Jane Austen discussion

The ball goes off with a bang and Fanny is now officially 'out'. Mary and Edmund didn't have the best time but generally Fanny enjoyed herself! Following the ball, things at Mansfield quieten down a little. Henry returns and he has come to a decision!

One person I'm through with is Sir Thomas. That "speech" of his was horrid! So it is now down to Edmund, Mary, and Fanny being the only characters I like. :-)

Oh dear! I think Mary is realizing her mistake with Edmund. Mary has strong ideas in her mind of the type of life that she'd like to lead (social leader/prominence), a London house and great wealth. However, these notions are so strong that when she does fall in love, she drives him away with her scorn for his chosen profession . Now that Edmund is away on a visit with a friend in a house full of 3 young ladies of marriageable age, Mary is jealous. You had better believe the Owens' family are happy to host Edmund, a baronet's son, and soon to be clergyman for as long as he cares to extend his visit.

I don't believe HC is "in love" with Fanny. I will admit that as a brother, he is quite loving to his sister, but I think he is too selfish to be a good husband to a woman who cares about, love and companionship. He is better off marrying some young lady who sees him as nothing more that a stepping stone to a house in London and fashionable gowns. With a wife like this, she isn't likely to be hurt by him or disappointed in her marriage and he can stay just as selfish and self-absorbed as he always has been.

Andrea says, "I don't believe HC is "in love" with Fanny."

I agree totally. His attitude seems to be a combination of wanting her because she doesn't want him, and being in love with the idea of the person he might be if she changed him into a better man--but we all know how well that turns out! He'd get tired of her seriousness and literalism in no time. Isn't it wonderful how deep JA takes us into the complexities of human nature, simply through little stories of the normal exchanges and happenings of everyday life?

I actually think Henry was in fact in love with Fanny. Well, with a caveat. As in love as someone of his character was capable of. :-)

Frustration, frustration, frustration... how can everyone in that house can be so blind when it comes to Mr. I-am-handsome-now-adore-me Crawford?

Changing subject... I am amazed at how many "what if" paths there are in this novel. How is it that fan fiction Authors consider Mansfield Park so little? There's room for plenty of speculations!

@Irene

I was under the impression the HC was not that handsome. Charismatic perhaps, But not handsome.

Aside from his being a clever conversationalist (which we're told more than we see--where is Henry Tilney when we need him?), it's probably his independent fortune that makes the Bertrams so fond of him--as a companion, as a suitor for Fanny.

@Abigail

Although we , the readers know HC is a rotter, he would be viewed as a brilliant match of colossal proportions for Fanny.

I think it’s in these chapters that the Crawford’s show to the best advantage. You can see that there’s a few things they don’t really understand about their own behaviour but they value the merits of Fanny and even Edmund more highly than their own family.

Their love certainly does not have that selflessness we associate with true love, but I think they are in love as far as their current understanding allows. Henry certainly went out of his way to please Fanny, more effort than could reasonably be expected in someone who is just amusing himself.

Could Edmund and Fanny improve them?… possibly but I think the Crawfords would make them both very unhappy in the process because they wouldn’t understand why their behaviour caused pain, and sooner or later they would tire of always disappointing and being in the wrong.

@Irene I agree there’s a lot of potential for fanfiction, I can’t say I’ve ever looked for any but if there isn’t much I would guess that it’s because Mansfield Park isn’t as well known as the other novels.

From my experience people today are looking for action and that is why they do not like Fanny/ she has depth and she stands up for her truths even if they are not popular and such a person is not "in "today. Emma readers find hard because nothing happens really and S&S is too predictable/ so P&P And NA are the most popular for many readers. I think that our group are lucky to see the insights and wit of JA and to appreciate her novels and see their relevance 200 years after being written I admit that the most fun to read is P&P however the deepest in my eyes is Mansfeild park and I read it most often

So true! I loved Persuasion when I was younger, but MP certainly gives the most food for thought--even though I find JA's tone occasionally a little bitter and harsh in it.