Discovering Russian Literature discussion

CHAPTER X. THE WALLS ARE FALLING
CHAPTER XI. ON THE WAY TO THE SCAFFOLD
Conclusions

I will move the ending date to 25th of July.

I guess in the end it is not about whether or not their actions were wrong rather they were wronged in their death. They are tried in secret, they're pronounced guilty and hung the next morning. Specially the five terrorists. (Yanson and Tsiganok, both who are murderers, were sitting on death row at least for a month.)

It was too bad that each man was described much more vividly than the two girls... I really didn't understand them that much. Earlier, even with the mothers of Vasily and Sergey - both men are interested in their fathers' views. Sergey calls his father "a noble man" and mother asks what about "And I?"

Didn't anyone else find the final chapter, specially the seven's journey to gallows somewhat humourous? All the nonsense of Yanson and Tsiganok?

The hangings are not described, but there is a VERY graphic description of what the bodies look like afterwards. death by hanging didn't seem very instantaneous or painless.

The last chapter was indeed a very powerful one. Particularly the very end I thought really drove home how terrible an act it is to take the life of another. It was also interesting seeing the way in which the condemned where all there for one another particularly with Yanson and Tsiganok who where strangers to the 5 terrorists, but where still embraced and supported by them.

One of the things I thought was interesting was the fact that though it is true we never are given very much information about the two women, it seemed as if they where portrayed as being braver/stronger than the men or is Andreyev indicating that the women are more "innocent" than the men are? Tsiganok does tell Tanya that she is a pure soul.

Musya is the only one to step forward and agree to go with Tsiganok to be hanged when no one else wanted to stand with him, and he did not want to go alone.

But the thing that struck me was the way in which Tanya was the one who had to face the scaffold alone. All these men and not one of them were willing to go with her because none of the men could stand having to go alone, so they make the woman face it alone.

I was confused about the incident with the solider who for no apparent reasons just drops his rifle and goes off in the snow? At first the way it was described I thought maybe someone just shot him or something. I didn't quite understand what was happening there.

Anya wrote: "That is, he really doesn't provide any details as to what the Minister did to warrant the assassination attempt; whether or not the revolutionaries were in the right to have tried to assassinate him... Andrey..."

Oh yes. Anya, I think there irony here as well. The Minister did die from the heart attack he died a day before the terrorist could've killed them, because it is only in the end of the first chapter after all the security measures they learned they were planning to kill him the day after. So, in the eyes of law, the 5 cannot be convicted, right? How can they are to be condemned to kill someone who died the day before. I guess that's the point Andreyev is making here. They were wronged at their death, they were hanged for a non-existing crime.

I find there's a lot of irony here now looking at it again. The five were hung with a professional killer and another murderer(Yanson). Are their crimes equal to be hung? The five only planned the crime, they could continue it. Andreyev might be siding with the 5 here but I don't think he is being biased on their cause of death.

I wonder what the society knows about the death of the Minister? Do people know he died from a heart attack or he was "assassinated" by terrorists who were put to death?

Silver wrote: "the way in which Tanya was the one who had to face the scaffold alone. All these men and not one of them were willing to go with her because none of the men could stand having to go alone, so they make the woman face it alone...."

She did seem as a mother to all of them. I wonder if she is a symbol. The Mother Russia? When all her "children are put to death" she is lost, She cries "I am alone". After all, these dying people were the revolutionists, and Andreyev (although not biased) is on their side. The tsarist regime did have its affect on Andreyev like it did on many other of his contemporaries, right?

Amalie wrote: "Didn't anyone else find the final chapter, specially the seven's journey to gallows somewhat humourous? All the nonsense of Yanson and Tsiganok? "

I think it was their way to react to what was happening. I didn't find it humourous but rather sad. All the characters have changed going on in the story because they had to face something huge for a human mind. Like it was written in the first chapter: the worst thing is to know the exact moment when we must die.


Silver wrote: "One of the things I thought was interesting was the fact that though it is true we never are given very much information about the two women, it seemed as if they where portrayed as being braver/stronger than the men or is Andreyev indicating that the women are more "innocent" than the men are? Tsiganok does tell Tanya that she is a pure soul."

I agree. Also in my opinion the female characters are stronger.


Anya wrote: "I was moved by how the accused became a sort of loving family; providing love and support to one another during their very last moments.."

They were murders but they were more human than people that don't kill. In my opinion also this helps to understand that also murders have feelings and are humans and they must be treated like humans, always.


Silver wrote: "I was confused about the incident with the solider who for no apparent reasons just drops his rifle and goes off in the snow? At first the way it was described I thought maybe someone just shot him or something. I didn't quite understand what was happening there. "

I think he was profoundly touched by the human behavor of the seven convicts and so he didn't want to stay there helping to hang them. He wanted to go away and don't be part of this "homicide".


I could manage to finish the book today and I must say that the second part is really good and I liked the detailed insights.
In the last chapter there were a couple of interesting phrases: ...the jailers were extremely kind; even too kind. It was as if they tried partly to show themselves humane and partly to show that they were not there at all, but that everything was being done as by machinery.

....that the most insane deed on earth was being committed with such an air of simplicity and reasonableness.

It is as if the jailers are doing a job like another, they seem cold as if they aren't killing the convicts because it's not their will to hang them. In fact, they could say that they don't kill them because they execute only an order. It is sad to see that hanging people is seen like a "normal" job. In fact, I was happy when one soldier went away. This means that he could see what others don't see: the humanity in the convicts, that they are people like the other also if they have committed a crime. Committing a crime doesn't make a person less human.

dely wrote: "Silver wrote: "I was confused about the incident with the solider who for no apparent reasons just drops his rifle..."

He wanted to go away and don't be part of this "homicide".

That's how I read it as well. I'm glad you were able to join us.

If you are interested in reading few short stories, try this place: Leonid N. Andreyev @ Classicreader

There is also "Judas Iscariot and Others". Our next reading. I read "Lazarus" which was really interesting, as well as "The Serpent's Story", "On The Day of the Crucifixion"... Andreyev's story has a touch of Khalil Gibran.

Amalie wrote: "dely wrote: "Silver wrote: "I was confused about the incident with the solider who for no apparent reasons just drops his rifle..."

He wanted to go away and don't be part of this "homicide".

Tha..."

Thanks for the link! When will you read Judas Iscariot?

I'm reading with the group so, So I'll be starting soon.

Amalie wrote: "I'm reading with the group so, So I'll be starting soon."

Ok, have seen only now that the book will be read from the 25th July. I think I will read it with the group.

Hearing Amalie's comment that Tanya could represent Mother Russia was to me a powerful symbol that I agree with and it deepens the story for me.

"Silver wrote: "I was confused about the incident with the solider who for no apparent reasons just drops his rifle..." I took this to be a physical, elemental response; the soldier's body decides for him. Rather than let the intellect overcome the physical revulsion of being part of a killing, the soldier's body rebels. Like a person at the edge of a high dive times a thousand, the body has a mind and in this case an ethic of its own. I found it interesting and believable that his fellow soldiers were not surprised or angered by this, they understood it.