Reading the 20th Century discussion

The November 2017 Backlisted podcast (you know how I love them) was about...


To Serve Them All My Days by R.F. Delderfield

Here's the Wikipedia page...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_Serv...

To Serve Them All My Days mirrors the history of Britain in the post-Great War era, casting David's experiences against the difficulties, contradictions, and social issues of the inter-war years. David's life focuses on how Britain comes to terms with the turmoil of the Great War, the General Strike, socialism and the formation of the National Government in particular. Some commentators have remarked on the similarities between this book and the earlier Goodbye, Mr. Chips, which has a similar theme but is less pointed politically and socially.

There have been adaptations you might have come across...

First published in 1972, the book was adapted for television in 1980. It has been adapted twice by Shaun McKenna, first as a stage play at the Royal Theatre Northampton (Royal & Derngate) in 1992 and again as a five-part series of 45-minute plays for BBC Radio 4, first broadcast in January 2006.

I have a copy waiting patiently for me to start reading it.

I heartily recommend the discussion. Interestingly they compare it favourably to the wonderful London Belongs to Me by Norman Collins

Anyone read any R.F. Delderfield? Or tempted? Or have anything else to say?

I have never read any R.F. Delderfield, in fact other than having heard of To Serve Them All My Days the only other time I have come across his name was in the credits, as writer of the source novel, of the 1961 Alfie Lynch, Sean Connery film On the Fiddle. And a jolly little romp that is too.
I'm certainly tempted though.

Me too CQM. I now have a second hand copy of To Serve Them All My Days by R.F. Delderfield. The November 2017 Backlisted podcast makes a very compelling case for his work. It has convinced me. I'll update the thread when I get to the book.

I read The Dreaming Suburb a while back. I thought it was okay but not great. It's the first in a 2 book series. I haven't read the 2nd yet: The Avenue Goes to War. I might enjoy that more than the first since I find WWII such a fascinating time in history.

Lynaia wrote: "I read The Dreaming Suburb....


Is it just me, or is The Dreaming Suburb one of the all time great book titles?



The Dreaming Suburb

Between the wars, the lives of four neighbouring English families intersect in this "highly recommended" saga by a New York Times-bestselling author (Sunday Express).

In the spring of 1919, his wife's death brings Sergeant Jim Carver home from the front. He returns to be a single parent to his seven children in a place he has never lived: Number Twenty, Manor Park Avenue, in a South London suburb.

The Carvers' neighbour Eunice Fraser, at Number Twenty-Two, has also known tragedy. Her soldier husband was killed, leaving her and her eight-year-old son, Esme, to fend for themselves.

At Number Four, Edith Clegg takes in lodgers and looks after her sister, Becky, whose mind has been shattered by a past trauma.

No one knows much about the Friths, at Number Seventeen, who moved to the Avenue before the war.

The first book in the two-part historical series the Avenue, which also includes The Avenue Goes to War, The Dreaming Suburb takes readers into the everyday lives of these English families between World War I and World War II, as their hopes, dreams, and struggles are played out against a radically changing world.

Some of his books were discounted earlier in the year, so they are sitting on my kindle, waiting for me to make room for them...

In September 2019 we will be having a buddy read for To Serve Them All My Days....


https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

See you then

In other R.F. Delderfield news, CQM is reading Long Summer Day....


CQM wrote: "I've just started Long Summer Day, the first part of a trilogy by R. F. Delderfield.

I don't often comment on here but it seemed to fit the remit of you good people as the trilogy begins in 1902 and ends somewhere in the 1960s.

I like a book that begins with a map as my 60s Hodder edition does, however when I turned the page and discovered a family tree-esque list of characters I will admit to being a little daunted...
Book one is a whopper at 576 pages and the other two, which I ordered at the same time, don't look like pamphlets either but having read Delderfield's To Serve Them All My Days I know that he's very readable so the sheer bulk of the combined trilogy isn't too worrying."

I'm looking forward to my first by this author. One of the reviews I read about the upcoming buddy read indicated it might have what I liked about The Cazalet Chronicles: characters you come to love and want to spend time with.

In for a penny, in for a pound. Long Summer Day is a Kindle Deal today, so I might as well pick it up!

Anybody else suffer with recommendation anxiety?
Delderfield is very easy to read and the characters definitely come to feel like old friends and that can't just be down to the length of the books.

Anxiety might be overstating it, but certainly feel somewhat overwhelmed by the sheer quantity of books I buy

I do find that I am so tempted by group reads, NetGalley, etc. that I don't spend nearly enough time reading personal choices. I am going to make a concerted effort to read the many, many books on my TBR list...

Susan wrote: "I am going to make a concerted effort to read the many, many books on my TBR list...."

That's what I say to myself regulary and then start discovering new authors and deciding I'll read all their work - and so the pile grows and grows

I know. Well, I'll temper that by saying that I will do my best to read at one personal choice, alongside group/review books.

Maybe I don't understand. Aren't NetGalley personal reads? I mean, you aren't required to choose certain titles there, are you?

You are right, Elizabeth, of course. However, I get so tempted by NetGalley, and, of course, there is a date by which you should read them (if I am given a book by a publisher, I feel I should try to read it by publication date), which means that other books get pushed down my reading list. I really mean that I want to get to all those books that have been lurking, unread, on my TBR list forever...

Oh, well, there is that of course. A couple of years ago I made a concerted effort to pare down the number of on hand but unread books. I did pretty well, but only proportionately. Then I went to my library's annual book sale and undid my year's worth of diligence. I came to the (rationalized) conclusion that having books ready to be read - both physical and digital - was a good thing, that having so many books at my fingertips couldn't possibly be a book-buying addiction. ;-)

I do still go to the library and I do still buy books for group/buddy reads that intrigue me. And I do still think that a $1.99 kindle book is a bargain even if I don't actually *need* another unread book.

Yes, it's my utter lack of will-power that's at fault, Elizabeth!

I must admit I am really enjoying our forthcoming buddy read....


To Serve Them All My Days by R.F. Delderfield

The earliest section is particularly good at showing the trauma and after effects of shell shock but also how relative normality and patience can be so beneficial.

It quickly moves on from this and is very compelling.

I'm looking forward to discussing it with you some of you lovely people in about a week's time.

I defy anyone to get through...


To Serve Them All My Days by R.F. Delderfield

...without a tear in their eye

#challenge

I've just noticed that....


God is an Englishman (The Swann family saga Book 1)

...is currently 99 pence for Kindle

I've snapped up a copy

If anyone fancies another R.F. Delderfield buddy read, and specifically God is an Englishman, then please reply and we will make it happen

The blurb...

Adam Swann is hungry for success. He is one of the new breed of entrepreneurs thrown up by the Industrial Revolution, determined to take advantage of current economic conditions to build an unrivalled business empire. And he is determined to win the beautiful, strong-minded Henrietta, and persuade her to share in his struggles and triumphs.

"About the Author":

R.F. Delderfield was born in London but has lived much of his life in Devon, where he started writing as a reporter on his father's newspaper, the Exmouth Chronicle. During World War II and immediately thereafter he achieved quite a success as a West End playwright (one of his plays ran five and a half years). Then, at the age of forty, he stopped to take stock of his life. "What I really wanted was to be a novelist," he told one interviewer, "to project the English way of life in the tradition of Hardy and Galsworthy." Out of that resolve have come his great family sagas- The Avenue, A Horseman Riding By and its sequel, The Green Gauntlet, and now his latest and most ambitious saga which begins with God Is An Englishman.

In preparing himself to write one of his vast family chronicles, Mr. Delderfield draws a detailed map of the territory, county or city that he will cover, placing the houses where his characters will live and adding the place names and details that will build up into a rich and convincing background. Then he steps back and lets inspiration take over. He writes regularly in the morning, averaging about 4,000 words a day, then takes the afternoons off to go strolling over the moors.

I've just finished the second volume of the Delderfield trilogy A Horseman Riding By: Post of Honour.
Both the first and second volumes are whoppers well over 500 pages, small print pages at that, of country life in the first 40 odd years of the last century. There is a lot in them to recommend but there is, equally, much here to leave you either laughing or possibly crying depending on your tolerance for stolid and, at the same time, overly romantic dialogue.
I'll definitely be finishing the trilogy, WWII has just started and I want to see who wins, but I don't think in all good conscience I could recommend these books.

That’s really helpful



Thanks CQM. Based on your comments, I won’t prioritise this RFD series

I just picked up the third in the series as a Kindle deal, but I have a *lot* of unread books on hand.

Are you thinking of reading the third in the series as a standalone book Elizabeth?

Nigeyb wrote: "Are you thinking of reading the third in the series as a standalone book Elizabeth?"

No, I already had the first two. I might have been clearer above. These are the only titles I thought would interest me other than our buddy read To Serve Them All My Days.

They certainly are big books, even the paperback book feels heavy.

Thanks. I look forward to your reaction Elizabeth

I’m poised to start reading one of our mid-January 2020 buddy reads....


God is an Englishman (1970) (The Swann family saga Book 1)

The blurb...

The first novel in the epic God is an Englishman series, this book is a stirring saga of England in the 19th century, as the Industrial Revolution takes hold, forever changing the landscape of England and her people.

Adam Swann, scion of an army family, returns home in 1858 after service with Her Majesty's army in the Crimea and India, determined to build his fortune in the dog-eat-dog world of Victorian commerce. Swann is soon captivated by Henrietta, the high-spirited daughter of a local mill owner. As Swann works to build his name, he and Henrietta share adventures, reversal, and fortune.

God is an Englishman (1970) (The Swann family saga Book 1) has started very promisingly...


There's a lot more general information e.g. a soldier's lot in India in the mid 19th century and the background behind the Industrial Revolution, but there's also the seeds of the kind of sweeping narrative that I so enjoyed in the wonderful To Serve Them All My Days. It appears to be very well researched.

The three books in the Swann series explore the economic history of England from the 1860s to the outbreak of the First World War.

Judy, that may be a very good book, I just wish Delderfield had used a different title.

Judy?


Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Judy, that may be a very good book, I just wish Delderfield had used a different title."

God Is an Englishman?

You think it's blasphemous or disrespectful? Or you don't like the title? Or some other reason for wanting a different title?

The word God is from old English/German (guþ, gudis in Gothic, Gott in modern German)

In 2010, Is God Still an Englishman?: How We Lost Our Faith (But Found New Soul by Cole Moreton was published

I find it offensive because of the Englishman part. While I'm no longer a believer, I doubt seriously that any God pays attention to man made country boundaries. What about God is a Russian? or God is Chinese? or God is a Frenchman? on and on. I just wish he'd chosen a different title, that's all.

Ah. Right. I see.


I assume the title is meant ironically. The story is set in the mid-ninteenth century which marked the full flower of the British Empire. At that time many would have believed that the world was a manifestation of God's will and, given Britain's global dominance, he must favour the British/English.

Patently absolute nonsense, and perhaps only ever said somewhat tongue in cheek, then again, perhaps not, either way I think the title is not to be taken seriously. Neither Delderfield, nor (so far) any of the characters in the story, come close to believing the statement.

But you have to get beyond the title to know that. Titles and covers are the first thing a reader sees to choose about a book. And, frankly, I feel confident that Victoria and her ilk actually *did* believe the title.

Good point Elizabeth. I suspect Victoria and her ilk did passionately believe it. And why wouldn't they?

I'd not thought about that aspect.

But doesn't this all suggest it's quite an apposite title given the era in which its set?

It's also taking place towards the end of the Industrial Revolution. A period of such profound social and technological change that it may also have given industrialists a sense of providence, maybe even divine intervetion.

I had not really thought about the title before but your points suggest it could be very appropriate? A signpost to some of the attitudes and feelings around at the time in which it is set?

Nigeyb wrote: "A signpost to some of the attitudes and feelings around at the time in which it is set?"

Exactly. The Sun Never Set on the British Empire. God is an Englishman. You may be reading the title as sarcasm, but it is off-putting. Entirely. And don't tell me you wouldn't feel the same way if an American author had titled a book "God is an American." (Which, by the way, I'd find just as offensive.)

Not sarcastic but, perhaps, ironic?


That said, your ideas have caused me to rethink. I now conclude it's more likely to be sincere, and is a reflection of the beliefs of some of the book's characters.

What do you think?

The two main characters I have met so far are both from poor backgrounds and both end up wealthy.

Perhaps another suggestion of providence?

Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "And don't tell me you wouldn't feel the same way if an American author had titled a book "God is an American." Which, by the way, I'd find just as offensive.)"

I wouldn't find it remotely offensive.

The closest book on GoodReads is Maybe God is an American (the follow up to Maybe God was an Irishman).

Well, you and I can just agree to disagree on this. No reading I have done about religion would condone worshiping a God who takes sides based on man made borders. In fact, as far as my reading goes, God doesn't favor one group over another in anything. (But as I say, I've become a non-believer, and that is based on my reading of religion and then applying logic, so you can take that with any grain of salt you wish.)

Indeed so Elizabeth.


Just to be clear, whilst I think the title might be sincere I do not for one moment think it is meant to be taken literally.

Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "God doesn't favor one group over another in anything"

Absolutely. Like you, I am not aware of any divinity who favours one nation or group over another.

The Christian God loves all his children the same, even sinners.

I thought the title sounded satirical (it suggested to me that the novel will be critical of imperialism) and was probably a quote - I've just checked and, according to various websites, it was originally said by George Bernard Shaw : "The ordinary Britisher imagines that God is an Englishman."

Apparently he said this to the New York Times in 1911, but so far I haven't found any more detail about it. Hope to do so before our discussion, though.

Thanks Judy. I agree with your suggestion that it is probably satirical, and certainly not a sincere belief on the part of RFD.


I didn't realise GBS was the (likely) originator of the quote. Makes sense though. He was eminently quotable.

Thanks, Nigeyb - I'm looking forward to reading this one and finding out more about its tone, but will have to hold off for now as I have quite a backlog of books!

I'm now thoroughly enjoying.....


God is an Englishman (1970) (The Swann family saga Book 1)

It's somewhat melodramatic but irresistably so. I am getting swept along by the increasingly addictive plot. The rich period detail is there in abundance, not least the sweeping social and economic turmoil of the Industrial Revolution whilst also credibly bring the characters to life. All in all, it's capturing the energy of the age in a way that would have done Dickens proud.

There's still loads to go. I've read about 100 of 700 pages. It's a whopper but when it's this enjoyable then that's very much a positive.

It's quite interesting reading God is an Englishman at the same time as Master and Commander.

What helps set great historical fiction apart from the average is the little details of everyday life and, probably the most important aspect, credible dialogue. Master and Commander scores really highly on this count, and God is an Englishman is rather wonderful too.

I'm still working my way through God is an Englishman and enjoying it more and more. I'm really looking forward to discussing it with you in about a month.

I’d never come across the concept of baby farmers before. The term “baby farmer” is a pejorative one that came into use only in the latter half of the nineteenth century. It referred to a person, usually a woman, who took in and cared for the children of other women.

Adam’s tour of London with Keate is an extraordinary section of GIAEM

Baby farming is used in Oliver Twist, so it must have been around in the early 19th century - in Dickens's book, the baby farmers are cruel and neglectful people who take in children for money and do not care for them properly, so they often die.

As is also the case here Judy. A shocking era.