Crime Detective Mystery Thriller Group discussion

Recently, I was reading a review/interview of an older novel/writer and the interviewer wondered if the novel would have been published today with the language use the author chose to use back then.

And this made me start wondering how others felt about the future of writing when it comes to controversial or offensive language usage.

For myself, I have a very strict interpretation of the importance of free speech, but it still makes me wonder about the future of word usage by writers (personally, I think with the sheer number of publishing avenues and for the need for artistic freedom, that speech will fine).

For an illustration, in today's world, I do not think the old - to some, very old - Saturday Night Live skit with Chevy Chase and Richard Pryor would air in this current age (this is the skit where the two start throwing out slurs at each other during a job interview).

So do others think fiction writing will remain such as it is or that changes will be on the horizon?

I think this is a very astute comment, Eric. If you created a timeline of literature, it would reflect that any type of writing: essays, didactic teachings, pastoral poetry, metaphysical poetry, sonnets, plays and then novels, one can depict that history, sociology, philosophy, economy and psychology had an enormous influence on anything written or filmed; therefore, I think the answer would have to come from our society. I was a strict believer in free speech; however, with the advent of 'snuff' films on social media, and how certain words are never permitted, I do believe that society would raise a challenge. I do not think All in the Family would go over nowadays, but I hope I am wroing.

Skye wrote: "I think this is a very astute comment, Eric. If you created a timeline of literature, it would reflect that any type of writing: essays, didactic teachings, pastoral poetry, metaphysical poetry, so..."

Skye, maybe the printed word will escape the limitation of social changes.

I have just found it kind of odd how under some mediums there have been changes or omissions, while in there (music and writing) limitations have been different.

I was watching Netflix's MIndhunters and there is some very, very strong language used in a segment pertaining to women, but the use of it served a larger purpose (to elicit information from a villain by an interrogation tactic).

Overall, Eric, i have thought writers are consolidating their ideas in shorter sentences and less likely to be wordy and tres descriptive: think of James Patterson, Robert B. Parker, and Michael Connelly in comparison to writers a century ago; sparse, terse and easier to read; however, your post sent me 'rocking and a reeling." Our society has become so politically correct, now, and I do believe in freedom of speech in writing and films; whatever happens in social media doesn't affect me whatsoever, I don't have Twitter, Instagram, or Face Book; I love my privacy, but then I saw the movie many years ago entitled '8 Millimeter" with Nicholas Cage, and that definitely gave me fodder to chew. It's a great flick in many ways, but very upsetting.

My belief has always been you have the freedom to read what you want, and if something becomes offensive, you can close the book, the same with television and theatre.

Skye wrote: "Overall, Eric, i have thought writers are consolidating their ideas in shorter sentences and less likely to be wordy and tres descriptive..."

It depends on who you read and what genre they write. Some genres (such as contemporary mystery or crime) do better with plain language than others. But also, consider that the audience now knows far more about the world than it did a hundred years ago. An author no longer needs to spend five pages describing the Eiffel Tower or the Roman Colosseum; we all know what they look like from having seen thousands of photos and videos of them, something that couldn't be said a century ago.

If you want long, elaborate descriptions, try science fiction or fantasy (those authors build alien worlds, so they have to spend more time describing them), or historical fiction.

Skye wrote: "Our society has become so politically correct, now..."

I've always considered "politically correct" to be a more compact way of saying, "Don't be an asshole in public." We do seem to be moving past the time when everyone who wasn't a straight WASP male had to put up with being called whatever slur happened to be in vogue at the time.

For literature, though, it depends on the context. Authors will continue to be able to use language we no longer tolerate in daily discourse to define a character's viewpoint or state of mind, or to accurately place a story in a specific time or milieu. But if an author goes off on an offensively racist or sexist rant that isn't motivated by the story, s/he's going to repel a lot of readers.

Skye wrote: "I do not think All in the Family would go over nowadays, but I hope I am wrong."

For the record, I think an updated All in the Family would do fine today on basic cable. Remember how transgressive that show was when it came out; it was considered seriously controversial. We've seen that bigotry is still with us. An Archie for the 21st century would have different targets for his spleen-venting, but he'd still be timely.

It depends on who you read and what genre they write. Some genres (such as contemporary mystery or crime) do better with plain language than others.
This does make sense of course; however, I don't read science fiction or futuristic novels any longer; I doubt anyone can compete with 1984 by Orwell, or 2001: A Space Odyssey by Clarke or even Thomas Pynchon's works.

Lance, many authors have been banned / restricted over and over again: The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Clemons has been on and off book shelves many times, as well as Lady Chatterly's Lover: Novel by Lawrence, and I never even thought that was excessively provocative. Therefore, the written word has been silenced, only to be permitted ( more than once).

I completely agree with you that everyone should be kind and mindful of how others may be affected, and no one should be permitted to go on a rant that may injure someone's feelings.

I didn't watch All in the Family frequently; however, I adored the way Archie Bunker made up words ( to suit his purpose); I labeled it 'the Archie Bunker syndrome.'