Why Christianity? discussion

Years ago I held a short and informal lesson about Islam for a small group of Christians. I thought some here might find this info interesting, so I'm going to post my notes here. Feel free to ask questions, discuss, etc.

Just like in Christianity, there are many Muslims who are not well versed in Islamic doctrine - this is particularly true of Western converts, there are cultural Muslims, cafeteria Muslims - who pick and choose what to believe, as well as Muslims who will not be upfront, direct and honest to a non-Muslim regarding less savory parts of Islamic teaching. Many will avoid, deflect, give partial truths, use terms they know we will misinterpret (peace) - similar to what Mormons will do. So, there are many, many Muslims who are nice, honest, decent people who just want to live in peace with their non-Muslim neighbors. When I speak about Islam I mean what official Islam teaches.

House of Islam, House of War
Doctrine of Abrogation
Taqiyya
Jihad, Christians, Jews
The Islamic claim on Jerusalem
Religion of Peace
Forced Conversions
Sharia Law - human rights, equality

House of Islam, House of War

In Islam the world is divided into two "houses". Dar al-Islam and Dar al-harb. The House of Islam is everywhere where Islam is in control. The House of War is everywhere else. Therefore Islam designates non-Islamic countries as under war with Islam, everything belonging to non-Muslims rightfully may be taken as spoils of war - which includes raping the women. And of course justifies the murder of any non-Muslim in these countries - and why none are considered innocents.

Doctrine of abrogation

The Quran is internally contradictory in many places. The doctrine of abrogation is the way Islam reconciles/explains the contradictions.

"At CPAC I explained that the doctrine of naskh, or abrogation, was mainstream in Islam, and so is the idea that the Medinan suras take precedence over the Meccan ones -- that is, the violent passages are considered to take precedence over the peaceful ones. Numerous Islamic authorities enunciate this common view, including Muhammad's first biographer, Ibn Ishaq, early jurists such as Ibn Qayyim, and in our own day a Pakistani Brigadier (S.K. Malik, author of The Qur'anic Concept of War) and a Saudi Chief Justice (Sheikh Abdullah bin Muhammad bin Humaid, author of "Jihad in the Qur'an and Sunnah"), along with Sayyid Qutb and many others." Serge Trifkovic

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2007/03/ser...

From Reliance of the Traveler - A Classic Manual of Islamic Sacred Law

o22.9 pg 626 A(9) those (nasikh) which supersede previously revealed kuranic verses;

o22.10 pg 626 A(10) and those (mansukh) which are superseded by later verses”

r14.1 Pg 751 The prophet (Allah and give him peace) said, AWhoever speaks of the book of Allah from his own opinion is in error@

r14.2 Pg 752 The generality of the prohibition also entails that whoever does not know which verses abrogate others and which are abrogated, the points upon which there is scholarly consensus (def: b7), and the tenets of faith of Ahl al-Sunna, is not safe from error if he interprets the Koran with nothing beyond the implications of the Arabic. Mere linguistic familiarity with the language is insufficient, and one must also know what we have just mentioned. When one knows both, one may interpret the Koran, and is not doing so by mere opinion.

Understanding Taqiyya Islamic Principle of Lying for the Sake of Allah
by Warner MacKenzie
30 April, 2007

"Lying and cheating in the Arab world is not really a moral matter but a method of safeguarding honor and status, avoiding shame, and at all times exploiting possibilities, for those with the wits for it, deftly and expeditiously to convert shame into honor on their own account and vice versa for their opponents. If honor so demands, lies and cheating may become absolute imperatives."[David Pryce-Jones, The Closed Circle An interpretation of the Arabs, p4]

"No dishonor attaches to such primary transactions as selling short weight, deceiving anyone about quality, quantity or kind of goods, cheating at gambling, and bearing false witness. The doer of these things is merely quicker off the mark than the next fellow; owing him nothing, he is not to be blamed for taking what he can." [David Pryce-Jones, AThe Closed Circle@, p38]

'The word "Taqiyya" literally means: "Concealing, precaution, guarding.@ It is employed in disguising one's beliefs, intentions, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions or strategies. In practical terms it is manifested as dissimulation, lying, deceiving, vexing and confounding with the intention of deflecting attention, foiling or pre-emptive blocking. It is currently employed in fending off and neutralising any criticism of Islam or Muslims.

Falsehoods told to prevent the denigration of Islam, to protect oneself, or to promote the cause of Islam are sanctioned in the Qur'an and Sunna, including lying under oath in testimony before a court, deceiving by making distorted statements to the media such as the claim that Islam is a religion of peace. A Muslim is even permitted to deny or denounce his faith if, in so doing, he protects or furthers the interests of Islam, so long as he remains faithful to Islam in his heart. (See endnotes)'

Jihad, Christians, Jews
A footnote from The Noble Qur'an, to v2:190, as translated by Muhammad Taqi-ud-Din Al-Hilali and Muhammad Muhsin Khan\

"Al-Jihad (holy fighting) in Allah's Cause (with full force of numbers and weaponry) is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars (on which it stands).

By Jihad Islam is established, Allah's Word is made superior, . . . and His Religion (Islam) is propagated. By abandoning Jihad (may Allah protect us from that) Islam is destroyed and the Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honour is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim, and he who tries to escape from this duty, or does not in his innermost heart wish to fulfil this duty, dies with one of the qualities of a hypocrite."

"Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah....When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them....If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them.... --"
Sahih Muslim 4294

"Mohammed confirms: I have been commanded [by Allah] to fight against mankind until they testify that none but Allah is to be worshipped and that Muhammad is Allah's Messenger (Bukhari B2N24; next to the Koran, the second most authoritative text in Islam).

Koran 9:29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last day, nor hold the forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and his messenger, nor acknowledge the Religion of Truth from among the People of the Book, until they pay the Jiziyah with willing submission. And feel themselves subdued.

And of course it counsels Muslims to make war against Jews and Christians until they submit to Islamic authority and pay a special tax: "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (9:29).

And it says that those who "make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land" an elastic term that could mean almost anything should be punished by crucifixion, double amputation, or exile: "The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land" (5:33)."

"Unfortunately, the hadith in which Muhammad makes a distinction between greater jihad of spiritual struggle and the lesser jihad of warfare doesn't appear in any of the hadith collections that Muslims consider most reliable. Jihad understood as warfare against unbelievers in order to establish the hegemony of Islamic law has much greater support in Islamic scripture, tradition, and historical practice -- and leading jihad theorists including Hasan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, and Abdullah Azzam, Osama bin Laden=s friend and intellectual mentor and co-founder with him of Al-Qaeda, challenge the authenticity of the saying in their writings.

Nowhere in the world is there a significant anti-jihad, anti-al-Qaeda, or anti-bin Laden movement; while Muslims worldwide rioted over cartoons in a Danish newspaper and remarks by Pope Benedict XVI, they have never rioted over Osama bin Laden=s supposed hijacking of their faith." Robert Spencer, Religion of Peace, Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn't

"If the Amir al-Mo'menin wanted to be tolerant, he would not have drawn his sword killing 700 people in one go.
In our prisons we have more of the same kind of people who are corrupt. If we do not kill them, each one of them that gets out will become a murderer! They don't become humans.
Why do you mullahs only go after the ordinances of prayer and fasting? Why do you only read the Quranic verses of mercy and do not read the verses of killing?
Qur'an says; kill, imprison!
Why are you only clinging to the part that talks about mercy? Mercy is against God.
Mehrab means the place of war, the place of fighting. Out of the mehrabs, wars should proceed, just as all the wars in Islam used to proceed out of the mehrabs....The lives of people must be secured through punishment. Because, the protection of the masses lies beneath these very punitive executions. With just a few years of imprisonment things don=t get fixed. You must put aside this childish sentimentalism. We believe that the accused essentially does not have to be tried. He or she must just be killed. Only their identity is to be established and then they should be killed." Ayatollah Khomeini, as quoted by Robert Spencer, Religion of Peace, Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn't

"The choices for unbelievers are thus either conversion, subjugation as inferiors with the obligation of paying the tax and submitting to inferior status under the rule of Islamic law, or war. Peaceful coexistance as equals in a pluralistic society is not an option." Robert Spencer, AReligion of Peace, Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn't

"To defeat the jihadists, we don't need Islamic scholars to lecture the pope; we need them to lecture Muslims about why the traditional Islamic teaching and jurisprudence on jihad must be reformed. There is a difference between reform and deception. If the Protestant Reformers had indignantly denied that the Catholic Church taught transubstantiation and the sacramental priesthood, instead of arguing that such doctrines should be discarded, they would not have been reformers, but obfuscators." Robert Spencer, Religion of Peace, Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn't

'Two months after the mass murdering acts of jihad terrorism on 9/11/01, Dr. Walid Fataihi, director of "outreach" for the Islamic Society of Boston (ISB), who still serves on the ISB Board of Directors, boasted that this carnage engendered two related "successes" -enhanced Muslim proselytization efforts, and damage to Christian-Jewish relations in the U.S. He continued triumphantly, quoting the Koran (3:112/ 2:61 (see also this).
The words of the Koran on this matter are true: "They [the Jews] will be humiliated wherever they are found, unless they are protected under a covenant with Allah, or a covenant with another people. They [the Jews] have incurred Allah's wrath and they have been afflicted with misery. That is because they continuously rejected the Signs of Allah and were after slaying the Prophets without just cause, and this resulted from their disobedience and their habit of transgression." The great Allah spoke words of truth. Their covenant with America is the strongest possible in the U.S., but it is weaker than they think, and one day their covenant with the [American] people will be cut off.

As a central anti-Jewish motif, the Koran decrees an eternal curse upon the Jews (Koran 2:61/ 3:112) for slaying the prophets and transgressing against the will of Allah. This motif is coupled to Koranic verses 5:60 and 5:78 which describe the Jews transformation into apes and swine (5:60), having been "...cursed by the tongue of David, and Jesus, Mary's son" (5:78). The related verse, 5:64, accuses the Jews-as Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas did in a January 2007 speech, citing Koran 5:64-of being "spreaders of war and corruption", a sort of ancient Koranic antecedent of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

From the advent of Islam, dehumanizing Jews as apes (Koran 2:65/7:166), or apes and pigs (Koran 5:60) transcended any mere application to "Sabbath breakers." Muhammad himself, in both the sira (early, sacralized Muslim biographies) of Ibn Ishaq and Ibn Sa>d, referred to the Medinan Jews of the Banu Qurayza as "apes" just before orchestrating the slaughter of all their post-pubertal men.

This sacralized massacre is the prototype. Large scale massacres of Jews by Muslims occurred in Granada (circa 1066; 4000 killed, and Jewish society destroyed; more Jews killed in this one pogrom than in the Crusaders' much more infamous ravages through the Rhineland 30 years later); Baghdad (1290/91; hundreds killed with pogroms extending throughout Iraq, and into Persia); and the southern Moroccan oasis town of Touat (~ 1490; many Jews killed, and their Temple destroyed).

Each of these massacres was incited and/or celebrated by depictions of Jews as apes in verses by popular clerics-in the case of Touat, the "composer" of such a verse al-Maghili (d. 1505), an important Muslim theologian whose writings influenced Moroccan religious attitudes towards Jews into the 20th century-led the pogrom himself. Maghili also declared in verse, "Love of the Prophet, requires hatred of the Jews.

"The centrality of the Jews' permanent "abasement and humiliation," and being "laden with God's anger" in the corpus of Muslim exegetic literature on Koran 2:61 (including the hadith and Koranic commentaries), is clear. By nature deceitful and treacherous, the Jews rejected Allah's signs and prophets, including Isa, the Muslim Jesus. Classical Koranic commentators such as Tabari (d. 923), Zamakshari (d. 1143), Baydawi (d. 1316), and Ibn Kathir (d. 1373), when discussing Koran 5:82 ("Thou wilt surely find the most hostile of men to the believers are the Jews and the idolaters; and thou wilt surely find the nearest of them in love to the believers are those who say 'We are Christians'; that, because some of them are priests and monks, and they wax not proud."), concur on the unique animus of the Jews towards the Muslims, which is repeatedly linked to the curse of Koran 2:61. For example, in his commentary on 5:82, Tabari writes,
In my opinion, [the Christians] are not like the Jews who always scheme in order to murder the emissaries and the prophets, and who oppose God in his positive and negative commandments, and who corrupt His scripture which He revealed in His books.

Tabari's classical interpretations of Koran 5:82 and 2:61, as well as his discussion of the related verse 9:29 mandating the Jews payment of the jizya (Koranic poll-tax), represent both Antisemitic and more general anti-dhimmi views that became, and remain, intrinsic to Islam to this day. Here is Tabari's discussion of 2:61 and its relationship to verse 9:29, which emphasizes the purposely debasing nature of the Koranic poll tax:

..."abasement and poverty were imposed and laid down upon them", as when someone says "the imam imposed the poll tax (jizya)on free non-Muslim subjects", or "The man imposed land tax on his slave", meaning thereby that he obliged him [to pay ] it, or, "The commander imposed a sortie on his troops", meaning he made it their duty....God commanded His believing servants not to give them [i.e., the non-Muslim people of the scripture] security-as long as they continued to disbelieve in Him and his Messenger-unless they paid the poll tax to them; God said: "Fight those who believe not in God and the Last Day and do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden-such men as practice not the religion of truth [Islam], being of those who have been given the Book [Bible]-until they pay the poll tax, being humble" (Koran 9:29).. The dhimmis [non-Muslim tributary's] posture during the collection of the jizya- "[lowering themselves] by walking on their hand, ...reluctantly

...Ibn Zaid said about His words "and abasement and poverty were imposed upon them", >These are the Jews of the Children of Israel'. I said: >Are they the Copts of Egypt?' He said: "What have the Copts of Egypt to do with this? No, by God, they are not; but they are the Jews, the Children of Israel....By "and slain the prophets unrightfully" He means that they used to kill the Messengers of God without God's leave, denying their messages and rejecting their prophethood.

Indeed the Koran's overall discussion of the Jews is marked by a litany of their sins and punishments, as if part of a divine indictment and conviction process. The Jews wronged themselves (16:118) by losing faith (7:168) and breaking their covenant (5:13). The Jews (echoing an ante-Nicaean, Marcionite polemic) are a nation that has passed away (2:134; repeated in 2:141). Twice Allah sent his instruments (the Assyrians/or Babylonians, and Romans) to punish this perverse people (17:4-5)-their dispersal over the earth is proof of Allah's rejection (7:168).

The Jews are further warned about both their arrogant claim that they remain Allah's chosen people (62:6), and continued disobedience and "corruption" (5:32-33) Other sins, some repeated, are enumerated: abuse, even killing of prophets (4:155; 2:91), including Isa [Jesus] (3:55; 4:157), is a consistent theme. The Jews ridiculed Muhammad as Ra'ina (the evil one, in 2:104; 4:46), and they are also accused of lack of faith, taking words out of context, disobedience, and distortion (4:46). Precious few of them are believers (also 4:46). These "perverse" creatures also claim that Ezra is the messiah and they worship rabbis who defraud men of their possessions (9:30).

Additional sins are described: the Jews are typified as an "envious" people (2:109), whose hearts are as hardened as rocks (2:74). They are further accused of confounding the truth (2:42), deliberately perverting scripture (2:75), and being liars (2:78). Ill-informed people of little faith (2:89), they pursue vague and wishful fancies (2:111). Other sins have contributed to their being stamped (see 2:61/ 3:112 above) with "wretchedness/abasement and humiliation," including-usury (2:275), sorcery (2:102), hedonism (2:96), and idol worship (2:53).

More (and repeat) sins, are described still: the Jews' idol worship is again mentioned (4:51), then linked and followed by charges of other (often repeat) iniquities-the "tremendous calumny" against Mary (4:156), as well as usury and cheating (4:161). Most Jews are accused of being "evil-livers" /"transgressors" /"ungodly" (3:110), who, deceived by their own lies (3:24), try to turn Muslims from Islam (3:99). Jews are blind and deaf to the truth (5:71), and what they have not forgotten they have perverted-they mislead (3:69), confound the truth (3:71), twist tongues (3:79), and cheat Gentiles without remorse (3:75).

Muslims are advised not to take the Jews as friends (5:51), and to beware of the inveterate hatred that Jews bear towards them (5:82). The Jews' ultimate sin and punishment are made clear: they are the devil's minions (4:60) cursed by Allah, their faces will be obliterated (4:47), and if they do not accept the true faith of Islam-the Jews who understand their faith become Muslims (3:113)-they will be made into apes (2:65/ 7:166), or apes and swine (5:60), and burn in the Hellfires (4:55, 5:29, 98:6, and 58:14-19).

The essential nature of the Koranic "revelation", as understood by Muslims, was elaborated in 1891 by Theodore Nöldeke (whose seminal 1860 Geschichte des Qorans remains a vital tool for Koranic research): To the faith of the Muslims...the Koran is the word of God, and such also is the claim which the book itself advances...And to this day, for the Muslim masses, as Ibn Warraq notes,

...the Koran remains the infallible word of God, the immediate word of God sent down, through the intermediary of a "spirit" or "holy spirit" or Gabriel, to Muhammad in perfect, pure Arabic; and every thing contained therein is eternal and uncreated. The original text is in heaven...The angel dictated the revelation to the Prophet, who repeated it after him, and then revealed it to the world. Modern Muslims also claim that these revelations have been preserved exactly as revealed to Muhammad, without any change, addition, or loss whatsoever...the Koran remains for all Muslims, and not just "fundamentalists" the uncreated word of God Himself. It is valid for all times and places; its ideals are, according to all Muslims, absolutely true and beyond any criticism. [emphasis added]

Thus it strains credibility to assume that Dr. Fitaihi-a pious Muslim actively engaged in politicized da'wa-would have apologized for his invocation of antisemitic motifs from the Koran, the Jews' traits as characterized therein being deemed both infallible and timeless. Equally important and related concerns were raised by Boston area blogger Solomonia, who observed,

We don't have any wording from the "apology," nor do we know who, exactly, was at the meeting. How do we measure this? Fitaihi jetted into town, then just as quickly jetted out after facing what looks like a friendly audience and no serious or skeptical questioning-a group who then...surprise...pronounce him absolved.
The Fitaihi affair-a depressing web of deceit, denial, and delusion-epitomizes the
sorry state of public understanding of Islamic antisemitism, most ominously, by its victims.'

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/0...

The Islamic claim on Jerusalem stems from two things. First, the vision Mohammad claimed to have in which he accended from Jerusalem into heaven and spoke with past prophets. Second, the Islamic concept that once a place is taken by Islam it becomes forever the rightful property of Islam.

Religion of Peace

When the Islamic leaders say they want peace they mean the kind of peace where the entire world is under Islamic rule. Where all non-Muslims are either dead or forced to submit to Islamic rule and control. They may desire peace, but on their terms, by their definition, and they're willing to fight and murder the rest of us to get it.Perhaps on this level Islam is a "religion of peace", a religion that will fight with any means in order to usher in the "peace" of Islamic world domination.

People of the west may misunderstand and think they mean they wish to live peacefully with us by our definition, but it is incorrect. Why the "President" of Iran can say both that he desires peace, and calls for death to America and to Israel.

Forced Conversions
In Islam the focus is not on belief or sincerity of heart. What matters is submission, subjection. Which is why forced conversions in Islam are valid. It does not matter if someone submits under threat of death.

Islamic law not compatible with western law, or Judeo-Christian values.

Rather than regarding women as human beings equal to men, the Qur'an likens a woman to a field (tilth), to be used by a man as he wills: "Your women are a tilth for you (to cultivate) so go to your tilth as ye will" (2:223).

The Qur'an also declares that a woman's testimony is worth half that of a man: "Get two witnesses, out of your own men, and if there are not two men, then a man and two women, such as ye choose, for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her" (2:282).

It allows men to marry up to four wives, and have sex with slave girls also: "If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, marry women of your choice, two or three or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess, that will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice" (4:3).

It rules that a son's inheritance should be twice the size of that of a daughter: "Allah (thus) directs you as regards your children's (inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females" (4:11).

The Qur'an tells husbands to beat their disobedient wives: "Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them" (4:34).

It allows for marriage to pre pubescent girls, stipulating that Islamic divorce procedures Ashall apply to those who have not yet menstruated@ (65:4).

Interesting things:

Muslims believe it was Ishmael, not Issac, that Abraham nearly sacraficed. They believe the story in the Bible was altered by Jews to change this to Ishmael.

I have not yet heard, although I have asked, of any contemporary, or near contemporary, historical references to Mohammad. There is a theory that Mohammad is actually a conglomerate of several warlords. The claim Muslims spring from Abraham through Ishmael this is not necessarily a historical fact.

Prayers in Islam are given in Arabic, regardless of the native language of the worshiper.

Good Sources:

The Religion of Peace, (Why Christianity Is and Islam Isn't), by Robert Spencer
The Truth About Mohammad, by Robert Spencer
What Every American Needs To Know About The Qur'an by William Federer
Answering Islam: The Crescent in Light of the Cross by Abdul Saleeb and Norman L. Geisler

"The Reliance of the Traveler" is a Shafi'i manual of Islamic law certified by Al-Azhar University as conforming to the practice and faith of the orthodox Sunni community.

Behind The Veil by Joel Richardson , available free online at http://www.answering-islam.org/Behind...

AntiChrist Islam's Awaited Messiah by Joel Richards, available free under the title Will Islam Be Our Future at http://www.answering islam.org/Authors/JR/Future/index.htm

The Quran=s Doctrine of Abrogation by Abdullah Al Araby http://www.islamreview.com/articles/q...

William Wagner [How Islam Plans To Change The World] Joan Peters [From Time Immemorial]Michael Cappi [The Never Ending War]Raymond Ibrahim [The Al Qaeda Reader]Emir and Ergun Caner [More Than a Prophet] The Caner=s are brothers who are both ex-Muslims, now Christians.Ibn Warraaq

Mark Gabriel - Dr Gabriel's credentials: Bachelor's, master's, and doctorate degrees in Islamic History and Culture from Al-Azhar University, Cairo, Egypt, Graduating second in his class of six thousand students for his bachelor's degree. This ranking was based on cumulative scores or oral and written exams given at the end of each school year, One of the youngest lecturers ever hired at Al-Azhar University. He started lecturing after he finished his master's degree and was working to finish his doctorate, Traveling lecturer. The university sent him to countries around the Middle East as a lecturer in Islamic history, Served as the imam at a mosque in the Cairo suburbs, Later Gabriel became a Christian and pursued a Christian education which include: Discipleship Training School with Youth With A Mission in Cape Town, South Africa, Master's degree in World Religion from Florida Christian University in Orlando, Florida (2001), Doctorate degree in Christian Education from Florida Christian University in Orland, Florida (2002), Induction as a fellow in the Oxford Society of Scholars, September 2003.
www.islam-watch.org and www.jihadwatch.org - Robert Spencer's sites
www.thereligionofpeace
www.americanminute.com - William Federer's site
www.str.org - a Christian apologetics site, expert on Islam Alan Shlemon occasionally contributes articles on Islam

Books

Princess by Jean Sasson - story of a female member of the Saudi royal family. Certainly not the live of the typical Saudi woman, but an interesting look at life in Saudi for woman anyway.

Secret Believers by Al Janssen - story of Muslim converts to Christianity in an Islamic country, and missionary efforts to assist them.

America Alone by Mark Steyn

What Every American Needs To Know About Islam by William J. Federer

30 Days Muslim Prayer Focus - booklet published each year for daily prayers for Muslims during Ramadan. Includes interesting information and stories from different Muslim countries and communities. This years version goes from Aug 11 to Sept 9 2010. Order from www.worldchristian.com for $3.00.

Other good sources:

Answering-islam.org
A website that response to Islamic apologetics promoted on the Islamic website answering-christianity.org, lots of good information regarding Islam, and Christian responses. (if you check out answering-christianity.org keep in mind it’s a site intended for public consumption, and therefore not to be trusted to even give an honest reflection of their views)

World Net Daily - Christian, conservative news site - wnd.com

Turkish World Outreach - ministry to Christians and non-Christians in Turkey. Often has news regarding persecution, conversions, etc in Turkey. Www.two-fot.org

Robert Spencer
Websites - www.islam-watch.org Www.jihadwatch.org
Numerous books on Islam
Facebook - Robert Spencer also involved with the Facebook group Stop Islamization of America
Twitter jihadwatchRS
YouTube - couldn’t find a YouTube channel for him, but there are videos of him posted by others.

Voice of the Martyrs
www.persecution.com
Facebook - The Voice of the Martyrs - USA
Twitter - VOM_USA

Secret Believers
www.secretbelievers.org
Facebook group Secret Believers

Open Doors - Missionary group affiliated with Secret Believers
Twitter - OpenDoors
Facebook Open Doors USA
www.opendoorsusa.org
YouTube - OpenDoorsUSA

CARM.org - Christian apologetics. Good articles. I encourage you to check out the Forum, where you can join the battle directly, refuting heresy, debating politics, dialoging with people caught in false religions. It’s a great way to learn and gain experience, without being on-the-spot face-to-face. Lots of knowledgeable Christians there to dialog with as well. There are Muslim run discussion sites, I’d advise against joining those. I know people who have received threats from participating on Muslim sites.
Podcast of Matt Slick’s radio show available on iTunes, search for CARM. Occassionally discussions on Islam.
Facebook Carm Org
Twitter carmorg

Objections to Christianity

That God became man.
That Jesus died on the cross.
That Jesus is God, and God died on the cross.
The Bible is untrustworthy and has been corrupted
That Allah has no partners and no sons is a tenet of Islam that is drilled into them - in direct response and rejection of Christianity.
That Christians do not adhere to the Law.
They reject original sin, consider Adam’s disobedience a “mistake”, and often do not consider their “mistakes” sin.
Jesus was the prophet to the Jews.
Christians do not keep Jewish Law

Defenses

The OT is full of slaughter too.
Christianity is guilty of attrocoties
Jesus was a failure. His message rejected. He was (attempted to be) murdered. Mohammad was superior because he fought his enemies
Christians do not keep Jewish Law - only for the Jews, most Christians are Gentiles. Muslims also do not keep Jewish Law. If they actually kept the Law they would be righteous, however no on does and no one can - so, now what?

Tactics

When using scripture, focus on the words of Jesus. And focus on Jesus.
Muslims believe Jesus was born of a virgin. Another significant speciality Islam agrees upon Jesus, not Mohammad.
Mohammad performed no miracles, but Jesus did (although Muslims will claim the Quran was a miracle).
Explain Christians believe in one God.
The Islamic god requires no payment for sin, and allows sinful men into his heaven. Therefore the Islamic god is not just, nor holy. Unlike the Almighty God. In Islam their “good deeds” are weighed against their “bad deeds”.
Even Mohammad was unsure he’d achieve paradise.
God loves them.
Focus on the law, do they keep it (of course not), do they know they’ll achieve paradise (they hope so, “Allah is merciful” - he is also capricious, and can send anyone to hell he wills regardless of good deeds).

Misconceptions of Christianity

That the Trinity is God, Jesus, and Mary
That Christians are polytheists
That Christians can “sin all they want”.

Alexandra wrote: "Years ago I held a short and informal lesson about Islam for a small group of Christians. I thought some here might find this info interesting, so I'm going to post my notes here. Feel free to ask ..."

This is great information! I noticed that you have No God But One: Allah or Jesus? on your 'to read' list. I have read that and found it to be extremely informative. Qureshi's ability to break down complex subjects, make them easy to understand and look at them objectively is refreshing.

He looks at each objection to Christianity, each defense and breaks them down objectively.

The book is really written to people who currently practice Islam, but he tells the Christian reader that it can be used to help them learn about Islam. Which he is absolutely correct.

He also fully realizes that unless a Muslim is seriously seeking truth, there is no way they will read his book.

Again, thanks for these notes... even though No God But One is a great book, it contains so much information, it is hard to keep in mind all the things he brings up.

Chad wrote: "Alexandra wrote: "Years ago I held a short and informal lesson about Islam for a small group of Christians. I thought some here might find this info interesting, so I'm going to post my notes here...."

I hadn't read No God but One: Allah or Jesus?: A Former Muslim Investigates the Evidence for Islam and Christianity at the time I'd prepped this, and I still haven't, although I have recently purchased it. So, it's on my To Read pile. I'm glad to hear it's good.

I really recommend Robert Spencer's books, Religion of Peace?: Why Christianity Is and Islam Isn't is a good place to start for people who don't know much about the topic. As well as those who do :D

And you're welcome. I'm up for questions, if any come up. Although it's been awhile since I've been in the thick of this stuff, so I may be a bit rusty.

I can start a thread about Mormonism too, although I don't have anything handy like this to start us off with.

For those that aren't familiar with Islam I also want to point out a few important facts.

In Islam the Quran is considered not able to be correctly interpreted except by using the Hadith. The Hadith, as I understand it, is about the life of Mohammed. This is one reason why those who simply read the Quran cannot correctly understand Islam.

The Quran is not prose written in chronological order, like the Bible is. It is a collection of "Suras", sayings and teachings, that vary in length. In the Quran these suras are ordered by length, it's either shortest to longest, or vice versa, I never can remember which :)

And this is why, even understanding the Doctrine of Abrogation, one cannot properly understand Islam simply by reading the Quran.

In Islam there are three official, authoritative writings, and in order to be correctly understood all three must be taken into account. They are the Quran, the Hadith, and Reliance of the Traveler, which is official, authoritative, Islamic Law.

The Quran is also only considered authoritative in Arabic, although translations are allowed. In Islam the Quran is also considered literally the word of God, meaning each individual copy of the Quran is considered holy and literally Allah's word. Which is why Muslims get really, really upset over any form of damage or lack of care or disrespect even to an individual copy of the Quran. To them such a thing is truly blasphemous.

In Islam there are various sects, the largest being the Sunni and the Shiite. If I remember correctly the only significant differences between those two are believes about eschatology - end times prophecy - and a dispute over which of these two groups is the rightful authority. In all ways that would be pertinent to us as non-Muslims their beliefs are the same. And each of these groups considers the other heretical, which is why they'll fight each other.

There are some smaller groups, at least one I know of that truly does hold a sincerely peaceful view of non-believers, but they are tiny in comparison, and those we're likely to come into contact with, be effected by, etc., are likely to be either Sunni or Shiite.

Fun topic. I've been studying and critiquing Islam for 15 years. Thanks Alexandra.

Rod wrote: "Fun topic. I've been studying and critiquing Islam for 15 years. Thanks Alexandra."

Most welcome :D

Great thread. I read it and ate it up. Confirms (and refutes) much of what I've heard and read. I am meeting regularly with a couple of Mormon bishops who are part of a community group that meets weekly. I would love to get an overview of where they are coming from. They are really good at disarming everyone around them and coming off as, "Hey, we all worship the same God, and Jesus is our mutual savior. Don't believe all that hokey stuff you've heard about Mormons."

Eric wrote: "Great thread. I read it and ate it up. Confirms (and refutes) much of what I've heard and read. I am meeting regularly with a couple of Mormon bishops who are part of a community group that meets w..."

Sure! I don't have anything I can easily just copy/paste as an overview, like here. But I do have a lot of documentation on things I've written as rebuttals and some notes. And I'm open for questions. I'll start a thread, and we can discuss it. If I have some time I'll try to mock up some basics.

I do enjoy asking Muslims why Allah keeps sexual Houris locked up? Or even guarded? From what exactly?
No Muslim woman has ever responded to that question.

But that's a brutal end to a conversation. But often fair.

Eric wrote: "Great thread. I read it and ate it up. Confirms (and refutes) much of what I've heard and read. I am meeting regularly with a couple of Mormon bishops who are part of a community group that meets w..."

Eric, I've started a thread here on Mormonism, feel free to ask questions and I'll answer as best I can.

Their beliefs and theology take a lot of explaining, so I haven't yet taken the time to try to mock up something as a short overview.

Alexandra - thanks for the synopsis - good scholarly work!

Robert wrote: "Alexandra - thanks for the synopsis - good scholarly work!"

Welcome! As you can tell, I quoted others quite extensively. LOL But I certainly did vet those who are trustworthy sources, and have studied Islam regarding it's authoritative texts, and learned from those who are both expert and trustworthy.

Happy to share what I've learned.

Alexandra - I come from a science background so I naturally am more concerned about understanding the natural phenomena that God created (He gave us quite a mystery - in all fields!), than the behavioral aspects of pure Scripture. Nonetheless, if a God is to be worshipped then He must be Just. A religion that allows it's adherents to lie, cheat, and steal doesn't qualify as an entity searching for it's better angels, to me. More like a sect trying to swordfight with Satan.

Robert wrote: "Nonetheless, if a God is to be worshipped then He must be Just. A religion that allows it's adherents to lie, cheat, and steal doesn't qualify as an entity searching for it's better angels, to me. More like a sect trying to swordfight with Satan. "

I'd agree that if God were not Just He wouldn't be worthy of worship. Often when talking with Muslims I'd tell them their god is too small. LOL

From their perspective they don't see it as lying, or stealing, etc., because in Islam everything that belongs to unbelievers actually belongs rightfully to Muslims. A spoils of war sort of thing.

So, they would say that Islam doesn't allow stealing, or lying, or cheating, but what they mean is different than what we mean. They mean from other believers. Other Muslims.

Taking from non-Muslims, isn't stealing in their point of view. Lying to non-Muslims isn't lying, in their point of view, etc. That's how they justify it.

But we need to understand, the morals and values of Islam are not at all consistent with the morals and values of Western societies, which (whether people know or admit it or not) is heavily influenced by Judeo-Christian morals and values.

And that's not even getting into how they treat their own. For example when a Muslim woman is raped she is considered guilty of "adultery", and put to death.

“Christianity also shares key moral principles with Judaism-principles that do not carry over to Islam. These principles are the fount from which modern ethicists have drawn the concept of universal human rights-the foundation of Western secular culture.”

Robert Spencer, “Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn’t”.

“Jews, atheists, Muslims, and many other non-Christians live comfortably in societies shaped by Judeo-Christian values, and they need to understand that those values are not identical to Islamic ones. Judeo-Christian values have informed ideas of human rights that prevail across the globe, and which also have significant influence in the Islamic world-although there they battle with traditional Islamic values.”
Robert Spencer, “Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn’t”.

"Here is the hierarchy of human worth in Islam: At the summit are free male Muslims. Next come Muslim male slaves. Then come free Muslim women. Next come Muslim slave women. Then come free Jewish and/or Christian men. Then come slave Jewish and/or Christian men. Then come free Jewish and/or Christian woman. Then come slave Jewish and/or Christian women."
Robert Spencer, “Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn’t”.

"And because Islamic law mandates discrimination against religious minorities (as well as women), it rules out the idea that all citizens enjoy equality of dignity and rights before Islamic law. Robert Spencer, “Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn’t”.

Alexandra - thanks for taking the time to lay out a direct insight into the Islam pattern of thinking. No wonder they can't get to first base as a society - no one can rise up from a lower hierarchical position to make a contribution, no matter how brilliant or creative they are.

Robert wrote: "Alexandra - thanks for taking the time to lay out a direct insight into the Islam pattern of thinking. No wonder they can't get to first base as a society - no one can rise up from a lower hierarch..."

Welcome. And, that's not the only reason. Look at countries where Islam is in control. They're theocracies. Nothing that is contrary to Islam is allowed, and Islam controls every facet of life. Which is why, for the most part, those societies can't advance beyond the middle ages. It's more than just an aversion to "corruption from the west". And, they control information their citizens have access to, what they are taught in schools, etc.

I can guarantee their kids aren't taught Evolution theory. ;)

Alexandra - what happens then, when the oil runs dry -back to being Bedouins?

Robert wrote: "Alexandra - what happens then, when the oil runs dry -back to being Bedouins?"

Good question. But I doubt we'll be around by then. I expect those who are running the show will figure out some way to continue to be wealthy, regardless of what happens to the masses.