful thing that they let us see this beautiful book.
Do you agree?

Yes I agree. I saw a pic of the book.

Gorgeous! Wish I could have understood any of it ;-)

Daisy wrote: "What I meant was to open a new thread because I was concerned about this group being so passive. In my other groups there is always something new--actually new members too--and I think this group m..."

What this group needs is someone willing to be co-moderator and make an effort to keep the discussions active. I have not had the time and/or resources to keep it going.

FYI, when this group was originally created it was just a small group of us who wanted to chatter about RIII without mucking up our book reviews and comments. It just grew from there.

If it is a passive group we have only ourselves to blame for not coming on and saying something.

Perhaps we need a few Tydder-loving trolls to come in and wind us up.

Brian wrote: "If it is a passive group we have only ourselves to blame for not coming on and saying something.

Perhaps we need a few Tydder-loving trolls to come in and wind us up."

Well, there will be the Starz version of The White Princess coming up soon.

Well, that has already caused a few spats in Facebook groups that I know of, between those who love PG and those who have a more reserved opinion. :-)

Brian wrote: "Well, that has already caused a few spats in Facebook groups that I know of, between those who love PG and those who have a more reserved opinion. :-)"

I saw the remnants of that spat, but missed all the fun stuff and drama.

I think we need to accept the fact that nobles spoke with regional accents. If it is not accepted, it proves there is still snobbery in England about the way nobles spoke and behaved over 500 years ago.

Most likely the posh accent didn't exist until much more recently.

Anyway,I'm glad if the group is not so passive after all.I cannot be a co-moderator,but I hope someone else can,and I have a suggestion. If we want to chat about Richard and related topics,why don't we do it the discussion based on books? We ,like other groups,could choose one or two books or subjects for a month and discuss them. why don't we?

Daisy wrote: "Anyway,I'm glad if the group is not so passive after all.I cannot be a co-moderator,but I hope someone else can,and I have a suggestion. If we want to chat about Richard and related topics,why don'..."

Any member can start new topics.

Now it's mid-March. I suggest someone start a thread in connection with a book for April that everyone interested could read or re-read until then and then we would discuss it in April. Then do the same thing for every month. I actually left two groups in which they suggested books for discussion for the next month,but I wasn't interested in any. I am really interested in historic topics,so in this group it would seem more interesting to me...

Daisy wrote: "Am I the only one who feels that this is a very passive group? Several months without a discussion!"

Hi Daisy-
Anyone in the group can post a question or suggest a book to read. Please feel free to suggest away. Personally, my energy has shifted from RIII to Edward III and the Black Prince. Primarily because in order to understand the Wars of the Roses, one has to go back to Edward III's reign and the conflicts between his grandchildren.

Fire away!

Daisy wrote: "Am I the only one who feels that this is a very passive group? Several months without a discussion!"

OK, here's a topic for discussion ... The Wars of the Roses goes back to issues between Edward III's grandchilden and the deposition of Richard II. Was Bolingbroke right to challenge his cousin and take the throne?

I wouldn't be happy to suggest any special book because I 've suggested topics. Of course Richard III was not an isolated person of history,so there are many related topics and actually books written about these topics we could discuss. In connection with authors I mentioned before there are some interesting things that other members of the group could check out.
I don't know whether or not anyone else follows Matthew Lewis, a very interesting contemporary author. He wrote a book about Richard, Duke of York suggesting that the claim of the House of York was right, the Lancesters were usurpers.

Matthew is very knowledgeable about the Plantagenets and in particular the Wars of the Roses. His books give another view of the " Tudor hymn sheet" history we've all been taught at school thanks to his extensive research.
I too follow him and always look forward to his posts. I regard him as my fountain of knowledge and go to his blog page regularly

I absolutely agree with Vera that Matt Lewis is great. For those who don't know him, I suggest to read something from him,and I also agree that we have to see things in perspective,this is why his book about Richard, Duke of York seems the most interesting to me. On the other hand,now he announces on his blog that he is writing a very long book about the life of Richard III portraying Richard as neither hero nor villain. I won't read that one!
I love Richard and I love Matthew,but doesn't he-- and of course his publisher-- notice that we have had enough of this stuff? The broad historic context mentioned by RJAy is much more exciting.
If someone doesn't agree with this, I am glad to discuss it

Is Matthew's book on Richard, Duke of York, a biography or historical fiction novel?

The book about Richard, Duke of York sounds interesting as there is little written about him.

It is a biography. Matthew wrote several novels of rather Ricardian approach.I liked that stuff,that was why I started to follow his blog,Matt's history blog. Recently he seems to have shifted to history writing in his books too.
C'mon,everybody,why don't we do with this book about the Duke of York what other,more active groups do with many ,not always inspiring books? Now that several of us either know and appreciate Matthew,or have our interest raised in this book of his,let's choose this one to discuss for a start . Then later we can suggest other books for each other to read and discuss. Does anyone agree?

I would really love to read it. However, the kindle version is $20, which is more than I'm wiling to pay.

Daisy wrote: "It is a biography. Matthew wrote several novels of rather Ricardian approach.I liked that stuff,that was why I started to follow his blog,Matt's history blog. Recently he seems to have shifted to h..."

Daisy wrote: "I absolutely agree with Vera that Matt Lewis is great. For those who don't know him, I suggest to read something from him,and I also agree that we have to see things in perspective,this is why his ..."

I agree Daisy-I'm a committed Ricardian but unless there are some new revelations I think R3 has been done to death( if you pardon the pun!) for the time being However I also have a wider interest in all the Plantagenets and would find his book about Henry 11 and Eleanor of Aquitaine interesting as she is one of my favourite queens. A "book club reading club" on Matthews Richard of York would be good but as has already been said the cost of some books can be quite restrictive.

Greed,isn't it ?The otherwise very intelligent Matthew in his new post on his blog claims that he is becoming a full time writer and he writes many new books because of this. Among them is the 200 thousand words biography of Richard III !
Still,my partner, Diego,here in Altea, Spain ,has Kindle Unlimited or whatever they call it and I read many things he downloads.He downloaded the book about Richard, Duke of York too, I don't know if it was part of Kindle Unlimited or he paid the $ 20...
In the groups I left here on Goodreads they offered classics to read that i'd read when I was a teenager. Perhaps because those are cheaper. But if we don't discuss books,this group becomes very passive again. it's a pity because I actually hate the social media, I don't use Facebook or Twitter,and I joined Goodreads only because a writer invited me. She is a Ricardian too,and I found this group interesting.
What about taking a look at her stuff which is also on Kindle and it looks at the Richard III issue from the broadest possible point of view? She claims that the Elizabethan Age was Ricardian, Shakespeare portrays that the Lancesters were usurpers ,he mocks Tudor calumnies and his anti- Tudor message was misinterpreted.
She even looks at the international connections of the problem. I don't agree with her in many things,but she certainly gives ideas to understand the Plantagenet- Richard III- Tudor problem .
Shakespeare Made Me Love Richard III is the title of her book, I've just checked and it's very cheap.

This thread is going a bit off topic. If any here want to discuss a particular book, please start a thread in the book section and also link to the book being discussed so that everyone knows what book is being discussed.

I added the two books I mentioned here to the bookshelf section but without offering myself to lead a discussion. Anyone can easily find them now,they are both very interesting for those who want to understand the problem of Richard better.The new revelations mentioned by Vera may be in the Elizabethan Age, subject of the Shakespeare book,little known by mainstream Ricardians because the author is a struggling indie.Her findings deserve more attention ,I'm sure. Matthew is already a pretty well-known author,his books may be a little expensive,but they are REALLY good.
What I don't want is to lead a discussion,if anyone else wishes,these books deserve to be discussed.

Daisy wrote: "I added the two books I mentioned here to the bookshelf section but without offering myself to lead a discussion. Anyone can easily find them now,they are both very interesting for those who want t..."

Daisy, the Matt Lewis book is not even available on Kindle in the US and it's $21 for a hardcover from Amazon (I have no desire to buy any more hardcovers for my overloaded bookshelves, so unless I can find this at my local library, it will be a while before I read it.) As for the Eva Burian book, I found that for free on Kindle, but I'm afraid I didn't find the short sample I downloaded particularly inviting. But thanks for adding some interesting new material to our shelves.

Speaking of Shakespeare and Richard III, has anyone in this group seen the "Hollow Crown Part 2" broadcasts of Henry 6, 1-3, and Richard III, with Benedict Cumberbatch playing Richard? I was a big fan of the first "Hollow Crown" (R2, H4, H5) and wondered whether the magic was still there (as, to me, the second set are lesser plays.)

I actually have the book Richard,Duke of York. My partner bought me several books for Christmas which we'd previously found on the internet,or read on Kindle Unlimited. Now I went to the flat where I keep it. It looks great on the bookshelf,and I enjoyed reading it. If someone can afford it,it's worth money!

Second request. Please do not use this thread to discuss individual books, use the book discussion section and start a thread there. Some comments in this thread about specific book(s) are beginning to 'feel' overly promotional.

I have no interest to promote Matthew Lewis's books whom I never saw in my life, I only like his books.If I had started a discussion thread,it could seem promotion too if I praise it,but I don't want to dedicate too much time to this, I only wanted to call others' attention to books which are at last not about Richard III's life,but other aspects,and this book of Mr Lewis is my favourite one.

For instance,in my other group now we can choose between two books for group discussion,and one is Robyn Young's Sons of the Blood. It could be discussed here too,because it has to do with the period of the War of the Roses. normally it is(one of the) moderator(s) who not only suggests the books,but sends notifications to group members. I never received such notification from here,even if searching, I can find that there IS a suggested discussion. I don't want to spend too much time on Goodreads,others may have the same problem,but this group could work more actively attracting more members. That's my concern. All the 3 books of the three authors I mentioned here could create real debate.

I think we can safely say this is no longer a passive group!! even if the discussion is perhaps not to everyone's taste

Vera,thanks,this was my goal. To promote Richard through the writers who do something for him. I don't know if others had the same impression,but this one seemed a very passive group. If you sign in Goodreads,there are the 'recently active groups' and this was not among them. And I never received invitations for group readings from here,only from my other groups.

At the moment I am reading a book about George Duke of Clarence - Death Be Pardoner To Me, published 3 years ago. The author is Dorothy Davies. It has not received any reviews good or bad. I'm enjoying it.

ooh that sounds interesting I'll keep an eye for that one -George is a bit of a background character in most WoR books-I'd be interested to read more about him.

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

For those who would like to mention a new-to-you book and don't want to start a new thread, please use the thread above. Thank you.

Richard features a lot in the book and would appeal to Ricardians. So no need to start a new thread.